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View Full Version : D&D 5e/Next The Telekineticist [PEACH] [WIP]



DerTollUdo
2020-06-13, 08:37 AM
This is my first time making an entire class by myself, so all feedback is helpful. I got many of the ideas for this class from the 3.5 version I was heavily involved in creating. My biggest issues are general balance, and appeal of the different archetypes. I do know I am missing most of the fluff, but that can be worked out after all the crunch gets fixed. And I'm missing some of the newer staples like quick start and stuff, as well as better formatting. All that said, here's the class!



Level
Proficiency Bonus
Hands
Features


1st
+2
3
Strong Hands, Archetype


2nd
+2
5
Fling, Tier 1


3rd
+2
7
Strike


4th
+2
9
Forcearmor, Tier 2, Ability Score Improvement


5th
+3
11
Touchsight


6th
+3
13
Tier 3


7th
+3
15
Manifest


8th
+3
17
Tier 4, Ability Score Improvement


9th
+4
19



10th
+4
21
Tier 5


11th
+4
23



12th
+4
25
Tier 6, Ability Score Improvement


13th
+5
27
Manifest


14th
+5
29
Tier 7


15th
+5
31



16th
+5
33
Tier 8, Ability Score Improvement


17th
+6
35



18th
+6
37
Tier 9


19th
+6
39
Manifest, Ability Score Improvement


20th
+6
41
Tier 10





Main stats
Cha save, Wis Save
Skills: 3 Sleight of Hand, Stealth, Arcana, Athletics, Investigation, Insight, Medicine, Perception, Performance, Deception, Persuasion
D6 hit die
Proficiencies: Weapons -None, Armor - Light, Tools - None

Starting equipment:
Any one light armor
Any gear pack (explorer, burglar, etc.)

Alternatively, you may start with 3d4 × 10 gp to buy your own equipment.

Base Abilities

Hands: At first level, your powers manifest in the form of Telekinetic Hands, generally referred to as Hands or TH throughout this class. As you gain levels you gain Hands in accordance with the table above. These Hands are what power your abilities. Your Hands are an emanation from you, and have a trivial physical or visual sensation associated with them (chosen by the player at creation) that others can detect with normal senses. All abilities, unless otherwise stated, require 1 action to perform. These abilities count as magical for overcoming damage resistances and antimagic effects. For all save DCs 8 + your proficiency bonus + your Charisma modifier They are used in two distinct ways:

• Expanded: During a long rest, you may expand or unexpand Hands to grant you various abilities. These abilities may be used as long as they are expanded. The Hands used in this manner are unavailable to be invested. An ability will list how much its expansion costs next to it i.e. Thing (1H): to show that this ability requires 1 Hand to be expanded in order to use it. You are proficient with all expanded abilities. If an ability lists another ability in its description then that ability must be expanded as a prerequisite as well.

During a short rest, you may change some of your Hands up to your [/b]Tier Limit: You can unexpand them to free up Hands for investing, or you may Expand them as a different ability, or any combination of those.

• Invested: As an action, you may invest your Hands in your expanded abilities to augment them. They remain invested until you use another action to change them. You may only invest as many Hands as the ability says you can. Any Hands invested in abilities that take time cannot be changed until the ability they are used in completes. You may do this as a bonus action a number of times per short rest equal to your Tier Limit.

* Tier Limit: Many of the abilities in this class reference Tier Limit, or TL. This is simply a number equal to the highest tier ability you currently have expanded.


Archetype: Each Telekineticist has a natural inclination to a specific way of using their abilities. You pick one of the paths and gain abilities in it as you progress in the class. You only gain the abilities for your specific branch.

The Controller branch focuses on the raw power of their TH and manipulating the energies in the world around them; such as creating barriers, creating areas of intense gravity, and ripping holes across the multiverse.

The Martial branch focuses on using their TH to manipulate weapons and others around the battlefield; such as fending off small armies alone, or speeding up their allies.

The Precision branch focuses on concentrating their TH into a more refined approach. They can manipulate the light and sound that others perceive, unravel magical energies around themselves, and even take the energy from others leaving them exhausted.

At 1st level, each Telekineticist must decide which branch they are.

Strong Hands(1H): At 1st level, as an action, you may manipulate or maneuver objects, but not creatures, within 10' of yourself. This includes precision manipulation like picking locks if you have the skill, holding a door shut, and liquid manipulation as though the liquid were solid objects. You may lift up to 15 times you Cha score in pounds. Should anything require an ability check using these, it is done with Cha; proficiency applies if you are proficient in the skill or ability.

If you choose to drop an object on someone/something it deals 1dX damage (based on your Cha mod as shown below) if the target fails a Dex save. If they pass, they take no damage. If the object is large enough, the DM may allow this ability to hit multiple targets requiring them all to make a save.

For a charisma modifier of: +0 and below you deal 1d4 damage, +1 is 1d6, +2 is 1d8, +3 is 1d10, +4 is 1d12. As you increase in Telekineticist levels, the damage of this ability increases as well. At each of the levels listed, increase the damage by 1dX: 5th level (2dX), 11th level (3dX), and 17th level (4dX)


Investment:


1 Hand to double Carrying Capacity with this ability.

Hands to increase range by 10' per Hand.



