Bean vs. Vetinari

[kco_501]

Who do you think would win in a political power play between the two. Both come with their own groups, and are on different sides. Everything is allowed, but they should share a tech level.

PS. I mean Bean as he developes ni the Shadow Saga, not just in Ender's Game... And the Patrician, also as he is developed in the more recent books (i.e. with the assasin training and so forth)

[Kaelaroth]

If they are sharing a tech level, Vetinari. He just takes over everything with his control-freak uber-cool tentacles of political intrigue. :smallamused:

[Porthos]

I'm disappointed. :smallfrown:

When I opened this thread, I was hoping it was referring to the other well known Bean (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mr._Bean).

Oh well. Maybe next time. :smalltongue:

[Riffington]

Why would they fight?

[kco_501]

It would be inevitable if they were to share a space time continuum and NOt be on the same side... Vetinari would not allow such a power player to exist. And i am not sure that Bean could be handled with only political intrigue, as he proved more than capable of outwitting bread geniuses and also seeing through enemies plans.

[Tengu]

I'm disappointed. :smallfrown:

When I opened this thread, I was hoping it was referring to the other well known Bean (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mr._Bean).

Oh well. Maybe next time. :smalltongue:

Same here. I really think it would've been very interesting...

[kco_501]

The answer to the other Mr Bean is too obviuos... he would be catalogued as Mime and thrown to the scorpion pit

[Hermit]

This (http://content.answers.com/main/content/wp/en/thumb/4/4c/180px-Bean_the_Dynamite.gif) was the first Bean which came to my mind. no idea why either.

[Greebo]

It would be inevitable if they were to share a space time continuum and NOt be on the same side... Vetinari would not allow such a power player to exist. And i am not sure that Bean could be handled with only political intrigue, as he proved more than capable of outwitting bread geniuses and also seeing through enemies plans.

Disagree. I believe you do not understand Havelock Vetinari.

Vetinari has no interest in turning A-M into an empire, or in conquest of any sort. (See Making Money AND Jingo) His is the most powerful city in the world, yet he allows many power players to exist within his realm, even when he is aware they could challenge him (Vimes, Von Lipwig, Harry King, even, to a degree, the editor of the Times), not to mention the number of power players outside of his realm with whom he maintains positive relations (The Low King, That Lady Vampire, and so forth).

[bugsysservant]

Vetinari Hands down. Bean could probably lead a successful army against Ankh Morpork, but we know how that would turn out... :smallbiggrin:

[dehro]

I'm disappointed. :smallfrown:

When I opened this thread, I was hoping it was referring to the other well known Bean (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mr._Bean).

Oh well. Maybe next time. :smalltongue:

lol...me too, I was thinking of blackadder..

[Moff Chumley]

...Pratchet vs. OSC...
Um...
Vetinari.

[Malik]

Vetinari.

He is just too tricky.

[Cyrano]

"Bean chose of his own free will to become a master spy. It was that or choose of his own free will to be thrown out an airlock. Into a pit of scorpions."

[The_Snark]

Truly, free will is a wonderful thing.

[Green Bean]

Vetinari.

Bean uses armies. Vetinari uses people. While in the expanded Shadow books, Bean learns how to win people's loyalty, he's got nothing on Ankh-Morpork's twistiest mind.

[Winterwind]

I'm not so sure.

Vetinari is so brilliant in his schemes that the sheer scope of it is being used for comedic effect, but still I have the feeling he is way below the level of genius Bean operates upon.

No matter his plans and manipulations, Bean would foresee them and devise a counter.

[bugsysservant]

"Bean chose of his own free will to become a master spy. It was that or choose of his own free will to be thrown out an airlock. Into a pit of scorpions."

Bean would be a TERRIBLE spy! The guy is what, eight feet tall?


I'm not so sure.

Vetinari is so brilliant in his schemes that the sheer scope of it is being used for comedic effect, but still I have the feeling he is way below the level of genius Bean operates upon.

No matter his plans and manipulations, Bean would foresee them and devise a counter.

Just like he saw through Achille's, hmm...

And I have no doubt that Vetinari is better than Achilles. Bean is smarter and a better strategist than Vetinari, but he's not that great at politics.

[kco_501]

In the shadow books bean proved to be quite able to master the subtler art of politics and in the newer Discworld books Vetinari showed ample fighting skills... so i would not dismiss either of them on these grounds.
Also,let me remind you that both are obviously highly intelligent and adaptive, and while suffering apparent setbacks at times, have never actually lost a conflict.
(except maybe Vetinari in Sourceror, but i find that particular one irrelevant)

[Green Bean]

In the shadow books bean proved to be quite able to master the subtler art of politics and in the newer Discworld books Vetinari showed ample fighting skills...

No, Bean understood politics, but he never really tried to play them. That was more of Peter's job.

[kco_501]

Because Peter was already on it, but not because of lack of potential or possibility :) And while Bean does not make a play for power, because he is not interested in having it, i think he would "retire" someone he deemed inadecquate. And to that end, do anything including politics :)

[Cyrano]

Bean would be a TERRIBLE spy! The guy is what, eight feet tall?

This is the sort of thing that you'd expect.
But you're talking about the Discworld. Pratchett makes the things you expect NOT HAPPEN, merely for personal amusement.

[Dervag]

It would be inevitable if they were to share a space time continuum and NOt be on the same side... Vetinari would not allow such a power player to exist. And i am not sure that Bean could be handled with only political intrigue, as he proved more than capable of outwitting bread geniuses and also seeing through enemies plans.Vetinari doesn't pick fights with powerful and cunning enemies if he can help it. Bean isn't very ambitious; Vetinari would quickly ascertain that he's not a great threat to Vetinari's rule or the prosperity of Ankh-Morpork.


Because Peter was already on it, but not because of lack of potential or possibility :) And while Bean does not make a play for power, because he is not interested in having it, i think he would "retire" someone he deemed inadecquate. And to that end, do anything including politics :)Vetinari is easily as good a politician as Peter- better, because he's not as blind to the things that don't concern him.

Peter Wiggin is something of a megalomaniac; he's so focused on uniting the world (with benevolent aims, granted) that he loses sight of the details. This makes him vulnerable to his enemies on levels that Vetinari is not. So if Bean was willing to follow or tolerate Peter, he'd be willing to follow or tolerate Vetinari.