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View Full Version : Rules Q&A Help with a Kobold Dragon Build Idea



Bromley20
2020-04-04, 06:20 AM
My group has been running random one shot sessions online during the lockdown to pass the time. It's not a very serious group, so I'm trying to turn a kobold into a mini dragon (wings, breath weapon, frightful presence, etc) using feats and class features by level 6. My idea is to have the character claim to be a shrunken green dragon and hoard all of their wealth. No items or anything, just a place to live with a giant pile of coins inside (probably copper coins because it makes the largest pile to swim in).


Basic info on the build so far:
Race: Green Dragonwrought Kobold

Magic sleep and paralysis immunity
Claws and Bite from web
General appearance of a dragon(ish) thing


Stat rolls:

12
18
12
10
17
13
Not sure what to throw where just yet but these are the rolls I'm working with.


Class: Dragon Shaman 6 (green totem obviously)

Waterbreathing
Acid Breath Weapon
Damage Reduction Aura
Elemental Resistance (Acid) Aura
Vigor Aura
Swiftness Aura
See the Unseen invocation


Feats:

Level 1: Dragonwrought
Flaw 1: Dragon Tail
Flaw 2: Improved Dragon Wings
Level 3: Toughness/Multiattack/Flyby Attack
Level 6: Endure Blows/Frightful Presence/Flyby Breath



This is where things get weird. Awaken Frightful Presence and Awaken Spell Resistance look like they could be taken by a dragonwrought kobold since they only require the dragon type and somewhat average stats. However, the effects you receive are tied to racial HD and Kobolds don't have any from what I can see.

With Awaken frightful presence for example, would I end up with a frightful presence ability that has null range and every creature would be unaffected due to having more than enough HD? If so, that would be hilariously ineffective.

I was thinking about possibly switching to a kobold variant like Desert or Jungle Kobold so I don't take a Con hit. If I do that, I could slap that 18 I rolled in Con, take toughness at 3, increase Con to 19 at level 4, and qualify for Endure Blows at level 6. DR 2 (4 with aura active) would be useful since I don't plan on using items.

Any help would be appreciated!

Edit: Updated feat choices

Gruftzwerg
2020-04-04, 09:14 AM
are you set with the class? Imho a Dragon Fire Adapt would be much more fitting for the fluff. Add Mortalbane (feat) as nice daily dmg boost. Entangling Exhalation is a great lvl 1 feat to faceroll most low lvl encounters.
Draconic Aura: Vigor is you want to have some passive healing.

Troacctid
2020-04-04, 12:09 PM
Try taking Frightful Presence or Dreadful Wrath instead of Awaken Frightful Presence.

WhamBamSam
2020-04-04, 04:39 PM
Per page 8 of Races of the Dragon/page 4 of Dragon Magic, dragons automatically qualify for anything requiring the Dragonblood subtype. So you can skip Dragon Wings and go right to Improved Dragon Wings. Then again, if you're in a game where you're considering Toughness, that might be too cheesy.

Since you bothered getting all those natural attacks, having something like a Sneak Attack Fighter or Warblade dip so they actually do some damage might not go amiss.

You can get any 1/day 1st level Sorc spell as a SLA via the Draconic Rite of Passage. Benign Transposition is my go-to, but with all your natural attacks, you might consider Blood Wind.

Vizzerdrix
2020-04-04, 05:10 PM
You can get any 1/day 1st level Sorc spell as a SLA via the Draconic Rite of Passage. Benign Transposition is my go-to, but with all your natural attacks, you might consider Blood Wind.

Nerveskitter is also super handy.

Bromley20
2020-04-04, 09:47 PM
Per page 8 of Races of the Dragon/page 4 of Dragon Magic, dragons automatically qualify for anything requiring the Dragonblood subtype. So you can skip Dragon Wings and go right to Improved Dragon Wings. Then again, if you're in a game where you're considering Toughness, that might be too cheesy.