Fling (1H): Starting at 2nd level, when you have Strong Hands expanded you may pick up and launch an object, or launch and object already being held, as a ranged attack action. The attack may originate from any point within the range of yourStrong Hands, and has a range equal to half of Strong Hands. This object must be something you can physically lift with your Hands. To hit, you roll a d20+prof+Cha and on impact you deal 1dX+Cha Bludgeoning or Piercing (based on the object thrown) damage. Damage scales based on your Charisma modifier as follows:

For a charisma modifier of: +0 and below you deal 1d4 damage, +1 is 1d6, +2 is 1d8, +3 is 1d10, +4 is 1d12. As you increase in Telekineticist levels, the damage of this ability increases as well. At each of the levels listed, increase the damage by 1dX: 5th level (2dX), 11th level (3dX), and 17th level (4dX)


Investment:


3 Hands to grant yourself advantage on the attack roll.



Strike (1H): Starting at 3rd level, as an action you are able to make a melee attack at a distance using your TH. This attack has a range of 30' and deals 1dX+cha Force damage. The damage of this ability is dependent upon your Tier Limit. TL 1, 2 = d4; TL 3, 4 = d6; TL 5, 6 = d8; TL 7, 8 = d10; TL 9, 10 = d12.


Investment:


Hands to add +10' range per Hand

Hands to increase number of damage die for this ability at 1 die per Hand. You may only make this investment a number of times equal to your TL/2 round down (minimum 1).



Forcearmor (1H): Starting at 4th level, you have learned how to brace yourself with your TH to assist in keeping you safe. You may add your Cha to your AC when you aren't wearing armor or a shield.


Investment:


1 Hand to increase the bonus by +1.

2 Hands to be able to grant this bonus to another person within the range of your Strong Hands only if you have that ability expanded as well. They only keep this bonus as long as they are in range of your Strong Hands. Granting this bonus requires an action and takes concentration.



Touchsight (1H): Starting at 5th level, you have begun to learn what most things feel like. This has granted you the ability to use your TH to see, in a way. Your TH now provide a sense of what's around you. In a 10' radius centered on you they grant a physically based, and detail accurate, mental image of what is there. You don't perceive colors, nor do you perceive ethereal things. But you do perceive invisible things and ignore non physical illusions, as examples.


Investment:


Hands to grant you an increased range of 10' per Hand.



Ability Score Improvement: When you reach 4th level, and again at 8th, 12th, 16th, and 19th level, you can increase one ability score of your choice by 2, or you can increase two ability scores of your choice by 1. As normal, you can't increase an ability score above 20 using this feature.

Manifest: As your proficiency has grown, so has the breadth of you abilities. Each time you gain this ability, you are able to pick a power from a different branch than your main. These additional powers cost extra Hands to expand, but otherwise act as normal. The abilities must be of a tier you already have powers for at the level you get this ability.

The first time you get this ability, 7th level, you pick one branch and one ability from it. These second branch powers cost an extra Hand each to expand.
The second time you get it, 13th level, you pick a second power from that same branch, and one power from the third branch. The powers in the third branch cost 2 extra Hands each to expand.
The third time, 19th level, you pick a third power from the second branch and a second from the third.



Archetypes


Martial

Tier 1 - Strong Legs (2H): At 2nd level, you can use your TH to boost your base walk speed. Your move speed is increased by 5’ as long as this ability is expanded. Additionally, you may move over non-solid surfaces and vertical surfaces as long as you end your movement on solid, horizontal ground.


Investment


Hands to add 5’ per 1 Hand. You may only invest a number of Hands equal to your Tier Limit.

Hands to grant the effects of this ability to others within the range of your Strong Hands at 1 target per Hand, doing this takes an action and requires concentration to maintain the effect on others.



Tier 2 - Handheld Weapons (2H): At 4th level, you gain the ability to pick up and wield weapons with your TH; it turns out that learning to wield a weapon is much easier when you don't have to worry about a physical body in your way. Weapons wielded this way are treated as you being proficient, but only when they are wielded by your Hands with this ability. To expand this ability, you must have Strong Hands expanded, and the weapon must be able to be lifted with it. With this ability you may use an attack action to use a weapon against a target. To hit, you use your prof+Cha, and damage is dealt based on the weapon itself and adding your Cha.

They may be used within the same range as your Strong Hands, and may be repositioned as a move action up to half of the range. They threaten/flank squares as they would if being wielded normally, and you can make a reaction attack with them as normal.

Once manifested, you have 2 Hands available that can wield weapons. You can only wield weapons if you have the required number of Hands that the weapon needs. For example, a dagger would need only 1H, where a bow would need 2H. These weapons cannot benefit from abilities like Great Weapon Master, Sharpshooter, Reckless Attack, etc.


Investment:


Hands to add 1 additional Hand for wielding per Hand invested. You may only invest a number of Hands equal to your Tier Limit.



Tier 3 - Handheld Strikes (2H): At 6th level, you have learned how to incorporate your Strike into the Handheld Weapon attacks you make and requires both to be expanded. With this ability expanded, you are able to add the current damage of Strike on each successful hit you make, but this damage will not be included in critical multiplying.


