How to break your artificer: add yours

[Taboomantis]

Building a list of ideas to make an artificer even crazier. All suggestions must be RAW.
Multiclass into one level of forge cleric. Pick up shield of faith.

Heavy armor artificer
AC with shield = 20. (plate)
+1 with forge feature
+1 if warforged
+2 with shield of faith
+1 AC shield infusion.
Total AC 25. At level 3. Artificer 2 cleric 1

[jaappleton]

I honestly do NOT know if this works. But if you can convince your DM.... This is pretty darn good.

Can you make your Arcane Firearm a spell storing item?

Because if so, Magic Missile is 1d4+1+1d8, or 8 damage. With 3 missiles, that's 24 Force damage, auto-hit.

Spell Storing Item has 10 charges. Its also an action to use it. Its explicitly stated to be an object, and you use your action to use it.

Haste lets you take the Use an Object action.

Rogue - Thief's ability Fast Hands lets you Use an Object as a bonus action.

So that's three uses of it in a turn, or 72 Force damage auto-hitting a target.

[Galithar]

Building a list of ideas to make an artificer even crazier. All suggestions must be RAW.
Multiclass into one level of forge cleric. Pick up shield of faith.

Heavy armor artificer
AC with shield = 20. (plate)
+1 with forge feature
+1 if warforged
+2 with shield of faith
+1 AC shield infusion.
Total AC 25. At level 3. Artificer 2 cleric 1

That's not purely a Artificer then.

Fighter - Defense style and Forge Cleric Warforged can do the same thing.

Or a straight Artificer can at level 10 do the following.

Half plate with +2 infusion
Shield with Repulsion +1 infusion
Haste for +2 AC
Cloak of Protection infusion +1
Warforged +1

AC of 26 with shield available to take it to 31 (Battlesmith or Artificer for shield spell)

Granted it comes on much later and you're hosed if you lose concentration on Haste.



I honestly do NOT know if this works. But if you can convince your DM.... This is pretty darn good.

Can you make your Arcane Firearm a spell storing item?

Because if so, Magic Missile is 1d4+1+1d8, or 8 damage. With 3 missiles, that's 24 Force damage, auto-hit.

Spell Storing Item has 10 charges. Its also an action to use it. Its explicitly stated to be an object, and you use your action to use it.

Haste lets you take the Use an Object action.

Rogue - Thief's ability Fast Hands lets you Use an Object as a bonus action.

So that's three uses of it in a turn, or 72 Force damage auto-hitting a target.

Artillerist doesn't have magic Missle on its spell list and spell storing item only works for Artificer spells.

Also using the spell storing item doesn't use the 'Use an Object' action just like any other magic item doesn't. It uses a specific action, as described in the items description.

[Dork_Forge]

I honestly do NOT know if this works. But if you can convince your DM.... This is pretty darn good.

Can you make your Arcane Firearm a spell storing item?

Because if so, Magic Missile is 1d4+1+1d8, or 8 damage. With 3 missiles, that's 24 Force damage, auto-hit.

Spell Storing Item has 10 charges. Its also an action to use it. Its explicitly stated to be an object, and you use your action to use it.

Haste lets you take the Use an Object action.

Rogue - Thief's ability Fast Hands lets you Use an Object as a bonus action.

So that's three uses of it in a turn, or 72 Force damage auto-hitting a target.

Magic Missile isn't an Artificer spell.

[Quietus]

Magic Missile isn't an Artificer spell.

It is for UA armorer, not that that helps.

However, yes, you can make an arcane firearm into an SSI. To make your SSI, an item must be one of the following :

Simple weapon
Martial weapon
Spellcasting focus

Your arcane firearm is explicitly a spellcasting focus, and so it is a valid target for SSI. I myself plan on using this to put an Enhanced Arcane Focus infusion on my Arcane Firearm, and turn it into an SSI for Shatter. 10/day 4d8 shatters is nothing to sneeze at. I hadn't thought about using Haste to do it a second time, but as far as bonus actions go, I'd probably stick to my turrets. Those 3 levels of Thief, if I instead put them into Artificer, get me to the point that I have two turrets doing 3d8 damage each on a bonus. A "Nova" fight would therefore be me casting Haste, then using all my actions to cast Shatter twice each round while firing 2x 3d8 turrets.

