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Curelomosaurus
2020-06-26, 11:46 AM
Exemplars of Evil provides a mechanic whereby "villains" can gain lackeys (basically followers) for free simply by being a villain. Is it possible for a PC to qualify as a villain to get lackeys? Exemplars of Evil specifically states that villains can be of any alignment, so even a good-aligned PC could potentially gain lackeys. Here is the closest thing EoE has to a definition of "villain":


Every villain is either a minor villain or a major villain. Minor villains are supporting characters. They have a place and purpose in the plot, but they are not central to it; thus, the PCs can defeat them without derailing the rest of the campaign. Many minor villains are minions of major villains. They might be interesting characters, but they lack the depth of detail and investment of time that you would put into creating a major foe.
Major villains are the principal antagonists in a campaign or adventure. They propel the story, driving the plot and the PCs’ actions toward the grand finale. Major villains are powerful and influential, and they pose a significant threat to the player characters.

From this, it seems like a villain is either a) not central to the campaign and lacking great detail or b) an obstacle to the other PCs who is powerful and drives the story. Is there a way to pull either of these off without derailing a campaign?

For reference, here's the relevant information on gaining and replacing lackeys:


LACKEYS Beneath minions in the pecking order are lackeys, less sig-nifi cant characters who live only to serve and protect their master. Lackeys are less impressive than minions and have lower Challenge Ratings. They might have levels in NPC classes, and they resemble the usual types of cannon fodder that player characters fi ght on a regular basis. A villain’s number of lackeys depends on her Charisma modifier and her Challenge Rating. Add the two values together and consult Table 1–2: Typical Lackeys. (For example, a villain whose CR + Cha modifi er equals 14 typically has twenty lackeys of CR 1, four lackeys of CR 2, and two lackeys of CR 3.) The table is meant only as a guide, so feel free to modify the numbers to meet your needs.


...if you choose to give your villain the Leadership feat, she gains a cohort and follow-ers in addition to any servants she accumulates by dint of her villainy.


For each week that a villain spends recruiting (or enslaving), she can regain a number of lackeys equal to 1d6 + her Cha modifi er.

el minster
2020-06-26, 12:03 PM
I believe to be a villian you need to cause problems for the PC's, that's it.

hamishspence
2020-06-26, 12:08 PM
I figure the "free minions" are a general guideline for creating villain encounters.

So it's not a case of "they declare themselves a villain and immediately those NPCs sign up to their cause".


As such - just declaring yourself a villain won't do anything.

Curelomosaurus
2020-06-26, 01:27 PM
Sad day. I guess I'll just have to settle for abusing Nymm Ascendant and Leadership. :smallfrown:

hamishspence
2020-06-26, 01:29 PM
Or role-play out the recruiting process a bit.

Aotrs Commander
2020-06-26, 01:35 PM
I think the bigger hurdle is as simple as "is the DM willing to let you have an army of minions," because if the answer is not "yes," then it doesn't matter what mechanics or lack thereof you can find.

Curelomosaurus
2020-06-26, 01:55 PM
Yes. I am aware that, like most dirty optimization tricks, this should never be used in-game without express permission from a DM.

Batcathat
2020-06-26, 02:21 PM
I think this would be hard to claim even as RAW, without some Olympic level semantic acrobatics, since the description of "villain" makes it pretty clear that a villain is different from the PCs.

KillianHawkeye
2020-06-26, 03:06 PM
It's pretty clear that villains are meant to be NPCs which oppose the PCs in some way. Even if you were to play an evil character, you're not the villain of your own story.

EDIT: Maybe if you were playing in a game where you're actually working against other players in some kind of designated heroes vs villains role, then it could work. But most games have all players on the same team.