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View Full Version : D&D 5e/Next Class: Bruiser (variant Rogue, Strength-based)



Draz74
2020-03-18, 11:17 AM
A lot of people have homebrewed something similar to this, but I wasn't quite satisfied with any of the versions I saw. So I'm mixing and matching elements of them to get what I want.

I'm also making this a base class, rather than a subclass for fighter or rogue or barbarian. None of those chassis classes have just what I want -- or rather, they all have features that I don't want on my Bruiser.

(Truth be told, I expect to use it mostly for NPCs, although I'd like it to be balanced for PCs. I think it's marginally underpowered as-is, at least in a typical leave-the-city-and-fight-monsters campaign, but I'm not sure how to fix that without losing flavor. At least I think it's balanced in an urban campaign where you fight mostly humanoids.)

I've been informed I really should have subclasses for this creation ...

The Bruiser

Hit Points
Hit Dice: d10
Hit Points at 1st Level: 10 + your Constitution modifier
Hit Points at Higher Levels: 1d10 (or 6) + your Constitution modifier per Ruffian level after 1st

Proficiencies
Armor: Light and medium armor
Weapons: Simple weapons, two martial weapons of your choice
Saving Throws: Strength, Constitution
Skills: Choose 3 from Acrobatics, Athletics, Deception, Insight, Intimidation, Investigation, Perception, Performance, Persuasion, Sleight of Hand, and Stealth.

Starting Equipment

A melee weapon you're proficient with
A light crossbow and a quiver with 20 bolts, two daggers
(a) a burglar's pack, (b) a dungeoneer's pack, or (c) an explorer's pack
(a) studded leather armor, or (b) a chain shirt armor
Alternatively, you may start with 5d4 × 10 gp to buy your own equipment.

Multiclassing
Prerequisite: Str 13
Proficiencies: Light and medium armor, 1 skill from Acrobatics, Athletics, Deception, Insight, Intimidation, Investigation, Perception, Performance, Persuasion, Sleight of Hand, and Stealth.
Since this is a Rogue variant, a multiclassing character probably should not be allowed to have levels both in Bruiser and in Rogue.



Level
Proficiency Bonus
Brutish Strike
Features


1
+2
1d6
Expertise, Brutish Strike, Thieves' Cant


2
+2
1d6
Dirty Fighting, Street Fighting Technique


3
+2
2d6
Archetype


4
+2
2d6
Ability Score Improvement


5
+3
3d6
Cocky Resilience


6
+3
3d6
Expertise


7
+3
4d6
Professional Vandal, Blackjack


8
+3
4d6
Ability Score Improvement


9
+4
5d6
Archetype Feature


10
+4
5d6
Ability Score Improvement


11
+4
6d6
Reliable Talent


12
+4
6d6
Ability Score Improvement


13
+5
7d6
Archetype Feature


14
+5
7d6
Extra Attack


15
+5
8d6
Streetwise Ego


16
+5
8d6
Ability Score Improvement


17
+6
9d6
Archetype Feature


18
+6
9d6
Brutalize


19
+6
10d6
Ability Score Improvement


20
+6
10d6
Stroke of Luck


Expertise
At 1st level, choose two of your skill proficiencies. Your proficiency bonus is doubled for any ability check you make that uses either of the chosen proficiencies.

At 6th level, you can choose two more of your skill proficiencies to gain this benefit.

Brutish Strike
Beginning at 1st level, you know how to strike where it hurts, fight dirty, and take advantage of unprepared foes. Once per turn, you can deal an extra 1d6 damage to one creature you hit with an attack if you have advantage on the attack roll. You must be proficient with the weapon used to make the attack.

You don't need advantage on the attack roll if another enemy of the target is within 5 feet of it, that enemy isn't incapacitated, and you don't have disadvantage on the attack roll.

The amount of the extra damage increases as you gain levels in this class, as shown in the Brutish Strike column of the Ruffian table. Damage dice from this feature may not be rerolled by the Great Weapon Fighting fighting style.

Thieves' Cant
During your life on the streets you learned thieves' cant, a secret mix of dialect, jargon, and code that allows you to hide messages in seemingly normal conversation. Only another creature that knows thieves' cant understands such messages. It takes four times longer to convey such a message than it does to speak the same idea plainly.

In addition, you understand a set of secret signs and symbols used to convey short, simple messages, such as whether an area is dangerous or the territory of a thieves' guild, whether loot is nearby, or whether the people in an area are easy marks or will provide a safe house for thieves on the run.