Investment


5 Hands and you may apply this damage to critical multiplying.



Tier 4 - Surge (2H): At 8th level, you can now use more than one weapon when attacking. As an action, you may make a single attack with every Handheld Weapon you currently hold, you make one attack roll and apply it to all attacks. Only one weapon can benefit from being a critical. No target may be targeted by more than 2 weapons with this attack. You may only use this ability a number of times per long rest equal to your Tier Limit.


Investment:


Hands to apply critical to an additional weapon at 1 additional weapon per Hand.

2 Hands to gain advantage on this attack roll.



Tier 5 - Martial Strikes(2H): At 10th level, you can now use your TH to perform combat actions. As an attack action you may make use of your Strong Hands (required for this ability) and its associated ability rolls (Cha(Athletics) vs target Dex(Athletics) or Str(Acrobatics) at their choice) to Disarm (object falls in an adjacent square, or you may pick it up with Strong Hands as a part of the action), shove, or grapple creatures of the same size category as yourself.

A move action is required each turn to maintain the grapple effect, and the target can resist as normal on all checks. It has the same range as Strong Hands.


Investment:


3 Hands to get advantage on the rolls.
Hands to increase the size category you can grapple as at 2 Hands per size category larger than you they are. Making this investment treats the rolls as though you were of the same size category your TH are mimicking e.g. medium, large, etc.



Tier 6 - Lockdown (2H): At 12th level, you can now create an area of thick Telekinetic Force using your Strong Hands. As an action, you make a Cha+prof attack roll and target a 5’ cube within the range of your Touchsight. All creatures within the area of effect who would be hit with the attack roll are subject to a saving throw. If they fail, they are incapacitated in place, held where they are mid-motion by your Hands. This effect lasts until the start of your next turn. If they succeed, they are subject to being restrained instead, but they roll to resist with advantage. You roll Cha(Athletics), they roll with advantage Dex(Athletics) or Str(Acrobatics) as they prefer as though it were a grapple counted as a same size creature as the target(s).

Once someone has been incapacitated for 1 round or passed their save, they cannot be incapacitated by the same character's Lockdown again until after the user finishes a long rest. Should it be tried, they are treated as having auto passed the save and instead roll with advantage to resist being restrained.

You may only use this ability a number of times per long rest equal to your Tier Limit.


Investment:


Hands to increase the dimensions of the cube by 5’ per 2 Hands. At least one 5' cube must be within range, but all of them do not need to be.

2 Hands to cause all those who are incapacitated to be subject to being restrained in the following round. They may break free as normal for a grapple. This additional effect lasts until the start of the following turn.

Hands to extend the maximum duration of the restrained condition by 1 round per Hand.



Tier 7 - Multi Handed (2H): When using an ability that requires an attack action, you may use another ability that requires an attack action, or even the same one again, in the same action.


Investment


Hands to increase the number of simultaneous attack actions at 7 Hands per additional attack action. You may not invest more than 14 Hands this way.



Tier 8 - Positioning Hands (2H): As an action, you may switch places with a willing or unconscious ally. They must be within range of your Touchsight.


Investment


2 Hands to receive total cover provided by your Hands upon arrival at the new location that lasts until the start of your next turn.

2 Hands to grant the switched ally total cover upon arrival at the new location that lasts until the start of their next turn.



Tier 9 - Deflecting Hands (2H): As a reaction when you would be attacked, you may use your Strike to reflect attacks made against you back at the attacker, both melee and ranged, as long as the origination of the attack is within the range of your Touchsight. When using this ability, you roll your Strike damage. If you roll more damage than the attack would deal, you reflect it back at the attacker. It uses the original attack roll and damage roll with any extra Strike damage being applied as a bonus to the damage at 1 point of bonus for 2 points of damage left from the strike. You may only use this ability a number of times per long rest equal to your Tier Limit.


Investment


Hands to increase the return attack roll by +1 per 3 Hands



Tier 10 - Puppet Hands (2H): You may use your Hands to maneuver a willing ally. You may, as an action, use your Strong Hands to boost their maneuverability. A target within range is granted the following benefits: speed is doubled, it gains a +2 bonus to AC, it has advantage on Dexterity saving throws, and it gains an additional action on each of its turns. That action can be used only to take the Attack (one weapon attack only), Dash, Disengage, Hide, or Use an Object action.

These bonuses last until the start of your next turn, and targets must remain within your Strong Hands range. You may only use this ability a number of times per long rest equal to your Tier Limit.


Investment


Hands to grant additional allies the bonus at 3 Hands per target.

Hands to allow you to spend a move action per turn to maintain these bonuses for 1 round per Hand.


Controller

Tier 1 - Carrying Hands (2H): You gain a fly and swim speed equal to your base speed as long as this ability is expanded.


Investment


Hands to add 5’ per Hand. You may only invest a number of Hands equal to your Tier Limit.

Hands to grant the effects of this ability to others within the range of your Strong Hands at 1 target per Hand, doing this takes an action and requires concentration to maintian the effect on others.



Tier 2 - Walls (2H): You can solidify some of your Hands into a quasi physical barrier. Using your Strong Hands you may create a 5’x5’ wall segment in range, this requires concentration. You may place the wall in any direction and orientation as you desire (such as a box if you invest additional panels). The wall affects objects and creatures differently. Objects that are individually within your Strong Hands carrying capacity are stopped, those beyond it simply ignore the wall.

