Find Familiar for a Moon Druid?

[Eradis]

I am supposed to play a Warforged Moon Druid in an upcoming game skinned as a tree spirit entity (so none of that robotic nonsense). I'm was wondering about taking the Magic Initiate or Ritual Caster instead of ASI at level 4 to gain the Find Familiar spell.

I'd use the additional cantrips for shenanigans like Prestidigitation and Mage Hand, or for something I haven't looked into for the Ritual Casting second 1st level spell.

I'd like your opinion about Pros and Cons regarding owning a Familiar as a Moon Druid. It is mostly for the fluff really as we rolled stat (ugh...), but fun utility is cool too.

Pros.:

Be carried by it in a mouse wild shape
Use it as an extension of myself as a lazy ent for mundane things like fetching
Use it to increase my touch spells' range (although I'd rather use Healing Word in general since it's a bonus action instead of a full action)
Save wild shape charge for scouting


Cons.:

I might benefit more combat-wise with an ASI (well, when I'm not wild shaped) or another feat
It won't do much that I can't already do better in wild shape

[Warlush]

I have seen moon druids use a familiar to communicate while in wild shape.

[Eradis]

I have seen moon druids use a familiar to communicate while in wild shape.

I thought familiar couldn't speak?

[DrKerosene]

I would suggest Ritual Caster and having Unseen Servant be the other ritual, pretend you’re calling invisible fey things, or elemental spirits, etc. But I do see the Cantrips being a big bonus.

One thing about the idea of “Druid Familiars” I occasionally pitch is the Common Magic Item from XGtE called a Hat Of Vermin. Combine if with some Animal Friendship spells before a Long Rest, and then (Ritual) Cast Speak With Animals when necessary the next day, occasionally using the spell Beast Bond if you need to do so.

Basically lets you do all the things of having a Familiar without requiring attunement, and a one time purchase.

Edit: I’ve been playing a Cleric who took both feats and has a Familiar. I’ve found it’s usually been more useful to designate a Party member who my Familiar is chilling on, to usually do the touch-spell casting before it moves to somewhere else.

[nickl_2000]

Personally, I would suggest Magic Initiate: Wizard for Find Familiar, Booming Blade, and some support spell.

With Booming Blade a Druid can be very effective at melee combat even in their caster form (assuming you can get a medium armor made of non metal materials). Between Medium Armor and a Shield your AC will be up there with everyone else and you can rock some pretty hard melee hits with a staff.

Bonus if you can pick up a Staff of the Woodlands, it is silly powerful for a Rare magical item.



I actually wouldn't suggest that you take ritual caster wizard because of the concentration requirements. A Druid has a metric ****ton of powerful concentration spells and you don't want to have to drop those if you have used a high level spell.

[DrKerosene]

I actually wouldn't suggest that you take ritual caster wizard because of the concentration requirements. A Druid has a metric ****ton of powerful concentration spells and you don't want to have to drop those if you have used a high level spell.

So finding a Familiar goes from a 60 minute casting time to 70 minutes with ritual casting. Being able to lose the book would probably be a more likely issue to occur.

And Unseen Servants don’t take concentration after being cast. If a DM is really permissive with prep time, a random animal controlling <6 Unseen Servants could wreck a lot of havoc.

But I agree about the woodlands staff.

[Eradis]

I won't rely on items because my game master is not fond of rolling them or letting NPCs sell them. Not sure about Booming Blade either as I'd rater be Wild Shape to melee and back away and play as a caster out of the shape. From memory I don't have Shillelagh for this reason. Although you are making me reconsider as it could make a decent combo.

[nickl_2000]

I won't rely on items because my game master is not fond of rolling them or letting NPCs sell them. Not sure about Booming Blade either as I'd rater be Wild Shape to melee and back away and play as a caster out of the shape. From memory I don't have Shillelagh for this reason. Although you are making me reconsider as it could make a decent combo.

Up to you really, it's just a different play style. I had a Moon Druid 12, Ranger 4, Cleric 1 who was an absolute Monster and literally always had a tool to use in any situation.

[da newt]

I'm a familiar addict. Grab an owl for 120' dark vision and keen sight and hearing for ADV on perception, flyby (so it doesn't trigger op attacks), 60' fly speed, and every round you don't have something more important for it to do - have it take the HELP action to provide ADV for the next attack against the target. Familiars are a great force multiplier / action economy boon.

Besides, every tree needs someone to roost in it.

[Segev]

I thought familiar couldn't speak?

One might, with a generous DM, talk the DM into letting a raven's mimickry ability let it speak as long as the master is feeding it words.

[elyktsorb]

One might, with a generous DM, talk the DM into letting a raven's mimickry ability let it speak as long as the master is feeding it words.

I'm pretty sure a reasonable DM would let a druid communicate using simple signals, such as shaking their head or nodding for no and yes, as well as just making marks on the ground, so having a familiar just to be able to talk seems really pointless.

