Bannan_mantis
2020-05-11, 12:51 AM
So I’ve created martial combat expansions in the past which aim toward fixing a few issues I had with martial combat. Previous versions of that are here - https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?607238-Martial-Combat-Expanded&p=24370559#post24370559 and now I’ve created a new version to that expansion. Most of the main goals for this are the same as the old versions but I’ve had a few changes and I’d like to explain why I made those changes. Anyway here are the links for the new versions and a few other things, I’ve split them up as both cover different aspects:
https://homebrewery.naturalcrit.com/share/RJ1-09ieC - basic changes, things such as weapons, actions, feats and etc.
https://homebrewery.naturalcrit.com/share/LObtJj4gh - combat maneuver system
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/14GiZuuMDwF5renc8TW4tB4W_4Rd3a46VWGfcFKI-HeY/edit?usp=sharing - calculations for balancing weapon damage
Overall I’d love to get feedback, I know this is a lot though so feedback on any part of this would be appreciated. There's bound to be things I've missed or messed up on so any input would be appreciated.
New Weapon Changes
So I’ve done a large amount of changes to the ways weapons can work, I’ve added new weapon traits and changes to a large amounts of the regular weapons. I’ve also designed some of these changes to try and balance certain elements such as how finesse weapons should, on average, deal less damage than non-finesse weapons so strength based characters do genuinely do more melee damage when compared to their dexterity alternatives (and by that I mean a strength based one hander vs dexterity based one hander or strength based two hander vs dexterity based two hander.) Dexterity is very much a more powerful stat than strength in 5e so I feel this change can work to help give strength more to it to try and balance it against dexterity more. I’ve also done the same with strength based ranged weapons so dexterity still has the advantage when ranged damage is concerned. Overall these changes tend to mean that weapon users deal 0.25 extra points of damage than normal which I tend to find is overall executable and doesn’t necessarily break anything.
Elemental Weapons
This is more designed as an option for martials to prepare for a combat encounter against a specific type of creature so martials can be a bit more effective in monster hunting style scenarios.
New shields
While I think the basic shield being representative of different shields can be simple but effective I tend to find it’s very boring. So for this reason I’ve added tower and buckler shields which are both designed so that they function in the same way they function in real life. Tower shields work to protect others like how shield walls function and bucklers give you more mobility with your shield hand but both have their costs such as the movement reduction on tower shields and the fact that bucklers can’t block ranged attacks. Overall I hope these costs balance out these new shields and allow for a larger amount of variation within shield choices. Additionally I’ve changed shield master to specifically work differently with different types of shields to show this variation even more.
Armour Changes
I’ve already talked about the silent heavy armour and heavy padding in other versions but essentially silent heavy armour is designed as an option for people in heavy armour to be slightly stealthy if they’d like to or they need to and heavy padding is designed so that people without heavy armour can have decent strength and don’t have to choose dexterity for their AC. Overall both tend to work fine while balanced well, the cost of the silent heavy armours mean that they sacrifice AC for their stealthiness when compared to armour of similar cost and strong characters using heavy padding don’t have any major advantage over regular dexterity characters not using heavy padding (in fact the regular dexterity alternatives tend to do better from initiative and good dexterity saves.)
New actions
The ram and shift options are designed so people can use their movement in a larger amount of ways which could make speed used more in combat which could lead into it being taken into account more during combat. Also sprint was designed so 5e characters actually run around at speeds you’d expect them to with your average person running at 13.5 mph which fits the average running speed but physically adept characters can move faster with them reaching 20.5 mph which fits since they’re physically very capable and that’s around the speed of an athlete which is fitting. This does mean level 20 monks can run at 40.9 mph or tabaxi monks with mobile can move at 95 mph which I know some people might not like since that’s clearly superhuman but I’m personally fine with it since monks should be pretty fast and that’s not that insane compared to other things people can do at those levels.
Grappling Change
Basically I wanted to allow grapplers to function against larger creatures a bit more so when they fight a large creature they can still help. I felt like the regular grapple wouldn’t work so I designed this to more be like you joyriding it so it still feels like you’re fighting a huge monster. Also the grapple holds were there since I wanted to give grappling more options and I felt like the regular prone + grapple combo is a bit redundant in usage so I tried to make it more varied. Also finally this does improve grappling in power but to be honest I felt grappling is kinda weak in 5e so I don’t think it’s much of a major issue.
Unarmed strike change and fighting styles
This is so non monks could use unarmed striking a bit if they’d like to. I feel people will say this invalidates monks but I’m against that since monks do more than unarmed strikes and overall these unarmed strikes tend to work ok when compared to the weapon alternatives with them not being too much stronger or weaker. Also while there is an unarmed style in recent UAs that works it works for grapplers, not really so much for strikers, so that's why I've added a brawler and pugilist style with one being about striking but the other about grappling.
