Moon vs Land Druid....what should I be thinking about?

[MarkVIIIMarc]

There is a chance our group is going to pick new characters. What should I think of as the differences between Moon and Land Druids?

To me I notice Moon Druids can wildshape faster and use higher CR creatures as a BONUS ACTION plus the Primal Strike feature seems important. Elemental Wild Shape is wild but perhaps only sometimes useful? Alter Self seems fun socially for a character who may be short on Charisma.

Circle Druids get extra spells and some short rest spell recovery. I'd be a Drow Druid so Underdark would be the list with the interesting Gaseous Form and eventually GREATER INVISIBILITY(!) not to mention some thematic spider spells. Although for potential back story reasons you could talk me into another list...

What should I think of or what other Druids should I consider? I have no idea on the rest of the potential party composition but my groups seem to skip Druids so I wanna give one a shot.

[JellyPooga]

Moon Druids look good; they're super cool and have really top notch personal survival with being able to beast-out and all that...but Land Druids actually druid better.

Moon Druids stop being a really effective contributor in melee combatant with Wild Shape after about level 6 and to remain relevant, usually find themselves using their core Druid package (i.e. spells) to do their heavy lifting while their subclass becomes a forgotton or little used toy (at best). There is a very real danger at higher levels of trying to get more use out of Moon Druid than really exists; "I'm a Moon Druid and my Wild Shape is Super Awesome!" doesn't apply when the "awesome" was left on the doorstep at level 2.

Land Druids gets more spells per day and know more spells for them to play with. They might not be as exciting as Moon Druids, but they're more versatile spellcasters and as such, in my opinion, simply better.

Never forget that the Druid is not a melee-focused chassis; it's a spellcaster. The subclass that enhances the primary focus is always going to be better than the subclass that detracts from, or worse, sidelines that primary focus.

By way of analogy, imagine a Barbarian subclass that offered (significant) spellcasting, but you still couldn't cast while Raging...it'd be great for versatility, sure, probably even an exciting and useful option. But it'd never be as good as an option that enhances what he does best, which is get angry and hit stuff.

Druids cast spells. Do that.

[MaxWilson]

Moon Druids look good; they're super cool and have really top notch personal survival with being able to beast-out and all that...but Land Druids actually druid better.

Mmmm. You can only concentrate on one spell at a time anyway, and druids tend to be concentration-bottlenecked. Moon Druids have a better action economy, and can do things like e.g. toss down a Spike Growth and then also wildshape into a Giant Constrictor Snake for some bonus control (built-in Sentinel equivalent on opportunity attacks!).

Land Druids are kind of like a druid + part of a crummy wizard.


Moon Druids stop being a really effective contributor in melee combatant with Wild Shape after about level 6 and to remain relevant, usually find themselves using their core Druid package (i.e. spells) to do their heavy lifting while their subclass becomes a forgotton or little used toy (at best).

You're not wrong, at least from a damage perspective, but they still contribute tanking and control in melee, and the elemental forms have some terrific utility for scouting (tremorsense + Earth Glide or 90' flying). Fire Elemental form can do tons of damage under the right circumstances simply by moving through a bunch of enemy spaces before stopping to attack, and if you happen to be e.g. a Goblin Moon Druid who can Nimble Escape to avoid opportunity attacks while Dashing through enemy spaces, you've got 100' of movement to play with. Furthermore a Goblin Moon Druid has other fun tricks to play like Pass Without Trace + bonus action Hide (especially if you take Skulker)--imagine trying to fight an Air Elemental that you can't even locate. Under circumstances like these the middling damage output of an elemental form matters less than the damage-over-time.


There is a very real danger at higher levels of trying to get more use out of Moon Druid than really exists; "I'm a Moon Druid and my Wild Shape is Super Awesome!" doesn't apply when the "awesome" was left on the doorstep at level 2.

Agreed that you shouldn't rely solely on wildshape. "I'm a Moon Druid and Wrath of Nature (or Quickling summons, etc.) + Air Elemental form are super awesome together!" is however more impressive than a Land Druid's "I'm a Land Druid and my Wrath of Nature (or Quickling summons, etc.) is super awesome while I hide behind total cover and try not to lose concentration."

Look for synergies between spellcasting and other features. In the same way that a Young Adult Red Dragon benefits hugely from even as little as 3 levels in Dragon Sorcerer despite still being primarily a melee brute, even so Druid benefits greatly from Combat Wildshape despite being primarily a spellcaster. Synergy is the name of the game.

[sithlordnergal]

So, before I make this post, I will admit I am a little biased. I have taken an AL Moon Druid from level 1 to level 20 though, and its the only character I have that isn't a multiclass. Here's what I've found:

Moon Druids are exceptionally powerful. I found that the so called "dip" in power has a far less impact on the Druid than you might think. I spent 90% on my time in Wild Shape throughout all of Tomb of Annihilation. Wild Shape may lose the edge on damage, but they still have a pretty significant HP buffer. I mean, a level 8 Druid with 16 Con that takes the average for their HP has 67 HP, and can turn into a giant Constrictor Snake that had 60 hp. That's basically equal to your base form's HP, and you can do it twice. You essentially have 187 hp to tank with. Plus you can still concentrate on, and use, spells that you've cast while in Wild Shape. So you could cast something like Call Lightning or Heat Metal, turn into a massive snake, and still use those spells. Also, don't forget that you could make a case for being able to wear and continue using certain magical items. Sure, a giant snake can't use a staff, but they'd still be able to wear a cloak.

As for the Elemental Wild Shape, it is probably the deadliest ability in the Moon Druid's arsenal. Fire Elementals have been my go to elemental for most problems. Hell, I was able to do an entire encounter where I had disadvantage on all attack rolls by being a Fire Elemental and standing in the space of an enemy. I never made an attack, I just stood there dealing damage. And at the end of ToA, I was able to cheese the boss with the help of our Wizard by grappling the final boss, dragging it into lava, and just holding it there. It took somewhere between 6d10 to 10d10 every round, I forget the exact amount, while I was immune to the damage and its exhaustion granting abilities. The final boss died in 3 rounds without being able to harm anyone in the party other than me when it finally knocked me out of my wild shape...not that it mattered since we had taken a short rest right before the final boss, and I had remained a fire elemental during that short rest, so I could just turn back into a Fire Elemental on my turn. and be immune again.

Or there was the time when I was able to cheese an entire room of golems by casting Spike Growth, turning into a bug, and crawling around on the ceiling. I will admit, that was a special case because the golems were mindless, had no ranged attacks, and had standing orders to follow and attack any creatures that entered the room. So I was only able to cheese it because of that set up...but I still managed to kill about 10 of them on my own by running in a circle and forcing them to follow me while they walked through spike growth and tried to reach me.

