Paranatural: And the New Forum Thread [Archive] - Giant in the Playground Forums

KatsOfLoathing

2020-04-10, 08:43 AM

Link to the latest strip (https://www.paranatural.net)
Link to the start of the comic (https://www.paranatural.net/comic/chapter-1)

Hey there, Playground! Here's my attempt at getting a forum thread started for Paranatural, the urban fantasy comedy webcomic by Zack Morrison. For those not in the know, the comic follows Max Puckett, a new arrival to the small town of Mayview who finds himself entangled in the extra-normal world of ghosts and spirits and falls in with the Activity Club, a junior-high organization of students who fight dangerous spirits and are led by the (allegedly) mysterious Mr. Richard Spender. At least, that's the idea at first: the scope of the comic rapidly expands outwards and incorporates a huge and developed cast that only seems to get bigger every chapter. There's much to see and read.

I only stumbled on the comic recently, but it's still one of the most consistently funny, well-written, and beautifully drawn webcomics I've seen in a very long time, and I was surprised the forum didn't have a dedicated thread for it (there's an old one from two years ago, but it doesn't seem to have lasted long). Now that chapter 7 has begun in earnest, I figured I'd give it a shot. Any other fans of the (Paranatural) Activity Club feel like giving their two cents?

Mr. Garcia being a (former?) Cousinhood operative both explains a lot and raises even more questions.

Feels weird to see Mr. Spender wearing something other than a tailored suit. Makes him seem a lot more vulnerable than normal. But he's still refusing to mend fences with Mina, so I do wonder if he actually took anything away from the events of chapter 5.

The opening chapter blurb from last update still has me thinking. It refers to the "three remaining veteran members of the Activity Club". I'm guessing that means Isabel, Ed, and Isaac. But does it also mean that Dimitri isn't the only former member running around? And what about the vaguely alluded-to adventures Spender and Mina had when they were the same age as the kids? I strongly believe we're going to find out what happened between Spender and Lucifer when the former was thirteen in this chapter, but I don't know what else.

Agi Hammerthief

2020-04-10, 12:05 PM

shame the comic comment section was deactivated, maybe this thread will pick up the slack.

Ibrinar

2020-04-10, 02:29 PM

It is over now but I wanted to say I found the last arc confusing, in the sense that I was confused that the story switched to that arc for some reason it didn't really fit imo.

KatsOfLoathing

2020-04-10, 03:04 PM

It is over now but I wanted to say I found the last arc confusing, in the sense that I was confused that the story switched to that arc for some reason it didn't really fit imo.

I can think of a number of reasons why, at least.

Taking a break from the perspective of the Activity Club. It gives us a chance to see how weird Mayview looks from the perspective of someone not involved in the world of spirits (answer: still really freaking weird).
Developing characters. Zack loves to flesh out the secondary cast, and Stephen was the least-developed member of Johnny's gang for a while before that chapter came out. It also gives us some insight into Davy and what his whole deal is, without having to contort the story so he could make more appearances.
It gives both reader and writer a break with a short, mostly self-contained story after the sprawling openness of Chapter 5, which was very good but also kind of exhausting to get through. Not sure where the latest chapter will fit in on that front; hopefully somewhere in-between.
It allows Zack to flex their artistic muscles and do something a little more experimental with the framing device of the chapter. I'm not sure the whole DJ Mothman and Prof. Bigfoot thing worked for me, but I could see how it would make a nice change of pace from a writer's perspective.

Could be any of those reasons. Could be none of them. Shrug, I say.

Floogal

2020-04-11, 11:07 PM

My main issue with the otherwise delightful Chapter 6 is that it feels Zack still has loads of story left to tell with the main plot, and that he shouldn't waste time with "filler" side stuff. I want him to be able to finish the main comic before he either loses focus & the plot sprawls into an incomprehensible mess (like Erfworld), or he loses the time/drive/resources to finish (too many other webcomics I've followed).

The comic started April 30, 2011. (I was introduced to the comic by a guest comic he did at Paradox Space, a Homestuck spinoff.). For almost 9 years now, we have had plot progress, but there's still a lot more to go, at least without rushing things. This little side-story took us from Jan 2019 to March 2020. I know he needs to do what he feels inspired to do to stave off burnout, but I also think he won't want to do this for the next 40 years. I don't think this comic is his main source of income, like other big ones (Sluggy Freelance, Schlock Mercenary, Order of the Stick, Saturday Morning Breakfast Cereal).

As a side note, Alex was my favourite character introduced in chapter 5, so it was nice to see her have a tiny cameo in chapter 6. I wonder, given the time spent on her, if she'll have any relevance in the future.

KatsOfLoathing

2020-04-17, 10:38 AM

So Mr. Garcia is at least still semi-active when it comes to monster hunting. That might explain that time Max saw him floating in a river? Not so much how that crossbow ended up at Spender's place, though.

Curious whether the Cousinhood has some alternative method of seeing spirits and ghosts, or whether they're divorced from that side of the supernatural entirely and "Monsters" like vampires are just visible if you know where to look.

Kantaki

2020-04-17, 10:52 AM

"Moon's not full just yet"?
So he's a werewolf/therianthrope of some kind?
Or something else connected to Luna?