Unlike normal Strong Hands where objects are cumulative in weight, each needs only to be within the capacity to be stopped by the wall.

Weapon attacks against the wall are simply blocked, with the Fling investment (below) they instead bounce back at the attacker.

Creatures may attempt to pass through the wall, however, upon doing so the wall tries to shove them away with a few differences. Those who interact with the wall must make a Str save against your save DC. If they pass, that particular panel of Walls fades away for the duration. If they fail, they are subject to a shove. Unlike a normal shove, those that fail are pushed 5’ + 5’ per 2 they failed the check by (minimum 0).

The wall otherwise lasts until you stop using a move action to maintain it each round.


Investment:


Hands to add another 5’x5’ panel to place for each hand.

2 Hands to have the bonus shove distance replaced with a Strike (no attack roll, upgraded Strikes are able to be used but must be expanded/invested at time of wall creation). The damage dealt is rolled once each turn when you use the move action to refresh it. This damage is the same until the start of your next turn.

Hands to increase the weight capacity by 100 per Hand

1 Hand to have objects that impact get automatically [b]Flung (if expanded and within Strong Hands capacity). They target where they came from, using the objects original attack roll if one was present and fling damage.

2 Hands to allow the wall to block or reflect (if above investment is also chosen) spell effects as well. If the spell is an area effect, it is blocked as though the wall is a physical barrier. If it is a targeted attack at you, then you can choose to reflect it, otherwise it is blocked.

1 Hand to impose disadvantage on the saves made to push through the wall.



Tier 3 - Vibrating Hands (2H): You may change the vibration of your Strikes allowing you to cause half of the damage to repeat at the start of the creatures next turn.


Investment:


1 Hand to change the vibrations of your Strike allowing you to mimic 1 of the following damage types (chosen at time of investment): Fire, Cold, Acid, Bludgeoning, Lightning, Piercing, Radiant, Necrotic, Slashing, or Thunder



Tier 4 - Overflowing Strike (2H): As an action make a Cha+prof attack roll and apply it to all targets of your choice within range of your Touchsight. Any who would be hit are hit by a Strike. You may only use this ability a number of times per long rest equal to your Tier Limit.


Investment:


2 Hands to gain advantage on the roll.

2 Hands to cause half of the damage to repeat at the start of your next turn if they are still in range. This can stack with Vibrating Hands for full damage to repeat.



Tier 5 - Singularity (2H): As an action, you may create a tiny black vortex within range of your Touchsight. The vortex requires concentration to maintain and lasts until the start of your next turn. Any square within a 15’ radius of the vortex counts as difficult terrain. Furthermore, any creature that begins its turn or moves within the 15’ radius of the vortex takes 1d6 damage and must make a strength saving throw.

On a failure, it is restrained for one round and is pulled 5ft towards the vortex. If the creature’s path is blocked, or if it is already in the same square as the vortex, the creature takes another 1d6 points of Force damage.

The damage dealt by this ability increases by 1 for each creature within the area of effect.

You may only use this ability a number of times per long rest equal to your Tier Limit.


Investment:


Hands to add +1d6 Force damage per 2 Hands. You may make this investment a number of times equal to your tier limit.

Hands to increase the duration by 1 round per Hand, each additional round requires an action to maintain the effect.

1 Hand to impose disadvantage on the saves.

Hands to increase the radius by 5’ per 2 Hands.



Tier 6 - Repelling Hands (2H): As an action, you create a 15’ cone that must begin within the range of your Touchsight pointing in whatever direction you choose, and it requires concentration. Those who enter a new square or start their turn within the area, are subjected to a shove away from the origin point. If someone collides with someone else, they take damage as well as causing another shove attempt on all those that were hit. The shove is based on your Cha, and can not knock prone; only push.

If they collide with a wall, a creature, or other such thing that cannot be shoved, they take 1d12 bludgeoning damage per 5’ they traveled this turn. Targets closest to the origin point are affected first.

If aimed upwards, those who reach the end of the cone on the outer edge will begin to fall. Those not on the edge will stay in the air and be considered prone. This ability lasts until the start of your next turn. The movement caused by this ability does not provoke attacks.

You may only use this ability a number of times per long rest equal to your Tier Limit.


Investment:


Hands to increase the duration by 1 round per Hand, each additional round requires an action to maintain the effect.

1 Hand to grant you Advantage on the shoves.

Hands to increase the cone by 10’ per 2 Hands, entering a new square triggers additional shoves so someone can be pushed out from the origin to the edge in one turn.



Tier 7 - Moving Hands (2H): You Hands can move across vast distances, and bring things with them. You may, as an action, travel to anywhere you are very familiar with on the same plane or to a teleportation circle you know. You may only use this ability a number of times equal to your TL/2 (round down) per long rest.


Investment


Hands to bring others with you at 2 Hands per target.

5 Hands to gain the ability to use a move action to teleport yourself only (other investment option doesn't interact with this one) to anywhere within the range of your Touchsight, or teleport unattended objects or ones in your possession with the same restrictions.



Tier 8 - Shuffling Hands (2H): Learning how to manipulate the willing has evolved into learning how to force the unwilling to move. As an action, you may make a Cha+prof roll against a target within the range of your Touchsight. Upon hit they are subject to a charisma saving throw. If they fail, you teleport them within the range of your Touchsight. If they succeed, nothing happens.

