[3.5] Best Individual Summons?

[Thurbane]

Which creature is the best you can get through a Summoning spell? Either the highest CR, or the one that provides the best SLAs or other redeeming qualities.

Specifically, not a Calling spell like Gate or Planar Binding, but a Summoning spell (Summon Monster, Summon Nature's Ally, Summon Undead, Summon Giants, Summon Elemental Monolith etc.).

Some ground rules for my question:


No PF, home-brew or 3rd party.
Do not calculate in things like Augment Summoning or other boosts to the spell from feat or class, just the base summons itself.
Must be from a spell, not an SLA, Su, invocation, infusion, psionic power etc.
Looking at individual summons, not spells that summon a group of beings.
Not Calling spells.

I know there will be loopholes I've forgotten, but maybe try to stay in the spirit of what I've asked? :smallsmile:

Cheers - T

The Summoner's Desk Reference: https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?255219

Other Summoning Spells: https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=23345947&postcount=4

[Mike Miller]

You've already named some good ones... Maybe I can think of an obscure Dragon Magazine one that you've missed...

[Thurbane]

You've already named some good ones... Maybe I can think of an obscure Dragon Magazine one that you've missed...

Sorry, probably wasn't clear in OP - I mean which summoned creature is best, not which summoning spell is best. :smallsmile:

[Troacctid]

Off the top of my head, unicorns and oreads, from SNA IV and VI respectively. They have great SLAs.

[JeminiZero]

Try the Summoner's Desk Reference (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?255219).

[Thurbane]

Off the top of my head, unicorns and oreads, from SNA IV and VI respectively. They have great SLAs.

Cool.

I've just noticed, of the core Summons, Unicorn Celestial Charger seems to be the highest challeng rating at 13; Leonal and Fiendish monstrous scorpion, Gargantuan come in at 12.

Phantom Bear from SC summons a CR 14 being, and Elemental Monoliths are CR 17.

Not that CR is the be-all and end-all, or even very accurate a lot of the time...

[Bullet06320]

at first level, summon fey from Kingdom of Kalamar, get a pixie with Irresistible Dance

[Thurbane]

at first level, summon fey from Kingdom of Kalamar, get a pixie with Irresistible Dance

Something broken in a KoK book? Colour me shocked! :smalltongue:

[Bullet06320]

Something broken in a KoK book? Colour me shocked! :smalltongue:

I didn't print it, i just abuse it, lol

first time i pulled that one off, DM said I had to roll for the 10% to see if i got one, lol

[Fuzzy McCoy]

Summon Elemental Monolith is hard* to argue with. A CR 17 creature at 17th level? Yes please!

*Actually it’s pretty easy to argue with, it does much better on a scroll than prepped every day.

The hollyphant on summon monster 8 gives you at least a three round AOE stun, in addition to a bunch of nice SLAs.

[Dalmosh]

Kaorti are very good options for SMII due to their selection of spell-like abilities.

[daremetoidareyo]

Summon dire hawk has hour/lvl duration, and thus rocks

[Thurbane]

The hollyphant on summon monster 8 gives you at least a three round AOE stun, in addition to a bunch of nice SLAs.

Kaorti are very good options for SMII due to their selection of spell-like abilities.

Summon dire hawk has hour/lvl duration, and thus rocks

Great answers, thank you. :smallsmile:

Also, great call daremetoidareyo: never thought to take the spell durations into account, defeinitely something to look at! https://forums.giantitp.com/images/sand/icons/icon_thumbsup.png

[Anthrowhale]

Summon Marked Homunculus (L1) and Summon Devoted Roc (L9) are two other hour/level summon spells.

Summon Giants is most notable on an archivist where they can summon a fiendish fire giant (CR 12) at level 7.

[Troacctid]

Summon dire hawk has hour/lvl duration, and thus rocks
I'm seeing minutes/level.

[daremetoidareyo]

I'm seeing minutes/level.

I'll be darned, memory retrieval error on my part. My bad.

Engulfing terror is fun.

[Delta_tea]

Summon Ice Beast 1, Wolf. Cheap spell slot, decent armor, 29HP, give it 1d6 frost aura without a save and let it run stuff down with 50 ft move. If your feeling frisky you can let it attempt a +3 1d6+1 bite attack for giggles.

[Asmotherion]

I'm a big fun of Summon Monster IV, V for summoning Allips.

Turns out, things immune to Wisdom Drain are extreamly limited, making it one of the best "all arounder summons".

The fact it's incorporeal is just icing on an already amazing cake.

