Law and Order

[Sheogoroth]

So, one of my Players murdered a guy(surprise surprise!). Instead of doing the responsible thing and running away and hiding it, the other players decided they needed to face the music.
Is there a handbook on how to handle crime and punishment in a D&D setting? I think it would be interesting to have a courthouse drama play out.

[SquidFighter]

Did they confess their crime ? Because at that point it really just seems like they're gonna get a simple sentencing session. Then, the game is about the sentence, not the trial.

If you want to go for courthouse drama, they at least have to claim "Not Guilty".

You might want to think about the style of justice enforced in your setting.
Are they considered guilty unless proven otherwise, or it's inverse ?
Can they be subjected to Questionning ? (The medieval kind.)
Can they demand trial by combat ?
Can they demand religious ordeals to prove their innocence ?
Do they get to negociate the sentence, or is there a magistrate that simply enforces the King's Law ?

[Crake]

Did they confess their crime ? Because at that point it really just seems like they're gonna get a simple sentencing session.

I mean, there's more to it than that, depending on how in depth you're going. They may have killed someone, but they might not be charged with murder, they might argue self defense, or manslaughter if it wasn't intentional, or if they are charged with murder, it matters the circumstances to determine if it was premeditated or not, and so on.

[KillianHawkeye]

Criminal justice systems, if they even exist, are going to vary wildly by setting and in many cases even by what country or region within a particular setting the game is taking place.

So OP, is your game in an established D&D setting? And if so, wherein?

If not, then you need to answer some questions about how "modern" the setting is. Such as, do the lower classes theoretically have the same rights as upper classes? Or for that matter, different races (i.e. orcs)? Is legal representation available equally, or only to those who can afford it? Are legal judgements decided by a jury, an impartial judge or arbitrator, or by the local mayor/noble/king? Are verdicts fair or harsh? Are they nuanced enough to differentiate between murder of passion, premeditated murder, accidental murder, and killing in self-defense? How much jurisdiction does the legal system actually have (i.e., if a crime happens in the wilderness, is it subject to prosecution)? Do they still use any medieval style judgement systems, like trial by combat or witch trials or something like enduring a lot of suffering? Are the laws generally secular, or are the courts run by various religious sects which might have different ways of doing things? Are there any wacky fantasy laws that need to be considered? Is magic such as mind-reading or divinations or Zone of Truth allowed to determine guilt and innocence?

I'm sure I could go on thinking of things, but the point is that there are a lot of variables to consider if you're making it up from scratch.

[Quentinas]

There is something in dungeon master guide II , and in the cityscape book , but they are dependant on the setting so maybe is not so useful for you there are some examples at least

[mindstalk]

There's also sentencing. What if the PC is found guilty? We're used to years in prison, because we're filthy rich and can afford to spend resources on not just unproductive prisoners but their guards. Traditional punishments in general were fines, corporal punishment (hard to simulate short of long term penalties to the PC, can't flog the player), exile/outlawry, or execution (which we also use.) But some societies had fines for murder, weregeld; could say that's equal to seven times the annual income of the victim.

Or perhaps, weregeld for *manslaughter*, killing someone but then turning yourself in, making your plea of self-defense or crime of passion or whatnot. Killing and trying to cover it up puts you into murder and outlawry, itself close to a death sentence (anyone can kill you without penalty.)

(Disclaimer: bunch of ideas from fallible memory, and simplified. But you need gameable ideas, not a historical primer.)

[Batcathat]

There's also sentencing. What if the PC is found guilty? We're used to years in prison, because we're filthy rich and can afford to spend resources on not just unproductive prisoners but their guards. Traditional punishments in general were fines, corporal punishment (hard to simulate short of long term penalties to the PC, can't flog the player), exile/outlawry, or execution (which we also use.) But some societies had fines for murder, weregeld; could say that's equal to seven times the annual income of the victim.

From a roleplaying perspective (and assuming the player wants to keep the character) exile seems like the best choice. Having to pay a big fine or suffer penalties from corporal punishment would probably be annoying more than anything but exiling the character can offer some interesting drama, forcing them to either run away to some unfamiliar land or stay, but having to hide or change their identity.

[Peelee]

There's also sentencing. What if the PC is found guilty? We're used to years in prison, because we're filthy rich and can afford to spend resources on not just unproductive prisoners but their guards. Traditional punishments in general were fines, corporal punishment (hard to simulate short of long term penalties to the PC, can't flog the player), exile/outlawry, or execution (which we also use.) But some societies had fines for murder, weregeld; could say that's equal to seven times the annual income of the victim.

Or perhaps, weregeld for *manslaughter*, killing someone but then turning yourself in, making your plea of self-defense or crime of passion or whatnot. Killing and trying to cover it up puts you into murder and outlawry, itself close to a death sentence (anyone can kill you without penalty.)

(Disclaimer: bunch of ideas from fallible memory, and simplified. But you need gameable ideas, not a historical primer.)

Also, all of those are punitive, not rehabilitative. A society could have a purely rehabilitative form of sentencing... Like a mandatory casting of Geas to compel you to do certain acts of restitution, or curse in which you must help anybody that requests it for the next x-time units, or you find yourself in immobilized or in immense pain or whatever. At the absolute extreme end of the spectrum, an offender may be crowned with a helm of opposite alignment (if ever done to a PC, obviously an OOC discussion before the fact would be warranted, at the very least).

With magic, there's a lot of potential for rehabilitation sentencing that can be incorporated into game play, instead of just having one character be caged up for however long.

[mindstalk]

From a roleplaying perspective (and assuming the player wants to keep the character) exile seems like the best choice. Having to pay a big fine or suffer penalties from corporal punishment would probably be annoying more than anything but exiling the character can offer some interesting drama, forcing them to either run away to some unfamiliar land or stay, but having to hide or change their identity.

OTOH annoying the player may be what it takes to get the player to change!

I just thought of a fantasy penalty: being level drained by a captive undead. (Or non-captive, if you're in some undead-ruled society like High Cromlech or Ravenloft.)


Also, all of those are punitive, not rehabilitative. A society could have a purely rehabilitative form of sentencing... Like a mandatory casting of Geas to compel you to do certain acts of restitution, or curse in which you must help anybody that requests it for the next x-time units, or you find yourself in immobilized or in immense pain or whatever. At the absolute extreme end of the spectrum, an offender may be crowned with a helm of opposite alignment (if ever done to a PC, obviously an OOC discussion before the fact would be warranted, at the very least).

With magic, there's a lot of potential for rehabilitation sentencing that can be incorporated into game play, instead of just having one character be caged up for however long.

Interesting point. Blue Rose's worldbuilding includes Aldis using torcs of Calm on offenders. D&D could have a geas of "you shall not fight within our borders". Or there's the Mark of Justice in Order of the Stick, which I just discovered is an actual core spell, not homebrewed.

[False God]

There is no law book or specific criminal codes or court procedure in D&D in general. Some settings have detailed out some of those things yes, but you'd need to provide details on which established setting you're using.

If you are using a homebrew setting, then the justice system is whatever you want to be.

[Batcathat]

OTOH annoying the player may be what it takes to get the player to change!

If the point is to change and/or punish the player rather than the character I don't think any sort of in-game procedure is the best, or at least not the most effective, idea.