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Letric
2020-04-04, 03:17 PM
So, we're playing a custom campaign, so I have no info at all. We will have access to Wands for healing, so I'm guessing we will have the standard Wealth by level.

The info I have is: Fighter, Paladin and Wizard. Me of course being the last. I believe the fighter and the wizard are new players.
My idea is to play something to support the party, remove conditions, do heal after combat or in combat healing if necessary.
We rolled stats, and, well, I got pretty darn good stats:

18 16 16 15 14 13

I'm not into playing a full caster class, unless you give me a good reason on how (also a build would be cool) and why they won't break the game and make it unfun for everyone else. I don't to take the spotlight, I just want to help the melee have a good time and protect them.

I had something like this in mind:

Skald (Battle Scion) Human

1 - Feat: Lingering performance
1 - HumanB: Skill Focus Knowledge (Focused Study, you get 3 Skill Focus feats for 1)
3 - Rage Feat: Good for What Ails You
3 - Feat: Eldritch Heritage (Arcane Bloodline to get familiar) > mixed with https://aonprd.com/SpellDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Spirit%20Share to deliver touch through familiar with Deliver Touch Spells
5 - Feat: Combat reflexes
6 - Rage: Outflank, so I can share it with Party!
7 - Feat: Bodyguard
9 - Rage: Harrying Partners

Besides Inspire Rage, not sure what to do. If I go melee, I'll have troubles casting because I'll be in range. If I take a 5' step I won't be able to use bodyguard.
Reach weapon seems the way to go, I could use my action to give allies +2 to Attack and Combat Reflexes give +2 to AC.
If I'm allowed traits I can take Adopted and Helpful for both my traits to get +4 to aid another, and that looks awesome!

In regards to full casters, I'm not really familiar, but I had a couple of ideas:
- Cleric evangelist > but I feel like besides casting Inspire Courage, Bless, I wouldn't have much to do, except throwing spells with 20 WIS at level 1
- Witch > this one intrigues me the most. I can handle being in close range, but not sure how it works.

Kurald Galain
2020-04-04, 03:33 PM
I just want to help the melee have a good time and protect them.
And Skald is one of the best choices for that, so go for it!

First, ensure both paladin and fighter are using a str-based build, and convince the wizard to cast some summon spells.
Second, go to town with your raging song. Stack up all the rage powers and feats you can think of, and watch your party go nuts. Spirit Totem, Reckless Abandon, Superstition, and Elemental Blood are good rage powers; Lastwall Phalanx and Broken Wing Gambit are good teamwork feats.
Third, lingering performance doesn't work on skalds (it keeps the bonuses, but not the powers/feats that you actually want). Bodyguard is good, I'd get that as early as possible. Yes, with Helpful trait as you mention; and yes, you'd obviously want a reach weapon with that. I'm not sure why you'd want a familiar considering you're in touch range yourself, too.

You'll probably have plenty of moments where you can still cast, either because the enemy next to you just got killed, or because you can 5'-step way. Don't worry about that. Ear-Piercing Scream and Cacophonous Calls are nice to have in addition to the buffs. And you can, of course, make melee attacks with all the buffs you grant yourself.

Good concept, go for it.

Letric
2020-04-04, 04:48 PM
And Skald is one of the best choices for that, so go for it!

First, ensure both paladin and fighter are using a str-based build, and convince the wizard to cast some summon spells.
Second, go to town with your raging song. Stack up all the rage powers and feats you can think of, and watch your party go nuts. Spirit Totem, Reckless Abandon, Superstition, and Elemental Blood are good rage powers; Lastwall Phalanx and Broken Wing Gambit are good teamwork feats.
Third, lingering performance doesn't work on skalds (it keeps the bonuses, but not the powers/feats that you actually want). Bodyguard is good, I'd get that as early as possible. Yes, with Helpful trait as you mention; and yes, you'd obviously want a reach weapon with that. I'm not sure why you'd want a familiar considering you're in touch range yourself, too.