I think the best application of a familiar is for looking more like you belong there. 1 Owl in the middle of the day in a nearby tree, odd. 2 Owls in a nearby tree where one is cleaning the other? Less odd.

[Eradis]

I'm a familiar addict. Grab an owl for 120' dark vision and keen sight and hearing for ADV on perception, flyby (so it doesn't trigger op attacks), 60' fly speed, and every round you don't have something more important for it to do - have it take the HELP action to provide ADV for the next attack against the target. Familiars are a great force multiplier / action economy boon.

Besides, every tree needs someone to roost in it.

I'm an familiar addict to, but I only get to be a player once every other blue moon (and that's being generous). I was thinking about a Raven for Mimicry, but Owl does sound great. I might alternate between the two depending if I'm going into more urban area or uncharted territories. A Raven is far less conspicuous than an Owl in a city. I'm fuzzy on the rules too as I never got to have one. Does taking the Help Action for my familiar takes my Action away or does it counts like my Bonus Action?

Segev, elyktsorb, I am not to worry about communication. I will probably be the one limiting it as people tend to share tactics out of character and I try to avoid that. There are ways to narrate one's intention without having to make a character speak.

Otherwise, what are your thoughts regarding the pros or cons of having a familiar as a Moon Druid?

[Segev]

Otherwise, what are your thoughts regarding the pros or cons of having a familiar as a Moon Druid?

Same as on any character, really. It's a nice extra set of eyes and possible way of remote communication (not necessarily verbal). Depending on your use and build, it can be quite helpful. It's not really going to have much in the way of useful proficiencies, but you don't always have to be proficient to use tools, so a flying monkey with thieves' tools can be a substitute rogue, especially with its ability to get places. An owl is probably the best all-round familiar for its scouting and senses. Flyby sounds great, but doesn't help much with delivering touch effects since that takes the critter's reaction. You don't have the most potent combat use I've seen for one in that you can't cast dragon's breath.

Might have some niche combo ability in getting a flying familiar you can ride on as a house spider to get into hard-to-reach areas and be unobtrusive, then retreat back to the bird (who isn't in spying range) for exfiltration.

The Help action is always nice.

It's really a question of opportunity cost: what else would you spend the feat/ASI on? Those alternatives might be better or they might not be. Do you have any that interest you?

[DrKerosene]

Does taking the Help Action for my familiar takes my Action away or does it counts like my Bonus Action?

It should take the Familiar’s Action. They’re supposed to roll their own Initiative and act independently. I believe the telepathic communication is about as free as normal verbal communication between PCs.

If your Familiar is already riding an ally, using their Reaction on your turn should be fine for channeling the spell. And if you want to use Flyby to deliver a touch spell to an enemy, you should be able to ready your action to channel the spell as the Owl goes.

[da newt]

The familiar gets it's own move, action, and reaction every round. There is no cost for the PC to communicate with it - give direction.

The DM's I've played with have the familiar use the PC's initiative and go on the PC's turn which makes things simpler. This also makes delivering touch spells simple - you cast the spell, the familiar breaks up their move with the spell attack and still move away w/ owl's FLYBY. HELP action is resolved the same way.

If your DM prefers the familiar to have it's own separate turn, I believe the touch spell is resolved as if the familiar took the ready action (burns it's reaction) so that on it's next turn it delivers the PC's spell as an attack so that it can still move - attack - move. (If not, the familiar would have to be positioned in melee with the target at the end of it's previous turn so that it could attack without moving on your turn as a reaction [if the target's turn comes between, it could just move away], which seems needlessly complicated and nerf's the ability, but might be RAW ????)

[Eradis]

Glad to know it that part! Thanks!

[Vogie]

If you're not planning on taking the character all the way to 20, you can grab 3 levels of Warlock for a chain familiar, and pick up the Voice of the Chain Master and Gift of the Ever-living ones. Not only do you gain a familiar that you can talk through (with VotCM), you gain short rest spell slots that you can use for maximized BA healing on yourself (with GotELOs), plus the ability to give up one of your attacks to have the familiar attack, which could give the target the poisoned condition, or put them to sleep.

Chain familiars also mostly have invisibility, as a flyby alternative, providing help actions, and can have a small number of things they can shapechange into.

If you choose GOOlock, you don't need VotCM because you can now telepathically communicate.

[Segev]

The familiar gets it's own move, action, and reaction every round. There is no cost for the PC to communicate with it - give direction.

The DM's I've played with have the familiar use the PC's initiative and go on the PC's turn which makes things simpler. This also makes delivering touch spells simple - you cast the spell, the familiar breaks up their move with the spell attack and still move away w/ owl's FLYBY. HELP action is resolved the same way.