You may only use this ability a number of times equal to your TL/2 round down per short rest.


Investment


2 Hands to give the target disadvantage on attacks until the start of your next turn from the disorientation of the effect, even if they succeed on the saving throw.



Tier 9 - Shifting Hands (2H): Once per short rest you can use your Hands to rip open a small path to another plane. This path closes at the start of your next turn. If you don’t know a teleportation circle on the target plane, you end up in a random location near your target.


Investment


Hands to bring others who are willing with you on your action at 2 Hands per target.



Tier 10 - Banishing Hands (2H): Ripping the fabric of space behind your target, you attempt to shove them through to another plane of existence. As an action, you must make a Cha+prof roll against a target within the range of your Touchsight. On hit, the target must succeed on a Charisma saving throw or be banished for up to the next minute (10 rounds) subject to concentration. You must use a bonus action each round to maintain this effect, or else it ends and the target returns.

If the target is native to the plane of existence you’re on, you banish the target to a harmless demiplane. The target remains there until the spell ends, at which point the target reappears in the space it left or in the nearest unoccupied space if that space is occupied.

If the target is native to a different plane of existence than the one you’re on, the target is banished with a faint popping noise, returning to its home plane. If the spell ends before 1 minute has passed, the target reappears in the space it left or in the nearest unoccupied space if that space is occupied. Otherwise, the target doesn’t return.

You may only use this ability a number of times per long rest equal to your Tier Limit.


Investment


Hands to target additional creatures at 1 creature per 4 Hands. Each target is targeted by the original attack roll. You may only invest up to 20 Hands this way.
[+]10 Hands to force the target(s) to make the save with disadvantage.



Precision

Tier 1 - Gliding Hands (2H): You can use your Hands to drift. When you would fall, you may instead begin to glide. For every 5’ of vertical distance you fall, you can move up to 5’ horizontally. And you no longer take fall damage as long as this ability is expanded.


Investment


Hands to increase the horizontal distance by 5’ per per Hand. You may only invest a number of Hands equal to your Tier Limit.

Hands to grant the effects of this ability to others within the range of your Strong Hands at 1 target per Hand, doing this takes an action and requires concentration to maintain the effect on others.



Tier 2 - Precise Strike (2H): Upon focusing your Strikes to certain areas of the body, you have learned how to mimic certain physical effects. On a successful strike, the target must make a Charisma saving throw or be afflicted with one of the following conditions of your choice. Blinded, Deafened, Frightened, Poisoned, Stunned. Conditions last until the start of your next turn and start after the damage would be dealt, regardless of if any actually gets dealt.


Investment


Hands to increase duration of conditions, 1 round per Hand. The target may save on each round to break the effect early.



Tier 3 - Countering Hands (2H): You may use a reaction to have your TH rip apart a spell in the process of being cast within the range of your Touchsight. If the creature is casting a spell of 1st level or lower, its spell fails and has no effect. If it is casting a spell of 2nd level or higher, make an ability check using your Charisma. The DC equals 10 + the spell's level. On a success, the creature's spell fails and has no effect. This ability may be used up to a number of times per short rest equal to your Tier Limit.


Investment


Hands to increase the level automatically countered by 1 per 3 Hands.



Tier 4 - Bouncing Strike (2H): You may make your strike bounce between targets. As an action, make a Strike against a target, enhanced Strikes such as Precise apply to all hits. Using the same attack roll, select another target within range. If it hits, they take the original damage (and effects if any) -5 (minimum 1). You may continue to select targets until you miss, run out of targets, or the damage reaches 1, whichever comes first. Each target may only be struck once with this ability. Only the first hit can count as a critical for damage. This has the same range as your Strike.

You may only use this ability a number of times per long rest equal to your Tier Limit.

Investment


Hands to increase the number of hits that can count as critical at 1 per Hand.

2 to 8 Hands to reduce the penalty by 1 for each 2H, down to -1 minimum, for each bounce.




Tier 5 - Dispelling Hands (2H): You can, as an action, have your TH rip apart magic that is already in place. Choose one creature, object, or magical effect within range of your Touchsight. Any spell of 1st level or lower on the target ends. For each spell of 2nd level or higher on the target, make an ability check using your Charisma. The DC equals 10 + the spell’s level. On a successful check, the spell ends. This abilty may be used up to a number of times per short rest equal to your Tier Limit.


Investment


Hands to increase the level dispelled automatically by 1 per 3 Hands.



Tier 6 - Unfettering Hands (2H): Using your TH, you are able to precisely remove any hindrances to your movement. As an action you get the benefits of Freedom of Movement until the start of your next turn.

You may only use this ability a number of times per short rest equal to your Tier Limit.


Investment


Hands to extend this effect to others at 5 Hands per target.

Hands to extend the duration by 1 round per Hand, and they must be within range of you Touchsight for the duration.




Tier 7 - Hiding Hands (2H): You have learned how to use your Hands to disperse the light that would be reflected by you. As an action, you become invisible. This lasts until the start of your next turn. You may only use this ability a number of times per short rest equal to your Tier Limit.


Investment


Hands to increase the duration of the invisibility by 1 round per Hand.

