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StickMan
2007-10-26, 10:35 AM
I was wondering if there has ever been any information put out on the history of the gods of the core DND pantheon, how they were developed what inspiration sources did the authors draw on and so on.

I ask because I'm doing a paper for my classical mythology class and I may want to do something on Pelor who very much resembles the Greek God Apollo. Both Are sun gods concerned with farming and healing and athletics, aka strength domain in Pelors case.

If anyone can give me any info on the core pantheon, or on the history of Pelor in DND, I would be great full.

Kurald Galain
2007-10-26, 11:00 AM
Where else would you find it? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Dungeons_%26_Dragons_deities)

DrummingDM
2007-10-26, 11:25 AM
Where else would you find it? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Dungeons_%26_Dragons_deities)I was going to recommend Dieties and Demigods (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=products/dndacc/881650000).

Jasdoif
2007-10-26, 11:41 AM
I was going to recommend Dieties and Demigods (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=products/dndacc/881650000).Deities and Demigods didn't touch much on the development of the "default" pantheon that I saw. IIRC (can't check the book here) there was a single sidebar, talking about how the pantheon was created with deity choices class-by-class, instead of by general role as the book suggested for creating your own pantheon.

CASTLEMIKE
2007-10-26, 11:46 AM
He gets about 2 paragraphs in the Living Greyhwak Gazetter. I'd suggest checking out Canonfire:http://www.canonfire.com/ or Wikpedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pelor

http://www.fortunecity.com/rivendell/hero/37/gods/pelor.html

http://www.fortunecity.com/rivendell/hero/37/gods/pelor.html

http://www.nyrond.org/turbine/deity-show?deity=Pelor

Legends and Lore from the old editions at Wizard's not sure how helpful it will be:

http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/dnd/downloads

Other articles with brief metion of Pelor at Wizard's:
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/prc/20070807


http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20041203a

Old Dragon article on Pelor #346 back in July:
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/news/20060718a

One of the 9 Gods article:
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20010406

DeathQuaker
2007-10-26, 11:52 AM
Pelor is a Greyhawk god, so researching Greyhawk and its development history is probably your best bet.

And understand that the best you might find is, "We needed a sun god, so we made Pelor. He is kinda like Apollo."

You might spin it around--depending on your assignment--and show how Greek mythology has influenced modern pop culture. If you illustrate the comparison strongly enough with enough logical argument, you don't necessarily need a quote saying, "We based this god on this other god."

You can also look at a lot of the Forgotten Realms deities, many of whom bear similarities to Greek Mythological gods -- Lathander also bears a LOT of similarity to Apollo, even more than Pelor (he is connected to youth, virility and the dawn... he is a *young* god and a god of young men, like Apollo... compared to say, the dead Sun God Amaunator, who might be somewhat likened to the older Sun Titan Helios). Selune references quite obviously Selene the Moon Goddess/Titaness (and to a lesser extent Artemis). Sune shares similarities with Aphrodite. The Red Knight has a faint resemblance to Athena. Chauntea is plays a similar role to Gaia, and perhaps moreover Demeter.

You might also look at obvious absences... there are gods of learning and magic and gods of travel and trickery in D&D, but none quite resemble Hermes. Why? Why reference some gods and not others?

And of course if you do pick up Deities and Demigods, you can also see how the system stats out the Greek Gods themselves, and compare those stats to similar gods.

MrNexx
2007-10-26, 02:43 PM
Incidentally, as a teacher, I would NOT suggest making wikipedia your primary research source for anything. A starting source, sure. The place you jump of from, no problem. But if 90% of your footnotes (or MLA-be-damned parenthetical citations) are referring to Wikipedia, your teacher is not likely going to look kindly upon it.

Nerd-o-rama
2007-10-26, 03:06 PM
Ugh, parenthetical citations. So tacky. Anyway, don't cite Wikipedia; use Wikipedia's bibliography to figure out what books to check out. Or just use Wikipedia and cite them instead, it's not like teachers bother to check these things (No offense, MrNexx).

Kurald Galain
2007-10-26, 03:25 PM
Incidentally, as a teacher, I would NOT suggest making wikipedia your primary research source for anything.

It might not be the most appropriate thing for academics, but it's the first and truest resource for geekdom topics :smallsmile:

MrNexx
2007-10-26, 04:40 PM
It might not be the most appropriate thing for academics, but it's the first and truest resource for geekdom topics :smallsmile:

He's writing a school paper. I would tell my students that it was fine as a place to look first, but it should always be checked against another source, and it was best used as a way to get an overview so you knew what else to look at.

Sure, if I want to reference something quickly on a message board (such as MLA notation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MLA_Style_Manual)), I use wikipedia freely. It's handy. But if I'm writing a serious work, I'm going to have real sources that aren't wikipedia to back it up.

(Funny story: I've been working on a project for Palladium, and one of the hardest things about it has been NOT putting in footnotes as to where I got my information, as would be required in the Chicago Manual of Style (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicago_manual_of_style).)

Tallis
2007-10-26, 05:11 PM
Don't know about Pelor specifically. St Cuthbert is an actual saint and many of the Forgotten Realms dieties are taken directly from real world mythologies. They did articles on several of the core dieties in dragon magazine over it's last couple years, but I don't remember any references to real world dieties or the connections between them. The demonomicon entries did have references toi their real world origins if you want to look at really ancient dieties like Pazuzu.

StickMan
2007-10-26, 08:15 PM
This is a college paper and I'm just throwing around this as an idea if I can find the info. I'm doing it as a long shot but figured I would try. At any rate I'm well aware that Wiki is a bad source. (This has not how every stopped me from writing whole paper off the source cites, in which the teach said do not use wiki, I got an A by the way).

I know it does not sound like a college paper but the Professor once gave someone an A for doing a painting of Cronus eating his children.

RTGoodman
2007-10-26, 08:26 PM
St Cuthbert is an actual saint and many of the Forgotten Realms dieties are taken directly from real world mythologies.

Yeah, it freaked me out a little when I was reading Bede's "Historia Ecclesiastica" and he started talking about all the deeds of St. Cuthbert.


Anyway, any Greyhawk material (the Gazetteer, etc.) is probably great for info about Pelor, but as for his creation? I'm not so sure you'd be able to find much. You might have to even resort to trying to get in touch with whoever created the world of Greyhawk (Gygax, I guess?), which would be a pain.

Oh, and because I'm a nerd, here's a site (http://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/557/01/) that's pretty good as a reference for MLA stuff.

MrNexx
2007-10-26, 08:32 PM
Oh, and because I'm a nerd, here's a site (http://owl.english.purdue.edu/owl/resource/557/01/) that's pretty good as a reference for MLA stuff.

Except, ya know, it's about MLA. :smallbiggrin:

However, you might try going over to Dragonsfoot (www.dragonsfoot.org) and doing some searches. In addition to Cannonfire, that's where a lot of grognards and even designers from the early days post. You might be able to find information about the genesis of Pelor.

CASTLEMIKE
2007-10-27, 04:24 AM
LGC has a little information at Wizard's in the Living Greyhawk Dieties V2 pdf:

http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=lg/welcome