Since you bothered getting all those natural attacks, having something like a Sneak Attack Fighter or Warblade dip so they actually do some damage might not go amiss.

You can get any 1/day 1st level Sorc spell as a SLA via the Draconic Rite of Passage. Benign Transposition is my go-to, but with all your natural attacks, you might consider Blood Wind.

This group is full of weird cheesy builds so I'm not too concerned about grabbing Improved Dragon Wings a few levels early. For example, one person in our group is looking into whether a Warforged Juggernaut with Trollblooded is possible.

Since I can free up a feat slot by going straight to Improved Dragon Wings, I may grab Multiattack. It would be easier to land my natural attacks. Sadly, I can't take Dreadful Wrath because I don't meet the prereqs. Frightful Presence may work at 6 though. I also found the Flyby Breath and Strafing Breath that seem interesting. The idea of orbiting the fight and occasionally strafing seems like a fun time (for me, not the enemies :smallbiggrin:).

I completely forgot about the Rite of Passage. 1/day Blood Wind seems pretty nice. I learned that at level 5, I can trade my new aura for a draconic invocation. I'll probably grab See the Unseen so I have see invisibility. The Vigor and Swiftness Auras also look like they would be useful so I will probably take them as my remaining auras. I'll look into classes that would be good to dip into to boost my natural attacks.

Thanks for all the help so far!

Thunder999
2020-04-04, 10:06 PM
How does warblade put the natural attacks to good use? You can't full attack with most maneuvers, which are the main thing it has going for it.

Troacctid
2020-04-04, 10:19 PM
Since I can free up a feat slot by going straight to Improved Dragon Wings, I may grab Multiattack.
You can't actually, though, you still need the rest of the prerequisites. Being a dragon only fulfills the "dragonblood" part.


Sadly, I can't take Dreadful Wrath because I don't meet the prereqs.
Not in PGtF alone, but Champions of Valor adds new regions and assigns some existing feats to them. A couple of them allow you to take Dreadful Wrath without needing to be a particular race. So you can, if your game includes Champions of Valor as a legal source.

Gruftzwerg
2020-04-04, 11:04 PM
You can't actually, though, you still need the rest of the prerequisites. Being a dragon only fulfills the "dragonblood" part.


page 4 of Races of the Dragon and says
Dragons automatically qualify for any classes, prestige classes, racial substitution levels, feats, powers, or spells that require the dragonblood subtype.



(Note Dragons, not "true dragons")

So a DWK who is a dragon can automatically qualify for anything that requires "dragonblood subtype".

Bromley20
2020-04-04, 11:05 PM
You can't actually, though, you still need the rest of the prerequisites. Being a dragon only fulfills the "dragonblood" part.


Not in PGtF alone, but Champions of Valor adds new regions and assigns some existing feats to them. A couple of them allow you to take Dreadful Wrath without needing to be a particular race. So you can, if your game includes Champions of Valor as a legal source.

Thanks for the info. I forgot to always double check the sources provided. I don't have CoV but our group allows almost all sources for these one shots. I'll have to see if I can borrow it from someone in the group to find a region I like that allows me to take Dreadful Wrath.

The main thing from Warblade that stands out right now is Punishing Stance. It would give bonus damage to my melee attacks and adds up to 4d6 extra damage to my routine. Most of the maneuvers would likely end up being utility like Moment of Perfect Mind or Sudden Leap. Not a bad dip but there are probably better options for me right now.

WhamBamSam
2020-04-05, 12:00 AM
Others beat me to it, but just to confirm...

Punishing Stance is indeed what I was primarily referring to from Warblade. Since you also get Sudden Leap to move and full attack and probably one other utility maneuver, it likely compares favorably to 1d6 Sneak Attack in a one-shot where you won't be picking up Craven or whatever down the line.

By RAW "automatically" means "automatically," which is very different from simply qualifying for dragonblood stuff as if they had the subtype. That's likely the RAI, but frankly it's less interesting, and they published the same line verbatim in Dragon Magic.