If your DM prefers the familiar to have it's own separate turn, I believe the touch spell is resolved as if the familiar took the ready action (burns it's reaction) so that on it's next turn it delivers the PC's spell as an attack so that it can still move - attack - move. (If not, the familiar would have to be positioned in melee with the target at the end of it's previous turn so that it could attack without moving on your turn as a reaction [if the target's turn comes between, it could just move away], which seems needlessly complicated and nerf's the ability, but might be RAW ????)

The actual rules are specifically given by find familiar (http://5e.d20srd.org/srd/spells/findFamiliar.htm):


Your familiar acts independently of you, but it always obeys your commands. In combat, it rolls its own initiative and acts on its own turn. A familiar can't attack, but it can take other actions as normal.

[...]

Finally, when you cast a spell with a range of touch, your familiar can deliver the spell as if it had cast the spell. Your familiar must be within 100 feet of you, and it must use its reaction to deliver the spell when you cast it. If the spell requires an attack roll, you use your attack modifier for the roll.

So the way the RAW run it, your familiar does not act on your turn, but on its own, and it must use its reaction to deliver a touch spell. This would not enable the familiar to use any movement when so doing, which makes the flyby powers of a couple of familiars useless for any spell-delivery, at least insofar as this specific feature and avoiding being in reach of counter-attacks on the enemy's turn may matter. Using these rules, your best bet is to have the familiar swoop in on its turn and use the Hide action to hide behind an ally or something in reach of the desired target, cast the touch spell and have your familiar use his reaction to deliver it, and then Hide again on the familiar's turn.

For this to work ideally, the target needs to act between your familiar and your action, rather than between your action and your familiar's. That way, ideally, the familiar moves into position and Hides, the target acts, then you cast the spell and the familiar uses the Reaction to deliver it, then the Familiar acts and Hides, then the target gets to act again.

If you have that arrangement of turn orders, you're good, as long as the target doesn't have a higher passiver perception than your familiar's stealth check and the target stays put, within 5 ft. of the familiar's hiding place.

You can get a little more leeway out of this by having your familiar ride a party member's shoulder or something: using the mount rules, the familiar just moves when the intelligent mount does, and doesn't use his own movement unless dismounting. He can make attacks from there. Whether he has enough obscurement to hide on the person of the ally he's riding is up to the DM, however.

[Quoz]

Goodberry + familiar is as good as it gets for low level yo-yo healing. Have a small pouch for them and your familiar can revive any ally that drops to 0 hp for 1/10th of a 1st level spell and no PC action. Since goodberries last 24 hours, you can even use your last spell slots before a long rest to have pre-cast heals that last all day.

Since familiars break action economy, they tend to work well with magic items as well. Some, like having them fold up and carry your party in a portable hole, require no attunement. Others, like activating your Cube of Force or Ring of Spell Storing are a bit more complicated. I dont think it is spelled out specifically in the rules how familiars attune to items, but I think the adventure league ruling that they share your attunement slots is a good ruling.

[Segev]

Goodberry + familiar is as good as it gets for low level yo-yo healing. Have a small pouch for them and your familiar can revive any ally that drops to 0 hp for 1/10th of a 1st level spell and no PC action. Since goodberries last 24 hours, you can even use your last spell slots before a long rest to have pre-cast heals that last all day.

Since familiars break action economy, they tend to work well with magic items as well. Some, like having them fold up and carry your party in a portable hole, require no attunement. Others, like activating your Cube of Force or Ring of Spell Storing are a bit more complicated. I dont think it is spelled out specifically in the rules how familiars attune to items, but I think the adventure league ruling that they share your attunement slots is a good ruling.

While I won't dispute others' rulings on it, I will say that, by default, if the rules don't say a creature has different rules than the default, they default to "they're creatures" rules. And creatures have their own attunement slots.

The AL ruling may actually be particularly helpful, however: if they share your atunement slots, you can atune things that require a spellcaster and let your familiar use them. (Unless they ruled otherwise on that, but it seems a logical conclusion if it's your atunement being used.) As-is, they're not spellcasters, not members of any class, so familiars can only attune things that anybody can attune. And you often will need something with thumbs to use many items. Flying monkeys suddenly become a lot better as familiars if you can hand them your wand of fireball.

[Chronos]

Short answer, familiars are good for anyone. As to which feat to take, I'd recommend Ritual Caster, especially if you're in a party that doesn't already have a wizard. Two rituals probably aren't as good as two cantrips and a first-level spell... but two rituals plus all the other rituals you encounter in your adventure can be much, much better. My character with Ritual Caster ended up with eight of them, by the time he hit 14 (that campaign started at 1).

[sambojin]

Familiars are great for Moon Druids. They do the two things you want. Let you yo-yo with Good Berries while still tanking, and giving you advantage through the Help action to boost your rather poor to-hit.

Yes, others can use your berries for yo-yoing, but why not use something without a proper action?

Yes, you have other sources of advantage available. But making those pounces/ charges/ restrains stick far more regularly and reliably is worth the feat quite easily.

All the scouting and world interaction is a bonus.