Honestly, Land Druid may get a lot of spells, but Wild Shape is such a powerful and versatile ability that its as good as spell casting. I'd go with Moon Druid if I were you. And even if Wild Shape drops off a bit, you get Polymorph at the time it drops off, which is basically Wild Shape but with higher CR beasts. Best part about that is you don't need to see the beast to polymorph, and because Polymorph states you change the target of the spell into that specific animal, you could make an argument for using Polymorph to add extra beasts to the animals you'e seen.

EDIT: So, I do have two suggestions. You're gonna wanna take Mobile, according to sage advice you can benefit from the +10 movement even in Wild Shape. Meaning your Air Elemental form will be able to have a 100ft fly speed. Second, take Resilience: Constitution, that will give you proficiency with Con saves, and will let you add your proficiency bonus to concentration checks.

You might wanna start as a Variant Human, that way you can get one of those two feats at the very start.

[Eldariel]

I mostly second Max's point. Moon Druid is actually a perfectly capable melee combatant and caster. It's actually one of the better melee fighters in the game at certain key levels, and it's never bad at the role (just not the best). Which is okay, because Wildshape does a lot of useful things for a Moon Druid specifically and it synergises with feats to boot. Shapeshifting is a big part of fantasy Druid; if you want that, you want Moon Druid. Land Druid is spellcasting focused and don't be fooled, it's good at what it does. Moon Druid isn't that much worse at casting though (Natural Recovery and few spells less, yes, but Druid list is so good that you can make do without those spells and you can probably save the resources you'd recover via. combat use of Wildshape).

It depends on what kind of a Druid do you want to play. Do you want to be the frontline beast warrior and master of nature's fury, or do you prefer to be the wizened sage leaning on a staff calling forth the trees to strangle your opponents? Land Druid gets Wildshape too and it's actually not bad for combat for the first 2-4 levels but it falls off quickly; it's worth remembering though (Velociraptor, Wolf, Ape are all good forms for their levels), because Land Druid isn't entirely without that option either. But yes, Primal Strike is necessary to keep it up and without the extra HD you're getting from Moon, you'll eventually be better off solely using it for utility. As said, Moon Druid can use it for a massive HP buffer at worst. Land Druid depends more on positioning and cover to stay safe (on the flipside, maintaining Concentration is much easier that way - but Moon Druid can do just the same, except with a hundred more HP).

[HappyDaze]

Fire Elemental form can do tons of damage under the right circumstances simply by moving through a bunch of enemy spaces before stopping to attack, and if you happen to be e.g. a Goblin Moon Druid who can Nimble Escape to avoid opportunity attacks while Dashing through enemy spaces, you've got 100' of movement to play with.

I believe that Fire Form allows you to enter a hostile creature's space, but you then have to stop in that space. Unless I'm reading it wrong, that means you can only use this trick against one creature per turn.

[GentlemanVoodoo]

Party make up is going to be your prime concern. If full of melee fights land druid is the preferred choice. If not then a moon druid does get the job done. Main thing to check with your dm is how learning new animal shapes are handled. Some DMs are strict on this and animal availability is the potential crippling factor. I would advise you pick up some other books that have animal stats beyond the mm and phb.

[MrStabby]

I think I agree with a lot of what has been said here. I have seen a few druids in play and they are both very effective. They do have different strengths though and at different times.

Moon is obscenely powerful early game. Getting your two attacks at level 2 and being a better fighter than the fighter is very strong. As you go up levels this does drop off in effectiveness. The power of a moon druid as a tank is then really down to party composition though. If you need another tank, then it's good. If not then land might be better.

Lands extra spells known and natural recovery comes down to what you make of it. If your campaign style doesn't see you run out of spells, then having more isnt really a big boost. There are some really good extra spells you can get from your land type, and as you always have them prepared even the niche ones will potentially see play. Again, the true value of this can come down to party composition. If one member can cast stinking cloud, the marginal value of another is lower.

[Eriol]

There's a large gap IMO between "Moon Druids are really powerful (maybe overpowered) at level 2" and "Moon Druids are bad at mid-high levels." They are relatively less powerful, but they are still solid contributing members. They might go from "overpowered" to "balanced." So you might feel less "punchy" but you are still a more-than-viable subclass, as the testimonies above say.

IMO the Land druids are probably the least well-off if you consider the sub-classes that get additional spells and really neat features (spore druid) that are published, along with the ones that get the same that are in UA.

[J-H]

What's been said above is generally accurate, although I think Land Druids have a great set of spells available to them. They're kind of like playing a Batman wizard (3.5) since you have a spell or two for almost everything, but have to pick what to prepare. Unlike a Wizard or Sorcerer, however, you can swap spells around within your list every night rather than being limited by 2/level+copied spells known.

Land Druid still has access to utility forms (flight, "disguise as a horse for recon", swimming, etc.) - it's just not very combat-effective in those forms.

I would be content playing either one in most circumstances.

[MaxWilson]

I believe that Fire Form allows you to enter a hostile creature's space, but you then have to stop in that space. Unless I'm reading it wrong, that means you can only use this trick against one creature per turn.

I don't believe so. What makes the fire elemental special is the *ability* to stop in a hostile space, but it's not a requirement to do so. A hill giant can enter your space too, due to being two sizes larger, but unlike a fire elemental it can't stop there.

BTW don't underestimate wildshape for non-Moon Druids. Sure, you can't do it as a bonus action during combat, but 52 HP of Giant Octopus with built-in quasi-Sentinel restraining reach attack is still 104 free HP per short rest. (Or be a Giant Hyena for more mobility, or a Giant Owl for stealth and flyby, or an armor-and-shield-wearing Ape if you're not high enough level for CR 1 forms yet.) If you have long adventuring days where Natural Recovery feels relevant, having a way to gain hundreds of free HP will probably be relevant too.

[Zuras]

In my personal experience Moon Druids are decent offensively in combat until around 6th level, at which point their lack of defenses and features to increase burst damage leaves them as a low damage tank.

If you have other party members available to do damage, though, you can continue using wild shape very effectively in combat your whole career. The thing to understand about Druids is that their battlefield control and support spells are top notch, and by 7th level as a Moon Druid your Wild Shape is also more of a battlefield control tool than a way to deal damage. I rarely used a beast form without a grapple attack after 6th level.

Also note that using a concentration spell, then wildshaping allows all sorts of shenanigans at high level. Nothing beats casting Investiture of Wind and wildshaping into a Brontosaurus to use your 20’ reach to attack enemies from above.