KatsOfLoathing

2020-04-17, 03:11 PM

"Moon's not full just yet"?
So he's a werewolf/therianthrope of some kind?
Or something else connected to Luna?

Sounds to me more like he's going werewolf hunting than a werewolf himself. The Cousinhood are monster hunters, remember.

...that being said, he definitely could be a werewolf. Stranger character reveals have happened.

Kantaki

2020-04-17, 03:18 PM

Sounds to me more like he's going werewolf hunting than a werewolf himself. The Cousinhood are monster hunters, remember.

...that being said, he definitely could be a werewolf. Stranger character reveals have happened.

Being paired with a "I'll be fine, don't worry." makes it sound kinda suspicious to me.
Makes it sound like it's about him, not something he's hunting.

Yuki Akuma

2020-04-17, 05:07 PM

Being paired with a "I'll be fine, don't worry." makes it sound kinda suspicious to me.
Makes it sound like it's about him, not something he's hunting.

"I'll be fine [because my prey won't be able to fully transform into a horrifying death machine]" is a perfectly valid interpretation and you know it. :smalltongue:

Kantaki

2020-04-17, 05:19 PM

"I'll be fine [because my prey won't be able to fully transform into a horrifying death machine]" is a perfectly valid interpretation and you know it. :smalltongue:

Maybe, but it wasn't the first thing I thought of. I build myself a little molehill, might as well half heartedly pretend to defend it.:smallamused:
(Originally I misread it as "It just isn't full moon yet" which makes it read very differently)

KatsOfLoathing

2020-04-26, 01:22 PM

No update this week. That's a bad sign only two pages into the new chapter. Also, isn't this comic supposed to be updating twice a week?

Maybe Zack posted something on Twitter, I wouldn't know.

Agi Hammerthief

2020-04-26, 04:15 PM

No update this week. That's a bad sign only two pages into the new chapter. Also, isn't this comic supposed to be updating twice a week?

Maybe Zack posted something on Twitter, I wouldn't know.
He posted under a comic long ago that it‘s only updated on Friday.
and the occasional skip is quite normal.

KatsOfLoathing

2020-05-01, 07:28 AM

Lots of ambiguous wording getting thrown out here. I'm inclined to believe the "Her" Spender and Garcia keep referring to is the "angel" that Doorman and Nin serve, for no other reason other than that it'd be convenient, and we have enough factions running around anyway.

Agi Hammerthief

2020-05-01, 08:26 AM

good advice in the last second to panel :smalltongue:

KatsOfLoathing

2020-05-01, 09:43 AM

good advice in the last second to panel :smalltongue:

I have a feeling the relationship between Spender and Zarei is going to make up a big chunk of this chapter.

Squire Doodad

2020-05-03, 03:47 PM

My main issue with the otherwise delightful Chapter 6 is that it feels Zack still has loads of story left to tell with the main plot, and that he shouldn't waste time with "filler" side stuff. I want him to be able to finish the main comic before he either loses focus & the plot sprawls into an incomprehensible mess (like Erfworld), or he loses the time/drive/resources to finish (too many other webcomics I've followed).

Actually, I'd wager Stephen's side story wasn't filler at all. It let Zack cover some of the less-fleshed out characters pretty easily, but more importantly he also was able to give some serious details on the vampires without having the Activity Club have to find out about them or it being a non-sequitur. While the whole Mothman radio thing felt a bit iffy, the amount of information we got with the vampires probably would have had to come up sooner or later.

Right now it sounds like we have two main long-term conflicts that the Activity Club is subject to, with the first one being in the town (as represented by Davy and the vampires) and a second one in terms of spirits (as represented by...either Doorman's group or the people the dogs were reporting to, it's rather ambiguous). I'd say there's another side in the form of the Activity Consortium, but for brevity I'd say they're close enough to being "good" for all intents and purposes.

There's still a lot of stuff that the plot has to reveal or trim away, but Chapter 6 helped give some background to let Zack maneuver through the plot more readily.

KatsOfLoathing

2020-05-03, 04:41 PM

Right now it sounds like we have two main long-term conflicts that the Activity Club is subject to, with the first one being in the town (as represented by Davy and the vampires) and a second one in terms of spirits (as represented by...either Doorman's group or the people the dogs were reporting to, it's rather ambiguous). I'd say there's another side in the form of the Activity Consortium, but for brevity I'd say they're close enough to being "good" for all intents and purposes.

There's still a lot of stuff that the plot has to reveal or trim away, but Chapter 6 helped give some background to let Zack maneuver through the plot more readily.
Yeah, there's a lot of factions in play. That's not even counting the "Broken God" possessing Max (which may or may not be tied to either of the spirit factions), the vice principal/"The Witch" and whatever her deal is, and the Cousinhood. Also, the people the Pixhellhounds were reporting to were in turn reporting to somebody else. It's complex, in a word.

Doorman and Nin claim to be the "good guys" in the spirit conflict, but neither of them particularly care for humans and they were willing to work with Forge, who's not exactly a nice guy himself. Though the black robe dudes can command the Pixhellhounds, who instinctively obey the most evil person in their midst, so they're probably the bad guys in that situation.

Also, I'd like other opinions on a question I've been pondering for a bit: is Lisa a vampire? She certainly seems to know about the supernatural, and there are a few scenes in Chapter 5 where her eyes do the same ghostly-glow thing as Cody's (and they're the same shade when fully open, too). Thoughts?