Hands to increase the number of targets by 1 target per 3 Hands, and they must be within range of you Touchsight for the duration.



Tier 8 - Healing Hands (2H): You have learned how to knit together wounds using your Hands. As an action, you may heal a target within the range of your Strong Hands using the same damage as your Strike would deal. You may only use this ability a number of times per long rest equal to your Tier Limit.


Investment


Hands to affect additional targets per use at 1 target per Hand, the damage pool is split amongst all targets.



Tier 9 - Persistent Hands (2H): Your TH have become so adept at weaving through all manner of hindrances that they can even weave through areas where normal magic would falter. You may use your abilities within antimagic areas as long as this is expanded. They are only able to be used within 5’ of yourself, and all effects are subject to this range limit even if it would normally be greater.


Investment


Hands to increase the range they may be used by 5’ per 2 Hands.



Tier 10 - Exhausting Hands (2H): As an action, you use your TH in the most precise way to physically tax the target's muscles. You may use this ability as often as you would like, however individual creatures can only be affected once per long rest. You may make a Cha+prof attack roll against a target. On a successful hit, the target is subject to a constitution saving throw. On a failure they take one level of exhaustion*. On success they suffer disadvantage on attack rolls for their next round.


*Exhaustion Effects
Level - Effect
1 - Disadvantage on Ability Checks
2 - Speed halved
3 - Disadvantage on Attack rolls and Saving Throws
4 - Hit point maximum halved
5 - Speed reduced to 0
6 - Death


Investment


Hands to increase the levels of applied exhaustion by 1 level per 12 Hands.

JNAProductions
2020-06-13, 10:02 AM
So, first off-that's WAY TOO MANY SKILLS. Rogues get 4. Bards get 3. Base class should not grant 6.

I'd up weapon proficiencies to all simple.

Force Armor is FAR too good, with multiclassing in play. Any Heavy Armor Class 1/Telekineticist X grants you an AC of 18+Charisma Modifier, increasing over time to 20+Charisma modifier. (Assuming a shield is used.)
Touchsight is also too good. Blindsight at level 1 is really good, even at 10', and you can trivially make it 70' or 130' as you gain levels.

Oh, wait, that's not granted till level 4 and 5 respectively. That's not clear at all in the features-I'd edit that. And they're still far too good.

So, just in general, what are you trying to accomplish with this class? What's the goal?

Evoker
2020-06-13, 11:45 AM
Many of this classes abilities seem too strong. At level two, the following is possible:
Expand Strong Hands and Fling
Invest one hand for the doubled carrying capacity on strong hands, and one hand for the bonus damage per 25 pounds on Fling.
With a charisma of 20 (fully possible, even though you'll be weak in other stats this class only wants charisma) you can now lift 600 pounds of weight with your strong hands, and by extension with your Fling. Find and carry around a 600 lb boulder, or tree, or any similar object. Fling it at someone to deal 1d10+24 damage. Repeat as necessary.
Some other problematic abilities:
Forcearmor stacking with armor, as already stated.
Surge, with N weapons allows you to make N attacks. That's a lot of scaling (at level 20, that could be up to 40 attacks in one round).
Lockdown is fully repeatable AOE action denial. Very strong.
Multi handed. Every action you take is now four actions, with the investment of a mere 31 hands. Every. Single. Action. Combine with lockdown to force your opponents to not get hit by four attacks, keyed off of your primary stat, or be unable to act. Every. Single. Round.
Deflecting Hands can make you literally unable to be hit by attacks, and that's way too strong. Infinite AC against one attack per round would be broken already, but guess what, by investing a few hands you can get infinite AC against up to 8 attacks per round.
Counter strike. Invest a mere 28 hands and totally negate any spellcaster thanks to the one spell per round limit.
Afflicted strike(stunned) is again, repeatable action denial. Invest a few hands and spread the inability to act around, especially because you'll have advantage on the attack rolls to keep them stunned!
Apart from the obvious balance issues, several of the abilities are lacking key elements.
Fling does not specify the attack modifier, or even the range.
Strike does not specify the attack modifier.
Martial Strike includes the line "things like that". That feels like it's not specific enough.

The versitilty and power of this class are off the charts, and you can easily make your opponents completely unable to act at surprisingly low levels, while multiplying your own action economy to a ridiculous level.

DerTollUdo
2020-06-14, 12:40 AM
Yeah, I knew I was too high on the power scale. I wanted to post it sooner rather than later, and as such didn't get to do too much of raw number crunching. Most of my play experience was with 3.5 so I can see my power gauging is still skewed that way. Thanks for the suggestions and feedback!

One thing I forgot to mention was that I was planning on making the different abilities cost different Hands to expand, but couldn't find how I wanted them to scale and cross balance. My intent with the class was to build it so that others would want to have more than one ability expanded. Causing a balance of picking abilities over powering just one.

Skills, yeah I'll change those. I was just kinda guessing there. I was aiming for compensating for not having any real weapons for a few levels. Does 3 or 4 sound good? Should the weapons really be upped?

Forcearmor was more a cool thing that I went overboard with definitely. Obvious balance would be remove armor stacking, and require no shield. Maybe change the +1 investment to +2 and increase the Hands to compensate. Thoughts on the ability to grant bonus to others? It requires you to have another ability expanded so that's another Hand tax. Not sure.