Dirty Fighting
Beginning at 2nd level, you can Disengage or Hide as a bonus action. If you take the Attack action on your turn, you can, until the end of that turn, make a single grapple or shove attempt as a bonus action.

Street Fighting Technique
Beginning at 2nd level, your unarmed strike is considered a light weapon, and you may add your Strength modifier to the damage of unarmed strikes made using two-weapon fighting.

Bruiser Archetype
At 3rd level, you choose an archetype that you emulate: Ruffian, Barroom Brawler, Bodyguard, or Sleuth. Your archetype choice grants you features at 3rd level and then again at 9th, 13th, and 17th levels.

Ability Score Improvement
When you reach 4th level, and again at 8th, 10th, 12th, 16th, and 19th level, you can increase one ability score of your choice by 2, or you can increase two ability scores of your choice by 1. As normal, you can't increase an ability score above 20 using this feature.

If your DM allows the use of feats, you may instead take a feat at any or all of these levels.

Cocky Resilience
Beginning at 5th level, when you deal your Brutish Strike damage to a target, you may force the target to make a Constitution saving throw (DC 8 + your Strength modifier + your proficiency bonus). On a failure, you gain temporary hit points equal to your Constitution Modifier plus your Proficiency Bonus.

Professional Vandal
Beginning at 7th level, objects within 5 feet of you are subject to your Brutish Strike.

Blackjack
Beginning at 7th level, you have advantage on Strength (Athletics) checks to grapple or shove a surprised target.

Reliable Talent
By 11th level, you have refined your chosen skills until they approach perfection. Whenever you make an ability check that lets you add your proficiency bonus, you can treat a d20 roll of 9 or lower as a 10.

Extra Attack
Beginning at 14th level, you can attack twice, instead of once, whenever you take the Attack action on your turn.

Streetwise Ego
By 15th level, you have acquired great cockiness from your success. You gain proficiency in Charisma saving throws. If you are already proficient in Charisma saving throws, you can instead choose another ability score and become proficient with saving throws of that type.

Brutalize
Starting at 18th level, you become a master of instant knockouts. When you attack and hit a creature that has not yet acted in the current combat, it must make a Constitution saving throw (DC 8 + your Strength modifier + your proficiency bonus). On a failed save, double the damage of your attack against the creature. You can only target a specific creature with this feature once per 24 hour period.

Stroke of Luck
At 20th level, you have an uncanny knack for succeeding when you need to. If your attack misses a target within range, you can turn the miss into a hit. Alternatively, if you fail an ability check, you can treat the d20 roll as a 20.

Once you use this feature, you can't use it again until you finish a short or long rest.

Bruiser Archetypes

Ruffian



Level
Feature


3
Brutish Coercion, Bully


9
Revel in Violence


13
??????


17
Lingering Dread


Brutish Coercion
Beginning at 3rd level, you have advantage on Charisma (Intimidation) checks against creatures your size or smaller.

Bully
Beginning at 3rd level, as a bonus action you can make a special DC 20 Charisma (Intimidation) check, targeting one creature within 10 feet of you who can see or hear you. If you succeed, the target is frightened of you for 1 minute. The target may attempt a Wisdom saving throw (DC 8 + your Charisma modifier + your proficiency bonus) to end the frightened condition at the start of each of its turns. This effect also ends if you take damage, if you become incapacitated, frightened, or restrained, or if you and the target are more than 60 feet apart. If their frightened condition ends, that target is immune to your Bully feature until they take damage.

Your Intimidation check for this feature does not benefit from Reliable Talent when you gain that feature. You can use Bully a number of times equal to your Charisma modifier, and regain all spent uses of it when you finish a short or long rest.

Revel in Violence
Beginning at 9th level, your taking damage does not end the Frightened condition caused by Bully. You also have advantage on attack rolls against frightened targets.

??????
Beginning at 13th level,

Lingering Dread
Beginning at 17th level, targets of your Bully feature no longer get to make saving throws to end their Frightened condition. The Frightened condition still ends after 1 minute, or if you become incapacitated, frightened, or restrained, or if you and the target are more than 60 feet apart.

Barroom Brawler
(Can also be used nicely for the barroom bouncer.)



Level
Feature


3
Tankard Smash, Masochistic Liver, Brawling Violence


9
Great Grappler


13
Imbued Table Leg, Cheap Shot


17
Superb Grappler


Tankard Smash
Starting at 3rd level, you are proficient with improvised weapons.

