Loxodon and the Defense Fighting Style

[jtreferee]

Hi,

I've just ran session 2 of a Ravnica campaign and my friend's level 2 Loxodon Fighter had an AC of 19 - Natural armour gave him 12 + con (4), plus (2) from his shield, plus (1) from his Defence fighting style.

I was wondering if he's actually entitled to that +1 from Defence? I'm split two ways:


The Defence fighting style says "While you are wearing armour, you gain a +1 bonus to AC." and Sage Advice has ruled that you aren’t considered to be wearing armour with natural armour.
Loxodon's natural armour says "When you aren't wearing armour, your AC is 12 + your Constitution modifier" However it also says:
"You can use your natural armour to determine your AC if the armour you wear would leave you with a lower AC." This confused me at first because it seems to contradict itself, but I take it that it's to make sure people don't try to stack Natural Armour with actual armour, and he can wear armour and still use Natural Armour on its own to calculate his AC.


My initial instinct/interpretation was that: He starts wearing standard leather armour, which would give him an AC of 11 + Dex -> This is worse than the Natural Armour's 12 + Con, so he uses that to determine his base AC -> however because he's wearing armour (which I suppose offers mild inconvenience in terms of don/doff time and roleplaying) he also satisfies the requirement for Defence and so gets the +1 from that on top, as well as a shield if he has one. This seems to be a literal interpretation of the RAW - does the armour he's wearing give him lower AC than Natural Armour? Yes, so use Natural Armour - however, is he wearing armour? Yes, he's wearing it even if he isn't using it to calculate his AC, so he gets the +1 from Defence.

However, someone else suggested that another interpretation (and perhaps RAI?) is: That the Defence +1 should be taken into account when calculating whether the leather armour would give him worse AC than the Natural Armour. This means he's comparing 11 + Dex +1 from Defence, against 12 + Con - and if the 12+ Con is greater he uses that on its own (plus a shield if appropriate).

Is anyone here able to help in terms of (a) the correct interpretation with reference to official clarifications or how other similar things interact, so I can explain my decision to the player; or (b) whether it's best to allow him the +1 of the more favourable interpretation in line with "The Rule of Cool" as it's fairer to him?

Thanks in advance!

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

"While you are wearing armor, you gain a +1 bonus to AC."

That doesn't say your armor gains an additional +1 bonus, it says you gain a +1 bonus to AC whenever you're wearing armor. If someone's wearing leather armor and has Mage Armor cast on them, they'll use Mage Armor to determine their AC, but still gain the bonus from their defense fighting style because they're still wearing armor.

[nickl_2000]

"While you are wearing armor, you gain a +1 bonus to AC."

That doesn't say your armor gains an additional +1 bonus, it says you gain a +1 bonus to AC whenever you're wearing armor. If someone's wearing leather armor and has Mage Armor cast on them, they'll use Mage Armor to determine their AC, but still gain the bonus from their defense fighting style because they're still wearing armor.

Mage armor is a bad example as you can't cast it on someone who is wearing armor and they lose mage armor if they put regular armor on. However the point still stands. If they are wearing armor, then they can get the defensive fighting style advantage, not matter what other armor calculation they are utilizing.


However, remember that you are the DM. If you feel that it doesn't make sense or you don't like it, have a conversation with the player. Say that it doesn't make sense from your prospective and see if they would like to choose a different fighting style instead.

[Quietus]

"While you are wearing armor, you gain a +1 bonus to AC."

That doesn't say your armor gains an additional +1 bonus, it says you gain a +1 bonus to AC whenever you're wearing armor. If someone's wearing leather armor and has Mage Armor cast on them, they'll use Mage Armor to determine their AC, but still gain the bonus from their defense fighting style because they're still wearing armor.

This logic is correct. The example is bad, Mage Armor ends if the target is wearing armor, but Loxodons and Lizardfolk both have racial features that set an AC "floor". Then any effects of armor take over from there. You can still benefit from wearing armor, including magical effects and class features that key off of it, while using your racial armor feature.

[Keravath]

I would say that RAW, as long as the character is wearing armor they can benefit from the bonus +1 AC from the defensive fighting style since it adds to AC under specific circumstances and doesn't change the calculation.

However, 19 AC isn't difficult to get - there is nothing unbalanced about it.

A fighter with 14 dex(+2AC), a shield(+2AC) and a breastplate or scale mail(14AC) with defensive fighting style is 19.
A fighter with chain mail( 16AC) , a shield(+2AC) and defensive fighting style is 19.

Both of these options, particularly the heavy armor one, are both ALREADY available to your loxodon fighter, I don't see any reason not to allow the +1 defensive fighting style to work for the Loxodon as long as they are wearing some form of armor.

Also, the Loxodon calculation is the equivalent of 17AC with 20 con, compared with half-plate with 14 dex which is also 17 and full plate which is 18 ... and to reach that they need to choose to spend ASIs on con rather than something more useful. In the end, the Loxodon will likely be better off wearing armor and spending the ASIs elsewhere.

[micahaphone]

Your player has the equivalent of the starting tier of heavy armor, and it's because they have an 18 in Con. That takes investment. How did your table generate ability scores? I wouldn't say that's OP, let them enjoy being a beefy frontliner.

If you want, you can instead think of the natural armor trait as saying "save 75 gold and don't have disadvantage on stealth checks".

When they're higher in levels, if they max out their con, with Defense Fighting Style they'll cap out an AC of 20, whereas with full plate they'd hit 21.