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View Full Version : Optimization Help with a lvl 6 support forge cleric



WaroftheCrans
2020-04-29, 05:20 PM
Hello everyone, I'm semi-new here, but I've been playing 5e for about a year and a half, and half a year of 3.5 before that.
So I took up a new pc in one of the campaigns I'm playing, and I'm trying to run a purely support cleric, without really being too much of a healer.

I've never played a cleric before, and I'm hoping for advice.
Basic info: V. Human, Forge Cleric single classed. AC of 21, HP of 66
Rolled stats:
Str: 15
Dex: 12
Con: 18
Int: 12
Wis: 20
Cha: 12
VHuman feat: Perceptive
House ruled starting feat: Observant
4th lvl ASI: Wis+2
Feats are both half feats intended to boost wisdom, and get my passive perception up to deal with in-party shenanigans.
I have a belt of dwarvenkind to start, as the rest of the party has multiple magic items.

We're playing with the UA class features, so I can swap out cantrips, but I currently have:
Guidance, Spare the Dying, Thaumaturgy and Toll the Dead.

EDIT: Reformatted post and hopefully made it easier to help me.

Questions: Should I multiclass? If so, what into?
What spells would best help me control battle-field and buffs my allies?
What would be the ideal way to play a support forge cleric? Should I be on the front line with the paladin, or hanging back in the midline with concentration spells?
What feats would help my build?
What class features will be the most helpful to me?

Bobthewizard
2020-04-29, 05:25 PM
Take Spiritual Weapon and Spirit Guardians and then whatever else you want.

I'd still take Healing Word and Lesser Restoration even if you aren't focused on healing.

Zetakya
2020-04-29, 05:44 PM
What's the rest of the Party? It's difficult to know how to build a support caster without knowing who you are supporting.

WaroftheCrans
2020-04-29, 06:49 PM
Rest of the party- I'm unsure of some of their subclasses, as that's not something that's really been discussed between players at this table.
Conquest Paladin - Actively participates in combat, uses spells and smites.
Circle of dreams(?) Druid - usually just casts low level spells and cantrips, hasn't used wildshape yet. Occasionally heals people.
Fighter - Runs in there with a sword, and starts swinging, but can be hesitant for fear of dying
Mastermind Rogue - Standard crossbow action in battle, doesn't really use the help action.
Bard - No real actions in combat that contribute to play, he's the fabled CN lunatic. He's the reason why I need a passive perception of 26.
Warlock of the Raven queen - Spams eldritch blast, and occasionally hexes/uses a disable.

I'm trying to make combat more amenable to the rest of them, as I'm fairly sure I'm the most experienced player at the table.

Edit: the real goal here is to bring some functionality to the group without dominating combat. Good AoE's, battlefield control and buffs for other players are what I'm looking for.

WaroftheCrans
2020-04-29, 09:27 PM
Take Spiritual Weapon and Spirit Guardians and then whatever else you want.

I'd still take Healing Word and Lesser Restoration even if you aren't focused on healing.

Spirit Guardians is definitely on my list, as its good aoe, and offers control, and while spiritual weapon seems like a good bonus action use, isn't it's sole purpose to do damage?

The spells that I currently have prepared are Healing Word, Cure Wounds, Shield of Faith(c), Guiding bolt, Detect Magic(c), Enhance ability(c), Silence(c), Hold Person(c), Spiritual Weapon, Bestow Curse(c), Spirit Guardians(c).

Would you say that Lesser Restoration would be more useful than Cure Wounds?

And are there any good buffing/debuffing/control spells that don't require my concentration?

ImproperJustice
2020-04-29, 11:35 PM
Healing is just a worthless use of spell slots unless you are getting people back on their feet.
Thus healing word is the only spell worth your time.

I run a level 16 Forge Cleric and I am usually on the front line controlling areas with Spirit Guardians, and Spiritual weapon. Against major threats, you unleash Wall of Fire, or Animate Objects.
Late late, you start doing things with Plane Shift and Celestial Allies.