Land Druids are decent in play as well, but from what I’ve seen party composition is important. If you don’t have other full casters in the party, you’ll probably feel awesome and flexible. If you do, you may feel like a bad wizard or limited Cleric.

[MaxWilson]

Also note that using a concentration spell, then wildshaping allows all sorts of shenanigans at high level. Nothing beats casting Investiture of Wind and wildshaping into a Brontosaurus to use your 20’ reach to attack enemies from above.

That's hilarious! If an enemy somehow hits you hard enough to lose concentration, a brontosaurus falls out of the sky and crushes them.

[Zuras]

That's hilarious! If an enemy somehow hits you hard enough to lose concentration, a brontosaurus falls out of the sky and crushes them.

Yeah. That particular fight I took over 350 HP of damage. There was an evil archdruid, some animated redwoods and a purple worm. It included conversations like “As a Gargantuan creature can I provide total cover to the Wizard?”

[JellyPooga]

Agreed that you shouldn't rely solely on wildshape. "I'm a Moon Druid and Wrath of Nature (or Quickling summons, etc.) + Air Elemental form are super awesome together!" is however more impressive than a Land Druid's "I'm a Land Druid and my Wrath of Nature (or Quickling summons, etc.) is super awesome while I hide behind total cover and try not to lose concentration."

The counter, of course, is that if you're trying to maintain concentration, then the last place you want to be is tanking. Unless you've somehow managed to guarantee your concentration checks, staying the hell away from being hit is the best way to maintain it. Which brings us back to the question of what you want your character to be good at; your primary class features or your subclass?

As good as Wild Shape might be, it's still only giving you the option of participating in an aspect of combat that you'd (usually) otherwise have very little business indulging in. It doesn't make you very good at it, any more than being an Eldritch Knight makes you a good blaster or controller and like an Eldritch Knight tossing out Fireballs or Hold Person you have to ask the question "If that's the thing I want to do, would I be better off doing it as a different Class?" because by doing it as a subclass you're usually actively making your primary features worse.

Don't get me wrong, Moon Druid has an awesome schtick; I love the whole shapeshifter thing and no other class even comes close to it until the tops tiers of play...but if it was attached to a different, non-full-caster class, I'd be a lot happier about it. It's like attaching Battlemaster to a Wizard...yeah, it's a great subclass, but it's in the wrong place.

[MaxWilson]

The counter, of course, is that if you're trying to maintain concentration, then the last place you want to be is tanking. Unless you've somehow managed to guarantee your concentration checks, staying ... away from being hit is the best way to maintain it. Which brings us back to the question of what you want your character to be good at; your primary class features or your subclass?

As good as Wild Shape might be, it's still only giving you the option of participating in an aspect of combat that you'd (usually) otherwise have very little business indulging in. It doesn't make you very good at it, any more than being an Eldritch Knight makes you a good blaster or controller and like an Eldritch Knight tossing out Fireballs or Hold Person you have to ask the question "If that's the thing I want to do, would I be better off doing it as a different Class?" because by doing it as a subclass you're usually actively making your primary features worse.

Don't get me wrong, Moon Druid has an awesome schtick; I love the whole shapeshifter thing and no other class even comes close to it until the tops tiers of play...but if it was attached to a different, non-full-caster class, I'd be a lot happier about it. It's like attaching Battlemaster to a Wizard...yeah, it's a great subclass, but it's in the wrong place.

Fair point. A Moon Druid who's invested in e.g. Resilient (Con) and Warcaster will have a lower Wisdom than a Land Druid who went all-in on Wisdom. They'll be equally good at the Quicklings, Spike Growth, Wall of Fire, Druid's Grove, etc. but the Moon Druid will be somewhat less effective at Wrath of Nature, Hold Person, Feeblemind, Antipathy, etc. Of those, Wrath of Nature at least is very druidy and I can see why you'd hate to have it be at only 90% effectiveness. On the other hand, wildshape makes everything about Guardian of Nature better, 200-300% as effective as normal.

Besides, you ought to invest in stuff like Resilient (Con) anyway even as a non-Moon Druid. Moon Druid gets more mileage out of it, and is more likely to wind up taking both feats, but when your whole combat shtick is concentration-oriented you can't afford to be bad at keeping concentration.

Overall I don't agree that Moon Druids are in any way bad at druiding.

[Zuras]

The counter, of course, is that if you're trying to maintain concentration, then the last place you want to be is tanking. Unless you've somehow managed to guarantee your concentration checks, staying the hell away from being hit is the best way to maintain it. Which brings us back to the question of what you want your character to be good at; your primary class features or your subclass?

As good as Wild Shape might be, it's still only giving you the option of participating in an aspect of combat that you'd (usually) otherwise have very little business indulging in. It doesn't make you very good at it, any more than being an Eldritch Knight makes you a good blaster or controller and like an Eldritch Knight tossing out Fireballs or Hold Person you have to ask the question "If that's the thing I want to do, would I be better off doing it as a different Class?" because by doing it as a subclass you're usually actively making your primary features worse.

Don't get me wrong, Moon Druid has an awesome schtick; I love the whole shapeshifter thing and no other class even comes close to it until the tops tiers of play...but if it was attached to a different, non-full-caster class, I'd be a lot happier about it. It's like attaching Battlemaster to a Wizard...yeah, it's a great subclass, but it's in the wrong place.

I understand your point about not spending resources and effort to make a class mediocre at something it’s bad at, but where do you get the idea that a Moon Druid is below average at tanking?

Besides Sentinel/PAM builds, Ancestral Guardian Barbarians, and Cavalier Fighters Moon Druids are easily the best tanks in the game. Your damage output is what suffers at higher levels, not your ability to draw enemy fire, and the wide variety of beasts that grapple on a successful hit gives you tremendous control over the battlefield.

Your problem is you get to do it at most twice per SR, not that it’s mediocre when you do it. If you think of it as just another crowd control resource in your pool (that refreshes on a Short Rest!), that’s significantly more resources than a Land Druid gets for crowd control.

The pain point I have felt as a Moon Druid with Wild Shape is actually healing. If someone on your team goes down, or worse is taken out of the fight by a charm or other effect you could break with a spell, the fact that you can’t cast in beast form starts to be a real problem. If nobody else in your group plays a PC who can cast healing word, Land Druid may well be better.

[JellyPooga]

Overall I don't agree that Moon Druids are in any way bad at druiding.

It depends on what you consider "druiding", I suppose. Shapeshifting into beast forms is something that, without doubt, Druids do better than anyone else. Whether it is a key aspect of being a Druid, particularly in a combat context, is a different question entirely.