Squire Doodad

2020-05-03, 05:07 PM

Yeah, there's a lot of factions in play. That's not even counting the "Broken God" possessing Max (which may or may not be tied to either of the spirit factions), the vice principal/"The Witch" and whatever her deal is, and the Cousinhood. Also, the people the Pixhellhounds were reporting to were in turn reporting to somebody else. It's complex, in a word.

Doorman and Nin claim to be the "good guys" in the spirit conflict, but neither of them particularly care for humans and they were willing to work with Forge, who's not exactly a nice guy himself. Though the black robe dudes can command the Pixhellhounds, who instinctively obey the most evil person in their midst, so they're probably the bad guys in that situation.

Oh shoot, I forgot about the vice principal and the spirit possessing Max. It'd be both hilarious and probably save a lot of time if it turns out the vice principal is just a terrible person that Zarei hates, but otherwise has no real role in the story. A bit like the gym teacher from Dr. McNinja.

Personally, I'm going to assume the Cousinhood isn't going to be overly relevant unless you count Garcia.

There's no evidence to suggest the ominous spirits (?) are backing any given side except for that they're almost certainly working against the angel.

Also, I'd like other opinions on a question I've been pondering for a bit: is Lisa a vampire? She certainly seems to know about the supernatural, and there are a few scenes in Chapter 5 where her eyes do the same ghostly-glow thing as Cody's (and they're the same shade when fully open, too). Thoughts?

What page does she do the glowing eye bit? Lisa might be a vampire, but given the Davy/Cody interactions she's on Cody's side if she is. Davy specifically is not the one in charge of the..."operations" at the middle school, and Cody is against his father. Assuming Lisa isn't a vampire sent to keep an eye on Cody, I'd assume she's either just a spooky person who has an inkling about what's going on, or doing stuff under Cody.

EDIT: Unrelated, I just noticed that at https://www.paranatural.net/comic/chapter-5-page-136 "Mr. Spender" only knows about Isabel's shoulder because Hijack is talking through him. (Hijack takes over at a bit before page 100 or something, right? When Spender opens the door for him)
Huh, looking back and rereading this with that one tidbit in mind makes this feel very intricately arranged.

KatsOfLoathing

2020-05-03, 06:06 PM

Oh shoot, I forgot about the vice principal and the spirit possessing Max. It'd be both hilarious and probably save a lot of time if it turns out the vice principal is just a terrible person that Zarei hates, but otherwise has no real role in the story. A bit like the gym teacher from Dr. McNinja.

I forgot about Max's spirit too until my second read-through.

Davy also makes reference to the vice principal (as "the witch", before we learn who that refers to), so she's definitely supernatural to some degree. Why she reacted the way she did when she crossed paths with Mina is what I'm really curious about. Doesn't recognize her somehow? Chose not to instigate a conflict in front of innocent bystanders? Something else?

Personally, I'm going to assume the Cousinhood isn't going to be overly relevant unless you count Garcia.

Fair enough. This story is definitely set to expand beyond Mayview at some point, though, given how many outside factions have an interest in the town, so if/when that happens I expect them to play a bigger role.

There's no evidence to suggest the ominous spirits (?) are backing any given side except for that they're almost certainly working against the angel.

Speaking of, I'm very curious what exactly the angel's deal is. She doesn't really fit in with anything we know regarding how spirits act and behave. Zack also said that demons are not a thing in the comic's universe (though they might've been joking), so that leaves me wondering where angels fit in, if they do at all.

What page does she do the glowing eye bit? Lisa might be a vampire, but given the Davy/Cody interactions she's on Cody's side if she is. Davy specifically is not the one in charge of the..."operations" at the middle school, and Cody is against his father. Assuming Lisa isn't a vampire sent to keep an eye on Cody, I'd assume she's either just a spooky person who has an inkling about what's going on, or doing stuff under Cody.

Here (https://www.paranatural.net/comic/chapter-5-page-80) and here (https://www.paranatural.net/comic/chapter-5-page-157). For reference, Cody (https://www.paranatural.net/comic/chapter-5-page-281). There's also her dialogue on this page (https://www.paranatural.net/comic/chapter-5-page-296), which I definitely don't think is just a setup for a cheap gag.

As for Lisa and Cody being connected... I dunno. They're part of the same friend group (which also includes Ed, Violet, and Jeff), but we've yet to see them interact outside of that context. They're also the leaders of the Student Council and Resistance at Mayview respectively, which has... interesting implications for the ongoing school plot.

EDIT: Unrelated, I just noticed that at https://www.paranatural.net/comic/chapter-5-page-136 "Mr. Spender" only knows about Isabel's shoulder because Hijack is talking through him. (Hijack takes over at a bit before page 100 or something, right? When Spender opens the door for him)
Huh, looking back and rereading this with that one tidbit in mind makes this feel very intricately arranged.

Yeah, several of the things that Hijack!Spender says and does really only make sense on a second read-through. And/or have a more tragic light since Isabel thinks her mentor is looking out for her, when really it's an empathetic spirit noticing that she's in pain.

Squire Doodad

2020-05-03, 06:24 PM

I forgot about Max's spirit too until my second read-through.

