View Full Version : Leomund's Hidden Lodge: Need Modification Help to make it a Scaling Survival Check
Quiet Wizard
2020-06-21, 05:57 PM
Leomund's Hidden Lodge (Complete Arcane, p. 113) is a pretty cool 5th level spell that gives your party a safe and camouflaged shelter for the night. I prefer something like this option over Mordenkainen's Magnificent Mansion, as it eliminates any contentious rules discussions regarding the hazards of combining extrad-imensional / non-dimensional spaces.
Anyhow, the issue I have with the LHL spell is the static DC 30 Survival Check. I'd like it to be scaling based on Caster Level so it can be still be potentially useful at high levels as it does at mid levels. Plus, in an optimization-friendly environment, a caster could allocate resources to buffing-up the spell's Survival Check in order to ensure maximum security for his friends' overnight sleep.
Do any of you have any suggestions on how the LHL spell text should be modified to accommodate such a scaling-friendly objective?
Thank you!
el minster
2020-06-22, 10:40 AM
20+Caster Level
Miss Disaster
2020-06-23, 01:14 PM
20+Caster Level
That seems about right. I was doing some math on how this spell performs at 9th level (earliest a Wizard can cast it) and at 20th level (when the static bonus becomes kinda "meh"). And CL +20 should make for a good ballpark scaling metric.
el minster
2020-06-23, 01:54 PM
20+Caster Level
20+ Caster Level [max 25]
that's better
EDIT: max 45 total
JNAProductions
2020-06-23, 01:56 PM
20+ Caster Level [max 25]
that's better
It's a 5th level spell. The current DC is 30.
Your proposal just nerfs it, and the scaling is entirely irrelevant.
el minster
2020-06-23, 01:58 PM
It's a 5th level spell. The current DC is 30.
Your proposal just nerfs it, and the scaling is entirely irrelevant.
The OP asked for scaling I gave hime scaling, Also I don't see how it's nerfed.
JNAProductions
2020-06-23, 02:14 PM
The OP asked for scaling I gave hime scaling, Also I don't see how it's nerfed.
The current check is DC 30. Your DC 20+CL (Max 25) caps at 25. That's 5 less than the current DC.
Unless you meant the CL bonus caps at 25-in which case, it'd cap at 45, which makes more sense. Is that what you meant?
el minster
2020-06-23, 02:51 PM
Sorry I meant 45.
JNAProductions
2020-06-23, 02:59 PM
Sorry I meant 45.
Okay, that makes sense.
It's not what you'd asked for, but instead of raising the survival DC, I'm going to suggest making the distance you have to get near it lower by somewhere between one foot and two every level past ten that the caster is. Or if you don't mind ending on an unusual number, every level past nine. This makes the shelter harder to find in a general search but if you already knew where to look makes it easier.
It also makes for fun trap setting shenanigans if you have those skills and a tracker that knows vaguely where you should be but not enough to narrow it all the way down.
Quiet Wizard
2020-06-24, 01:48 AM
Yeah, I like the "20+ Caster Level [max 45]" revision idea. Although, honestly, I don't see how any abuse shenanigans could occur if the formula was uncapped as we're talking about just a secure place to sleep here. Unless I'm missing something obvious? ...
******
It's not what you'd asked for, but instead of raising the survival DC, I'm going to suggest making the distance you have to get near it lower by somewhere between one foot and two every level past ten that the caster is. Or if you don't mind ending on an unusual number, every level past nine. This makes the shelter harder to find in a general search but if you already knew where to look makes it easier.
It also makes for fun trap setting shenanigans if you have those skills and a tracker that knows vaguely where you should be but not enough to narrow it all the way down.
That is a creative alternative, RSGA. Heck, it could possibly even be paired with El Minster's 20+ Caster Level [max 45] suggestion to make the spell even more useful at higher levels. Although some might argue it's getting too mathy at that point.
Yeah, I like the "20+ Caster Level [max 45]" revision idea. Although, honestly, I don't see how any abuse shenanigans could occur if the formula was uncapped as we're talking about just a secure place to sleep here. Unless I'm missing something obvious? ...
******
That is a creative alternative, RSGA. Heck, it could possibly even be paired with El Minster's 20+ Caster Level [max 45] suggestion to make the spell even more useful at higher levels. Although some might argue it's getting too mathy at that point.
The main reason I could think of for not uncapping it is that the thing does not burn easily since it's treated as stone, the thing doesn't stop operating in any way if you, say, open the door and shoot out long range combat spells, and if the DC is high enough then the thing just can't be found without a fiat circumstance bonus or lots of Aid Another. Which might not be available without feeling equally fiat-ish.
el minster
2020-06-24, 03:19 AM
Uncapped isn't too bad in this case but in general a cap is a good thing so I just like to cap everything.
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