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View Full Version : D&D 5e/Next Cleric: Ruin domain. Feedback appreciated



Magicspook
2020-03-21, 04:27 PM
Hello everyone,

So in my world, Fomorians are these goat-headed dudes from irish mythology whose civilisation fell centuries ago. Now reduced to savage tribes living in the far corners, their sages remember a time when their mystics laid low several human civilistions. The Ruin domain is meant to represent their magic. Born from my dissapointment with the death domain,which turned out to be the 'necrotic damage domain' rather than what I had imagined, Ruin focusses on debuffing and cursing enemies. I would really appreciate your feedback as I hope to let my players use this or use it for one of my own characters one day and I'd hate for it to be OP or UP.



Ruin Domain Spells
Cleric level Spells
1st Ray of Sickness, Bane
3rd Ray of Enfeeblement, Lesser Restoration
5th Bestow Curse, Feign Death
7th Blight, Death Ward
9th Contagion, Dispell Evil and Good

Oppressive Arcanum
When you choose this domain at 1st level, your magic opresses your foes, making it harder for them to hit you. In their eyes, you are cloaked in shadow and fearsome to behold. If you are concentrating on a spell, any hostile creature under that spell's effects have disadvantage on melee attack rolls against you.

Channel Divinity: Enduring Enchantment
Starting at 2nd level, your spells take hold more firmly and cling longer to friend and foe alike. When you cast a spell which increases in duration, or allows you to target additional creature when you cast it at higher levels, you can use your Channel Divinity to make the spell count as one level higher than the slot you use.

Chennel Divinity: Wasting Miasma
Starting at 6th level, your curses become even more potent and opressive to their target. Whenever a creature fails a saving throw against one of your spells, you can choose to spend your Channel Divinity to bestow a disease upon them. They become poisoned for the duration of the spell (if the spell allows them to make subsequent saving throws against the spell, the saving throw applies to this effect as well). In addition, you can choose to affect them with one of the diseases described in the Dungeon Master's Guide

Potent Spellcasting
Starting at 8th level, you add your Wisdom modifier to the damage you deal with any cleric cantrip

I left out the 14th level featurebecause I don't have a good idea for it yet. I think I'd like the cleric to be able to conjure up some contagious plague,but I don't know how to balance it. Anyone got amy ideas?

JNAProductions
2020-03-21, 04:29 PM
Feels a little powerful, but nothing extremely so. And that's just gut feeling.

Overall, I think it's at least balanced enough for playtesting.

Magicspook
2020-03-22, 08:03 PM
What parts do you think are too powerful?

Today me and my friends experimented with a wave-style combat oneshot. We liked it and want to do it again. If someone else DMs the next session, I'll give this subclass some playtesting.

JNAProductions
2020-03-22, 08:09 PM
Again, nothing really sticks out, it's just a gut feeling.

How'd the subclass fare, relative to the other PCs?

Magicspook
2020-03-23, 04:11 AM
I haven't played it yet ;) I was the GM yesterday.

Sam113097
2020-03-23, 03:17 PM
I like the flavor! The thing that sticks out to me as potentially a bit too strong is Oppressive Arcanum, but as it only affects melee attacks, it shouldn’t be too overpowered; it seems like this would be a very tempting multiclass dip: I’m imagining using metamagic to double the effects and your Channel Divinity to double the duration of spells like Fly and Invisibility could be fun.

Magicspook
2020-03-25, 11:42 AM
I like the flavor! The thing that sticks out to me as potentially a bit too strong is Oppressive Arcanum, but as it only affects melee attacks, it shouldn’t be too overpowered; it seems like this would be a very tempting multiclass dip: I’m imagining using metamagic to double the effects and your Channel Divinity to double the duration of spells like Fly and Invisibility could be fun.

Thank you for the feedback! I didn't think oppressive arcanum would be too powerful, since it is essentially a variation of the 1st level light cleric ability (which is a reaction to impose disadvantage on any attack roll, without prerequisite conditions). But I'll get the chance to playtest it this friday, so Ill see how it works and compare to the light cleric at the same time.
I didn't really consider multiclassing when balancing this. Nor did I really think about what enduring enchantment meant for buff spells; I was really focussing on the debuffs amd didn't expect anything to be more OP than overcasting hold person. I will need to look into that further.

Thanks again!

Segev
2020-03-25, 01:42 PM
I like the flavor! The thing that sticks out to me as potentially a bit too strong is Oppressive Arcanum, but as it only affects melee attacks, it shouldn’t be too overpowered; it seems like this would be a very tempting multiclass dip: I’m imagining using metamagic to double the effects and your Channel Divinity to double the duration of spells like Fly and Invisibility could be fun.

A problem I have with the cleric class in general is that it seems very tempting for a multiclass dip, but I have trouble conceiving of a character that follows it all the way up. I think it's the lack of choices post level 1, other than what spells to prepare that day.

Magicspook
2020-03-27, 07:17 PM
So I played my cleric at 5th level today, but I didnt really get the chance to properly test the features, sadly. Due to all the enemies being powerful monsters, there was never a reason to use enduring enchantment, and due to my atrocious rolls almost one of my debuffs ever arrived. On the flip side, my summoned giant constrictor snake (staff of the adder) landed multiple crits... I did manage to ray-of-enfeeble a hydra, which meant I could run out of its reach without fearing repercussions (disadvantage + half damage), after which I burnt it to a crisp with guiding bolt.