Davy also makes reference to the vice principal (as "the witch", before we learn who that refers to), so she's definitely supernatural to some degree. Why she reacted the way she did when she crossed paths with Mina is what I'm really curious about. Doesn't recognize her somehow? Chose not to instigate a conflict in front of innocent bystanders? Something else?

It's reasonable to assume that the VP was at least going to be supernatural in some regard. It doesn't stop her from being yet another thing on the story's plate though, which is annoying for predictions.

Speaking of, I'm very curious what exactly the angel's deal is. She doesn't really fit in with anything we know regarding how spirits act and behave. Zack also said that demons are not a thing in the comic's universe (though they might've been joking), so that leaves me wondering where angels fit in, if they do at all.

I'd imagine "angel" is more of a title given to a strong spirit with an angelic appearance. Sphinxes "exist" as what seems to be a subsection of spirits. One of the assumptions with this kind of story is either that the afterlife in the stereotypical sense does not exist, or exists in such a way that it can barely be seen in the main story.

As for Lisa and Cody being connected... I dunno. They're part of the same friend group (which also includes Ed, Violet, and Jeff), but we've yet to see them interact outside of that context. They're also the leaders of the Student Council and Resistance at Mayview respectively, which has... interesting implications for the ongoing school plot.

This is certainly something that's got plenty of meat on its bones, but we have to wait for a bit longer. I'm pretty much only assuming that if Lisa is a vampire and not sent by Davy, then she's working for Cody or something to that general effect. No better way to keep a town running happily than by playing the game from both sides, after all, and this applies to overwhelmingly elaborate middle school plots too.

You could also see them as being representative of opposite ends of a friend group too, with both sides trying to get what they want out of the deal. Of course, that's more just the school itself, and in that case Lisa being supernatural isn't as relevant, though it would be fitting.

KatsOfLoathing

2020-05-04, 06:49 PM

A discovery while rereading the last few pages of Chapter 6: One of the members of the cult that the psychic lady is a part of (https://www.paranatural.net/comic/chapter-6-page-40) is the same person that the Pixhellhounds report to (https://www.paranatural.net/comic/chapter-4-page-148). I'd thought he (they?) was some kind of humanoid spirit, but this suggests they're actually human, which raises... all kinds of additional questions.

I'd imagine "angel" is more of a title given to a strong spirit with an angelic appearance. Sphinxes "exist" as what seems to be a subsection of spirits. One of the assumptions with this kind of story is either that the afterlife in the stereotypical sense does not exist, or exists in such a way that it can barely be seen in the main story.

I could see that being a possibility, though the divine imagery surrounding her still leaves me wondering.

This is certainly something that's got plenty of meat on its bones, but we have to wait for a bit longer. I'm pretty much only assuming that if Lisa is a vampire and not sent by Davy, then she's working for Cody or something to that general effect. No better way to keep a town running happily than by playing the game from both sides, after all, and this applies to overwhelmingly elaborate middle school plots too.

You could also see them as being representative of opposite ends of a friend group too, with both sides trying to get what they want out of the deal. Of course, that's more just the school itself, and in that case Lisa being supernatural isn't as relevant, though it would be fitting.

Yeah, her being a vampire is still up in the air. I am definitely in favor of "spooky girl with some knowledge of the supernatural" at the very least. Suzy also calls her a "witch" at one point which, given the whole thing with the vice principal, definitely feels like a deliberate word choice by Zack.

Squire Doodad

2020-05-06, 10:31 PM

It occurred to me that in this context, "witch" could hypothetically refer to a member of a cult instead of actual magic power. Given that we know Mayview does, in fact, have it's own local Doom Cultists (https://www.paranatural.net/comic/chapter-6-page-40), it's plausible that the Vice Principal has political power within the town. In a bit of a stretch, since we know Davy wants to cover the land that makes up the circumference of the two hills (presumably linked to whatever power lays in Mayview), "the balance of power" may refer to having the VP be occupied with the school to stop her from trying to use her influence in the cult to counteract Davy's efforts.

A cult would also be something that could traumatize a child, especially given the VP's behavior.

It's perfectly plausible that the cult is also mixed up in this supernatural stuff, and maaaay happen to be related to the dark robe guys (seems to be the same outfits, they could have a spectral or two in it), though it's equally possible that the cult mentioned is completely irrelevant and just is going to show the many stacked layers of sinister plans that are occurring in the town.

KatsOfLoathing

2020-05-07, 09:12 AM

It occurred to me that in this context, "witch" could hypothetically refer to a member of a cult instead of actual magic power. Given that we know Mayview does, in fact, have it's own local Doom Cultists (https://www.paranatural.net/comic/chapter-6-page-40), it's plausible that the Vice Principal has political power within the town. In a bit of a stretch, since we know Davy wants to cover the land that makes up the circumference of the two hills (presumably linked to whatever power lays in Mayview), "the balance of power" may refer to having the VP be occupied with the school to stop her from trying to use her influence in the cult to counteract Davy's efforts.

Given that the cult and Davy are involved in both human and spirit affairs (though those two tend to go hand-in-hand in Mayview, it seems), I could certainly see something along those lines being a possibility.

It's perfectly plausible that the cult is also mixed up in this supernatural stuff, and maaaay happen to be related to the dark robe guys (seems to be the same outfits, they could have a spectral or two in it), though it's equally possible that the cult mentioned is completely irrelevant and just is going to show the many stacked layers of sinister plans that are occurring in the town.