14d8 per turn for upwards of five turns is.. pretty good... admittedly this is level 14, though.

[Waterdeep Merch]

Speaking of magic missile, you know what IS a hilariously cheap tactic at levels 10+?

Wand of Magic Missile and cheap hirelings.

They require no attunement, recharge themselves, and as an uncommon item, they'll cost you 100 gp and 2 1/2 days to craft each. You really shouldn't care about hiring capable minions, go for cheap laborers- quantity over quality, because all you need them to do is wave your kill sticks at whatever you want dead. You can hire a battalion for a handful of gold a day.

And just in case the DM has funny ideas about them trying to kill you and run off with your weaponry, be sure to keep Shield prepared at all times. And possibly a helmet and a face guard at the table for when the DM physically throws things at you.

[Dork_Forge]

It is for UA armorer, not that that helps.

However, yes, you can make an arcane firearm into an SSI. To make your SSI, an item must be one of the following :

Simple weapon
Martial weapon
Spellcasting focus

Your arcane firearm is explicitly a spellcasting focus, and so it is a valid target for SSI. I myself plan on using this to put an Enhanced Arcane Focus infusion on my Arcane Firearm, and turn it into an SSI for Shatter. 10/day 4d8 shatters is nothing to sneeze at. I hadn't thought about using Haste to do it a second time, but as far as bonus actions go, I'd probably stick to my turrets. Those 3 levels of Thief, if I instead put them into Artificer, get me to the point that I have two turrets doing 3d8 damage each on a bonus. A "Nova" fight would therefore be me casting Haste, then using all my actions to cast Shatter twice each round while firing 2x 3d8 turrets.

14d8 per turn for upwards of five turns is.. pretty good... admittedly this is level 14, though.

Even if the Armorer was applicable it's sketchy whether or not it would work. SSI specifies a spell from the Artificer spell list, where as the subclass spells state they simply count as Artificer spells for you. On the other hand the Warlock states the spells are added to the Warlock spell list.

[stoutstien]

Not necessarily breaking but:

SD can equip magical items. Gauntlets of ogre is a solid bump in damage. Radiant weapon gives it a reaction to use when it gets hit and blind is a painful debuff.

SSI doesn't need to be a magical item meaning it falls under the 'use and item' rules. Works with haste and thief for very good action economy.

[LudicSavant]

Speaking of magic missile, you know what IS a hilariously cheap tactic at levels 10+?

Wand of Magic Missile and cheap hirelings.

They require no attunement, recharge themselves, and as an uncommon item, they'll cost you 100 gp and 2 1/2 days to craft each. You really shouldn't care about hiring capable minions, go for cheap laborers- quantity over quality, because all you need them to do is wave your kill sticks at whatever you want dead. You can hire a battalion for a handful of gold a day.

And just in case the DM has funny ideas about them trying to kill you and run off with your weaponry, be sure to keep Shield prepared at all times. And possibly a helmet and a face guard at the table for when the DM physically throws things at you.

This sort of thing is why we nerfed magic missile wands :smalltongue:

[carrdrivesyou]

Here's a nifty trick: Artillerist Artificer 3. Make a bag of holding. Be a Warforged.

Create your turret to sit on your shoulder. Sit in your bag of holding because you do not have to breathe, nor do you exceed the weight limits of the bag. Put the bag of holding in another PC's backpack.

Pop out during a fight to fire laser beams over your friend's shoulder with three quarters cover.

[stoutstien]

This sort of thing is why we nerfed magic missile wands :smalltongue:
We added an arcana check if a wands spell is not on the users spell list.

