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Grod_The_Giant
2020-07-18, 05:53 PM
In what I swear is a total coincidence, I too have some alchemy-based 'brew to post-- in this case, a complete base class.


The Alchemist


Class Features
As a Alchemist, you gain the following class features.

Hit Points
Hit Dice: 1d6 per Alchemist level
Hit Points at 1st Level: 6 + your Constitution modifier
Hit Points at Higher Levels: 1d6 (or 4) + your Constitution modifier per Alchemist level after 1st

Proficiencies
Armor: None
Weapons: Daggers, darts, slings, quarterstaffs, light crossbows, syringes (new weapon, see below)
Tools: Alchemist’s Supplies, Herbalism Kit
Saving Throws: Intelligence, Constitution
Skills: Choose two from Arcana, History, Insight, Investigation, Medicine, and Religion

Equipment
You start with the following equipment, in addition to the equipment granted by your background:
(a) a quarterstaff or (b) a dagger
(a) a scholar's pack or (b) an explorer's pack
A spellbook and a set of alchemist’s supplies

You must have an Intelligence score of 13 or higher in order to multiclass in or out of this class.



Level
Proficiency Bonus
Features
Tinctures Known
1st
2nd
3rd
4th
5th
6th
7th
8th
9th


1st
+2
Alchemical Practice, Extracts, Tinctures
3
2
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


2nd
+2
Scientific Specialty, Persistent Extracts
3
3
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


3rd
+2
Alchemical Mastery
3
4
2
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


4th
+2
Ability Score Improvement
4
4
3
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


5th
+3

4
4
3
2
-
-
-
-
-
-


6th
+3
Specialty feature
4
4
3
3
-
-
-
-
-
-


7th
+3

4
4
3
3
1
-
-
-
-
-


8th
+3
Ability Score Improvement
4
4
3
3
2
-
-
-
-
-


9th
+4

4
4
3
3
3
1
-
-
-
-


10th
+4
Specialty feature
5
4
3
3
3
2
-
-
-
-


11th
+4

5
4
3
3
3
2
1
-
-
-


12th
+4
Ability Score Improvement
5
4
3
3
3
2
1
-
-
-


13th
+5

5
4
3
3
3
2
1
1
-
-


14th
+5
Specialty feature
5
4
3
3
3
2
1
1
-
-


15th
+5

5
4
3
3
3
2
1
1
1
-


16th
+5
Ability Score Improvement
5
4
3
3
3
2
1
1
1
-


17th
+6

5
4
3
3
3
2
1
1
1
1


18th
+6
Combine Extracts
5
4
3
3
3
3
1
1
1
1


19th
+6
Ability Score Improvement
5
4
3
3
3
3
2
1
1
1


20th
+6
Philosopher’s Stone
5
4
3
3
3
3
2
2
1
1



Extracts
Alchemists are not only masters of creating mundane alchemical substances such as alchemist’s fire and smokesticks, but also of fashioning magical potion-like extracts in which they can store spell effects. In effect, an alchemist prepares his spells by mixing ingredients into a number of extracts, and then “casts” his spells by drinking the extract, injecting it into a target, or spilling its contents on the ground.


Lab Notebook
Like Wizards, Alchemists use record their knowledge. To a wizard, the resulting record is a spellbook; to an Alchemist, it’s more commonly known as a lab notebook. At 1st level, you have a notebook containing the formulas for six 1st-level Alchemist spells of your choice. You might find other formulas during your adventures. You could discover a spell recorded on a scroll in an evil mage’s chest, for example, or in a dusty tome in an ancient library.

Copying a Spell into the Book. When you find an Alchemist formula of 1st level or higher, you can add it to your notebook if it is of a level for which you have extract slots and if you can spare the time to decipher and copy it.

Copying a formula into your notebook involves more than just writing down a list of ingredients. You must understand every stage of the process, learn new laboratory techniques, and practice complex distillations until you can reliably follow the formula. For each level of the formula, the process takes 5 hours and costs 50 gp worth of reagents and other materials. Once you have spent this time and money, you can prepare the spell just like your other extracts.

Replacing the Book. You can copy a formula from your own lab notebook into another book-for example, if you want to make a backup copy of your notebook. This is just like copying a new spell into your notebook, but faster and easier, since you understand your own notation and already know how to cast the spell. You need spend only 1 hour for each level of the copied formula, and you do not need to purchase any special materials.

If you lose your lab notebook, you can use the same procedure to transcribe the spells that you have prepared into a new notebook. Filling out the remainder of your notebook requires you to find new spells to do so, as normal. For this reason, many Alchemists keep backup lab notebook in a safe place.