Masochistic Liver
Starting at 3rd level, you have advantage on saving throws against poison, including saving throws to resist any negative combat effects of being intoxicated with alcohol.

Brawling Violence
Beginning at 3rd level, you may use a grappled creature as an improvised weapon. The creature must not be larger than you, and if they are the same size category as you, you have disadvantage on attack rolls using them. They are treated as a two-handed weapon with a base damage of 1d8, and anytime you use them to deal damage, that damage is dealt to both the target and the weapon.

Great Grappler
Beginning at 9th level, you count as one size category larger for the purposes of grappling and using Brawling Violence.

Imbued Table Leg
Starting at 13th level, your improvised weapons count as magical for purposes of overcoming resistance and immunity.

Cheap Shot
Starting at 13th level, when you successfully use Cocky Resilience, you may also stun the target until the end of your next turn. You can use this feature 5 times, and regain expended uses of it when you finish a long rest.

Superb Grappler
Beginning at 17th level, you count as two size categories larger for the purposes of grappling and using Brawling Violence.

Bodyguard



Level
Feature


3
Bonus Fighting Styles, Brave


9
Vigilance


13
Greater Interception


17
??????


Bonus Fighting Styles
At 3rd level, you gain the Protection fighting style (from the PHB) and the Interception fighting style (from UA (https://media.wizards.com/2019/dnd/downloads/UA-ClassFeatures.pdf)). If you already have one or both of these fighting styles, you can re-select one or two of the fighting styles you already had. You can't take the same Fighting Style option more than once.

Brave
Starting at 3rd level, you have advantage on saving throws against being Frightened.

Vigilance
Beginning at 9th level, you have advantage on Perception checks to avoid being surprised by an attacker. Once per round, you may use Protection or Interception without using up your reaction.

Greater Interception
Starting at 13th level, when a creature you can see attacks a target (other than you) that is within 5 feet of you, you can use your reaction to become the target of the attack in place of the other creature.

?????
Beginning at 17th level,

Sleuth



Level
Feature


3
Ear for Deceit, Eye for Detail, Insightful Fighting


9
Steady Eye


13
Unerring Eye


17
Eye for Weakness


These may look familiar; they are from the Inquisitive Rogue in Xanathar's Guide to Everything. You may use them wholesale with the Bruiser class, except that you replace references to Sneak Attack with references to Brutish Strike. (I just think this works better for some "detective" characters than Rogue does. Sam Vimes, for example, is more of a Sleuth Bruiser than he is any sort of Rogue.)

PEACH away!

Draz74
2020-03-18, 11:50 AM
Slight updates already. I made the Ruffian better at attacking afraid targets, because it's flavorful. Bully can now be resisted by Intimidation. And I compared with the Ranger chassis, and decided that the class could abide having its Hit Die upgraded to a d10.

JNAProductions
2020-03-18, 12:09 PM
Basic Chassis
Fine.

Expertise
Fine.

Brutish Strike
A bit better than Sneak Attack, but fine.

Thieves' Cant
Fine.

Dirty Fighting
Fine.

Street Fighting
Fine.

Brutish Coercion
Eh... Not thrilled at this, but I guess it's okay?

Bully
Hell no. Frightened is a POWERFUL condition, and you can inflict it at-will? Then at 9th, as a Bonus Action? And the DC is based on a skill check, that you almost certainly have Expertise in? And benefits from Reliable Talent at 11, and will often have advantage at 13?
No. This feature has to be tweaked MASSIVELY.

ASIs
As Rogue, fine.

Cocky Resilience
Feels a little high. Maybe make it 1d6+Prof mod?

Blackjack
Relies heavily on Bully, so obviously needs to be changed. Not inherently bad, though.

Professional Vandal
I like.

Reliable Talent
Yup, as Rogue.

Revel In Violence
Making Bully better has to go/be tweaked.

Extra Attack
Weird level, but okay.

Streetwise Ego
Fine.

Brutalize
Combined with Bully, too good. On its own, okay.

Cheap Shot
I guess it's okay, though why the size restriction?

Stroke Of Luck
Fine.


Overall, it feels good, except for Bully. That's broken.

Also, I did something similar a while back-feel free to grab inspiration from the Enforcer (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?566793-Enforcer-A-Strongman-s-Rogue)!