Still eats charges on failed check.

[Waterdeep Merch]

We added an arcana check if a wands spell is not on the users spell list.

Still eats charges on failed check.
It should've natively had a "requires the user to be a spellcaster" from the beginning, at least. In any world where it's even possible to craft it or purchase multiple, these suckers are overpowered.

An artificer is just the most convenient at mass producing them.

[Ventruenox]

I've been toying with an aggro-tank idea for a bit. Start with a Warforged with AC bumping Infusions & spells.

Using the Armorer subclass, take 1-2 levels of Fighter for the Interception fighting style and Action Surge. With the Guardian mode of your Power Armor, use your bonus action each round for some temp HP and your reaction to further reduce damage. With your physical attacks forcing disadvantage on other targets, probably having Blur active, and Sanctuary on the spell list, that's a pretty solid defensive strategy to draw and survive enemy attacks on lower tiers of play.

A four level dip into Battlemaster could serve this build well with Sentinel/Shield Master, and the Menacing Attack, Bait & Switch, and Restraining Strike maneuvers.

Also, Magic Missile is on the Armorer spell list if you want to pull off jaapleton's combo with Action Surge + Haste for 4x castings minus the Arcane Firearm damage. (Which would not apply to every missile, just once per casting)

[stoutstien]

I've been toying with an aggro-tank idea for a bit. Start with a Warforged with AC bumping Infusions & spells.

Using the Armorer subclass, take 1-2 levels of Fighter for the Interception fighting style and Action Surge. With the Guardian mode of your Power Armor, use your bonus action each round for some temp HP and your reaction to further reduce damage. With your physical attacks forcing disadvantage on other targets, probably having Blur active, and Sanctuary on the spell list, that's a pretty solid defensive strategy to draw and survive enemy attacks on lower tiers of play.

A four level dip into Battlemaster could serve this build well with Sentinel/Shield Master, and the Menacing Attack, Bait & Switch, and Restraining Strike maneuvers.

Also, Magic Missile is on the Armorer spell list if you want to pull off jaapleton's combo with Action Surge + Haste for 4x castings minus the Arcane Firearm damage. (Which would not apply to every missile, just once per casting)

Mirror image might beat blur once you get maxed out on AC depending on how many attacks you are facing each round. Haste + SSI (mirror image) is what I'm looking cat for laughable high staying power. True sight is a weakness but the haste dodge + bonus single attack takes over.

[MaxWilson]

I've been toying with an aggro-tank idea for a bit. Start with a Warforged with AC bumping Infusions & spells.

Using the Armorer subclass, take 1-2 levels of Fighter for the Interception fighting style and Action Surge. With the Guardian mode of your Power Armor, use your bonus action each round for some temp HP and your reaction to further reduce damage. With your physical attacks forcing disadvantage on other targets, probably having Blur active, and Sanctuary on the spell list, that's a pretty solid defensive strategy to draw and survive enemy attacks on lower tiers of play.

A four level dip into Battlemaster could serve this build well with Sentinel/Shield Master, and the Menacing Attack, Bait & Switch, and Restraining Strike maneuvers.

Honestly that all seems like overkill, when a bog-standard level 3 Artillerist can already impose disadvantage while spewing 2d8 flames (save for half) in a 15' cone: Flamethrower turret bonus action + Dodge action. Enemies can't ignore you because you're hosing them down with fire, and they can't hit you often because you're Dodging and you've got AC 18+.

Yes, you can Blur/Sanctuary/use armor infusions/be a Warforged on top of that, but low-level Artificers don't have great uses for their actions anyway (too few spell slots) so you might as well enjoy the flamethrower. The only downside is that the flamethrower competes with the temp HP turret which is even better, for the party as a whole.


True sight is a weakness but the haste dodge + bonus single attack takes over.