The Book's Appearance. Your lab notebook is a unique compilation of spells, with its own decorative flourishes and margin notes. It might be a plain, functional leather volume that you received as a gift from your master, a finely bound gilt-edged tome you found in an ancient library or even a loose collection of notes scrounged together after you lost your previous notebook in a mishap.

Preparing Extracts
The Alchemist table shows how many extract slots you have to prepare extracts of 1st level and higher. By spending one hour with a set of alchemist’s tools, you may prepare as many extracts as you like, but you must expend an extract slot of the extract’s level or higher every one that you prepare.

Once brewed, extracts are viable for twenty-four hours. You regain expended extract slots upon completing a long rest.

Using Extracts
Before it can take effect, an extract must be activated-- you must add the final final, volatile ingredient almost immediately before using extract. Once activated, the extract must be used before the end of your next turn or it is ruined. Doing so does not require an action.

Once used, extracts function as the spell of the same name but with different delivery mechanisms. Alchemists divide their extracts into three broad categories: bombs, potions, and poisons. The rules for using a specific type of extract replace any normal spellcasting rules or qualities of the spell they contradict.

Bombs are explosive concoctions of unstable chemicals. As an action, you can activate and throw a bomb up to 30ft. The spell takes effect centered at that point and affects all creatures within range--allies and enemies alike. Alternately, you can use your action to activate a bomb and place it at your feet. The spell takes effect at the bomb's current position at the beginning of your next turn.

Potions are the classic mainstay of the Alchemist’s art. As an action, you can activate and drink a potion, gaining the benefit of the spell.

Poisons are toxic compounds with mind and body-altering effects. As a bonus action, you can activate a poison and apply it to a melee weapon, thrown weapon, piece of ammunition, or other sharp or pointy object that can be used to injure a foe. Once applied, the poison is viable for ten minutes. If the weapon is used to damage a foe before the time expires, the spell takes effect targeting the damaged creature. You do not need to make any attack roll that might normally be required by the spell, but the target can make saving throws normally.

An Alchemist may use their item interaction to retrieve an extract from anywhere it might be stored on their person.

Other Creatures and Extracts
Once activated, any creature can use your extract, with or without your permission. As an action, you can activate an extract and hand it to an adjacent ally, who can either use their reaction to either use the item (throw a bomb, drink a potion, or apply a poison) or wait and use it on their next turn as described above. Whoever uses the extract must provide any concentration that might be required by the spell.

A creature can attempt to steal extracts from an Alchemist by making a Dexterity (Sleight of Hand) check, opposed by the Alchemist’s Strength (Athletics) or Dexterity (Acrobatics) check. Doing so replaces one of their attacks, and a successful check allows them to steal one extract. Unless they have a way of seeing what they’re grabbing, randomly determine which extract is grabbed. However, they are not capable of activating your extracts. Even if they themselves are an Alchemist, the individual quirks and modifications every Alchemst makes to their formulas make it impossible to guess how to activate another's extracts.

Ability
Intelligence is your spellcasting ability for your Alchemist extracts, since your formulas are far more science than they are art. You use your Intelligence whenever an extract refers to your spellcasting ability. In addition, you use your Intelligence modifier when setting the saving throw DC for an Alchemist extract you prepare, and when making an attack roll with one.




[*=2]Extract save DC = 8 + your proficiency bonus + your Intelligence modifier
[*=2]Extract attack modifier = your proficiency bonus + your Intelligence modifier



If another creature uses one of your extracts, the save DC remains the same, but they must use their own Intelligence modifier for any attack roll that may be required. They are not considered to be proficient in this attack unless they also have Alchemist levels, or have taken the Alchemical Savant feat.

Spellcasting Focus
While you need a set of alchemist’s tools to prepare your extracts, no special item is required to use them.

Learning Extracts of 1st Level and Higher
Each time you gain an Alchemist level, you can add two alchemist formulas of your choice to your lab notebook. Each of these formulas must be of a level for which you have extract slots, as shown on the Alchemist table.

On your adventures, you might find other formulas that you can add to your notebook.


Tincture: Just like wizards can perform simple cantrips at will, Alchemists have their own set of special formula that can be mixed on the fly, with little to no thought required, known as Tinctures. As long as you have a set of Alchemist’s Supplies on hand, you can use any tincture you know as an action.

At 4th level, you learn a fourth formula, and you learn a fifth at level 10.