Draz74
2020-03-18, 12:22 PM
Brutish Strike
A bit better than Sneak Attack, but fine.
It's really a very small difference, considering that rapiers and light crossbows can already deal d8 damage, and if the Ruffian uses anything with a bigger die than that, they will hinder their ability to use their grappling/shoving features.


Bully
Hell no. Frightened is a POWERFUL condition, and you can inflict it at-will? Then at 9th, as a Bonus Action? And the DC is based on a skill check, that you almost certainly have Expertise in? And benefits from Reliable Talent at 11, and will often have advantage at 13?
No. This feature has to be tweaked MASSIVELY.
Noted. I thought it would be ok because it's so easy to end the condition just by dealing any damage to the Ruffian (or having an ally do so), until Level 13. Even then, you can run away to end the condition.

The first fix that occurs to me is to divorce it from the Intimidation skill, and just have it be a Wisdom save against a DC of 8 + prof + Cha modifier. Does that sound a lot better?

The second fix that occurs is to give it 2 or 3 uses per short rest instead of at-will.

I definitely feel like if I went with both fixes the result would be uselessly weak.


Cocky Resilience
Feels a little high. Maybe make it 1d6+Prof mod?
I was shooting for making it equal with Uncanny Dodge ... although it doesn't use your reaction. I'm amenable to changing this, although I don't love the idea of having to roll a die for it each time. Maybe Prof mod + CON mod?


Cheap Shot
I guess it's okay, though why the size restriction?
It's a flavor thing, I guess. Shouldn't be a big deal, since huge or larger creatures will generally have superb CON saves anyway.


Also, I did something similar a while back-feel free to grab inspiration from the Enforcer (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?566793-Enforcer-A-Strongman-s-Rogue)!

Hmm, that might be closer to what I was going for than anything else I took inspiration from. But it's still got some stuff that feels too slippery-quick-rogue to me.

JNAProductions
2020-03-18, 12:30 PM
It's really a very small difference, considering that rapiers and light crossbows can already deal d8 damage, and if the Ruffian uses anything with a bigger die than that, they will hinder their ability to use their grappling/shoving features.

Noted. The first fix that occurs to me is to divorce it from the Intimidation skill, and just have it be a Wisdom save against a DC of 8 + prof + Cha modifier. Does that sound a lot better?

It's also pretty easy to end the condition just by dealing any damage to the Ruffian, until Level 13.

I was shooting for making it equal with Uncanny Dodge ... although it doesn't use your reaction. I'm amenable to changing this, although I don't love the idea of having to roll a die for it each time. Maybe Prof mod + CON mod?

It's a flavor thing, I guess. Shouldn't be a big deal, since huge or larger creatures will generally have superb CON saves anyway.

Hmm, that might be closer to what I was going for than anything else I took inspiration from. But it's still got some stuff that feels too slippery-quick-rogue to me.

The main thing is a quick dip into Fighter nabs your GWF, which combos well with lots of dice being rolled. Not a big deal-but it's there.

It sounds better, but still too strong to be usable at-will.

Prof Mod+Con Mod sounds fine.

Draz74
2020-03-18, 12:45 PM
The main thing is a quick dip into Fighter nabs your GWF, which combos well with lots of dice being rolled. Not a big deal-but it's there.
Good catch, I hadn't thought about that at all. Hmmm.


It sounds better, but still too strong to be usable at-will.

I edited in some more thoughts on the subject while you were replying. Let's see ...

After thinking about it more, I really don't want it to be divorced completely from Intimidation. I want Ruffians to be taking Expertise in Intimidation, and I want Bully to be better against not-bigger-than-you targets.

How about ...

Bully
Beginning at 3rd level, as an action you can make a special DC 20 Charisma (Intimidation) check, targeting one creature within 10 feet of you who can see or hear you. If you succeed, the target is frightened of you for 1 minute. The target may attempt a Wisdom saving throw (DC 8 + your Charisma modifier + your proficiency bonus) to end the frightened condition at the *start* of each of its turns. This effect also ends if you take damage, if you become incapacitated, frightened, or restrained, or if you and the target are more than 60 feet apart. If their frightened condition ends, that target is immune to your Bully feature until they take damage.

Your Intimidation check for this feature does not benefit from Reliable Talent when you gain that feature. You can use Bully 3 times, and regain all uses of it when you finish a short or long rest.

Beginning at 13th level, you can use Bully as a bonus action.

Revel in Violence
Beginning at 9th level, your taking damage does not end the Frightened condition caused by Bully.