The cult is definitely mixed up in supernatural stuff. If you look at the two pages I linked in my last post, the broad-shouldered cultist with the translator spirit sitting on his shoulder appears in both. It might be two different characters, but I strongly doubt it.

Squire Doodad

2020-05-07, 09:23 AM

The cult is definitely mixed up in supernatural stuff. If you look at the two pages I linked in my last post, the broad-shouldered cultist with the translator spirit sitting on his shoulder appears in both. It might be two different characters, but I strongly doubt it.

I didn't notice the translator spirit. Yup, another side to this conflict.

And here I thought Chapter 6 was going to give us background to lower the number of loose ends

KatsOfLoathing

2020-05-08, 09:56 PM

Squire Doodad

2020-05-11, 05:36 PM

Alright, let's get this show on the road (probably by explaining what happened to Ed's parents).

Peep the edge of Dimitri's afro in the picture on the right. And I guess Spender used a shovel as a tool at some point?

I mean, what did you think happened before Lucifer dragged him out of a lake? That Spender just magically shot proton torpedoes anyways?
I am looking forward to shovel spirit though.

Iruka

2020-05-18, 11:47 AM

Thanks for reminding me of that comic. I forgot about it when it went on hiatus.

KatsOfLoathing

2020-05-22, 09:50 PM

Good to know Zarei and Spender haven't changed much since their teenage years.

Two-year-old Ed is freaking adorable. And apparently had already broken through as a spectral? Wonder how relevant that detail is going to be.

theangelJean

2020-05-25, 06:05 AM

Two-year-old Ed is freaking adorable. And apparently had already broken through as a spectral? Wonder how relevant that detail is going to be.

Well, implications already abound in this strip ... Going to meet his mother - for the first time maybe - in Boss Leader's dreamworld? That's a kid that's already had less-than-ordinary experiences, right there.

KatsOfLoathing

2020-05-29, 11:03 AM

theangelJean

2020-06-05, 09:34 AM

Newest page. (https://www.paranatural.net//chapter-7-page-7)
Boss Leader has a predecessor?

Squire Doodad

2020-06-05, 08:36 PM

Newest page. (https://www.paranatural.net//chapter-7-page-7)
Boss Leader has a predecessor?

It's plausible that Boss Leader was the de facto leader (possibly related to this sealing of who I presume was the actual leader) but not actually the founder of the Activity Consortium.
Also, while the "strongest spirit" is almost definitely the shadow spirit Spender is a medium for (or it's Lucifer, with him becoming Spender's tool being interpreted as a sign that Spender "defeated" him, I don't think that's the grudge mentioned here. Given what we do know, I'd think it's actually the scrap dragon, given that we know it is a grudge, Mayview is apparently the general repository of spirit stuff, and Boss Leader seemed very interested in having the old snake sliced up and put into her custody.
The shadow spirit being the mystery grudge is perfectly likely, but I think it being Max's spirit is more probable.
Do you guys think the guy in the old Activity Club picture is Mr. Burger or Spender's father/uncle/etc.? He seems to have light hair and the right physique by anime standards (tall, lanky with glasses) to be either one.

Nettlekid

2020-06-07, 10:46 PM

Lots to parse on this page.

My reading of it is that Ed's parents sealed themselves away somewhere to prevent some kind of powerful spirit from escaping? And that they might've had some hand in causing it to become so powerful in the first place?

Speculation: I'm willing to wager that this grudge spirit the Burgers trapped is either the shadow creature that later goes on to possess Spender, or the "strongest spirit" that Nin claims he defeated. Those might actually be one and the same, now that I think about it.

Boss Leader and Ed's mom certainly seem like they are/were more than just work colleagues. And I appreciate that BL continues to make cracks in the fourth wall, even at the expense of the subtitles.

I think it is the spirit Spender defeated, and is now possessing him. Lucifer cites having pulled Spender out of the lake 13 years ago, (https://www.paranatural.net/comic/chapter-5-page-91-92) which would be when the Burgers first entered the Grudge's domain if 3 years had passed 10 years ago.

It's plausible that Boss Leader was the de facto leader (possibly related to this sealing of who I presume was the actual leader) but not actually the founder of the Activity Consortium.
Also, while the "strongest spirit" is almost definitely the shadow spirit Spender is a medium for (or it's Lucifer, with him becoming Spender's tool being interpreted as a sign that Spender "defeated" him, I don't think that's the grudge mentioned here. Given what we do know, I'd think it's actually the scrap dragon, given that we know it is a grudge, Mayview is apparently the general repository of spirit stuff, and Boss Leader seemed very interested in having the old snake sliced up and put into her custody.
The shadow spirit being the mystery grudge is perfectly likely, but I think it being Max's spirit is more probable.
Do you guys think the guy in the old Activity Club picture is Mr. Burger or Spender's father/uncle/etc.? He seems to have light hair and the right physique by anime standards (tall, lanky with glasses) to be either one.

I don't think it's possible for the Scrapdragon to be THE Grudge they're talking about, since presumably Boss Leader would have recognized it while she was analyzing it during Max's dream. If it was such a big deal then she wouldn't have just let him have it back.

Squire Doodad

2020-07-03, 09:02 AM

Previous post because of double posting.