Sneak attack finesse change
I did this so strength rogues can be a bit more functional by them having access to the benefits of strength weapons. It’s not enough to make them on par with dexterity rogues but it gives them something.
Ki techniques
I always felt the basic ki options for monk were boring so here are some options designed to be more varied. Also some of these do get somewhat wuxia or superhuman, that’s very much on purpose since I feel monks should have options for functioning like that since I think a lot of players choose monks for the express reason of feeling like a superhuman esc character.
Two weapon fighting style change
I felt that two weapon fighting on a fighter was really quite weak compared to alternatives so this is designed so that two weapon fighters can function on a level more equal to their alternatives. Also I’ve specifically made it so they on average deal less than great weapon fighters since two weapon fighters can spread their damage out more than two handers.
Fencer option
I’ve added options for using a one handed weapon without a shield. I’ve made it so it’s as effective as a two hander as I feel that should be the case since well both of them are designed around you using a single weapon with no shield so they have the same amount of attacks per turn and same level of protection. To make it so it does this while still being interesting I’ve designed this to basically be a high accuracy option which I feel fits this kind of warrior. Feat Changes Most changes to feats were done for balancing and overall I feel it works, you can see the average damage on a fighter that each feat does. I’ve also changed these in an attempt to make them more balanced.
Magic item changes
Most of these are designed to allow for different warriors to benefit from magic items more. Grapplers can now use magic gloves to grapple magical creatures, thrown weapons that are magic get returned so thrown weapon fighters actually use the bonus to attack and damage from those magic weapons and unarmed+unarmoured options since monks could use them.
Combat Maneuvers
Combat maneuvers are designed as a new system designed to be the main thing that gives martials new combat options. The maneuver types are designed to make it a bit easier to use the system and also to allow feats to specialise into certain maneuver types. Also I do know that this does step on the toes of the battlemaster a bit as it makes something specific to them something all characters can do but there's a few reasons I have which I feel clears this up with those being:
1 - battlemasters can be masters of this system since they still know more maneuvers than anyone else and have easier access to superiority dice so they still have a level of specialisation and power other characters don't have
2 - a lot of what the battlemaster can do should kinda be things martials can do on their own. Tripping people, pushing people, feinting, almost all of what the battlemaster can do feels like things that a large majority of warriors should or would be capable of doing.
Barbarians, rogues and fighters
I feel these 3 classes should be getting the most out of the new system as they have the least combat options at a base and are the most weapon focused classes in the game so overall I feel they deserve the most options. For barbs I’ve given them reckless attack for superiority dice, for rogues a decrease of sneak attack since half their sneak attack costs 50% of their overall damage but for other characters it’s more 25% from extra attack and fighters just get the most since well fighters are masters of combat and should know the most about fighting.
https://homebrewery.naturalcrit.com/share/RJ1-09ieC - basic changes, things such as weapons, actions, feats and etc.
https://homebrewery.naturalcrit.com/share/LObtJj4gh - combat maneuver system
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/14GiZuuMDwF5renc8TW4tB4W_4Rd3a46VWGfcFKI-HeY/edit?usp=sharing - calculations for balancing weapon damage
Overall I’d love to get feedback, I know this is a lot though so feedback on any part of this would be appreciated. There's bound to be things I've missed or messed up on so any input would be appreciated.
New Weapon Changes
So I’ve done a large amount of changes to the ways weapons can work, I’ve added new weapon traits and changes to a large amounts of the regular weapons. I’ve also designed some of these changes to try and balance certain elements such as how finesse weapons should, on average, deal less damage than non-finesse weapons so strength based characters do genuinely do more melee damage when compared to their dexterity alternatives (and by that I mean a strength based one hander vs dexterity based one hander or strength based two hander vs dexterity based two hander.) Dexterity is very much a more powerful stat than strength in 5e so I feel this change can work to help give strength more to it to try and balance it against dexterity more. I’ve also done the same with strength based ranged weapons so dexterity still has the advantage when ranged damage is concerned. Overall these changes tend to mean that weapon users deal 0.25 extra points of damage than normal which I tend to find is overall executable and doesn’t necessarily break anything.
Elemental Weapons
This is more designed as an option for martials to prepare for a combat encounter against a specific type of creature so martials can be a bit more effective in monster hunting style scenarios.
New shields
While I think the basic shield being representative of different shields can be simple but effective I tend to find it’s very boring. So for this reason I’ve added tower and buckler shields which are both designed so that they function in the same way they function in real life. Tower shields work to protect others like how shield walls function and bucklers give you more mobility with your shield hand but both have their costs such as the movement reduction on tower shields and the fact that bucklers can’t block ranged attacks. Overall I hope these costs balance out these new shields and allow for a larger amount of variation within shield choices. Additionally I’ve changed shield master to specifically work differently with different types of shields to show this variation even more.
