Helping a Rogue.

[sanon]

In my group, one of our players- a rogue- isn't to bright. I was wondering what some good advice would be to give him so he doesn't screw up, he will be a Human Rogue.

[cupkeyk]

You could give more info for one thing, how is he screwing up?

[sanon]

You could give more info for one thing, how is he screwing up?

Not bright game wise, I mean IRL his int would be his dump stat. I was just hoping to give him some good info before he died on our first session.

[cupkeyk]

Not bright game wise, I mean IRL his int would be his dump stat. I was just hoping to give him some good info before he died on our first session.

There are plenty of ways of playing a Rogue, making them an excellent Variable Ability Dependent Class. for newbies, I usually let them play Fighters or barbarians and let them enjoy the primary (and possibly most complicated) aspect of DnD, combat. I expect that character to die. That basically serves as their training wheels towards building a character they will like.

Since they started out as rogue, you can assist him make a thug type rogue, placing his primary stat is strength, with some social skills, since that is the easiest to play since its just talking supported by skill checks and letting him flank and deal SA.

[Jannex]

For starters, don't let him spread out his skill points too thinly; even with 8+Int/level and the extra one for being human, he doesn't have as many as it'll seem. Suggest that he pick a few important skills (Tumble, Hide/Move Silently, Search, etc.) and max them out, before dropping a couple of points here and there into other skills that might seem like a good idea.

Make sure he understands very clearly that he is not the tank. He shouldn't be charging head-first into combat. With his Sneak Attack, he should be creeping around the edge of the battlefield, finding a convenient flanking position, and stabbing his enemies in the kidneys.

Lastly, he should try to cultivate at least a bit of paranoia. In fact, it might not be a bad idea for you to suggest that he take Spot, Listen, and Sense Motive, if only so you can occasionally drop in-character hints when he's about to proceed with a bad plan. But he should never simply trust that a door is un-trapped, or that no one is lurking behind the corner of a dark alley, or that the guy offering the party a job is being completely forthright with them. Better safe than sorry.

[Nowhere Girl]

Convince him to play something else, like a barbarian or a (shudder) fighter. Or a druid with Natural Spell, since once you have Natural Spell, it's almost impossible to actually screw up a druid. You could just attack as a bear one moment and randomly cast whatever spell you happen to flip to the next, and you'd probably still do okay.

Rogues take planning and care to play, as much as or maybe in some cases more than wizards, especially since they're not so "I win" as wizards. I personally wouldn't recommend the class to someone who lacks in creativity.

If he's adamant, just make sure he knows how flanking works and that he does that a lot. At least he'll serve a kind of function as a dpser.

I'd say make sure he keeps UMD up, too, but I'm not sure that will do any good if he's not bright enough to use it well.

[Person_Man]

Give him a magic bow. If the bow is sufficiently powerful/interesting, he'll use it. Unless he's a total idiot, he'll hang back from the front line of combat shooting things. If he's not on the front line of combat and has ranks in Tumble, its unlikely he'll get killed. Suggest that he start building towards Greater Manyshot.

In terms of Skill use, just have him describe what he wants to do, ignoring the Skill ranks. If its reasonable, just let it happen. If it requires a Skill check, then ask him to roll for it. The next time he levels up, remind him of which Skills he's used and which he hasn't.

[RebelRogue]

Or a druid
Seriously, having worked with children and roleplaying for a couple of years, I know that druid is about the last thing you want the beginner/not so bright kid to play! Being a primary spellcaster with the ability to summon lots of different creatures (which he therefore needs to keep track of) as well as having an animal companion to deal with (including having a grasp of Handle Animal/tricks) is just pure hell IMO!

[goat]

The problem with rogues is that they're rarely the focal point, unless they're the party face or they're on their own doing things they do better than everyone else (skill-monkeying, hide, move silently etc). However, letting a brand new player scout out a dungeon full of critters would probably be a good way to kill him, and the utility of a strong face is entirely campaign dependent. Skill-monkeying can be powerful, but only if you're good at knowing when and how to use it.

I'd encourage him to build a combat-rogue. Fighting feats, skills in the more physical things (tumble, climb, balance, move silently, hide) so he can get into good flanking positions. Don't bother with int/cha-bumping, his mileage from UMD and bluff/diplo may well be limited at first. Keep his spot, listen and search high so he has use outside of combat, maybe disable device if you think traps will start turning up.

Probably easiest to make him largely SAD. Pump his dex, have him take wep-finesse when he can if he wants to stab things, guide him down the archery trees if he's happy with a bow.