Acid Flask: Up to two adjacent creatures within 30ft must make Dexterity saves or take 1d6 acid damage. This damage increases by 1d6 at 5th, 11th, and 17th level.
Alchemist’s Fire: Make a ranged spell attack against one creature within 30ft. If you hit, they take 1d12 fire damage. This damage increases by 1d12 at 5th, 11th, and 17th level.
Energizing Draught: Either drink or administer a potion to an adjacent creature. For as long as they concentrate on the effect, as on a spell, the target can roll a d4 and add the number rolled to one saving throw of its choice. It can roll the die before or after making the saving throw. After doing so, or after one minute elapses, the effect of the draught ends.
Frost Pellet: Make a ranged spell attack against one creature within 30ft. If you hit, they take 1d8 cold damage and have disadvantage on the next weapon attack roll it makes before the end of its next turn. This damage increases by 1d8 at 5th, 11th, and 17th level.
Poison Vial: Poison a weapon and make a weapon attack. If you successfully damage a target, they take an additional 1d6 poison damage. This damage increases by 1d6 at 5th, 11th, and 17th level. If delivered via a syringe, increase this Tincture's damage dice to 1d10.
Smokestick: You produce a stick that emits a steady cloud of noxious black smoke. You may either hold onto it or throw it up to 30ft away. Once drawn, the stick fills the air in a 10ft radius with smoke, blocking all vision for 1 minute. A strong wind will clear the smoke in 1 round.
Sunrod: You produce a gold-bound rod that glows with a steady light, twice as bright as a torch, for one hour.
Tanglefoot Bag: Make a ranged spell attack against one creature within 30ft. If you hit, the target is immobilized for 1 minute. At the end of each of its turns, it may make a Strength saving throw to escape.
Thunderstone: Pick a point within 30ft. All creatures in a 5ft burst must make a Constitution save or take 1d4 thunder damage and be deafened for 1 round. This damage increases by 1d4 at 5th, 11th, and 17th level.
Treated Bandages: Touch a living creature that has 0 hit points. The creature becomes stable. This ability has no effect on undead or constructs.

Alchemical Practice: Your proficiency bonus is doubled for any ability check you make that uses your Alchemist Supplies.

Over the course of any long rest, you may create two doses of any alchemical item-- acid, alchemist's fire, anytitoxin, oil, perfume, or soap. Doing so requires you to expend half the items' value in raw materials.

Scientific Specialty: At 2nd level, an Alchemist chooses one particular branch of their art to focus on, becoming an Endochemist, Mindchemist, or Pyrochemist. Your choice grants you features at 2nd level and again at 6th, 10th, and 14th level.

Persistent Extracts: Beginning at 2nd level, you have learned a more involved method of extract preparation--one that keeps an activated extract stable for much longer. When preparing your extracts, you can select a number whose combined extract slot level is equal to or less than half your Alchemist level (rounded up). These extracts, once activated, do not become inert until a full hour has passed.

For example, if you're a 4th-level Alchemist, you can prepare up to two levels worth of persistent extracts. Thus, you could prepare a single persistent 2nd level extract, or two persistent 1st level extracts.

Alchemical Mastery: At 3rd level, your skill with mundane alchemy continues to improve. As an action, you can identify one potion within 5 feet of you, as if you had tasted it. You must see the liquid for this benefit to work.

In addition, over the course of any short rest, you can temporarily improve the potency of one potion of healing of any rarity. To use this benefit, you must have alchemist's supplies with you, and the potion must be within reach. If the potion is drunk no more than 1 hour after the short rest ends, the creature drinking the potion can forgo the potion's die roll and regains the maximum number of hit points that the potion can restore.

Combine Potions: Beginning at 18th level, an Alchemist learns how to mix his potions without diluting their effect. You may combine any number of potions in a single dose, up to a maximum number equal to your Intelligence modifier, although you must spend spell slots for each potion normally. You may even combine multiple potions of the same type, as long as their duration is instant. For example, you could combine three Cure Wounds potions, but not three Haste potions.

When drunk, all component Extracts take effect immediately and simultaneously. If any require concentration, you must maintain concentration on all effects simultaneously-- failing your save will cause all effects to end.
The duration of the combined extract is that of the shortest of the extracts used.

Philosopher’s Stone: At 20th level, you have reached the pinnacle of the alchemical arts, and achieved the goal of every practitioner—you have learned the secret to creating the legendary philosopher’s stone.

A completed philosopher’s stone can be used to transmute base metals (iron and lead) into silver and gold, respectively. Doing so takes one minute per ten pounds to be affected. In addition, at the end of every long rest you complete with the stone in your possession, you become one month younger, until you reach your physical prime. Thereafter, you do not age unless you lose the stone. You can share this benefit with up to five allies, although they only receive the benefit on days when they complete a long rest at the same time as you and while within 100ft.