Your best support tools are preventive spells.
Aid is a great way to support your squishy allies, especially if someone with group hasinspiring leader to layer on top of it.

Late Game Heroes Feast is Amazing!

Since you are close to level 4 spells, Death Ward is a literal life saver. If the whole party drops, you can still get back up and start saving lives.

Gentle Repose should always be kept handy so if you miss someone when you run out of level 3 slots, you can cast it and then Revivify them later.

Banishment is a handy control spell and later encounter ender.
Bless should be a bread and butter spell for handling lesser battles to keep them from getting serious.

But really, spirit guardians and spirit weapon are a great combo for your tough as nails Cleric on the front line.

Something to think through and communicate to your group is that Clerics are not healers anymore. You are death insurance to a certain degree but they need to make smart choices.
Your primary role is status effect prevention including death, and to serve as a tankish guiding laser for the fist of your deity.

CTurbo
2020-04-30, 04:17 AM
In addition to what the others have said, I would stay full class Cleric all the way.

I would want Warcaster at level 8 for sure.

For level 12, since your Wis is already maxed, you could grab the always useful Res(Con). You don't want to lose concentration on Bless, Spiritual Guardians, or Wall of Fire!

Magic Initiate: Wizard for Green Flame Blade and Find Familiar would be good. (+1 another cantrip)

Stattick
2020-04-30, 07:39 AM
I wouldn't multiclass. But I would strongly consider picking up the Ritual Caster (Wizard) feat.

You'll get a familiar. And you'll be able to cast a lot of those support spells that aren't getting cast right now, without spending a slot. Detect Magic, Identify, Alarm, Tiny Hut, Gentle Repose, Telepathic Bond, etc. And the feat scales with CHARACTER LEVEL not with your level in a particular class. In the longest running game I'm in, our cleric picked that feat early, and it's been hugely useful.

The feat would be worth it just for the Familiar and Tiny Hut. The rest is gravy.

ImproperJustice
2020-04-30, 01:46 PM
I forgot to add some other vital and essential functions you can provide, especially if there is no one else carrying these duties:

Rituals are a great way to add to your utility:

Detect Magic, Identify, and Divinations like Augery, Divination, and especially Commune are essential exploration tools.
Commune has an up front cost, but afterward is a free three yes or no questions from your DM that can save a lot of wasted time and energy for the party.

Water Walk should honestly be kept around until you have a reliable way of not drowning if exposed to water.

Depending on your GM’s definition of point, creating a silence pebble can be a game changer.

Mask your heavy party members movements and toss it way when battle starts.
Toss it at an enemy patrol and take them out without a sound before they can alert allies.
Heck, load it in a sling and launch at an enemy caster to force them out of position and do some harm along the way.


Lastly, Heat Metal is an excellent spell in your arsenal for offense and defense if you encounter a heavily armored or armed opponent.

AH0098
2020-05-01, 08:29 AM
I agree with pretty much everyone has posted so far. Your Forge Cleric's best method of battlefield control is Spiritual Guardians, and walking into the front line.

Honestly with a party as large as yours, you should be fine, I think a lot of your issues is do to inexperienced players not working through their party rolls.

Your Bard should be capable of a lot of utility, outside of Wizard they are the most versatile casters, and we'll the most versatile class period.
Your Dream Druid won't wild shape, it's not their specialty, Moon Druids are the wild shape circle. Your Dream Druid should have some decent utility and battle field control depending on the encounters you face.

Your best battlefield control is your Paladin, they just don't come online with their fear aura until lvl 7.
I think you are trying to do too much to fix something that isn't broken, I would sit my fellow players down and talk about tactics and coordination in combat. Also if your fighter takes sentinel, they and the Paladin plus your spirit guardians will prevent almost any melee encounters from messing with your Druid, Warlock and Bard.