Because it's an important distinction that while Moon Druid improves the combat capability of Wild Shape significantly, it does little with regard to the utility aspect of it (i.e. while it accelerates the HD options, it does not accelerate whether you can adopt swim or fly speeds; a far greater aspect to enhance utility than HD). For myself, the "druidic" aspect of Wild Shape is in its utility, which Moon Druid does little to enhance. That might just be me, though and I grant that it's a personal preference/opinion.


I understand your point about not spending resources and effort to make a class mediocre at something it’s bad at, but where do you get the idea that a Moon Druid is below average at tanking?

It's not so much that Moon Druids are bad tanks, so much as it makes them worse druids. As you point out, a Moon Druid sitting on the front line can't pop a Healing Word, can't as easily just cast another concentration spell if one he has cast already drops or fails (for whatever reason, bearing in mind that a Moon Druid tanking is much more likely to fail a concentration check, if only because they're making more of them)...the Moon Druid is commited to tanking once he's in, making them less flexible.

That's even before you consider that a Moon Druid is much more likely to cast a spell to enhance their tanking than the spell the party actually needs. After all, players tend towards a smidge of selfishness, even under the best circumstances. Even so simple a thing as prepping Barkskin, instead of another spell to enhance their utility/versatility makes the Moon Druid less flexible, less useful in a range of circumstances.

Moon Druids are great in a straight fight and rank among some of the best damage sponges in the game, sure, but they lack specialisation and versatility. As a full-spellcaster that's a significant flaw.

[MaxWilson]

Because it's an important distinction that while Moon Druid improves the combat capability of Wild Shape significantly, it does little with regard to the utility aspect of it (i.e. while it accelerates the HD options, it does not accelerate whether you can adopt swim or fly speeds; a far greater aspect to enhance utility than HD). For myself, the "druidic" aspect of Wild Shape is in its utility, which Moon Druid does little to enhance. That might just be me, though and I grant that it's a personal preference/opinion.

How do you replicate the recon utility of Earth Glide + Tremorsense on a Land Druid's wildshape? Or do you consider that redundant?

I consider "druiding" the full package including e.g. casting spells and using them effectively. Not having to hide behind cover for fear of losing concentration makes you better at druiding in a different way than boosting Wisdom, but they're both aspects of druiding IMO. Turning into a Giant Constrictor Snake to lead a bunch of lesser snakes into battle is as druidy as it gets.

YMMV.

[JellyPooga]

How do you replicate the recon utility of Earth Glide + Tremorsense on a Land Druid's wildshape? Or do you consider that redundant?

I consider that a waste of resources.

Tremorsense reveals numbers and no more. Earth Glide is predicated on appropriate terrain. Elemental WS costs two uses. Wild Shape into a rat or sparrow for half the resource and be a better scout with visual and auditory input. Moon Druid enhances your ability to fight and little extra.

Now consider that some Land Druids add the likes of Gaseous Form and Greater Invisibility on top of the already formiddable utility that non-Moon Wild Shape offers as well as having greater option to build for scouting (e.g. taking Alert or Observant instead of War Caster or Resilient) and further that you can do this pre-lvl.10 and Moon Druid isn't looking so good as a scout compared to any other Druid.

As I say, Moon Druid is great for what it's good at, but it focuses too much on something that its base chassis simply isn't good at for me, personally, to consider worth the effort to work with.

[MaxWilson]

I consider that a waste of resources.

Tremorsense reveals numbers and no more. Earth Glide is predicated on appropriate terrain. Elemental WS costs two uses. Wild Shape into a rat or sparrow for half the resource and be a better scout with visual and auditory input. Moon Druid enhances your ability to fight and little extra.

Now consider that some Land Druids add the likes of Gaseous Form and Greater Invisibility on top of the already formiddable utility that non-Moon Wild Shape offers as well as having greater option to build for scouting (e.g. taking Alert or Observant instead of War Caster or Resilient) and further that you can do this pre-lvl.10 and Moon Druid isn't looking so good as a scout compared to any other Druid.

As I say, Moon Druid is great for what it's good at, but it focuses too much on something that its base chassis simply isn't good at for me, personally, to consider worth the effort to work with.

I would be loathe to take a squishy rat or sparrow into Khyber or a mind flayer citadel to scout, but I would take an Earth Gliding elemental around the perimeter. Rat or sparrow is fine for outdoors and some indoors--although even then it's possible to get your cover blown by a hawk or dog "killing" you, and now you're in your own in a hostile environment. (And taking a rat or sparrow into an alien environment filled with intellect devourers is a good way to get body-snatched.)

If you're taking Observant instead of Warcaster then you wind up with the same Wisdom as the equivalent Moon Druid anyway.

ISTR that you're a sandboxy, Combat As War type, right? Recon is important in your games, right? Mine too, although only some players take advantage of it.

Thanks for sharing.

[ShikomeKidoMi]

What you should be thinking about is how you want to play the Druid.

If you want to Wildshape more but still cast some spells, play a Moon Druid.

If you want to cast more spells, but still Wildshape occasionally, play a Land Druid.

(and if you want to summon animals more, be a Shepard Druid; if you want to heal more be a Dream Druid; if you want to poison people and make zombies be a Spore Druid).

[Spo]

My experience with druids is limited to having played a homebrew campaign as a Moon druid to level 6 (campaigned fizzled after that) and a Shepard Druid to level 12 (currently playing Mad Mage now.

Moon Druid was very powerful those 6 levels of play but one thing I didn't like was the inability to speak with others while in wild shape. We usually don't do too much meta playing at our tables so during combat the PCs have to talk to each other to coordinate their actions, "after I strike the guard in front of me I yell, 'the exit way is open over here, just watch out for the trap door' to the rest of the guys."

On the other hand, I really like how my Shepard druid has developed. At first she was going to be a Land Druid but I figured if I was going to do that I might as well just make her a controlling wizard. Therefore, shepard gave me more a druid feel that I could change up my play style at will. Do I need to be controlling? Summon 4 apes with multi-attacks and grapple with advantage. Lots of melee enemies? summon a pack of wolves to that group? Ranged enemies? Flock of fly-by owls. Transportation? Eight giant bat mounts.

I while my summons are fulfilling their roles, I can cast other non-concentration spells like a caster, or wildshape myself to mix it up if I like.

My vote Shepard.

[sambojin]

I'd probably rate both Shepherd and Land (grassland or coastal) as "more powerful" than a Moon Druid, but I still tend to play Moons because they're so reliable and fun. I've got a slightly more than working knowledge of wildshape, etc, now, so I can pull all kinds of tricks that I simply can't with the other subclasses.

Healing has never been a real problem for me. Just hand out your goodberries at the end of the day and it becomes everyone else's problem when you're in wildshape. When you're not in wildshape, then by all means, healing word away, while still casting well.