The Summon Monster V ones are also Nice, if your DM lets you order your Undead to Order it's Spawns to be unquestionably obediant to you and view you as their creator. Raw, they have to obey a direct order from their creator, so this should theoretically enable you to create a small army with minimal investment.

[AvatarVecna]

Summon Undead IV/V gets you 1/2 Allips, which are good for the reasons stated above (although I'm not sure if Summon Monster can summon them, so the poster above might've been referrig to SU?). Summon Undead V can also summon a single wight. It only lasts rounds/lvl, but the ones that arise due to its spawn ability aren't summons and won't disappear when the spell ends. That's the seeds of a wightpocalypse in a lvl 5 spell with no extra costs - compared with big metamagic Fimbulwinter shenanigans or expensive Create Undead (...if it can even make wights? I don't quite recall), both of which are higher level.

[Thurbane]

Summon Ice Beast 1, Wolf. Cheap spell slot, decent armor, 29HP, give it 1d6 frost aura without a save and let it run stuff down with 50 ft move. If your feeling frisky you can let it attempt a +3 1d6+1 bite attack for giggles.

Unfortunately those line of spells are Creation, not Summoning.


Summon Undead IV/V gets you 1/2 Allips, which are good for the reasons stated above (although I'm not sure if Summon Monster can summon them, so the poster above might've been referrig to SU?). Summon Undead V can also summon a single wight. It only lasts rounds/lvl, but the ones that arise due to its spawn ability aren't summons and won't disappear when the spell ends. That's the seeds of a wightpocalypse in a lvl 5 spell with no extra costs - compared with big metamagic Fimbulwinter shenanigans or expensive Create Undead (...if it can even make wights? I don't quite recall), both of which are higher level.

On that note, not Summoning...but I recently stumbled on Sticks and Stone from Shining South: it's a Clr/Sor/Wiz 3 spell that creates a temporary skeleton, but the interesting part is that it drains levels as a Wight, so you could start a Wightocalypse as early as level 5, without needing extra feats or class features to do so.

[AvatarVecna]

Not Summoning, but I recently stumbled on Sticks and Stone from Shining South: it's a Clr/Sor/Wiz 3 spell that creates a temporary skeleton, but the interesting part is that it drains levels as a Wight, so you could start a Wightocalypse as early as level 5!

This is also technically correct (was something I stumbled across as well, when I was making a necromancer for villain comp), but there's an important difference worth mentioning: the resulting skeleton has the negative energy level ability that wights have, but the "spawn" ability that lets wights make more wights is not part of that. And while "a guy killed by too many negative levels" will also become a wight by RAW, that occurs one day later, rather than "immediately". How much that delay matters for triggering your wightpocalypse is debatable.

The difference probably matters most in terms of what you can expect NPCs to do - the lvl 3 one is slower, but casters capable of 3rd lvl spells are more plentiful. "Wightpocalypse" via Fimbulwinter is an epic solo boss, via Summon Undead a mid-level solo boss, and via Sticks And Stones is a low-level cult plot. It's also worth mentioning that controlling the wightpocalypse via controlling the spawner that controls the spawn inevitably makes you the one point of attack that keeps the whole group organized, and being the target of any real response to a wightpocalypse is easier to handle as a 9th lvl caster than as a 5th lvl one. Not tons easier, but we're talking Polymorph/Scrying/Teleport at least theoretically on the table.

[Thurbane]

I guess it depends on whether the DM rules that any creature that dies of level drain rises as a Wight, unless otherwise stated.

[AvatarVecna]

I guess it depends on whether the DM rules that any creature that dies of level drain rises as a Wight, unless otherwise stated.

That's true. I mean yeah it's RAW, but then there's also weirdness if it's applied religiously. Wight isn't a template, it's a specific creature, but most anything can die from too many negative levels. Kill a child? Medium wight. Kill a giant? Medium wight. Kill a chicken? Medium humanoid wight. Strange.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

Do they have to be creatures?

Summon instrument can summon everything from cymbals (to use as shurikens in a pinch) to gongs (to use as full cover and concealment) to a wood saw (for cutting down a tree or taking out supports on a bridge) to a pianoforte (to let go of when positioned above an enemy) to a bona fide anvil (https://www.google.com/search?q=musical+anvil&oq=mu&aqs=chrome.0.69i59j69i57j69i59j69i60j69i61.719j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8) (ditto).

Likewise, summon component. I mean, almost anything can be used as a component for some spell or other. Like, plutonium or uranium for fabricate, as an example. Or any number of other substances or tools. So long as you only need them for 1 round (or 2, if Extended), you can summon pretty much anything. And if there are any spells that require creature parts, nothing says the creature can't be whole. And if the creature needs to be living, undead, or otherwise animated...