If you lose your philosopher’s stone, you can create a replacement with one month’s work. At the conclusion of the process, the previous stone loses its magic.



Endochemist
The essence of nature is to change--and in some senses, science is the study of those changes. You've chosen to focus your studies on that basic idea, becoming a master of the biochemistry of metamorphosis.

Endohemist Spells: Beginning at 2nd level, you always have certain spells prepared after you reach particular levels in this class, as shown in the Endohemist Spells table. These spells count as Alchemist spells for you, but they don’t count against the number of Alchemist spells you prepare.



Alchemist Level
Endochemist Spells


2nd
Disguise Self (Potion). When prepared by an Alchemist, this is a transmutation effect, not an illusion. Your clothes and equipment do not change, but changes to your form are real and tangible.


3rd
Alter Self (Potion)


5th
Gaseous Form (Potion)


7th
Polymorph (Potion or Poison)


9th
Transmute Rock (Bomb)



Minor Alchemy: Beginning at 2nd level, you can temporarily alter the physical properties of one nonmagical object, changing it from one substance into another. You perform a special alchemical procedure on one object composed entirely of wood, stone (but not a gemstone), iron, copper, bronze, or ceramic, transforming it into a different one of those materials. For each 10 minutes you spend performing the procedure, you can transform up to 1 cubic foot of material. After 1 hour, the material reverts to its original substance.

Hardening Transmutation: Beginning at 6th level, when you prepare a transmutation spell as an extract, you can apply advanced techniques to make it more effective. Any creature affected by the spell gains a +1 bonus to their Armor Class for the duration of the spell.

Major Alchemy: Beginning at 10th level, you may either transform ten times as much material with your Minor Alchemy ability, or cause the transmutation to last for ten times as long.

Unstable Blood: Beginning at 14th level, the chemicals in your blood never quite go away. You may cast Polymorph on yourself as an action. You can use this feature twice, and regain all expended uses when you finish a long rest.


Mindchemist
While most alchemists focus on the physical, some use alchemy for the opposite purpose—to alter the very substance of the mind itself. What are thoughts, after all, but chemicals swirling around in our heads? Mindchemists know that all manner of mental transformations are a simple matter of chemistry.

Mindchemist Spells: Beginning at 2nd level, you always have certain spells prepared after you reach particular levels in this class, as shown in the Mindchemist Spells table. These spells count as Alchemist spells for you, but they don’t count against the number of Alchemist spells you prepare.



Alchemist Level
Mindchemist Spells


2nd
Charm Person


3rd
Suggestion


5th
Enemies Abound


7th
Charm Monster


9th
Dominate Person



Toxicist: Beginning at 2nd level, you learn how to brew new and more virulent toxins. When you prepare one of your poisons, you may add one additional vector, beyond the usual injury: contact, ingested, or inhaled.


Contact: Contact poison can be smeared on an object and remains potent until it is touched or washed off. A creature that touches contact poison with exposed skin suffers its Effects. After applying a contact poison to a glove or similar object, you may attempt to make contact with a foe’s skin by making a melee spell attack, using your Intelligence modifier.
Ingested: A creature must swallow an entire dose of ingested poison to suffer its Effects. The dose can be delivered in food or a liquid. You may decide that a partial dose has a reduced effect, such as allowing advantage on the saving throw or dealing only half damage on a failed save.
Inhaled: These poisons are powders or gases that take effect when inhaled. Blowing the powder or releasing the gas subjects creatures in a 5-foot cube to its effect, unless they succeed on a Dexterity saving throw with a DC of 8 + your Proficiency bonus + your Intelligence modifier.


Psychotoxin: Beginning at 6th level, when prepare a Tincture or bomb that deals poison damage, you may alter its composition to deal psychic damage. If the effect would normally require a Constitution save, it instead requires a Wisdom save.

Subtle Elixir: Beginning at 10th level, you gain the ability to make a creature unaware of your magical influence on it. When you prepare an enchantment spell as an extract, you may add compounds that prevent the target from realizing it has been affected. Whether or not the succeed on any saving throws against the spell itself, they view their actions during and after that time as totally normal.

Exuding Charm: Beginning at 14th level, the chemicals in your blood never quite go away. As a bonus action, you may cause your skin to produce psychoactive chemicals. The next creature whose skin you touch must make a Wisdom save or be affected as though by a Charm Monster spell. If you do not touch a creature before one minute has elapsed, the chemicals dissipate. You can use this feature twice, and regain all expended uses when you finish a long rest.


Pyrochemist
Forget the complex arts-- you just want to see the world burn. Destruction is your goal, not creation, and fire is your tool of choice.