There's also some really good dips for Moons (Monk 1 or War Cleric 2), but they're not really needed for perfectly capable druiding. An Air Elemental with 20AC at lvl11 is nice to have though.

Elemental forms can also have hands (and are often described as "vaguely humanoid"). So, you can use stuff like shields, and even large bows/ slings. Which is why I like elementals. You can do human'y stuff, even though you can't really speak much (unless someone else understands primordial or the elemental language of your form). 17+AC on an air elemental without a monk dip is fine for late game tanking. If your table plays the whole "magic items adjust to fit the size of the wearer", then you can keep a lot of your kit without any explanation needed as well. Get a magic everything if you can, even if that's the only function of the magic (changes size to the wearer/wielder).

Speaking of which, even though it's really niche, Moons are great at flying in elemental form. You can't lose a flying spell due to concentration loss, you can't get knocked off yourself, and air elementals are immune to virtually every other condition that can take them out of the sky.

If you're starting at lvl1-2, I'd say go Moon. They're a really fun subclass to play. If you're starting at higher levels, then consider a land or shepherd. But I'd still probably recommend Moon for beginners. It's certainly not a beginners-basic class (no druids are), but it can be played pretty simply and effectively. It's got a pretty reasonable base level of power, and a fairly high ceiling, and it works in all sorts of campaigns (some groups/DMs abhor summons, so shepherd is out in some places. And while land is amazing, it just doesn't feel as powerful, or with a massive amount of fun stuff to try, even though it really is. It's probably more powerful than moon, it's just not as cool-feeling).

[sambojin]

For a comparison, Land Druids are more versatile spell-wise, Moons more versatile combat-wise.

After about lvl4-6, you really just start looking at big wildshape as a control or flying or stealth spell of sorts. How good is that spell? Probably about a lvl2-4 spell, can last hours too, so it's a pretty good spell.

Since you'll virtually always solve an encounter or two a day with wildshape, even later on in campaigns, its sort of like having 2-8 slots of spell "recharge" (or "didn't use a spell, just wildshaped my problems away, so saved some slots"), that happens to be specifically polymorph'y instead of for-anything'y. So both classes kinda do get slot recharge.

Land gets better slot recharge later on, but Moons get it far better in the early stages of a campaign. Likewise, Lands are a bit more powerful as casters later on, whereas you can spam whatever you please (just with less spells prepared) as a moon, safe in the knowledge that you've always got wildshape to fall back on. Sometimes entire days go by where you can count the spells you actually had to cast on one paw if you're being lazy. Strangely enough, you'll still have contributed plenty. Sometimes it goes the other way and you're barely ever in wildshape, but you never really feel like you were in danger of running out of slots either (druid spells last quite a while).

Moons can also cast and wildshape. Later on, Land's ability to do so just makes you feel squishier and with bad "initial round action economy".

So yeah, they're similar in many ways, just different too. And Moons are more fun to play as :)

[sithlordnergal]

Elemental forms can also have hands (and are often described as "vaguely humanoid"). So, you can use stuff like shields, and even large bows. Which is why I like elementals. You can do human'y stuff, even though you can't really speak much (unless someone else understands primordial or the elemental language of your form).


Oh, small thing to take note of the next time you play a Moon Druid. You can speak Common as an Elemental. You don't gain their language, instead you use the languages you currently know. This is backed up by the Sage Advice Compendium.

[DeadMech]

Playing a moon druid now in my campaign it's pretty fun. What might be a deciding factor for some players that hasn't been addressed is prep and paperwork. Moon Druid has easily been single class I've had to do the most prep and paperwork for over the course of playing. I hand wrote out all my spells and all my wildshapes and limiting that to only the stuff available at my level it was... significant. But having it all neatly organized and available in front of me at the table has been worthwhile.

(I should really just buy a printer though. I could feel the cramping setting into my hand after that much writing.)

Some people are not going to appreciate the complexity. They probably would have shied away playing a druid just due to it being a caster. Building your daily prepared spells, choosing if, when and what to wildshape into. It's allot of options and some people shut down when presented with too many options. Other people will really appreciate having all the levers in front of them all ready for the pulling.

Others have mentioned team composition. My party is three people. A wild magic sorcerer, a gunslinger fighter and me. So from the start I was looking for something melee and tanky with access to copious amounts of healing to plug the obvious gaps. On the tanky melee side of things I'm pretty happy. Damage at the level I'm at now is not amazing but supporting the team is more important than kill scores and high numbers. On hit restrains and such are worth the trade off of not having huge damage. And wading into the middle of a fight and just saying bring it on to the enemy's damage output feels like a pretty nice change of pace compared to previous characters I've played in other campaigns where it felt like they were made of tissue paper. Being able to contemplate nudging the sorcerer to drop a fireball centered on me to clear the chaff is nice. Watching a single powerhouse enemy on the map waste it's turns breaking out of grapples also feels pretty nice. And if I do get knocked out of wildshape there is always just wildshape 2: electric boogaloo. Eventually polymorph might get pulled out as a poor mans wildshape 3. And in a pinch just dropping a conjure animals or something like that the moment you get knocked out of wildshape and fall back a moment to better terrain.

It's really survivable and it's not til something like a spellcaster getting the drop on your party with fireballs or some other aoe basket of dice that I'd had much trouble keeping my allies safe. And that's something every party tank deals with. You can't protect your friends from everything all the time but you do your best.

On the healing side of things it would be nice if beast spell came online sooner to deal with emergencies but with a daily casting of goodberries to distribute and handing out affordable herbalist kit healing potions I'm keeping my friends alive by proxy. Dropping healing spirit on someone who's low after battle and letting themselves top up with hit die is fine as well. Or splitting the healing spirit dice between people. Or if the dm allows just hug or mayflower pole but you should save that for tight times unless you want a handbook thrown at you.

With this team comp we are overall very prone to.... self destructing so playing something reliable and versatile feels pretty good. And Wildshape feels flashy enough that I still feel like I'm doing fun things while other people are blowing up crowds of mooks or landing trickshots or mowing down foes.

And just so it doesn't seem like I was forced into this role I went in the session zero talking about making a "rainbow sparkle zealot" sort of character pretty early in so it was highly likely I was going to be playing something with a divine spell list and a in your face combat style. So playing a semi feral raised by wolves and just stumbled out of the feywild druid has been a very fun and entertaining chassis for characterization.

[MaxWilson]

For a comparison, Land Druids are more versatile spell-wise, Moons more versatile combat-wise.

After about lvl4-6, you really just start looking at big wildshape as a control or flying or stealth spell of sorts. How good is that spell? Probably about a lvl2-4 spell, so pretty good.