I don't think it's possible for the Scrapdragon to be THE Grudge they're talking about, since presumably Boss Leader would have recognized it while she was analyzing it during Max's dream. If it was such a big deal then she wouldn't have just let him have it back.

She makes a remarkably non-subtle request to take it and dice it up, and she might not have actual access to it during the dream. Also, it seems highly unlikely that she'd straight up tell Max that he's carrying an extremely dangerous entity that needs to go into quarantine. I doubt she'd make it obvious she recognizes it either.

You do make a good point as to that BL would probably have acted as soon as possible in much less subtle ways to get the bat.

EDIT: WOW OH JEEPERS. I...think we've seen the grudge now. I think "Clayview" is the Grudge, and its presently the entire room they're in.
Related, who was Agent Summers again...? If it's no one we know then it might be BL's actual last name.

Also, we see Mrs. Burger in a picture (https://www.paranatural.net/comic/chapter-7-page-4) at the start of this flashback. It seems Spender's predecessors were Ned's parents.

KatsOfLoathing

2020-07-10, 03:41 PM

Squire Doodad

2020-07-11, 10:48 PM

Ye gods, there's a lot of colors on this page. Zack's really going all-in with the art now that their wrist is healed up. And we got to see a little of Walker's powers for the first time, cool.

Interesting that the grudge seems like it's taking on Dr. Burger's form to attack the group. I'm pretty sure that speech bubble in the last panel is saying "LOOK AT ME", which raises further questions.

Careful, Rick, we almost saw your eyes for a half-second there.

I can confirm it sounds like it's saying "look at me".
I wonder if Walker's powers are sound based or, given that he's a sheriff and the crossed out circle, it's a literal "power of the law" thing. As in he can set up a barrier that protects from things by forbidding them from entering, or something equally wacky.

Interesting that the grudge seems like it's taking on Dr. Burger's form to attack the group.

Given it seems that the grudge was forcibly made into Dr. Burger's either medium or tool, and then both were forced into sleep so as to stop either of them from doing anything while being under watch by Boss Leader/BL's predecessor, the line between the two inside this "dream" might be a bit blurred.

Yuki Akuma

2020-07-13, 08:44 PM

I can confirm it sounds like it's saying "look at me".
I wonder if Walker's powers are sound based or, given that he's a sheriff and the crossed out circle, it's a literal "power of the law" thing. As in he can set up a barrier that protects from things by forbidding them from entering, or something equally wacky.

Given it seems that the grudge was forcibly made into Dr. Burger's either medium or tool, and then both were forced into sleep so as to stop either of them from doing anything while being under watch by Boss Leader/BL's predecessor, the line between the two inside this "dream" might be a bit blurred.

Based on certain comments made by the author on Twitter, Walker's power appears to be making barriers.

KatsOfLoathing

2020-07-18, 03:58 PM

Squire Doodad

2020-07-22, 05:06 PM

KatsOfLoathing

2020-07-22, 11:23 PM

Is Mina charging at the grudge, or the door? We don't know which way the two are going at a glance, just that it's in opposite directions.

The way this scene is framed, plus Rick turning away from Boss Leader and Dr. Burger in the second-to-last panel, seems to suggest that she's running at the grudge. Guess we'll find out on Friday, though.

Squire Doodad

2020-07-24, 08:55 PM

The way this scene is framed, plus Rick turning away from Boss Leader and Dr. Burger in the second-to-last panel, seems to suggest that she's running at the grudge. Guess we'll find out on Friday, though.

Turns out she's running to Dr. Burger. I guess a Wight is an exceptionally high tier spirit, and that this itself is the big bad? I'm a bit confused as to who the baddie is actually. Presumably it's not a new foe group, and it's probably either buried such that it's under both hills (Davy), secretly the Angel, who might have white energy (Forge and co), the object of worship for the cultists (Assistant Principal and Cultists), or the spirit in Max bidding its time (???). I'm not sure why we would have both a thing in Spender, a thing in Max, and a third entity. It's, uh, beginning to get confusing.

Should we stop beginning things with a spoiler bar and instead just have it in bold each time we're talking about the newest page? Anyone can look at it, after all

KatsOfLoathing

2020-07-25, 01:26 PM

Turns out she's running to Dr. Burger. I guess a Wight is an exceptionally high tier spirit, and that this itself is the big bad? I'm a bit confused as to who the baddie is actually. Presumably it's not a new foe group, and it's probably either buried such that it's under both hills (Davy), secretly the Angel, who might have white energy (Forge and co), the object of worship for the cultists (Assistant Principal and Cultists), or the spirit in Max bidding its time (???). I'm not sure why we would have both a thing in Spender, a thing in Max, and a third entity. It's, uh, beginning to get confusing.
Yeah, it's all a little unclear. I think we'd have a better idea if we knew whether this flashback is taking place before or after Spender becomes a medium for his shadow spirit. He's got Lucifer at this point, so it's probably afterwards, but who knows.

If I'm reading Dr. Burger's response in the last panel right, apparently the wight was what the Witch was seeking, whatever that means. This flashback seems like it takes place after Mina and Rick defeated the Witch, since the flashback panel depicting that event had them younger than they are now.

I'm willing to hazard the guess that the wight and the "broken god" possessing Max might be one and the same, but I might be wrong.