[T.G. Oskar]

Summon Monster VIII's Lillend.

While the Challenge Rating is rather low for the level in which you get the spell (CR 7, when you're already level 15 at least), Lillends are pretty sweet. Offensive-wise, they get a shortsword that deals damage as a longsword, and a tail slap that has Improved Grab, with a sweet +16 to grapple. However, while they can do that, they can also cast a few Bard spells, including Cure Light Wounds, Hold Person and Invisibility. They also have some SLAs, including Darkness and even Knock.

The kicker here is that it also has Bardic Music as a 6th level bard. If that's not obvious enough, that's the most basic Inspire Courage, Inspire Competence, Fascination AND Suggestion, on a creature with +14 in Perform. So, it can drop Inspire Courage (in case you lack a bard?), then start either casting or attacking at your leisure. It has decent stats all around, but it has a rather good Strength bonus, which gets even better if you have Augment Summoning as a feat.

The bad thing here is that, as an outsider, it has low HD, so most of the spells and SLAs aren't as strong. But as a jack of all trades, for a summon, it's pretty good.

...Of course, the Hellcat gets invisibility in light, pounce and rake, so for a Malconvoker it's a slightly better option. Plus Celestial Dire Bear OR Fiendish Tyrannosaurus. But hey - this is what you get from SMVIII.

[Saintheart]

Likewise, summon component. I mean, almost anything can be used as a component for some spell or other. Like, plutonium or uranium for fabricate, as an example. Or any number of other substances or tools. So long as you only need them for 1 round (or 2, if Extended), you can summon pretty much anything. And if there are any spells that require creature parts, nothing says the creature can't be whole. And if the creature needs to be living, undead, or otherwise animated...

Summon Component tells us that the component you summon cannot be worth more than a single gold piece.

That said, BoVD has lots of special 'components' for spells, some of which include that the caster is an evil outsider, or undead, or under the influence of a certain drug, or must be standing in a particularly place, or that the caster has someone's soul in a receptacle. If one reads Summon Component as summoning an evil outsider, that allows Demogorgon or any random Elder Evil to be brought in.

[Thurbane]

Do they have to be creatures?

Yes. :smallamused:


I know there will be loopholes I've forgotten, but maybe try to stay in the spirit of what I've asked? :smallsmile:

[Endarire]

@Maxi: I like summon instrument for the big folk to throw pipe organs around!

[Falontani]

DMG page 37 has a Summon Monster Variant which allows you to customize your summons as long as they remain the same type of creature (so if you can summon a celestial eagle, you roll up the stats of the celestial eagle, etc)

UA page 136 has more summon variants which allows you to create a theme for your summons. It gives some examples, but the important part of creating a theme, is that you choose creature types that match the theme that are roughly the correct CR. I suggest also getting DM permission for any specific creature.

Finally UA 138 gives every individual the ability to customize their summon list using a few different varieties. The DM is supposed to choose one of those varieties and then the world is stuck with that variety.

Combine the three and you have a summoner that chooses a theme very early on (when they first get access to a summoning spell). They may choose any creature of roughly the correct CR for the theme (with DM permission for any chosen individual). They may customize the creature, rolling its stats, choosing its feats, its skills, and if it comes with wealth in its statblock, presumably being able to choose what it has spent its wealth on. This creature becomes a named individual that the summoner may summon, and if the individual is slain or dispelled while summoned you lose access to that individual for 24 hours. What it doesn't tell you, is what happens if the creature is specifically called and killed. Presumably that you lose access to the creature until it is resurrected, or until you are able to change which individual you can summon (seemingly when you gain access to a new tier of summon spell).

This greatly empowers and complicates summoners, but in the right campaign makes them much more flavorful, and individualized. It also opens up tactics of calling in the specific creature of the summoner, and killing it so that the summoner can't use it in the fight later.

So to answer the question, best individual summon is one of the creatures summoned with the above variants.

[TotallyNotEvil]

I like the Bone Devil from SM VII. It can do everything decently well: it's fairly tough in the HP/AC/DR departments, it can hit fairly well with an interesting poison on its sting and the Fear aura can really come in handy. It has plenty of useful skills, especially as an Invisible flying scout with telepathy and Greater TP.

The SLAs are pretty good. Everything is At Will, and with Dim. Anchor, Fly, Major Image, Invisibility and Wall of Ice, it's just tremendously versatile.

It's a jack of all trades that actually pretty decent at all of them. Almost every situation could benefit from one, from laying down the smack to various crowd-control methods to scouting to accomplishing other goals while the enemy is distracted (as it can go around invisibly and communicate telepathically).