Since you'll virtually always solve an encounter or two a day with wildshape, even later on in campaigns, its sort of like having 2-8 slots of spell "recharge" (or "didn't use a spell, just wildshaped my problems away, so saved some slots"), that happens to be specifically polymorph'y instead of for anythingy. So both classes kinda do get slot recharge.

Land gets better slot recharge later on, but Moons get it far better in the early stages of a campaign. Likewise, Lands are a bit more powerful as casters later on, whereas you can spam whatever you please (just with less spells prepared) as a moon, safe in the knowledge that you've always got wildshape to fall back on.

I agree with your major point here, but I want to point out that Land Druids are actually at their best early on too, because Natural Recovery doesn't even give you back high-level slots at all, and your bonus spells are all low-to-mid-level. Take the above-mentioned Grasslands and Coastal Druids which were called out as being especially good for Land Druids:

Coastal Druid bonus spells (bold are non-druid): Mirror Image, Misty Step, Water Walk, Water Breathing, Control Water, Freedom of Movement, Conjure Elemental, Scrying.
Grassland Druid bonus spells (bold are non-druid, italic is ritual): Invisibility, Pass Without Trace, Daylight, Haste, Divination, Freedom of Movement, Commune With Nature, Tree Stride

Coastal Druid is actually at its greatest advantage at level 3! Even though the higher-level spells like Conjure Elemental and Freedom of Movement are worth having, and relieve some pressure on spells-prepared, by the time you reach higher levels (say level 15-20) Land Druid subclass will be all but irrelevant for a Coastal Druid. Grassland is a little better due to the rituals, but even at low levels Haste is not necessarily a better use of your concentration than e.g. Conjure Animals or Polymorph, and by higher levels having a couple of extra Hastes or Polymorphs per day isn't interesting because you're concentration- and action-bottlenecked, not spell slot-bottlenecked, at least for spells under 6th level.

IMO after 10th level Land Druid features get relatively weaker and less relevant and Moon Druid features stay relevant and maybe even get stronger, especially as monsters get stronger. (For example, Vampire Charm doesn't work on wildshaped creatures, only humanoids.) In a high-level game it might make sense to play a Moon Druid or a Shepherd Druid or maybe even a Dream Druid (I've never found Dream interesting so haven't thought much about it), but playing a Land Druid at 15th level is only fun if you like the challenge of purposefully gimping yourself. (Which is definitely still fun BTW, just in a different way, especially if you want other players to have more spotlight.)

==============================================


Some people are not going to appreciate the complexity. They probably would have shied away playing a druid just due to it being a caster. Building your daily prepared spells, choosing if, when and what to wildshape into. It's allot of options and some people shut down when presented with too many options. Other people will really appreciate having all the levers in front of them all ready for the pulling.

You're not wrong, but if you don't mind a DM-oriented tangent: you don't have to force players to decide on all their complexity up front. If you have a player who likes druids but doesn't like complexity, it's perfectly fine for them to play a Moon Druid who doesn't use all features to their fullest. Maybe at 5th level they only use two wildshape forms, Brown Bear for hitting hard and mobility and Giant Octopus for tanking and control, and maybe the only spells they prepare are Conjure Animals, Goodberry and Faerie Fire, and that's okay. (DMG spell points really help cut down on the complexity, BTW.) That's enough levers to be interesting and fun to play but few enough to be less overwhelming.

The same technique works for NPCs, if you want an NPC whose combat-related stats fit on a single line of text in your notes.

[stoutstien]

There is a chance our group is going to pick new characters. What should I think of as the differences between Moon and Land Druids?

To me I notice Moon Druids can wildshape faster and use higher CR creatures as a BONUS ACTION plus the Primal Strike feature seems important. Elemental Wild Shape is wild but perhaps only sometimes useful? Alter Self seems fun socially for a character who may be short on Charisma.

Circle Druids get extra spells and some short rest spell recovery. I'd be a Drow Druid so Underdark would be the list with the interesting Gaseous Form and eventually GREATER INVISIBILITY(!) not to mention some thematic spider spells. Although for potential back story reasons you could talk me into another list...

What should I think of or what other Druids should I consider? I have no idea on the rest of the potential party composition but my groups seem to skip Druids so I wanna give one a shot.

I don't know if you can include XGtE druid options or not but dream druids are probably the most user friendly of all the circles. Balm of the summer court is hassle free healing that can used while in wild shapes or when you use your action to cast a spell. Later on you get some good rest protection and mobility features.
Where land druids makes your casting better and moon druid makes your wild shapes better, the dream druid makes both more flexible.


The base druid is solid enough where your circle choice can be anything. You are a prepared full caster with some of the best control and Summoning spells in the game on top of the utility of wild shapes.

[Zuras]

It's not so much that Moon Druids are bad tanks, so much as it makes them worse druids. As you point out, a Moon Druid sitting on the front line can't pop a Healing Word, can't as easily just cast another concentration spell if one he has cast already drops or fails (for whatever reason, bearing in mind that a Moon Druid tanking is much more likely to fail a concentration check, if only because they're making more of them)...the Moon Druid is commited to tanking once he's in, making them less flexible.

That's even before you consider that a Moon Druid is much more likely to cast a spell to enhance their tanking than the spell the party actually needs. After all, players tend towards a smidge of selfishness, even under the best circumstances. Even so simple a thing as prepping Barkskin, instead of another spell to enhance their utility/versatility makes the Moon Druid less flexible, less useful in a range of circumstances.

Moon Druids are great in a straight fight and rank among some of the best damage sponges in the game, sure, but they lack specialisation and versatility. As a full-spellcaster that's a significant flaw.

JellyPooga, I understand the argument you’re making, but I just don’t see the support for it, unless you are arguing that full casters with options that tempt them into melee are always worse than full casters without those options.

Would you consider a Wizard who gets a free casting of Tenser’s Transformation every long rest to be worse than one who doesn’t, simply because they might be more prone to overextend themselves?

I think you’re also seriously overestimating the value of Natural Recovery and the additional spells known.

Natural Recovery is great at 5th-6th level, when it gives you an extra 3rd level slot over a long adventuring day, but at higher levels it’s less relevant, and Druids generally run out of spells the slowest of all the full casters, since most of your best spells use concentration. Even with DMs who enforced the 6-8 encounters between Long Rests model, an improved wild shape usage that refreshes every rest generally proves more useful than a single top slot that you get once.

The Land bonus spells are nice too, but hardly world-shaking. Of the 8 bonus spells you get, about half are consistently useful, meaning you effectively get an extra 4 prepared spells by 9th level. The effective benefits of a Pearl of Power plus four extra prepared spells just isn’t that compelling, and it certainly isn’t enough to convince me a Land Druid is better at Druiding than a Moon Druid.