Should we stop beginning things with a spoiler bar and instead just have it in bold each time we're talking about the newest page? Anyone can look at it, after all
I've only been doing it if I comment on the thread the day a new comic releases. Figure I'd at least give 24 hours in case anyone else forgot which day the comic updates.

Squire Doodad

2020-07-25, 01:50 PM

Yeah, it's all a little unclear. I think we'd have a better idea if we knew whether this flashback is taking place before or after Spender becomes a medium for his shadow spirit. He's got Lucifer at this point, so it's probably afterwards, but who knows.

If I'm reading Dr. Burger's response in the last panel right, apparently the wight was what the Witch was seeking, whatever that means. This flashback seems like it takes place after Mina and Rick defeated the Witch, since the flashback panel depicting that event had them younger than they are now.

I'm willing to hazard the guess that the wight and the "broken god" possessing Max might be one and the same, but I might be wrong.

So it seems that you can only effectively use the power of a tool of your color, but you can be the medium of any kind of spirit (like how Rick is yellow but FSS is ostensibly black). It seems Burger is black while the wight is white (or that's BL's energy?). It'd make sense that the wight is the spirit possessing Max, thus connecting the broken god to the current plotline. Either black and white are capable of interacting with each other/opposing colors acts as a seal, letting the wight have its powers neutered with Burger and for it to escape BL's eye when it somehow entered Max (maybe Burger died at the time of the beginning of the comic, and it was too weak to do much without a vessel?), or they're completely unrelated.

I'm pretty sure Burger is the "she" Mina mentions in that "if she can do it, so can I" when she's handling the train.

We have too many factions right now to say anything for certain, hopefully these flashbacks will serve to shrink them down to like 4.

I've only been doing it if I comment on the thread the day a new comic releases. Figure I'd at least give 24 hours in case anyone else forgot which day the comic updates.

I imagine just a bold line for the first day would have the same end result since if someone doesn't want to be spoiled they just see that and can read the comic themselves.

Yuki Akuma

2020-07-25, 03:38 PM

Should we stop beginning things with a spoiler bar and instead just have it in bold each time we're talking about the newest page? Anyone can look at it, after all

This is honestly how a majority of threads in the webcomics section of this forum operate. It's considered common courtesy for the first post after a new strip has been released has a spoiler box.

Squire Doodad

2020-07-25, 03:58 PM

This is honestly how a majority of threads in the webcomics section of this forum operate. It's considered common courtesy for the first post after a new strip has been released has a spoiler box.

Oh, is it? I don't use this side as much as the OotS side, so I didn't notice. Thank you for letting me know.

DevotedPaladin

2020-07-27, 11:49 PM

Mina, I appreciate the gesture, but you're pushing your plot armor a little too far here.

This flashback is just full of ambiguous statements. "You've bought me more time than you know"? Is that referring to some event we don't know the full details of yet? Or just a general statement about Rick taking care of Ed now that his parents are gone?

I think the "You've bought me more time than you know" may refer to her being able to see Ed. It may be that part of what makes her situation so dangerous is her sanity slipping and that being able to see her son, to see what she's fighting for or what see can see if she makes it out alive, that see may have more strength to carry on.

Lots of ambiguous wording getting thrown out here. I'm inclined to believe the "Her" Spender and Garcia keep referring to is the "angel" that Doorman and Nin serve, for no other reason other than that it'd be convenient, and we have enough factions running around anyway.

While it would be nice, I'm pretty sure this her is someone else. Is seems pretty heavily implied that there's a major werewolf player in the mix now, with Spender's comment of "That's why I'm worried" seeming to refer to the fact that since it's not a full moon yet "she" will have a human face. Plus a major werewolf player seems to fit as an explanation for Chapter 6 Page 40 whose last panel zooms in on giant clawed pawprints that are stepping over Forge's tracks. They don't seem to be the Murderdogs either as they're way too small to make those kind of tracks.

The "It" they're referring to that's moving again; however, I want to believe is either the Angel or the "Broken Gods"

Squire Doodad

2020-08-14, 10:03 AM

Finally, mass exposition. Hopefully this will clear up what's going on and reduce the faction count. Also, that song in the Alt Text is beautiful.

Hytheter

2020-08-20, 02:15 PM

I think the "You've bought me more time than you know" may refer to her being able to see Ed. It may be that part of what makes her situation so dangerous is her sanity slipping and that being able to see her son, to see what she's fighting for or what see can see if she makes it out alive, that see may have more strength to carry on.

I think it's actually more literal than that. She said earlier in the chapter that time was different where she is. Based on the the next line after that and the length of her hair I'm guessing it's faster on her end.

Squire Doodad

2020-09-05, 09:48 PM

Nettlekid

2020-09-08, 01:00 PM

So I'm not sure what is being said by the Wight, but it seems to be saying "Please don't [???]". Either "Please don't he c-cared", or more likely "Please don't be scared". I assume Sandman is willingly working alongside the Consortium.

Other news includes:
Boss Leader is not the first, and all of them in recent history were female
Boss Leader is apparently perpetually comatose as a result of Sandman

Do you guys think the two hills contain the two Wights in the story? Or three, if we assume the Angel is one while Sandman and "Clayview" are others. I'm guessing Rich's shadow spirit is an unrelated impending doomsday device, possibly to be used as the means to defeating whatever the final boss is.