Fling can be changed easy enough. I was leaning towards making it 100/75 for the bonus damage, and the die to a d4. Ends up maxing at 12 max damage, 16 on a crit. With a minimum of 9, assuming the highest weight. That's on par with a fighter using a d10 weapon and high str, with just a narrower range. That seem like a good balance point?

The table lists the levels they are granted, but yeah. I can see that I should add the levels to the ability itself.

Touchsight. What range scaling would be a good balance point? It is also used as a range factor for several other abilities, so can't be too over the top.

My intention with the class is to create a highly versatile character class that can change from offense to defense to utility rather easily, if they prepared the right expansions during the last rest. And also having to balance what they might need before the next round since they can only reinvest once per round as it is a bonus action.

Surge actually can't have that many hits. It requires a total of 4 Hands to be expanded in other abilities, assuming the expansion costs don't change, before the number needed for the weapons themselves. And expanding that many weapons would mean you don't have any other features of the class chosen. Perhaps using an increased expansion cost to limit the number of total weapons.

Lockdown, yeah I see that now. I think a simple choice would be to put a 1 or 2 times per short rest restriction on it. Would that solve the issue?

Multi handed is worded poorly. I wrote that after a long day lol. It was intended to be an extra attack kind of feature that to use would have you sacrifice damage options or other utility. I thought it was a decent attempt since you don't get it till level 14 anyway. Some help figuring out that would be greatly appreciated.

Deflect, same as above. Would granting a cover bonus be better? Or just a small boost to ac like the shield spell be better? The thing with this one is that you have to plan to be hit, since you can't invest as part of a reaction, and would have to give up your other action choices to use it.

Counter, again, it's something you have to plan to use since its a reaction. Would capping it at a lower level be better? Done most easily by raising the Hand investment cost. The point was that you need to choose if you want to fight or defend, or opt for something in the middle.

Afflicted. I think this would be best solved by making it a high cost investment to use and allow saves against in the first round. Since the only current tax on that is having Strike and Afflicted expanded.

Fling and Strike attack modifiers are supposed to be cha+prof, definitely missed that.

Martial strike has that wording in there because there are contests that aren't listed in the rules directly. Like disarm isnt actually spelled out except in the dmg, where it lists the contest as a general template to use for various combat interactions. Should I leave that caveat in there or restrict it to just those 3 types of actions?

The aim was for a strong class, though not overpowering. Help toning it down would be greatly appreciated.

TL:DR
Skills down to 3 or 4
Armor-remove stacking, change investment bonus?
Fling-struck with the nerf bat down to 9-16 damage range
Surge-Probably needs a higher expansion cost
Lockdown- apply per short rest restriction
Multi handed-Needs to be reworded into a workable extra attack
Deflect - less invincible, more sudden ac
Counter - higher costs
Afflicted - higher costs and saves immediately

Kael_Thor
2020-06-14, 10:08 AM
My intention with the class is to create a highly versatile character class that can change from offense to defense to utility rather easily, if they prepared the right expansions during the last rest. And also having to balance what they might need before the next round since they can only reinvest once per round as it is a bonus action.

I approve of this, reminds me of what I'm trying to do with my system, especially my Shroud technique.

Shameless plugging of my own stuff aside, I do like this, it has a lot of potential. I like telekinetic characters and versatile characters.
Unfortunately I'm too inexperienced with 5e to comment much on the numerical balance of things, but I do think flying at level 2 seems a bit powerful, especially fly speed that is the same as your base speed.

I will say that you have to be careful, balancing what you are trying to make is difficult, speaking from experience here. The trouble with versatile characters that can switch between offense, defense and utility easily is that unless balanced very carefully, you can accidentally create something that can replace all other characters, or is completely useless. If too good, then why should you play something else, if not good enough, then why should you play this?

I do like the basic system you have, although calling the resource Hands is a bit funny to me. I'm guessing the vectors of the Diclonii from Elfen Lied is a inspiration for this?
Name aside, I like your resource system, it reminds me of Incarnum and my own. As far as I can tell it works without being too complicated or number crunchy and I like that you can change expanded after a short rest. I assume you regain the Hands you have expanded and invested when completing a short rest?

Can you do complex manipulation using Strong Hands, such as lockpicking and pickpocketing?

Fling is a bit weird to me. It seems to me that it would be better to lift something heavy using Strong Hands and drop it on your target, than to throw it at the target. Is there a telekinesis spell in 5e that allows you to throw items at someone that you can use for inspiration?

On Expansion you are missing a / on the last [b]. I also wonder what you mean by branches, do you mean archetype? Do you get to pick powers from other archetypes than your own?

The power balance between your archetypes is a bit wonky. For example Martial tier 10 is move an ally, Controller tier 10 is a pocket dimension, Afflictor tier 10 is make a target exhausted. One of these is not like the others.

Additionally the archetypes don't seem to stick to their theme. Martial gets to move allies, which sounds more like a Controller ability, Afflictor gives you Freedom of Movement, Invisibility and Remove Cure/Greater Restoration. I think you need to go over the archetypes again and think over what you want each archetype to do. Do you want Martial to be 'fighting using telekinesis'? Moving allies doesn't really fit with that. Do you want Controller to be about controlling the battlefield? Where does pocket dimensions fit into there? And if Afflictor is about giving your opponents conditions, which the name suggests, then removing conditions fits, but invisibility doesn't.



