PDA

View Full Version : Fighter Subclass: The Fencer (WIP Name)



Nagog
2020-03-30, 06:12 PM
Hey ya'll! I'm fairly new to this side of the forum (5e discussion is my usual stomping grounds) but I wanted to share this and get some feedback on it.
The idea of this subclass is to give Fighters a more active role, both in and out of combat. Battle Master has some maneuvers available to vary up combat, however the limited uses of Superiority dice means a good chunk of the time in combat you'll be limited to "I go to the enemy and swing my weapon at them". The intent here is to give them more tactical choices akin to the Rogue and Monk's various martial abilities. Without further ado, here's the Fencer!

3rd level: At third level, you learn the importance of form and stature, both on and off the battlefield. You gain proficiency in two of the following skills: Persuasion, Intimidation, Insight, Perception, or Investigation. Your proficiency bonus is doubled for any ability check made with your chosen skills.
3rd level: Beginning at 3rd level, you learn to fight in a variety of different ways. As a bonus action on your turn, you may adopt a stance, granting you boons dependant on the stance you are in. You lose your stance bonuses when you are moved against your will or knocked prone.
Defensive Stance: While in a defensive stance, when you take the Dodge action you may immediately make one weapon attack as a bonus action. You may also make this attack as part of the bonus action of adopting this stance, if you have taken the Dodge action this round.
Aggressive: While in this stance, your attack rolls achieve a critical hit on a roll of 19 or 20.
Nimble: While in this stance, your movement speed increases by 10 feet, and opponents you hit with a melee attack are unable to make attacks of opportunity against you during your movement.

7th level: Debt of Mercy: When you reduce a creature to 0 hit points, you may choose to instead reduce them to 1 hit point, at which time the target makes a Charisma saving throw. The DC is 8 + your proficiency modifier + Your Strength or Dexterity modifier (player's choice). On a failed save, the target is charmed for 24 hours or until this feature is used again. The target has disadvantage on this saving throw if no other creatures damaged it in the preceding combat. If the target succeeds on their saving throw, they become immune to this feature for 24 hours. You may use this feature a number of times equal to your Wisdom modifier (minimum of 1)

10th level: At 10th level, you learn to master your stances, increasing the buffs you gain while holding them.
Defensive: Allies within 5 feet of you gain 3/4 cover.
Aggressive: When an enemy misses you with a melee attack, you may immediately use your reaction to make an attack of opportunity against them.
Nimble: You may make 2 reactions per round. You may only take one reaction per triggering event.

15th level: At 15th level you learn how to flow seamlessly from one stance to another. when you use your Action Surge, you may change styles freely between Actions. Additionally, you may change stances after each attack roll of your Attack Action or Opportunity Attacks.

18th level: At 18th level, you are pretty awesome and can do cool stuff I'm sure, but I have no idea what this subclass should give you for it. Any ideas?


So overall I like the subclass flavor, and I don't think it gets too overpowered. The level 15 feature makes it possible to be in the Aggressive stance, attack somebody that provokes an Attack of Opportunity by missing you with an attack, then using that attack as an opportunity to switch to Nimble stance and gain a second reaction in case that individual or another individual provokes an AoO through vanilla methods. That is intentional. It is true that by 20th level that allows this class to potentially take 11 attacks per round (4 attack action, 1 bonus action off hand, 4 more via Action Surge, 2 AoO), however I believe this will be offset by the rarity of AoO triggers/Reaction triggers. And it's 20th level, the same level that many Paladins essentially go Avatar State for a minute a day, so there's also that going on.

Also, I would absolutely LOVE to change the name to something better. Duelist was the original, but may cause confusion considering the fighting style and Defensive Duelist feat.

And then there's 18th level. I have no clue what to do there.

Daphne
2020-03-31, 10:46 AM
3rd level: At third level, you learn the importance of form and stature, both on and off the battlefield. You gain proficiency in two of the following skills: Persuasion, Intimidation, Insight, Perception, or Investigation. Your proficiency bonus is doubled for any ability check made with your chosen skills.

So, no other Fighter subclass gets two proficiencies, let alone expertise in two skills. The only one who gets expertise is the PDK at 7th level. I don't mind the expertise at 3rd level, but I'd reduce to just one skill. You're not a Rogue.
___

Defensive Stance: While in a defensive stance, when you take the Dodge action you may immediately make one weapon attack as a bonus action. You may also make this attack as part of the bonus action of adopting this stance, if you have taken the Dodge action this round.
I think this is too strong at 3rd level, especially without a resource cost. You can only attack once until you get extra attack so there's no trade-off.
___

Aggressive: While in this stance, your attack rolls achieve a critical hit on a roll of 19 or 20.
I'm not a fan of the Champion, but giving it's main feature while also giving a bunch of other stuff feels wrong.
___

Nimble: While in this stance, your movement speed increases by 10 feet, and opponents you hit with a melee attack are unable to make attacks of opportunity against you during your movement.
This one is solid.
___

Nimble: You may make 2 reactions per round. You may only take one reaction per triggering event.
I'd limit this to one reaction per turn.
___


Also, I would absolutely LOVE to change the name to something better.
Why not Stance Master? Or maybe you could find less generic names for the stances and go from there.

Nagog
2020-04-01, 10:33 AM
So, no other Fighter subclass gets two proficiencies, let alone expertise in two skills. The only one who gets expertise is the PDK at 7th level. I don't mind the expertise at 3rd level, but I'd reduce to just one skill. You're not a Rogue.
___


Makes sense, I was on the fence between one and two, the justification behind 2 being the short list of skills it can apply to, and that none of those skills are based off a stat the Fighter would typically have a great stat in.



I think this is too strong at 3rd level, especially without a resource cost. You can only attack once until you get extra attack so there's no trade-off.
___


1st through 5th level, the dodge action is less applicable due to lower AC scores. If you can dodge without a cost and have an AC of 20 it means a lot more than if you can do the same thing and your AC is 15 or less. If you start with the starting equipment of a fighter and pick up a shield, you'll have 18 AC. Dodging with that build is tanky, but that's the purpose of the stance. Later, when you have an AC of 20+, it gains more and more of a cost to do so, in return becoming very difficult to hit.



I'm not a fan of the Champion, but giving it's main feature while also giving a bunch of other stuff feels wrong.
___


The Champion subclass is already leagues behind all the other subclasses at level 3, and it never really catches up until the crit range is boosted again to 18-20, at which point other subclasses have moved far past that point. I don't think using the weakest subclass as a measuring tool for the power level of a subclass is a good practice.



I'd limit this to one reaction per turn.
___


Turn separate from round? I could see that working. It's not often one person's turn provokes 2 opportunity attacks while in this stance anyway (as opposed to the retaliation AoO from Aggressive)



Why not Stance Master? Or maybe you could find less generic names for the stances and go from there.

That could work. I could pull a bit from the terminology Star Wars uses and call them Forms, but the overall name Formic Master may give some fantasy fans an alien vibe. That's a good idea, I'll give some thought to the stance names.