You'll probably have plenty of moments where you can still cast, either because the enemy next to you just got killed, or because you can 5'-step way. Don't worry about that. Ear-Piercing Scream and Cacophonous Calls are nice to have in addition to the buffs. And you can, of course, make melee attacks with all the buffs you grant yourself.

Good concept, go for it.

Since they're new players, I'm trying to give passive bonuses during Inspire Rage, instead of giving them more options, just to make things easier for them. I'm still searching for new rage powers that are static or give a simple action.
I was considering https://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/barbarian/rage-powers/paizo-rage-powers/savage-dirty-trick-ex/, the advantage is that when we have more than 1 attack, they can use their -5 attack for this. > this does give them a new action, but it's pretty straighforward, just roll and make the enemy have something bad.
A combat maneuver check doesn't get this penalty:
CMB = Base attack bonus + Strength modifier + special size modifier
And the benefit from the trick, is great:
...must succeed at a Fortitude save (DC 10 + 1/2 the barbarian’s level + the barbarian’s Strength modifier) or take an additional penalty from the dirty trick based on the type of dirty trick performed and the following table.
Now, all of these will use my STR modifier, but I have great stats, so that can be easily a 16, 18 or even 20 at level 1.


Superstition is great, but makes them immune to spells, so you need some consideration before accepting rage.

Broken Wing Gambit > requires 5 Bluff, they still need to meet prerequisites.
Lastwall Phalanx > a bit more situational, but not bad, I will consider, not sure of their alignments.

Familiar > https://aonprd.com/SpellDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Spirit%20Share Familiars can carry items, they can carry alcohol, they don't need hands, just have it in their possessions. Familiars are eligible for spells with personal range. Once I cast this spell next to my familiar, she can use her action (for example flyby attack) to deliver an alcoholic drink to an ally, triggering https://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/barbarian/rage-powers/paizo-rage-powers/good-for-what-ails-you-ex, saving their standard actions, and saving mine as well.
I know this is situational, but gives me chances of being more useful, support the party, avoid nasty status.


Hm, the lingering performance is BAD. My inspire rage cost 2 rounds each round if I want them to get the feats. There's always https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/e/exquisite-accompaniment, and that becomes available at level 7, just when I get Harrying Partners, so, I will invest in Pearls of Power and done

https://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/flagbearer-local/ This could be a really good choice to improve my helping!

How do you think I should distribute my Stats?

Gnaeus
2020-04-05, 09:39 AM
If you are looking for passive bonuses, I enjoyed my totemic skald. By taking Bear, you get +2 enhancement to Con instead of a rage power at 3 (scales at high level). That’s free HP and it can free them from getting a +con item. Even your caster may very occasionally use it if he’s worried about failing fort saves.

You lose spell kenning, which is tragic. But you can wildshape into a singing bear, which is great.

I also liked the dirty trick rage power.

Heavenblade
2020-04-05, 09:59 AM
If you go for totemic skald you can use the bull totem in conjunction with skald's vigor for more fast heaing!
And if you invested in a familiar and have feats to spare, you can use sympathetic rage+ the valet archetype so you can raging song all day long

Gnaeus
2020-04-05, 10:56 AM
If you go for totemic skald you can use the bull totem in conjunction with skald's vigor for more fast heaing!
And if you invested in a familiar and have feats to spare, you can use sympathetic rage+ the valet archetype so you can raging song all day long

That’s true. The downsides are that your melee are almost certain to want enhancement bonuses to strength independently, and that bull wildshape < bear wildshape

Letric
2020-04-05, 11:06 AM
If you go for totemic skald you can use the bull totem in conjunction with skald's vigor for more fast heaing!
And if you invested in a familiar and have feats to spare, you can use sympathetic rage+ the valet archetype so you can raging song all day long

Not sure how the Sympathetic rage + familiar thing works, how do I get endles raging song?


And going totemic means losing Spell Kenning and with no Divine Casters in the party except the Paladin, it's a big problem! Mostly for those corner case spells.
Plus I can make scrolls with Spell Kenning, and having access to Raise Dead eventually.

Heavenblade
2020-04-05, 12:16 PM
Ok so apperantly the combo works with rage, not raging song (unless you are 20th level but that doesnt seem to be the case)