Just for the record: Haste offers an extra Attack (one weapon attack only), Dash, Disengage, Hide, or Use an Object. Extra Dodge is not an option. (But Disengage with Hasted speed is probably better than Dodge would be anyway.)

[Taboomantis]

Here's a nifty trick: Artillerist Artificer 3. Make a bag of holding. Be a Warforged.

Create your turret to sit on your shoulder. Sit in your bag of holding because you do not have to breathe, nor do you exceed the weight limits of the bag. Put the bag of holding in another PC's backpack.

Pop out during a fight to fire laser beams over your friend's shoulder with three quarters cover.

The opening of a bag of holding doesn't expand to accommodate the item going into it, that's how I play it at my table. The item also needs to be able to be handled by the person. You can't lift a body bigger then a small child with one arm.

[stoutstien]

Honestly that all seems like overkill, when a bog-standard level 3 Artillerist can already impose disadvantage while spewing 2d8 flames (save for half) in a 15' cone: Flamethrower turret bonus action + Dodge action. Enemies can't ignore you because you're hosing them down with fire, and they can't hit you often because you're Dodging and you've got AC 18+.

Yes, you can Blur/Sanctuary/use armor infusions/be a Warforged on top of that, but low-level Artificers don't have great uses for their actions anyway (too few spell slots) so you might as well enjoy the flamethrower. The only downside is that the flamethrower competes with the temp HP turret which is even better, for the party as a whole.



Just for the record: Haste offers an extra Attack (one weapon attack only), Dash, Disengage, Hide, or Use an Object. Extra Dodge is not an option. (But Disengage with Hasted speed is probably better than Dodge would be anyway.)

Yea I was thinking hasted action attack and normal action dodge. Facing off vs one large threat the disadvantage effect is the primary goal so the single attack should be fine. If you miss you can always use attack action.

[Quoz]

Infuse a bag of holding, then attach it to the back of a shield for a miniature portable hole. Useful as a quick place to dive into when avoiding large AoEs, or hop in and slide the shield between bars on a gate or under a door. Craft an immovable rod and attach as the shield handle, now you can make a floating foxhole for an archer or mage to rain down pain with improved cover and an elevated position.


Really off the wall combo if UA is on the table: take a 3 level dip in fighter for rune knight. Their signature subclass ability Giant Stature has you become large, add 1d6 to melee attack damage and gain advantage on strength saves and checks. You can also gain a rune that for 1 minute gives resistance to physical damage. Both recharge on a short rest.

Now add in artificer with enlarge/reduce and you can get up to huge size. At higher levels you can infuse a belt of giant strength. Now your kobold can become the size of a tyrannosaurus and grapple any size category in the game.

[MaxWilson]

Infuse a bag of holding, then attach it to the back of a shield for a miniature portable hole. Useful as a quick place to dive into when avoiding large AoEs, or hop in and slide the shield between bars on a gate or under a door. Craft an immovable rod and attach as the shield handle, now you can make a floating foxhole for an archer or mage to rain down pain with improved cover and an elevated position.

That sounds like a good way to make sure your immovable rod and bag of holding eventually get destroyed by a large AoE, while you are inside the bag.

[stoutstien]

Infuse a bag of holding, then attach it to the back of a shield for a miniature portable hole. Useful as a quick place to dive into when avoiding large AoEs, or hop in and slide the shield between bars on a gate or under a door. Craft an immovable rod and attach as the shield handle, now you can make a floating foxhole for an archer or mage to rain down pain with improved cover and an elevated position.


Really off the wall combo if UA is on the table: take a 3 level dip in fighter for rune knight. Their signature subclass ability Giant Stature has you become large, add 1d6 to melee attack damage and gain advantage on strength saves and checks. You can also gain a rune that for 1 minute gives resistance to physical damage. Both recharge on a short rest.

Now add in artificer with enlarge/reduce and you can get up to huge size. At higher levels you can infuse a belt of giant strength. Now your kobold can become the size of a tyrannosaurus and grapple any size category in the game.