TL:DR
Skills down to 3 or 4
Armor-remove stacking, change investment bonus?
Fling-struck with the nerf bat down to 9-16 damage range
Surge-Probably needs a higher expansion cost
Lockdown- apply per short rest restriction
Multi handed-Needs to be reworded into a workable extra attack
Deflect - less invincible, more sudden ac
Counter - higher costs

I think 3 is better, 4 may be too many.
If this was pathfinder, I'd suggest Forcearmor give deflection bonus to ac, but I'm unsure if that's a thing in 5e. Maybe compare it to a Shield spell? Being able to put it on others is fine, if the cost is high enough and the bonus low enough.
Why not change Surge to simply be Extra attack?
Even if you change Lockdown to be one per short rest, you also have to add a saving throw to it. Even once per short rest, aoe crowd control that doesn't have any save seems very strong.
I have no idea how to make Multi handed more balanced, being able to take multiple actions with one action seems Very strong. It sounds to me like you want to make Extra attack, but for other actions, and I'm not sure how that would work.
Maybe make Deflect into something similar to the monk's Deflect Missiles, or is that stepping on the monk's toes too much?

All in all, I think this needs some polish and balancing but it is an interesting start. With some more work, I think this can become really cool!

JNAProductions
2020-06-14, 11:55 AM
Why should this class get more skills than normal?

Most classes get two skills.

DerTollUdo
2020-06-14, 12:09 PM
Thanks!

I know what you mean by being difficult. I'm partly wondering if a simpler balance could be achieved with fewer Hands. But that would cripple the ability to do multiple things. So not sure where the point lies there.

I mean, for the flying, there are base races that grant the ability to fly.

Hands is a remnant from the 3.5 version of this class, and was inspired by that show yes.

I thought it was clear, let me know if it isn't: Expanded Hands are unavailable for use again until a short rest. Invested Hands remain invested in the same thing until you use a bonus action to shuffle them.

For Strong Hands, yes. They are meant to be precision TK that can also hold liquids.

Fling's intent was that you could use a small thing to whip at foes, or beat them with the door you broke down. I am unaware of a spell, but haven't done much looking honestly.

I'll fix the coding when I do a pass through for balance edits. Thanks for pointing that out! The intent is that you can pick up a few powers from the other archetypes. So if your campaign doesn't have someone who can handle X role, you could get something close.

TBH, most of the teir 7-10 stuff was made in rapid succession, and I was running dry on inspiration. Part of why I wanted to post and get feedback. So that someone could make a suggestion for me lol. And the afflictor was meant to be someone who controls the fights by inhibiting the enemy actions available to them. Applying exhaustion can be a very debilitating debuff. And I wasn't quite sure of anything that I could do with their theme. Suggestions welcome!

The branches got a bit fuzzy at the end yeah. The original themes were Pure (mage like), Martial (fighter like), Unarmed (monk like). But I ran out of inspiration and just created things. Totally open to any suggestions. When I get some serious time this week between work, I'll take a pass through with an eye for balance and tuning. Using any suggestions I can get. Might end up this weekend.

EDIT: And of course I posted without seeing the new post. For skills, probably because I like skills. If 2 is a more logical choice, then 2 it shall be!

DerTollUdo
2020-06-15, 02:55 AM
Alright, I got an idea to better balance strong hands and fling. Pardon lack of formatting, on mobile.

Strong hands: Using an action, you may manipulate or maneuver objects, not crearures, within 10' of yourself. This includes precision manipulation like picking locks, if you have the skill, and liquid manipulation as though the liquid were solid objects. You may lift up to 15 times you Cha score in pounds. If you choose to drop an object on someone/something it deals damage based on its weight if the target fails a Dex save. If they pass, they take no damage. For objects 10 pounds-99 pounds deal 1d6, 100 - 199 1d8, 200 - 299 1d10, 300 - 399 1d12. At (whatever the levels are for cantrip scaling) increase these damages by 1d.
Invest: 1 to double weight cap, 2 to increase range 10' each time.


Fling: Using Strong Hands, you can now launch your held objects at targets. Same range, same damage as if dropped but add cha mod, attack roll using cha+prof instead of save.
Invest: 3 Hands to grant yourself advantage on the attack roll.


This reigns in the power, and keeps the intent I was aiming for I think. It also keeps it as something even the non perfectly optimized character can get use out of. Thoughts on this? Is this the right direction to take the various abilities?

DerTollUdo
2020-06-20, 01:04 PM
That took longer than I had thought. I went through and did a more or less rewrite of the class abilities. I only managed to get through the Martial Archetype and base class abilities with this rewrite.

As I clearly wasn't ready to be saying this was complete, I changed this to a WIP class. Please let me know if the balance on the Martial path is more inline with what everything should be. If it is, I will spend more time to get the others reworked in the same manner.

Thanks for the help so far everybody.

DerTollUdo
2020-08-29, 02:10 PM
After finally getting some time from work to sit down and look over the branches, I feel I have reached a level way closer to balanced than when I began. Please let me know any thoughts anyone might have!