Can you hold a charge of Cure Light Wounds?

[SangoProduction]

Like how you can hold a charge of Shocking Grasp or whatever, I'm wondering if that sorta rule is universal to all melee touch spells, or if you need something to specifically call it out.

[Segev]

Like how you can hold a charge of Shocking Grasp or whatever, I'm wondering if that sorta rule is universal to all melee touch spells, or if you need something to specifically call it out.

It is universal to all melee touch spells, yes. But if you touch anything with that hand, you discharge the spell. Again, as with all touch spells.

[SangoProduction]

Awesome. And how long can you normally hold the charge? The table was in discussion about that for a bit, between Caster Level rounds, Spell Level rounds, 10 rounds, and indefinitely. So it would be helpful to know how long it could last.
(Also, do you know where I can find the rules for holding a charge? Literally all I get when googling are forum threads.

[Dimers]

It's under the "Duration" heading, oddly. Here it is on the SRD. (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicOverview/spellDescriptions.htm#duration) Answer to question 2 is "indefinitely".

[Zaq]

I am aware of the holding-the-charge rules, but to be honest, I'm fairly certain I've literally never seen it used in-game. How unusual is my experience in this regard?

[SangoProduction]

I am aware of the holding-the-charge rules, but to be honest, I'm fairly certain I've literally never seen it used in-game. How unusual is my experience in this regard?

I mean. I certainly never had it used in my games before.

[Dimers]

Huh. :smallconfused: It's come up more often than mounted combat in the 3.X games I've played.

[Biggus]

I have seen it used once or twice, but never for long enough to have to ask what the maximum duration is.

[Segev]

I've seen it used in situations such as a cleric casting it while en route to somebody in a silence field, and I've seen it with chill touch in particular due to its multiple-touches rules. I haven't seen it done in a game, but it might also be useful for somebody who has a "dead round" to spend charging up, so he doesn't need to cast next to his target but instead can waltz up and just poke him.

[Fizban]

The really fancy part is when you notice you're allowed to cast, move, and deliver the spell in the same round (it's under Actions in Combat, or under Spells, Range, Touch in Rules Compendium)- so most of the time you don't even need to hold a charge if your only goal is to avoid concentration checks for casting too close to someone.

Well that, and how reserve feats and many other abilities aren't spells, so you can hold a touch spell and then deliver it along with another Sp/Su/etc touch ability (next turn).

[newguydude1]

its main use is to bypass casting time.

personal weapon augmentation has casting time of 1minute. so i cast it, hold it, and when combat starts it automatically applies to my weapon which is carried by my other hand. 1min casting time suddenly a free action.

[Khedrac]

It's used whenever the caster misses on their attack roll with a (melee) touch spell...

Actually I'm with both Dimers in that it's used more often than mounted combat and Biggus in that no-one's ever asked the duration.

[SangoProduction]

Considering I didn't know that holding spells happened, without a specific call out in the spell or a class ability like Magus, it's pretty safe to say that it comes up very infrequently in my games.
I think I had someone try and have a mounted build about a year ago, personally.


The really fancy part is when you notice you're allowed to cast, move, and deliver the spell in the same round (it's under Actions in Combat, or under Spells, Range, Touch in Rules Compendium)- so most of the time you don't even need to hold a charge if your only goal is to avoid concentration checks for casting too close to someone.

Well that, and how reserve feats and many other abilities aren't spells, so you can hold a touch spell and then deliver it along with another Sp/Su/etc touch ability (next turn).

Oh. Neat. I can't seem to find an equivalent rule in pathfinder. Then again, I also couldn't find the duration of holding a spell either, so I could just be bad at it. Does anyone know where I can find such rules in Pathfinder?

[Dimers]

It's on this page (https://www.d20pfsrd.com/Magic/#TOC-Casting-Spells), but you have to scroll down quite a bit to get to it (or use Ctrl-F a couple times for the word "holding"). From the "learn something new every day" department: I wasn't aware that in PF you have to use a multi-touch spell all in one round. EDIT: Nope, I'm answering something that wasn't asked. You want confirmation that discharging a touch spell is a standard action? Here's (https://www.d20pfsrd.com/Gamemastering/combat/#TOC-Cast-a-Spell) the correct page.