For the sake of contrast, the Lore Bard gets 3 extra skills and additional magical secrets compared to the Valor Bard’s weapon & Armor proficiencies and extra attack. Now that is a much more clear case of one subclass doubling down on casting while another branches out into combat, and even so I haven’t ever felt the Valor Bards I’ve played or DMed for were any less Bardy than Lore Bards.

I agree that some classes are much trickier to play than others because they have powerful abilities that can get players into tactical trouble. Moon Druids who think Wildshape means they aren’t a caster first, Valor Bards who think their Extra Attack makes them a frontliner, Monks who keep using their amazing battlefield mobility to fight enemies far from party support, the list goes on and on. That doesn’t mean classes with dangerous options are bad in the least though.

Bottom line—yes, if someone plays a Moon Druid to be Beorn the amazing Man-Bear, they will get disappointed by about 7th level. But if you are wanting to play a caster, they are extremely flexible and versatile, especially in their ability to enhance the effectiveness of many spells using their improved wild shape features.

Land Druids aren’t bad, but I would only advise someone to choose the subclass if they were enthusiastic about several of the spells on the extended spell list.

[Fable Wright]

Going to have to reiterate that Druids have the most spellcasting stamina in the game; you'd be hard pressed to NEED the extra slots.

But the extra spells prepared are the make or break of Land Druid. Something like Coast, giving you Mirror Image, Misty Step, and Water Walk every day is a game changer, because flooding the battlefield is now always a viable option and you've got a LOT of useful options. Mountain giving Lightning Bolt is a game changer, letting you nova while you DoT. If you take the class, view it as three Magical Secrets as its features. People take Lore Bard for that.

Meanwhile, Moon is just good. Need a spell to restrain someone without Entangle's friendly fire? Turn into a giant spider or octopus. Need to make a bridge? Turn into a sauropod to transport your party, or turn into a Quetzalcoatlus. Want to be invincible? At level 18, Beast Spells + Air Elemental Form = amazing aerial mobility, no lockdown, full caster. Super versatile, and to reiterate, you're also a full caster.

Shepherd master race, though.

[JellyPooga]

JellyPooga, I understand the argument you’re making, but I just don’t see the support for it...[snip]

Likewise, I don't neccesarily disagree with your post, but when you talk about a Wizard getting an additional use of Tensers Transformation, imagine it was at the cost of an additional spell slot that could be used for any spell.

That's what we're talking about, essentially. Moon Druid gets de-facto Polymorph twice per short rest and that's great. It's a hell of a boon and on paper it looks like a shed-load more than the (at most, at 20th level) two 5th level slots...until you consider that Land Druid has not only the flexibility of choosing any spell, but also an extended spell list that is variable to their preference. The felxibility offered by beast forms is nothing compared to that offered by simply having extra spell slots.

Sure, Moon Druid seems to offer more at higher levels than 10th with them getting Elemental Wild Shape...wow, great, that lack of combat efficacy you've been feeling since 6th lvl has all of a sudden paid off and you get a little bump in your damage output in a straight fight. You've also lost stamina, because you need to short rest between every fight you want to be relevent in, unlike, for example, the Warlock who just started getting a little bit of endurance with his 3rd Pact Magic slot and later their 4th. Moon Druid actually loses endurance in the third tier. Think about that. A Moon Druid never gets any more uses of Wild Shape until level 20, but due to the lack of higher HD beasts, they increasingly rely on Elemental Wild Shape to remain relevant in combat...which means 1 Wild Shape per rest, instead of two.

Meanwhile, the Land Druid gains endurance. They can afford to burn an extra slot or two and as irrelevant as a 1st or 2nd level slot might seem when you're in Tier 3 play, some spells just don't go out of fashion. Sure, Natural Recovery caps at 5th level spells, but there are some really good spells in that 1st-5th level range. I'd even go so far as to say that as powerful as 6th-9th lvl spells are, your <5th level spells are your bread and butter and the trick to higher level play as a full caster lies not in how you use your big gun spells, but those lower level spells that you actually get a decent number of uses out of over the course of an adventuring day.

[sambojin]

For the OP:
#1 Another thing you should be thinking about is downloading an app or two on your phone. No matter what type of druid you want to play. "Companions for d&d 5e" by Ryan Stout is a godsend. It's also free. It gives you most of the stat blocks for any beast, elemental, and a few (but not all) Fey. You can then study your options, whether it's for wildshape, polymorph, or Conjure X. It makes it easier to learn what's good and what you actually *can* do.

You can also just load up a creature's statblock and hand your phone to your DM whenever you wildshape or summon something in. Hurrah! The world is saved! You'll never need to bring a pile of cards, a mountain of books, or other random junk to your play sessions again. Just bring your phone, which you would anyway, and it takes up nearly no table space. It's quick and easy and your DM and playgroup will love you for it.
(if you're playing over the internet, feel free to screenshot whatever stat block and just send it to your DM through messenger/ whatever program you're playing DND through. This works fine)

5th Edition Spell Book isn't bad either, but it tends to just have the core spells, not the extras that have come out over time. Still handy, but nowhere near as handy as Companions is for a druid.


#2 Another thing to suggest to your DM is to simply use "average damage rolls" for any summons. Still roll to-hit (it can't be avoided in many situations with proning and restraining advantage and beast-hit/charge riders etc being a thing). But just use the average printed damage for any creature if they do hit. It speeds up the game immensely, you don't need a bag full of every type of dice for all the different summon's damage die, and people don't mind you summoning in 4-8 beasts every once in a while because it didn't take as long as it usually does. Average damage is also listed in the Companions app. This is vital with Shepherds, but is best-practice for any druid that summons stuff on a regular basis (which you should). Druids don't have to slow the game down, even with their super powerful spells.


They're the two things every druid should have or do. Makes it easier, gives you the knowledge you need, saves prep work, and makes the game faster to play while still keeping what your core strength is.


#3 Also consider mostly just summoning in CR1/2-CR2 creatures. They're still great, and less is more when it comes to churning through combat rounds. Is it perfect efficiency per spell slot? Nope. But you'll still get stuff done. There is no time in a campaign where having an extra 1-4 (or 8) warhorses, apes, jaculi, brown bears, dire wolves, deinonychusi, dilophosauri, giant spiders, giant eagles, giant octopi turrets, giant elks, giant spitting lizard turret/defenders, polar bears, rhinos or giant constrictor snakes in a battle isn't a good thing. There are lots of times where having an extra 8-24 wolves in a battle just asks for problems to occur in the future, to the summoner of them. There's *so* many good options, for literally any terrain or purpose, that you should pick them, not wolf chaff.