Pyrochemist Spells: Beginning at 2nd level, you always have certain spells prepared after you reach particular levels in this class, as shown in the Pyrochemist Spells table. These spells count as Alchemist spells for you, but they don’t count against the number of Alchemist spells you prepare.



Alchemist Level
Pyrochemist Spells


2nd
Burning Hands (Bomb) (Note: as an extract, the spell's area becomes a 10ft radius bust)


3rd
Pyrotechnics (Bomb)


5th
Fireball (Bomb)


7th
Wall of Fire (Bomb)


9th
Immolation (Poison)



Grenadier: Beginning at 2nd level, you learn the Alchemist’s Fire Tincture. If you already knew it, you may choose a different Tincture in its place. In addition, the range of your bombs and Alchemist’s Fire Tincture increase to 60ft.

Potent Flames: Beginning at 6th level, when you use a Tincture or bomb that deals fire damage, you may ignore resistance to fire damage add your Intelligence modifier to that damage.

Hardened Skin: Beginning at 10th level, long exposure to the flames of your chosen specialty have scorched and hardened your flesh. You gain resistance to fire damage.

Fire in the Blood: Beginning at 14th level, the chemicals in your blood never quite go away. You may cast Fire Shield on yourself as an action, choosing the warm shield option. You can use this feature twice, and regain all expended uses when you finish a long rest.




1st Level Extracts
Bless (Potion)
Cause Fear (Poison)
Comprehend Languages (Potion)
Cure Wounds (Potion)
Detect Poison and Disease (Potion)
Dissonant Whispers (Poison)
Entangle (Bomb)
Faerie Fire (Bomb)
False Life (Potion)
Fog Cloud (Bomb)
Grease (Bomb)
Heroism (Potion)
Inflict Wounds (Poison)
Jump (Potion)
Longstrider (Potion)
Mage Armor (Potion)
Protection from Evil and Good (Potion)
Ray of Sickness (Poison)
Shield of Faith (Potion)
Sleep(Bomb)
Speak with Animals (Potion)
Tasha’s Hideous Laughter (Poison)

2nd Level Extracts
Air (Potion)
Alter Self (Potion)
Barkskin (Potion)
Blindness/Deafness (Poison)
Blur (Potion)
Crown of Madness (Poison)
Darkness (Bomb)
Darkvision (Potion)
Dragon’s Breath (Potion)
Enhance Ability (Potion)
Enlarge/Reduce (Potion)
Hold Person (Poison)
Invisibility (Potion)
Lesser Restoration (Potion)
Melf’s Acid Arrow (Poison)
Mind Spike (Poison)
Pass Without Trace (Potion)
Protection from Poison (Potion)
Ray of Enfeeblement (Poison)
See Invisibility (Potion)
Silence (Bomb)
Spider Climb (Potion)
Spike Growth (Bomb)
Water Walk (Potion)
Web (Bomb)

3rd Level Extracts
Bestow Curse (Poison)
Blink (Potion)
Catnap (Potion)
Daylight (Bomb)
Fear (Bomb). (Note: as an extract, the spell's area becomes a 20ft radius bust)
Feign Death (Potion)
Fly (Potion)
Gaseous Form (Potion)
Haste (Potion)
Hypnotic Pattern (Bomb)
Nondetection (Potion)
Protection From Energy (Potion)
Remove Curse (Potion)
Sleet Storm (Bomb)
Slow (Poison)
Stinking Cloud (Bomb)
Tongues (Potion)
Vampiric Touch (Potion)
Water Breathing (Potion)

4th Level Extracts
Black Tentacles (Bomb)
Blight (Poison)
Confusion (Bomb)
Death Ward (Potion)
Elemental Bane (Poison)
Fire Shield (Potion)
Freedom of Movement (Potion)
Greater Invisibility (Potion)
Guardian of Nature (Potion)
Ice Storm (Bomb)
Stoneskin (Potion)

5th Level Extracts
Cloudkill (Bomb)
Contagion (Poison)
Enervation (Poison)
Hold Monster (Poison)
Holy Weapon (Poison)
Insect Plague (Bomb)
Seeming (Potion)
Skill Empowerment (Potion)
Telekinesis (Potion)

6th Level Extracts
Circle of Death (Bomb)
Disintegrate (Poison)
Eyebite (Potion)
Flesh to Stone (Poison)
Harm (Poison)
Heal (Potion)
Investiture of Flame (Potion)
Investiture of Ice (Potion)
Investiture of Stone (Potion)
Investiture of Wind (Potion)
Primordial Ward (Potion)
Tenser’s Transformation (Potion)
True Seeing (Potion)
Wind Walk (Potion)