[SangoProduction]

It's on this page (https://www.d20pfsrd.com/Magic/#TOC-Casting-Spells), but you have to scroll down quite a bit to get to it (or use Ctrl-F a couple times for the word "holding"). From the "learn something new every day" department: I wasn't aware that in PF you have to use a multi-touch spell all in one round. EDIT: Nope, I'm answering something that wasn't asked. You want confirmation that discharging a touch spell is a standard action? Here's (https://www.d20pfsrd.com/Gamemastering/combat/#TOC-Cast-a-Spell) the correct page.

Thank you very much good sir.

[Mordaedil]

The really fancy part is when you notice you're allowed to cast, move, and deliver the spell in the same round (it's under Actions in Combat, or under Spells, Range, Touch in Rules Compendium)- so most of the time you don't even need to hold a charge if your only goal is to avoid concentration checks for casting too close to someone.

Well that, and how reserve feats and many other abilities aren't spells, so you can hold a touch spell and then deliver it along with another Sp/Su/etc touch ability (next turn).

This is interesting, because it means that the intention is that you can pick when you want to safely cast the spell and the only time you can't, is when you are threatened in your starting square and if the target you are delivering the spell to also has enemies that can hit you as you deliver it. Otherwise you can either move up to the target, cast the spell or cast the spell, move to the target and land it.

[Psyren]

rom the "learn something new every day" department: I wasn't aware that in PF you have to use a multi-touch spell all in one round.

PF has a lot more of those thanks to the "Communal" category of spell.

[Segev]

PF has a lot more of those thanks to the "Communal" category of spell.

Though you can explicitly touch multiple willing targets for those. Chill touch remains...an outlier. Can you touch multiple unwilling targets? Or are you stuck having to make a single attack as part of casting it, or casting it ahead of time and then doing a full attack and hoping you can get off all the touches to which you're entitled?

[Nifft]

This is interesting, because it means that the intention is that you can pick when you want to safely cast the spell and the only time you can't, is when you are threatened in your starting square and if the target you are delivering the spell to also has enemies that can hit you as you deliver it. Otherwise you can either move up to the target, cast the spell or cast the spell, move to the target and land it. If you're threatened both where you start and where you want to deliver the spell, but not in the middle -- I don't think you can move part-way, then cast, then move the rest of the way, then deliver.


PF has a lot more of those thanks to the "Communal" category of spell. "Alright team, hands in the middle!"

This is exactly why teams form huddles right before making a play in football combat.


Though you can explicitly touch multiple willing targets for those. Chill touch remains...an outlier. Can you touch multiple unwilling targets? Or are you stuck having to make a single attack as part of casting it, or casting it ahead of time and then doing a full attack and hoping you can get off all the touches to which you're entitled?

I've tried out allowing players to hold the charge on attack spells until fully discharged, as in 1/level attacks total, and it didn't seem to break anything.

There were some potential "exploits" -- Stormguard Warrior was interesting, for example, and so was a Monk multiclass -- but those "exploits" did come with some resource expenditures, and they didn't seem to surpass what a more conventional character could do.

[SangoProduction]

I've tried out allowing players to hold the charge on attack spells until fully discharged, as in 1/level attacks total, and it didn't seem to break anything.

...I thought that was the default interpretation. huh. Neat.

[Nifft]

...I thought that was the default interpretation. huh. Neat.

It was certainly the default for my group -- nobody particularly declared that this was how it would go, we just all assumed in the same direction.

The official "clarification" and/or stealth rules change didn't change anyone's mind.

[Mordaedil]

If you're threatened both where you start and where you want to deliver the spell, but not in the middle -- I don't think you can move part-way, then cast, then move the rest of the way, then deliver.

Correct, I believe there's a feat that allows this. (one I rarely see people take)