Best +1 or +2 LA Templates for 3.5 Druids?

[Endarire]

Greetings, all!

What +1 or +2 LA templates are best for Druids considering they can Wild Shape? Let's assume these are given as quest rewards or other means and don't 'cost' LA per se. Also assume all 3.5 sources are legal including web and magazine sources.

[Thurbane]

Divine Minion (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/mb/20050209a) for an unlimited wild shape pool? You may not be able to fuel your Druid WS uses/day; but if you take WS feats, you should be able to use it to fuel them.


..at least according to when I asked this question in the RAW thread.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Saint (BoED) is +2 LA, but you'll need to be NG and exalted. Also requires three exalted feats and character level 6+ (BoED p29).

Shadow Creature (LoM) is +2 LA and grants the amazing Shadow Blend (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/shadowMastiff.htm) ability, along with cold resistance, fast healing, and a number of other benefits.

Quasilycanthrope (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/mb/20040721a) is +1 LA and gives DR 10/Silver, plus a minor cosmetic shapechange ability. That page also has one of the best Druid spells in the game, by the way.

Divine Minion (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/mb/20050209a) gives Wild Shape at will as a free action for one or a few specific forms. Arguably the effective Druid level 11th on that will stack with actual levels of Druid for max HD and duration, but not what sizes or types. It's one of the best ways to enter Master of Many Forms.

Half-Fey (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/sp/20040213a) in Fiend Folio is +2 LA and gives immunity to enchantments, wings, and a ton of spell-like abilities.

[Thunder999]

Phrenic creature is a pretty great +2 option. +2 wis, +4 cha, 10+HD power resistance (which is spell resistance in the default transparency rules), psionic subtype and a whole heap of psi like abilities, including fission if you hit 17, needless to say fission on a druid would be crazy good.

Vecna blooded is always amusing for +1, everyone just forgets you exist and you're immune to divination.

[DwarvenWarCorgi]

Dark Creature from ToM is +1, grants +10 to all forms of movement, Darkvision, superior low light vision, resist cold 10, and more.

[NotASpiderSwarm]

Dark Creature and Saint are both good. Another option is Necropolitan, from Libris Mortis. It's not technically a LA, instead you lose 1 level+1000 xp, and in exchange you get the Undead type with all the advantages and disadvantages that brings. D12 hit dice means you can dump Con, and the various immunities(and weaknesses) stick with you when you Wildshape. You also qualify for feats like Lifesight and can use the Fangshield Druid sub level, which are both moderately useful.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Dark Creature and Saint are both good. Another option is Necropolitan, from Libris Mortis. It's not technically a LA, instead you lose 1 level+1000 xp, and in exchange you get the Undead type with all the advantages and disadvantages that brings. D12 hit dice means you can dump Con, and the various immunities(and weaknesses) stick with you when you Wildshape. You also qualify for feats like Lifesight and can use the Fangshield Druid sub level, which are both moderately useful.

If you go the Necropolitan route, say you were made one within the area of a Fell Energy Desecrate spell, with an evil altar present. That will give you +6 hp per hd permanently. If possible, also say the individual who made you one was a Dread Necromancer 8+ with at least one level of Wizard specialized in Necromancy with the Enhanced Undead ACF in UA, and the entire Corpsecrafter line of feats in LM.

[Endarire]

Undeath won't work well for this NG Druid. We're fighting Undead, not expanding their reach!

Shadow and Dark are the most likely candidates I'll ask our GM about.

What spiffy Druid-friendly +3 or +4 LA templates do you recommend?

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Woodling (MM3) is +3 LA and turns you into a plant creature.

Take a look at the variant Half-Fiend (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20060630a), and consider adapting that to make a variant Half-Celestial. If it's based on a celestial with a very high Con and Wis (higher than its other stats), the half-version of that would have higher bonuses to those ability scores. I haven't really looked at the stats of celestials so I'm not sure what would be a suitable candidate, but it may be worth looking into.

I know what you said about undead, but Lich would be pretty fantastic.

Saint still has my vote if you can swing the exalted status and feats.

[Quertus]

I just have to be the killjoy, and point out that, normally, even if a deity came down and granted a new form / template, that LA would still "count". It's actually part of a useful trick to back large sums of XP for crafting items, casting Wish, etc.

