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View Full Version : Two questions about Rashemen's Vremyonni (Old Ones).



Clistenes
2020-04-12, 02:59 PM
I have been re-reading Unapproachable East, and there are a couple bits of lore I have doubts about...

1.-Are men with potential for divine magic taken away by the Witches, or are they left with their families?

We are told that "The Witches test all children at a young age —less than ten years old —for aptitude in magic. Those who pass these tests are taken away from their parents to be trained with the Old Ones, male Rashemi of great age and magical power."

They say "aptitude in magic", not "aptitude in arcane magic". And we know that at least females with aptitude in divine magic become clerics of Chauntea, Mielikki and Mynstra.

Also: the Vremyonni Training feat, described as "You have had more than the typical amount of training with the vremyonni, the Old Ones who research spells and craft magic items for the Witches of Rashemen." has the following prerequisites: "Able to cast 1st-level spells. REGION: Rashemen."

1st-level spells, not 1st-level arcane spells... Does that mean that Vremyonni train both arcane and divine casters?

But we are also told "Both boys and girls train. The girls are taught the deep tenets of Rashemen’s religion in preparation for becoming hathrans, while the boys study only arcane magic."

Is this an errata? Or maybe boys with aptitude in divine magic are left alone?

If so... how come male divine casters can pick the Vremyonni Training feat?

We know that "The boys are given a choice when they reach adulthood: Join the Old Ones, or leave Rashemen forever under a geas to never reveal their secrets." and that "men with spellcasting ability are segregated from their kin as vremyonni, or “Old Ones.” Divine spellcasters such as clerics or druids are not required to set themselves apart in this way, but Rashemi expect wychlaran to placate the spirits and intercede with the gods, so male clerics or druids do not have a role in society. Most become hermits or eventually join a berserker lodge (after multiclassing as barbarians) and become advisors to these elite brotherhoods."

So, are male divine spellcasters given three choices rather than two? (leaving, joining the Old Ones or staying in Rashemen as an independent cleric or druid?) Or maybe they are never taken away in first place?.

And if they aren't taken away... who trains them? Do these boys have to search for a cleric or druid by themselves and ask to be trained?

2.-Do male arcane casters do the dajemma trip?

It is said that "An important aspect of the Rashemi way of life is the dajemma, a journey of self-discovery that all young men must take before being considered adults (women may take this journey as well, but it is not required). In days of old, young Rashemi nobles made the dajemma to visit strange lands, slaying horrible monsters and wicked warlords, but now it is mostly an exercise in drinking and sightseeing. It also helps Rashemen build trade contacts with the outside world. The hathrans require all young ethrans to go on a journey (usually in groups) to learn about the outside world and report on current events."

They say all young men, no exceptions mentioned... But on the other hand, male arcane casters have to choose to join the Old Ones or be exiled after receiving a geas to not reveal the secret of Rashemen...

If the male arcane casters were allowed to travel before receiving the geas, aren't they risking they escaping without receiving the geas?

Maybe they receive the geas before leaving for the dajemma and they have it lifted if they return?

But if they do that... aren't they risking too many Wizard boys not returning...? I mean, they have the geas already, anyways, they have been raised in isolation, and when they return they will never be allowed to leave again... I would try to experience as much as possible before returning... and if they spend enough time having adventures, learning and having fun in the outer wide world... wouldn't they eventually decide they don't want to come back?

Maybe they receive a different geas, one that forces them to return before a specific date?

But even then, they could endure it with the help of a friendly cleric able to cast Cure Moderate Wounds until finding a 13 level wizard able to cast Limited Wish and end the Geas...

Zarrgon
2020-04-12, 09:00 PM
1.-Are men with potential for divine magic taken away by the Witches, or are they left with their families?


It says all children that show aptitude for magic are taken away and they are all trained by Old Ones, male Rashemi of great age and magical power. So this is clear enough: all children that can use magic and the teacher is always an Old One.

Vremyonni Training is for kids that have had more than the typical amount of training. Any kid, boy or girl.

Male divine spellcasters such as clerics or druids are not required to set themselves apart in this way, but male clerics or druids do not have a role in society. Most become hermits or eventually join a berserker lodge. Men who happen to be arcane spellcasters have no such option.




2.-Do male arcane casters do the dajemma trip?


Adult age in Rashemen is 20, so there is plenty of time for a male to go on one ''before they take a level in a character class".

Clistenes
2020-04-13, 06:05 AM
It says all children that show aptitude for magic are taken away and they are all trained by Old Ones, male Rashemi of great age and magical power. So this is clear enough: all children that can use magic and the teacher is always an Old One.

Vremyonni Training is for kids that have had more than the typical amount of training. Any kid, boy or girl.

Male divine spellcasters such as clerics or druids are not required to set themselves apart in this way, but male clerics or druids do not have a role in society. Most become hermits or eventually join a berserker lodge. Men who happen to be arcane spellcasters have no such option.

So "men are taught arcane magic only" is an errata?



Adult age in Rashemen is 20, so there is plenty of time for a male to go on one ''before they take a level in a character class".

So, they aren't taught "the secrets of Rashemen" until after their dajemma?