JNAProductions
2020-03-18, 01:08 PM
I'd honestly make it a Cha Mod per Long/Short rest ability, and just have it happen automatically (if they fail their save).

Draz74
2020-03-18, 01:19 PM
I'd honestly make it a Cha Mod per Long/Short rest ability,
I actually thought that might still be too good, but ... I guess for most characters, who will be too MAD to invest much in Charisma, Cha Mod per rest is less good than 3/rest. Yeah, ok, I can do Cha Mod per short rest.


and just have it happen automatically (if they fail their save).

Meaning, you'd cut out the Intimidation check? That seems like it would be a lot less flavorful, even if it was more powerful.

I'll edit the OP according to discussion so far ...

On Brutalize, I'm not completely sold on having it work vs. Frightened targets. But if I make it only work on Surprised targets, it's too much weaker than the Assassin L17 ability (because that ability stacks with their auto-crit ability, making it effectively 4x normal sneak attack damage). What if it worked on any creature that hasn't acted yet in the combat?

On Cheap Shot, what if instead of the size requirement it had a Frightened requirement?

Btw, thanks for being prompt to help out with this project. I hate waiting. :smallsmile:

JNAProductions
2020-03-18, 01:22 PM
Well, even at DC 20, that means that (assuming a reasonable +2 Charisma) you have, at level 3, only a 35% of FORCING A SAVE with your action!

But, at level 20, you have an 85% of forcing a save with your bonus action.

It's just a kinda wonky mechanic that doesn't balance super well.

Brutalize is fine, so long as Bully is limited.

And the change to Cheap Shot feels good.

Draz74
2020-03-18, 01:34 PM
Well, even at DC 20, that means that (assuming a reasonable +2 Charisma) you have, at level 3, only a 35% of FORCING A SAVE with your action!

But, at level 20, you have an 85% of forcing a save with your bonus action.

It's just a kinda wonky mechanic that doesn't balance super well.

Touche, DC 20 at Level 3 for using your action is too weak. Any ideas how I can thematically tie it to your Intimidation skill in a way that balances better?

One aspect you might be missing is that, even if they succeed on their first saving throw against the condition, you still frightened them until their turn starts. Which can mean the Ruffian or her alies got a chance to shove or grapple them, or at higher levels attack them, with advantage.

Draz74
2020-03-18, 01:43 PM
Hmmm, what if I keep the DC 20 Intimidation check, but make the ability always a bonus action? Then it's good even at Level 3, when it probably fails but only used your bonus actions.

If I go with that, I just need a new ability for Level 13 ... I assume that removing the per-short-rest limit on Bully would be too strong still ...

JNAProductions
2020-03-18, 02:31 PM
I could rename my class, though, and make Ruffian a Bully-based subclass, where the other subclasses are much like yours ...

Yeah, that could work. You really SHOULD have subclasses.

Draz74
2020-03-18, 02:47 PM
Yeah, that could work. You really SHOULD have subclasses.

Heh, ok. Is there another name I could use for the overall class that works as well as "Enforcer" but doesn't copy you so explicitly? :smalltongue:

JNAProductions
2020-03-18, 06:23 PM
Thug? Scoundrel?

Draz74
2020-03-18, 06:48 PM
Hmmm, Thug only works for the Ruffian-type subclass, and Scoundrel is too similar to Rogue (and describes most Rogues too).

What do you think of Goon or Bruiser?

Draz74
2020-03-18, 07:45 PM
Went with "Bruiser." Added subclasses ... mostly.

I still need a good Level 13 feature for Ruffian and a good Level 17 feature for Bodyguard.

Draz74
2020-03-19, 08:35 AM
Made two NPCs with this class! (One a brand-new statblock, the other re-worked.) Fortunately neither was a high-enough-level character concept to run into the levels that I still need to think of Features for.

Bamodi Underhill, Forest Gnome Bruiser 6, Lawful Good (https://www.worldanvil.com/w/ferkathas-mckayb/a/bamodi-underhill-article). Bodyguard to the local Regent (who is low-level) in a rather pleasant medium-sized city. Should be indifferent towards the PCs unless they pick a fight with the (lawful good) Regent.

Artyom Rudenev, Human Bruiser 7 / Bard 1, Neutral (https://www.worldanvil.com/w/ferkathas-mckayb/a/artyom-rudenev-article). Harbormaster and Lieutenant of a Thieves' Guild in a rather corrupt medium-sized city. Can be a friend (and quest-giver) or foe of the PCs.