That out of the way, I would ask, "how many of these bonuses does the Druid retain while in wild shape?", except… as long as this is a "gift" that is breaking the rules anyway, why not make it part of the gift that they "just do" keep every aspect in any form.

Feral might actually be an interesting option in this scenario. The loss of Intelligence does not result in a retroactive loss of skill points, making this better than a "normal" Feral Druid. Getting to keep all the pounce, fatty healing, etc in any form makes a lot more forms viable - never mind the stat bonuses.

Lycanthropy might be interesting… the Druid is now the were creature, the Father of all Lycanthropes. Any form that they're in, they get DR, and can spread the corresponding lycanthropy. And, arguably, they could take the intermediate forms for all creatures, too.

If you want to be punitive, the "+0 LA" "hit by a Rod of Wonder" could turn them permanently blue, purple, or green. Makes for rather distinctive forms. (This feels familiar…).

As long as we're looking at… "stylistic" options, and aren't caring too much about the rules, why not make them an actual Transformer? Let them apply the "effigy" template to any forms that they take (perhaps even to their default form, as well). DR adamantine, bonus HP, and let's give them the bonuses as though crafted by an Effigy Master, too.

"Corpse" and "Bone" would also make interesting +1 LA templates, for the undead critters it would produce. (EDIT: pity about the "no undead" - I figured that this was most likely a punitive option)

As would "Winged", lol. Even gives a Wisdom bonus.

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Myself, personally? I love Chaos, and having a Table of Doom™ to roll on. So… I would love a GM to invent a custom Chaos Chassis. Features might include…

Ring of Gygax style bonuses: each day, get a +4 (racial) bonus to one random stat, and a +2 to a different stat. These bonuses last until a random time the next day, when new bonuses are rolled.

Similar random bonuses (rolled separately) to NAC, movement… maybe even DR, or an extra daily use of wild shape - your imagination's the limit.

When you attempt to wild shape, choose a form, such as "brown bear". Then roll on the Table of Doom, and apply the corresponding template to the form (note that "player's choice" and "no template" are the two most likely options). Any form taken with this use of wild shape must apply the same template.

This would likely be too much work to use at an actual table, though. :smallbiggrin:

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Really, IMO, it should depend on *who is giving the gift* as to what they could / should get.

[Endarire]

Why would Lich be so mechanically viable?

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Why would Lich be so mechanically viable?

Lich is an extremely powerful template that can deliver its paralyzing touch on the first natural weapon attack that hits each round when in a wild shape form. Being undead makes you immune to pretty much all of the special attacks of undead creatures. A lich can't be killed, keep your phylactery in a safe place (or make it a giant old oak tree protected by Dryads or similar) and you'll regenerate after a few days if you're defeated. Druids have an aversion to the undead so one probably wouldn't become a lich willingly, but any 11th level spellcaster can make a phylactery and become a lich.

Edit: Between Wild Shape and a Thousand Faces nobody even needs to know what you are!

[Thunder999]

Lich is a pretty awesome template, it just costs way too much LA to actually take normally.

It's got some solid DR, bludgeoning and magic is a decent combo, many enemies with magic items are probably using bladed weapons so no bludgeoning, many monsters don't beat DR/magic.
The stat boosts are ok.
It's got an excellent list of immunities, even better than normal undead.
The touch attack is decent, at will save or lose is nice, and it adds some damage to natural attacks too.
Most importantly, if you hide/protect the phylactery well you never need to worry about death again. Assuming it's not a TPK you don't even have much issue with gear as your allies can grab it for you. If it is a TPK then you're probably the only reason the campaign can continue, you're the one who's not dead and can therefore resurrect or replace the party.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

If you don't want to have an undead template, that's fine, but if you do decide to go for it, make sure you take Human Heritage. You gain all the immunities and other benefits of undeath, but you still count as humanoid (human) for things like command undead and turn/rebuke undead. And since most of the things that negatively target humans are also [mind-affecting], and you're immune...

Do the physical portions of your template(s) apply after you've wild shaped into something else? Because if not, make sure all your most important benefits are mental, such as ability score bonuses and Su, Sp, and Ps abilities, else you might as well not even have them. If so, that blows the whole thing wide open.

Also, don't get the Dark Creature template (ToM). You can get an item for that.