7th Level Extracts
Etherealness (Potion)
Finger of Death (Poison)
Power Word Pain (Poison)
Regenerate (Potion)
Reverse Gravity (Bomb)

8th Level Extracts
Abi Dalzim's Horrid Wilting (Bomb)
Animal Shapes (Potion)
Antimagic Field (Bomb)
Feeblemind (Poison)
Glibness (Potion)
Maddening Darkness (Bomb)
Power Word Stun (Poison)

9th Level Extracts
Foresight (Potion)
Invulnerability (Potion)
Power Word Heal (Potion)
Power Word Kill (Poison)
Shapechange (Potion)
Weird (Bomb)



New Weapons


Name

Cost

Damage

Weight

Properties



Syringe

15gp

--

0.1 lb

Special














Syringes deal no damage. Despite causing no hit point loss, the wound is sufficient to deliver poison, including Extracts of that type. When wielding a syringe, you may use your choice of your Dexterity or Intelligence modifier for the attack roll.


New Feats
Alchemical Savant
You have studied the secrets of alchemy and are an expert in its practice, gaining the following benefits:

You gain proficiency with alchemist's supplies. If you are already proficient with them, you double your proficiency bonus to checks you make with them.
You learn two 1st level Extract of your choice, and gain two 1st level Extract slots that can only be used to prepare your chosen Extracts.

Kane0
2020-07-22, 06:57 PM
*Cracks knuckles* Rightio, i'll comment on items as I read through.

Chassis: I'm going to skip the usual 'this could just be [class]' remark, I assume you know that and have something specific in mind that justifies this being a full class

Extracts: Much like Artificers casting through tools and keeping a book of schematics, you cast via brewing and chemistry with your notes in a cookbook. But this appears to be more than a reflavor, your spells are actual items that can be taken and used by others.

Bombs: Ouch, that radius limit and slow spread sucks.
Potions: The imbiber taking the concentration is fantastic. This does raise the question though, how does concentration interact with Bombs and Poisons?
Poisons: Not sure about the 10 min viability, perhaps it could scale?

Tinctures: Energizing Draught appears to have no duration limit and seems to stack with Guidance, which might be problematic. The rest all look pretty good.

Alchemical Practice: You may need to specify what counts as an Alchemical item

Combine Potions: Neat way to bypass Concentration, and it's at level 18 so I don't really have a problem with it. Can you stack multiple instances of the same spell, like five Cure Wounds in the same potion?

Philosopher's Stone: I would say this is a pair of ribbons, though virtually unlimited money is theoretically a mechanical benefit.

Not written anywhere, but I would like to note: There doesn't appear to be any alternative resources nor any way to add longevity to your spell slots, which every other full caster has. I would recommend adding something in to fill that gap, even if it's borderline ribbon material (though I would say you have plenty of ribbons as it is).

Syringe: Using Int to attack as a weapon quality is neat, though this feels more like a piece of equipment rather than a weapon with how specific its use is.

Alchemical Savant: 1/3 of this feat is useless if you don't have an Alchemist in the party, I don't think any other feat has that sort of external reliance. I would suggest that proficiency in alchemist's supplies would be enough to ignore the disadvantages of using an alchemist's bombs/poisons.

Endochemist: The only subclass to get a new type of Extract, and I question why only they get Oils when it seems a perfect counterpart to poisons that everyone gets. Hardening Transmutation should probably specify the +1 AC lasts as long as the spell does.

Mindchemist: It took me this long to realise there are no fear/frighten effects available for an Alchemist, at all. That seems perfectly up this subclass' alley. The rest looks good.

Pyrochemist: Nothing fancy here, but appears functional. I assume this is the Champion option.

Spell List: I haven't had a good look at the moment, but didn't spot any glaring problems or oversights besides the aforementioned lack of fear.

Grod_The_Giant
2020-07-22, 08:57 PM
*Cracks knuckles* Rightio, i'll comment on items as I read through.
Many thanks for taking a look!


Extracts: Much like Artificers casting through tools and keeping a book of schematics, you cast via brewing and chemistry with your notes in a cookbook. But this appears to be more than a reflavor, your spells are actual items that can be taken and used by others.
Oh yeah. I'm not a fan of lazy refluffing like the Artificer-- this class sorta represents the minimum amount of tweaking I can think of to make casting feel like you're actually brewing potions.


Bombs: Ouch, that radius limit and slow spread sucks.
I felt like the radius limit was kind of necessary to keep you from blowing yourself up with your own bombs-- a 20ft radius spread from something like Stinking Cloud with a 30ft range doesn't leave you much wiggle room. I was also kinda concerned about the nova potential of everyone in the party chucking Fireball bombs... do you think it's too much?


