Need some help understanding Tomelocks

[thorr-kan]

Correct me if I'm wrong here.

A 1st-level warlock gains:
A. Two cantrips chosen from the warlock spell list.
B. Two 1st-level spells chosen from the combination of the warlock spell list and your otherworldly patron's expanded spell list.

Good so far? Now the questions.

A 3rd-level warlock choose pact of the tome for his pact book. The Book of Shadows contains "three cantrips from any class's spell list." Do all three cantrips have to be from the same class list, or can they be mixed up?

The same 3rd-level warlock swaps one of his invocations known for the Book of Ancient Secrets invocation. It has "two 1st-level spells with the ritual tag from any class's spell list." Do these have to be from the same class list, or can they be mixed up? Can subsequently learned rituals be from any class's spell list, or are they limited to the original class?

[Zetakya]

They can be from any classes spell list and there's no need to stick to one (although you can do so, of course, if it's more thematically appropriate for your character).

[Millstone85]

This has been the object of errata (https://media.wizards.com/2020/dnd/downloads/PH-Errata.pdf). Both Pact of the Tome and Book of Ancient Secrets now precise that the spells "needn’t be from the same list".

[ImproperJustice]

Which allows Tome Warlocks to be incredibly Diverse support characters....

[Zetakya]

Which allows Tome Warlocks to be incredibly Diverse support characters....

Somewhat. I don't think they really stack up that well against a Wizard's massive spell list or a Bard's ability to cherry pick higher-level spells, but there's certainly some utility advantages.

[thorr-kan]

So the pact boon offers more versatility than the Magical Initiate feat, and the invocation offers more versatility the Ritual Magic feat. Probably more power, too. Which make sense; you sold your soul, so you should get something, eh?

Thanks, all, for the clarification and errata link.

[Biggstick]

Somewhat. I don't think they really stack up that well against a Wizard's massive spell list or a Bard's ability to cherry pick higher-level spells, but there's certainly some utility advantages.

Guidance, Mold Earth, and room for one more cantrip is pretty sweet.

On top of that, this character has Eldritch Blast.

As for the rituals, Pact of the Tome Warlocks can add ALL rituals to their spell book that they qualify for level-wise. It doesn't matter what class tag it has on it, the Tome Warlock can copy it to their Tome.

In a game where DM's provide spell scrolls, this can bring a surprising amount of versatility to a character one might not expect Ritual spell support from.

[AttilatheYeon]

Yeah they all seem to talk with that mumbly accent. Just ask them to speak slowly and try real hard to listen. 😜

[Chronos]

While they can get rituals from any class list, you still need to find the spells in written form. And in practice, that's much harder for non-wizard spells. Wizards get the best rituals anyway, but if there are any non-wizard rituals you want, you want to make sure to grab them with your two free ones, because you don't know if you'll ever get another chance at those. Augury is a good one.

[Biggstick]

While they can get rituals from any class list, you still need to find the spells in written form. And in practice, that's much harder for non-wizard spells. Wizards get the best rituals anyway, but if there are any non-wizard rituals you want, you want to make sure to grab them with your two free ones, because you don't know if you'll ever get another chance at those. Augury is a good one.

I can agree that "finding" spells in written format is very much so up to the DM.

Once you overcome the aspect of finding written spells though, I would disagree that it's harder to find non-Wizard spells. Clerics and Druids are just as likely to scroll their spells as are Wizards.

I also disagree with the thought that Wizards have the best rituals. The following is list of just some of the non-Wizard spells that are rituals


Fobiddance.
Commune with Nature.
Commune
Divination
Water Walk
Meld into Stone
Silence


Comparably, Wizard-exclusive rituals include:


Drawmij's Instant Summons
Rary's Telepathic Bond
Phantom Steed
Tenser's Floating Disk
Find Familiar


These 5 rituals are the only spells found exclusively on the Wizard spell list. I only listed 7 rituals, but they definitely outclass the Wizard-exclusive Rituals as far as what they bring to the table.

As another point, Augury would not be a spell one could choose with your Book of Ancient Secrets Invocation. It would have to be two first level spells, not a second level spell.

[Chronos]

Scrolls from any class are equally likely, but with wizards, you're not limited to just scrolls: You can also use spellbooks, and every wizard has one of those.