Don't just try and summon wolves. Don't just try and be a brown bear. If you do, you'll feel weaker than you should. The class is strong by default, the subclasses are strong too. You can limit yourself to make things quick, or to RP your character properly. But a noob meme ain't a druid. Much like a wizard is powerful due to its powerful options, you are too. Just casting fireball isn't what makes a wizard powerful, even if it has its place from time-to-time.

[Nhym]

Neither; go Shepherd :D
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1xXgYqPxkEHaCisQ0tteFF-KtsmfJxkOQojeWwHf22n4/edit?usp=sharing

[MaxWilson]

Likewise, I don't neccesarily disagree with your post, but when you talk about a Wizard getting an additional use of Tensers Transformation, imagine it was at the cost of an additional spell slot that could be used for any spell.

That's what we're talking about, essentially. Moon Druid gets de-facto Polymorph twice per short rest and that's great.

Fine then, but then it has to be a no-concentration Tenser's as a bonus action twice per short rest, and it lasts for hours. And it's on a concentration-heavy class (druid) so having a good no-concentration option is even better than it would be for a wizard.

Even as a wizard I would be totally give up Arcane Recovery for no-concentration bonus action Tenser's that lasts for hours, twice per short rest. Arcane Recovery is nice but it's not that nice.


Sure, Moon Druid seems to offer more at higher levels than 10th with them getting Elemental Wild Shape...wow, great, that lack of combat efficacy you've been feeling since 6th lvl has all of a sudden paid off and you get a little bump in your damage output in a straight fight. You've also lost stamina, because you need to short rest between every fight you want to be relevent in, unlike, for example, the Warlock who just started getting a little bit of endurance with his 3rd Pact Magic slot and later their 4th. Moon Druid actually loses endurance in the third tier. Think about that. A Moon Druid never gets any more uses of Wild Shape until level 20, but due to the lack of higher HD beasts, they increasingly rely on Elemental Wild Shape to remain relevant in combat...which means 1 Wild Shape per rest, instead of two.

This doesn't match my experience. Elemental Wildshape is a great option especially when you first get it, especially for mobility options, but by level 15 it's no longer your best tanking option. In particular when you go up against high-CR creatures that do psychic, elemental, or magical weapon damage, if you're planning on tanking instead of kiting it's better to be two Giant Crocodiles or Brontosaurs instead of one elemental.

[Zuras]

This doesn't match my experience. Elemental Wildshape is a great option especially when you first get it, especially for mobility options, but by level 15 it's no longer your best tanking option. In particular when you go up against high-CR creatures that do psychic, elemental, or magical weapon damage, if you're planning on tanking instead of kiting it's better to be two Giant Crocodiles or Brontosaurs instead of one elemental.

Don’t forget Hulking Crabs! Moon Druid WS capabilities levels 9-14 are more constrained by the lack of quality CR 3-4 beast forms than any fundamental issue with the subclass.

The elemental forms are tremendously versatile, though. Since they have hands and can manipulate stuff, they are much better for spending significant time in. The mobility options are amazing as well. Earth Glide is amazingly versatile. In addition to scouting, I’ve used it to do all sorts of sneaky things, like surreptitiously trip people to instigate fights. I’ve turned into an air elemental underwater to keep an ally from drowning. I’ve gone through a LOT of small openings as an Air or Water elemental, and put out a bunch of fires. I’ve lost count of the enemies I’ve dropped from a great height as an air elemental. The only build resources needed was taking proficiency in stealth and athletics, which are good picks anyway and hardly a niche build.

The fact that elementals don’t have brains or other normal organs (as well as having immunity to exhaustion) comes up surprisingly often as well. I was once trapped inside a Wall of Force with a slimy Eldritch horror by the party Wizard after it incapacitated all the martials with paralyzing mucus and was about to implant them with something. I grappled it to drag it away from the rogue, and then slowly burned it to death in a goldfish bowl, as it couldn’t poison or paralyze me.

In my experience, more Wild Shape options = more versatility in both combat and exploration pillars, not just a modest increase in DPR and HP.

[MaxWilson]

@OP,

I went to emphasize one more thing for your consideration: part of playing a Moon Druid well is timing. If you wildshape at the wrong time just because you can't stand to spend a round shooting a crossbow/cantrips, you may wind up having to shift back to human shape in order to cast a key spell, which wastes your wildshape--or potentially even worse, persuades you not to cast that spell that the party needed right then.

Playing a Moon Druid well, like any other druid (and many bards), sometimes requires the patience to deliberately miss opportunities to use your action economy to the fullest. Sometimes waiting is the right thing, so think ahead of time what is going to be your default action when nothing looks appropriate. (Hide and Dodge are both reasonably good defaults for when Produce Flame/Thorn Whip is illegal. If Dodging you may as well also move toward the enemy hoping to attract some attacks.)

[Keravath]

I believe that Fire Form allows you to enter a hostile creature's space, but you then have to stop in that space. Unless I'm reading it wrong, that means you can only use this trick against one creature per turn.

The text in the MM is:
"In addition, the elemental can enter a hostile creature's space and stop there. The first time it enters a creature's space on a turn, that creature takes 5 (1d10) fire damage and catches fire."

You could read this two ways. The fire elemental can choose to enter an hostile creatures space and may choose to stop there. You could also read it as the fire elemental can choose to "enter and stop" in an hostile creature's space which would be read as the fire elemental can enter a hostile creatures space and must stop.

However, the next sentence says explicitly "the first time it enters a creature's space on a turn". If a fire elemental can only "enter and stop" then the next clause doesn't make much sense. Would it apply if someone was using telekinesis to move the fire elemental around through other creatures spaces? However, normally the fire elemental can't enter a hostile creature's space. The first part also says that the fire elemental can choose to enter a hostile creatures space .. which tends to imply that the next sentence is referring to the fire elemental entering a creatures space multiple times during its turn which would not be possible using the only "enter and stop" interpretation.

Final decision is up to the DM but I think the description supports a fire elemental moving through multiple creatures spaces during its turn and being able to stop as an option.

[Keravath]

Honestly, the biggest constraint on moon druid forms is that many of them are large, huge, or even gargantuan ... so they can be very limited by the tight spaces often found in dungeons. Outdoors is usually much less of an issue.

[MaxWilson]

Honestly, the biggest constraint on moon druid forms is that many of them are large, huge, or even gargantuan ... so they can be very limited by the tight spaces often found in dungeons. Outdoors is usually much less of an issue.

Reminder to everyone that Large creatures can fit in Medium spaces by the Squeezing Into Smaller Spaces rules in the PHB, and likewise Huge creatures can fit into Large spaces. Gargantuan, well, you're stuck with Huge spaces. : )