Potions: The imbiber taking the concentration is fantastic. This does raise the question though, how does concentration interact with Bombs and Poisons?
It is good... maybe too good-- that's one of my biggest concerns, but I can't think of any internally consistent limit to keep you from having multiple Concentration spells going. I... didn't think about Bombs and Poisons that might require concentration :/ Off the top of my head, I'm tempted to have them have no concentration but a 25% chance of failing each round, but that might simultaneously be too good and too weak.


Poisons: Not sure about the 10 min viability, perhaps it could scale?
I thought 10 min was already pretty generous, to be honest--


Tinctures: Energizing Draught appears to have no duration limit and seems to stack with Guidance, which might be problematic. The rest all look pretty good.
I'll fix it.


Alchemical Practice: You may need to specify what counts as an Alchemical item
Good point.


Combine Potions: Neat way to bypass Concentration, and it's at level 18 so I don't really have a problem with it. Can you stack multiple instances of the same spell, like five Cure Wounds in the same potion?
Yeah, why not? It's level 18 and your pseudo-capstone.


Philosopher's Stone: I would say this is a pair of ribbons, though virtually unlimited money is theoretically a mechanical benefit.
There's not really any other option for what the capstone could be, though, is there? Infinite money and immortality feels like enough, but I suppose could add the ability to use the stone to cast any Transmutation spell of 7th level or less once/day?


Not written anywhere, but I would like to note: There doesn't appear to be any alternative resources nor any way to add longevity to your spell slots, which every other full caster has. I would recommend adding something in to fill that gap, even if it's borderline ribbon material (though I would say you have plenty of ribbons as it is).
Not every-- Bards, Clerics, and non-PHB Clerics don't have anything that drastically increases their endurance-- but you're right. I did think about adding something, but I felt like the improved action/concentration economy was already enough of a boost.

Syringe: Using Int to attack as a weapon quality is neat, though this feels more like a piece of equipment rather than a weapon with how specific its use is.


Alchemical Savant: 1/3 of this feat is useless if you don't have an Alchemist in the party, I don't think any other feat has that sort of external reliance. I would suggest that proficiency in alchemist's supplies would be enough to ignore the disadvantages of using an alchemist's bombs/poisons.
Hmm... yeah, you might be right.


Endochemist: The only subclass to get a new type of Extract, and I question why only they get Oils when it seems a perfect counterpart to poisons that everyone gets. Hardening Transmutation should probably specify the +1 AC lasts as long as the spell does.
I couldn't come up with enough Oils to make them a fourth generic Extract type, but the few that I did spot seemed too significant to ignore entirely... though looking back it might not be worth it, replace the list with... oh... Disguise Self / Alter Self / Gaseous Form / Polymorph / Transmute Rock, something like that.

Good catch on Hardening Transmutation.


Mindchemist: It took me this long to realise there are no fear/frighten effects available for an Alchemist, at all. That seems perfectly up this subclass' alley. The rest looks good.
...huh. You're right. I can probably add some in there. Cause Fear as a poison, Fear as a bomb...

heavyfuel
2020-07-22, 09:33 PM
I've just finished reading it, but don't have time for a full review right now, so I'll just ask the question Kane0 didn't:

What's your goal with this as a standalone class?

I don't ask this in an accusatory manner, btw... More along the lines of trying to get inside your head to know where you're coming from.

Is it to work as a replacement of spells of traditional spellcasters? Do you intend to keep it around full caster power level, or were you looking for something else? Or perhaps you just want a bomb throwing mechanic in the game? :smallbiggrin:

Kane0
2020-07-23, 12:42 AM
I can't answer on Grod's behalf but my best guess would be he was looking for a full caster version of the Artificer, or felt that the Alchemist deserved more design space to itself than a single subclass of the artificer.

sandmote
2020-07-23, 06:48 AM
Any particular reason tinctures have flat ranges like spell do rather than short/long ranged like thrown weapons?

They're mechanically spell attacks, sure, but by the flavor I would expect them be closer to using physical objects (like a handaxe or javelin) in how they're aimed/attacked with.

Grod_The_Giant
2020-07-23, 10:38 AM
I've just finished reading it, but don't have time for a full review right now, so I'll just ask the question Kane0 didn't:

What's your goal with this as a standalone class?

I don't ask this in an accusatory manner, btw... More along the lines of trying to get inside your head to know where you're coming from.