Hehe. I knew about the combo but being a kobold is clever.

[Taboomantis]

Infuse a bag of holding, then attach it to the back of a shield for a miniature portable hole. Useful as a quick place to dive into when avoiding large AoEs, or hop in and slide the shield between bars on a gate or under a door. Craft an immovable rod and attach as the shield handle, now you can make a floating foxhole for an archer or mage to rain down pain with improved cover and an elevated position.


Really off the wall combo if UA is on the table: take a 3 level dip in fighter for rune knight. Their signature subclass ability Giant Stature has you become large, add 1d6 to melee attack damage and gain advantage on strength saves and checks. You can also gain a rune that for 1 minute gives resistance to physical damage. Both recharge on a short rest.

Now add in artificer with enlarge/reduce and you can get up to huge size. At higher levels you can infuse a belt of giant strength. Now your kobold can become the size of a tyrannosaurus and grapple any size category in the game.

If I had a player at the table I didn't want anymore, I would let him do this once. When it comes time to get out of the bag? Well darn, he needs someone to reach in.

[SpawnOfMorbo]

Building a list of ideas to make an artificer even crazier. All suggestions must be RAW.
Multiclass into one level of forge cleric. Pick up shield of faith.

Heavy armor artificer
AC with shield = 20. (plate)
+1 with forge feature
+1 if warforged
+2 with shield of faith
+1 AC shield infusion.
Total AC 25. At level 3. Artificer 2 cleric 1

You can have a 100 AC at level 1 and any DM worth their salt will still challenge you. You will also be crit when going up against swarms of enemies and a DM will have a lot of fun throwing a "swarm of Kobolds" at you.

This artificer is not all that crazy.

[Taboomantis]

You can have a 100 AC at level 1 and any DM worth their salt will still challenge you. You will also be crit when going up against swarms of enemies and a DM will have a lot of fun throwing a "swarm of Kobolds" at you.

This artificer is not all that crazy.

Battle Smith gets shield spell. As a reaction, +5 AC. The only thing going to hit this guy for a very long time is crits. Or as a DM your going to have to cast a lo of spells at the party.

[SpawnOfMorbo]

Battle Smith gets shield spell. As a reaction, +5 AC. The only thing going to hit this guy for a very long time is crits. Or as a DM your going to have to cast a lo of spells at the party.

I really think you don't understand what broken is.

AC (and HP damage via AC) are easy to get around. There are 6 saving throws, 6 general ability checks, and a ton of stuff that will easily give your artificer a run for their money.

The DMs job is to challenge a player and your battlesmith will easily be worn down. Not everything is an attack roll.

I really think people have gotten soft when it comes to what a strong character actually is.


Edit: Kobolds with alchemist fire, pushing your character off a cliff, traps that target dex, and so many other things.

You can have 2.5 Million Armor Class in my game if you want, I'll challenge your character and laugh when you get mad that your crazy alchemist is just like everyone else. Yeah, enemies will attack and miss you, but they won't always be dumb enough to keep doing the same thing over and over.

[DarknessEternal]

Battle Smith gets shield spell. As a reaction, +5 AC. The only thing going to hit this guy for a very long time is crits. Or as a DM your going to have to cast a lo of spells at the party.

You’re only one man who does negligible damage and no way to make enemies fight you. You’ve only made your party easier to kill since they’ll no longer have your hit points as a resource.

Tank builds that are only self-toughness are the opposite of optimized.

[stoutstien]

You’re only one man who does negligible damage and no way to make enemies fight you. You’ve only made your party easier to kill since they’ll no longer have your hit points as a resource.

Tank builds that are only self-toughness are the opposite of optimized.

BS can put out comparable damage to a Paladin over 6-8 encounters with more tools to punish foes for attacking others. (SD reaction disadvantage, radiant weapon on ally, more SaD so easier to pick up feats like sentinel).

The point was the artificer has adequate defense without focusing on it.