Given the shape of the wights, this does clarify Davey's plot since they would fit shape-wise.
It also might explain why Boss Leader was so finicky about Max's spirit; it's a functional tool containing a grudge which could potentially become a Wight if not dealt with properly.

I'm pretty sure it's "Please don't be scared." Also I didn't notice at first but both instances of Wight Wail that we've seen are rainbow-colored, but very subtly with all the colors overlapping. Pretty cool, representing the white energy as an overlap of all colors.

I don't think the Angel is a Wight because she doesn't speak in Wight Wail, even though she does have rainbow text. Unless her charm is an aspect of that "raw emotion" that Wights use? I think it's safe to say we haven't seen any other Wights in the comic yet, since their presence seems to be incredibly destructive. Like the mystery spirit possessing Max probably isn't a Wight because he's not unconscious from its overwhelming pressure, and same to Spender's Shadow Spirit (especially since presumably the Shadow Spirit eats yellow spectral energy?). That said, I did immediately wonder about the implication of Max having black spectral energy - we're told it's not uncommon and we've seen a few other users (including Dr. Burger herself), but I would bet that if Wights use white energy as a mesh of all other colors then it's got to interact with black energy in some kind of way. Like white may be a superposition of all other colors but that definitely doesn't include black.

Regarding "Clayview," I'm not sure that it is a name of an entity. The way I read that page I thought that Dr. Burger was telling Rick to leave Mayview and its darkness behind, but her time inside the dream had warped her memory and she misremembered the name of the town.

Remind me what Davy's plot is and why the shape of the Wights is important to it?

EDIT: Oh shoot, I may have spoke too soon. I forgot that Spender's sister who snatched the lantern has white energy (https://www.paranatural.net/comic/chapter-6-page-46). Although I guess that just means that she COULD be the vessel for a Wight, and it doesn't mean that she currently is? Maybe she's being positioned to become the next Boss Leader.

Although that reminds me, with the implication of Boss Leader being one in a long line of differently-sized-but-still-masked Boss Leaders, could the whole thing be a scam where she's the only one and keeps reimagining herself? She can make anything in the dream look however she pleases. I feel like the focus on the previous leader having big muscles was like, a ploy somehow. That and that she apologizes to Dr. Burger by throwing the previous leader under the bus, saying it was that leader's mess that they were cleaning up. Maybe she's just covering herself? Figuratively and literally.

EDIT2: I'm re-reading from the beginning to try to catch things I didn't get the first time through. Seeing Spender remark (https://www.paranatural.net/comic/chapter-4-page-73) that the barrier was made by a colleague of his - that's got to be Walker, right? Now that we know that Walker's power is barriers?

EDIT3: Oh shoot, look who else speaks in rainbow: Dr. Zarei's spirit Patchworm.

Squire Doodad

2020-09-24, 11:41 PM

I'm pretty sure it's "Please don't be scared." Also I didn't notice at first but both instances of Wight Wail that we've seen are rainbow-colored, but very subtly with all the colors overlapping. Pretty cool, representing the white energy as an overlap of all colors.

I don't think the Angel is a Wight because she doesn't speak in Wight Wail, even though she does have rainbow text. Unless her charm is an aspect of that "raw emotion" that Wights use? I think it's safe to say we haven't seen any other Wights in the comic yet, since their presence seems to be incredibly destructive. Like the mystery spirit possessing Max probably isn't a Wight because he's not unconscious from its overwhelming pressure, and same to Spender's Shadow Spirit (especially since presumably the Shadow Spirit eats yellow spectral energy?). That said, I did immediately wonder about the implication of Max having black spectral energy - we're told it's not uncommon and we've seen a few other users (including Dr. Burger herself), but I would bet that if Wights use white energy as a mesh of all other colors then it's got to interact with black energy in some kind of way. Like white may be a superposition of all other colors but that definitely doesn't include black.

If we assume there are different manifestations of Wight Wail, then Sandman being "fear" (or something, this is just an example) while the Angel is "love" would make sense. I would guess Sandman and the Angel are Wights, Patchworm and the Shadow Spirit are not Wights but will have importance in the plot (Patchworm looks to be part of Zarei's quest to create spirits, which is apparently unheard of; the Shadow Spirit could be hypothetically used as a stopper to prevent an unleashed Wight from obliterating the town.)

I would guess given the shape of the mountains and of Sandman, Davy wants to claim both hills because one or both is home to a Wight. The Wight is just a macguffin for his plot; it has unspoken levels of power and is very valuable but it's not crucial. That said we do have too many simultaneous villains; I count three major antagonists (Angel conflict, Davy, Cultists) with a handful of infighting at each stop, plus the Shadow Spirit which could be the Cultist goal? Making the Wight be the thing that ties them together at least eases the knot.
I would guess the school is ultimately not important except for as a subsection of the Davy plot, and the Activity Consortium are generally on the side of the Activity Club, with Penny and Isabel's father not being additional antagonists but supporting characters. Notably, Penny allows for BL to "die" without throwing things into disarray, or at least gives Zack some breathing room vis a vis handling the Wights.

I'm using Clayview as a nickname for the "Burger" Wight, and without further information I am assuming it's distinct from both the Angel and/or whatever Davy is after.

We'll know more details by Friday evening though, sooooo