Armour Changes
I’ve already talked about the silent heavy armour and heavy padding in other versions but essentially silent heavy armour is designed as an option for people in heavy armour to be slightly stealthy if they’d like to or they need to and heavy padding is designed so that people without heavy armour can have decent strength and don’t have to choose dexterity for their AC. Overall both tend to work fine while balanced well, the cost of the silent heavy armours mean that they sacrifice AC for their stealthiness when compared to armour of similar cost and strong characters using heavy padding don’t have any major advantage over regular dexterity characters not using heavy padding (in fact the regular dexterity alternatives tend to do better from initiative and good dexterity saves.)
New actions
The ram and shift options are designed so people can use their movement in a larger amount of ways which could make speed used more in combat which could lead into it being taken into account more during combat. Also sprint was designed so 5e characters actually run around at speeds you’d expect them to with your average person running at 13.5 mph which fits the average running speed but physically adept characters can move faster with them reaching 20.5 mph which fits since they’re physically very capable and that’s around the speed of an athlete which is fitting. This does mean level 20 monks can run at 40.9 mph or tabaxi monks with mobile can move at 95 mph which I know some people might not like since that’s clearly superhuman but I’m personally fine with it since monks should be pretty fast and that’s not that insane compared to other things people can do at those levels.
Grappling Change
Basically I wanted to allow grapplers to function against larger creatures a bit more so when they fight a large creature they can still help. I felt like the regular grapple wouldn’t work so I designed this to more be like you joyriding it so it still feels like you’re fighting a huge monster. Also the grapple holds were there since I wanted to give grappling more options and I felt like the regular prone + grapple combo is a bit redundant in usage so I tried to make it more varied. Also finally this does improve grappling in power but to be honest I felt grappling is kinda weak in 5e so I don’t think it’s much of a major issue.
Unarmed strike change and fighting styles
This is so non monks could use unarmed striking a bit if they’d like to. I feel people will say this invalidates monks but I’m against that since monks do more than unarmed strikes and overall these unarmed strikes tend to work ok when compared to the weapon alternatives with them not being too much stronger or weaker. Also while there is an unarmed style in recent UAs that works it works for grapplers, not really so much for strikers, so that's why I've added a brawler and pugilist style with one being about striking but the other about grappling.
Sneak attack finesse change
I did this so strength rogues can be a bit more functional by them having access to the benefits of strength weapons. It’s not enough to make them on par with dexterity rogues but it gives them something.
Ki techniques
I always felt the basic ki options for monk were boring so here are some options designed to be more varied. Also some of these do get somewhat wuxia or superhuman, that’s very much on purpose since I feel monks should have options for functioning like that since I think a lot of players choose monks for the express reason of feeling like a superhuman esc character.
Two weapon fighting style change
I felt that two weapon fighting on a fighter was really quite weak compared to alternatives so this is designed so that two weapon fighters can function on a level more equal to their alternatives. Also I’ve specifically made it so they on average deal less than great weapon fighters since two weapon fighters can spread their damage out more than two handers.
Fencer option
I’ve added options for using a one handed weapon without a shield. I’ve made it so it’s as effective as a two hander as I feel that should be the case since well both of them are designed around you using a single weapon with no shield so they have the same amount of attacks per turn and same level of protection. To make it so it does this while still being interesting I’ve designed this to basically be a high accuracy option which I feel fits this kind of warrior. Feat Changes Most changes to feats were done for balancing and overall I feel it works, you can see the average damage on a fighter that each feat does. I’ve also changed these in an attempt to make them more balanced.
Magic item changes
Most of these are designed to allow for different warriors to benefit from magic items more. Grapplers can now use magic gloves to grapple magical creatures, thrown weapons that are magic get returned so thrown weapon fighters actually use the bonus to attack and damage from those magic weapons and unarmed+unarmoured options since monks could use them.
Combat Maneuvers
Combat maneuvers are designed as a new system designed to be the main thing that gives martials new combat options. The maneuver types are designed to make it a bit easier to use the system and also to allow feats to specialise into certain maneuver types. Also I do know that this does step on the toes of the battlemaster a bit as it makes something specific to them something all characters can do but there's a few reasons I have which I feel clears this up with those being:
1 - battlemasters can be masters of this system since they still know more maneuvers than anyone else and have easier access to superiority dice so they still have a level of specialisation and power other characters don't have
2 - a lot of what the battlemaster can do should kinda be things martials can do on their own. Tripping people, pushing people, feinting, almost all of what the battlemaster can do feels like things that a large majority of warriors should or would be capable of doing.
Barbarians, rogues and fighters
I feel these 3 classes should be getting the most out of the new system as they have the least combat options at a base and are the most weapon focused classes in the game so overall I feel they deserve the most options. For barbs I’ve given them reckless attack for superiority dice, for rogues a decrease of sneak attack since half their sneak attack costs 50% of their overall damage but for other characters it’s more 25% from extra attack and fighters just get the most since well fighters are masters of combat and should know the most about fighting.