Luckily, we have another session planned for sunday. We get to make 10th level characters, so i am going to 'level up' my current character and check out the higher-end features. Ill post here if I find anything.

Grim Portent
2020-03-27, 09:09 PM
Oppressive Arcanum is definitely strong, but I wouldn't say it's meaningfully stronger than the options Clerics already have access to.

Enduring Enchantment feels odd thematically since this is a curse focused subclass, but if it didn't effect spells used on friendlies as well as enemies it would be far too situational, so I have no ideas to alter it.

Wasting Miasma seems good. Will be a bit powerful if it works on a boss enemy, but there's lot's of things immune to the poisoned condition and powerful monsters tend to have decent saving throws anyway.



The last feature could perhaps be something themed after Balor? Looking at official subclass abilities they're an odd mix. Some are utility abilities, some combat powers and some just passive buffs. Maybe something to damage the landscape? The exact abilities attributed to Balor's evil eye vary, but one version has it cause things to burst into flame as it's uncovered. Perhaps the Ruin cleric could spend a few turns focusing on an area to cause it to become difficult terrain, then burst into flame after a few rounds or minutes? A destroyer of cities kind of power.

Magicspook
2020-03-30, 05:16 PM
Oppressive Arcanum is definitely strong, but I wouldn't say it's meaningfully stronger than the options Clerics already have access to.


After playing another session, this time at 10th level, this ability came up only a single time. It did mean the enemy missed, so that was nice I guess. But melee attacks against backline clerics are quite rare.



Enduring Enchantment feels odd thematically since this is a curse focused subclass, but if it didn't effect spells used on friendlies as well as enemies it would be far too situational, so I have no ideas to alter it.


The main thing I was going for was to increase the duration of spells like bestow curse and to allow spells like bane to be cast at more targets. Its moment of glory should have come when I threw hold person over four enemies at once, but by some miracle, only one of the guys failed his saving throw. I tried it again later on that session on a bunch of devils. Guess what, devils are nigh-immune to save spells. I think enduring enchantment is in the right place but one the situaltional side. I haven't tried it on buffs yet, maybe that will turn out to be a little OP.



Wasting Miasma seems good. Will be a bit powerful if it works on a boss enemy, but there's lot's of things immune to the poisoned condition and powerful monsters tend to have decent saving throws anyway.

Sadly, the only guy I managed to miasma was a wizard who then promptly refused to cast his only attack spell, firebolt. On melee characters, is definately strong, but I think it is as strong as I want it to be.

I did change the disease clause to be instead of the poisoned condition rather than in addition, to further separate its combat use from its out-of-combat use.



The last feature could perhaps be something themed after Balor? Looking at official subclass abilities they're an odd mix. Some are utility abilities, some combat powers and some just passive buffs. Maybe something to damage the landscape? The exact abilities attributed to Balor's evil eye vary, but one version has it cause things to burst into flame as it's uncovered. Perhaps the Ruin cleric could spend a few turns focusing on an area to cause it to become difficult terrain, then burst into flame after a few rounds or minutes? A destroyer of cities kind of power.


That sounds very cool! Right now, I've gone very roleplay-y with a 3-hour long ritual to create a massive contagious plague. However, there is a bit of a jarring mismatch between this feature and others in the PHB. I like your suggestion; Ill ruminate on it a bit more.

Nagog
2020-03-30, 05:53 PM
I really like this idea! The mechanics are flavorful, but not enforced, and general enough to be put to many different uses. I would suggest as a 17th level ability the capacity to make your diseases and curses spread. When a creature is under the effects of Wasting Miasma, hitting them with a melee attack triggers a burst of foul poisons to be released in the air. Enemy creatures within 15 feet of the target make a Constitution saving throw or share the poisoned condition/disease inflicted on the original target. This condition lasts for 1 minute. Those afflicted may also be targeted with attacks and release their own viral cloud (one cloud per poisoned target). Afflicted targets may make a new Constitution save at the end of each of their turns, ending the effect on a success.

This would be pretty powerful against crowds of enemies, but BBEG battles it wouldn't grow as much. It would, however, help bring home the plague/curse feel of things and provide a good, new playstyle to share with the party.

Magicspook
2020-04-10, 07:56 AM
I really like this idea! The mechanics are flavorful, but not enforced, and general enough to be put to many different uses. I would suggest as a 17th level ability the capacity to make your diseases and curses spread. When a creature is under the effects of Wasting Miasma, hitting them with a melee attack triggers a burst of foul poisons to be released in the air. Enemy creatures within 15 feet of the target make a Constitution saving throw or share the poisoned condition/disease inflicted on the original target. This condition lasts for 1 minute. Those afflicted may also be targeted with attacks and release their own viral cloud (one cloud per poisoned target). Afflicted targets may make a new Constitution save at the end of each of their turns, ending the effect on a success.

This would be pretty powerful against crowds of enemies, but BBEG battles it wouldn't grow as much. It would, however, help bring home the plague/curse feel of things and provide a good, new playstyle to share with the party.

Oooo I really like that! Thanks for the suggestion!