Is it to work as a replacement of spells of traditional spellcasters? Do you intend to keep it around full caster power level, or were you looking for something else? Or perhaps you just want a bomb throwing mechanic in the game? :smallbiggrin:
A few reasons, I suppose.

As Kane0 said, I do feel like the archetype deserves more design space than a subclass-- especially one that doesn't really feel like it fits properly.
I enjoy quirky classes and I have fond memories of the Pathfinder version of the class.
And partially it's for for my low-magic overhaul (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?615370-Low-Magic-Casters-Replacements-for-the-Bard-Cleric-Druid-Pally-Warlock-amp-Wizard), to offer another magical-but-not-really-spellcasting

heavyfuel
2020-07-25, 11:45 AM
Full review time, sorry it took so long.

The first thing I have to say is that I love the true vancian feeling of the class instead of the prepared-spontaneous thing we got for other 5e classes. This is, however, a personal opinion I know not many people share. I do expect some push back due to it.

Second thing I have to say is that this class can so so easily break the action economy. It's something you'll have to correct if you don't want players using its mechanics to do so. And do mean "using" instead of "abusing" since it does seem kind of intentional.

Allow me elaborate. Anyone can use extracts, and the only penalty for non-alchemists using extracts is for bombs that allow saves (so, not all bombs) and poisons that affect melee weapons. Since you apply poison to ammunitions, which aren't weapons, this means the weapons themselves aren't posioned, so you don't get disadvantage. Don't know if this was intentional or not.

Even if we assume that was just an error in the phrasing and not your intentions, we still have a few bombs and every potion. So you can just distribute these around before battle. So, you can Haste the Fighter, make the Rogue greater-invisible, give a few Grease/Fog Cloud bombs to hired mooks so that they can create difficult terrain and block line of sight, and still use bombs yourself for full efficacy.

Yeah, the Rogue and the Fighter are still using their action, but a melee Fighter using their action to Haste themselves in a round the enemies are off range is still amazing, and pretty much every Rogue would love the auto-advantage they'd get from being able to hide anywhere.

Adding something akin to PF's Alchemist that says your extracts become inert the round after you create them works. You can say, for instance, that Bombs and Potions are left 99% created, and that with a last ingredient added (as part of the "casting" action), they are finally complete, but must be used within the round.

Then there's also the Concentration issue. A Fighter and a Rogue probably aren't Concentrating on anything else, so you can have multiple buffs that weren't meant to be used together running at the same time. This potential for support is unheard of in 5e. It's just that good. Too good, if I'm honest, especially for pre-battle buffs. Starting a fight with 4+ Concentration buffs is really amazing.

There should be a cap, somehow. No idea how to implement it, though

I don't like the new Feat. It's a huge feat tax for anyone in a party with an Alchemist. Yeah, you technically don't need it, just like a Wizard technically doesn't need a good Int score. It's not necessary for you to function, but the benefits of having it are so great that skipping it is shooting yourself in the foot.

Some bombs having the expanding effect is... logical. I do think they shoul expand faster, since at 10ft per round any enemy will just outrun its effects or the combat will be over by the time it's fully expanded. Doubling the rate to 20ft per round might work.

I think you did a great job with the spells available. I couldn't think of any spell that I thought was out of place or that was lacking.

You forgot to put the category for the Mindchemist/Psychonaut, though I assume they are all Poisons. Also, the subclass has these two names, and I prefer Mindchemist over Psychonaut.

The Syringe is... Odd. I think it having both effects (Using Int on attack AND the opponent not noticing) is too powerful. I can see the reasoning behind making it unnoticeable, and I think it's better than the Int attack effect. It also interacts weridly with Passive Insight, since anyone without a Wisdom penalty auto-passes the check. I'd make it a Finesse weapon with a Special property that reads:

"Syringes deal no damage. Despite causing no hit point loss, the wound is sufficient to deliver poison, including Extracts of that type. You can avoid an enemy noticing you using a syringe by making a Dexterity (Sleight of Hand) check opposed by the opponent's Passive Perception."

Maybe make it a Dex/Int/Wis(Medicine) check instead, but the idea is to make it unnoticeable depending on your roll, not the enemy's.

Lastly, I have one thing to say about Phylosopher's Stone. I don't think it's broken in any way, but as it is, I think you may miss out on potential quests.

Having a villain steal an Alchemist's PS and then having the PCs track them down to recover the PS would be a really cool Tier 3 quest. But it's made impossible if the Alchemist can just turn off the stolen one remotely.

I think that's all I have to say about it. A very promising class

Grod_The_Giant
2020-07-25, 08:38 PM
The first thing I have to say is that I love the true vancian feeling of the class instead of the prepared-spontaneous thing we got for other 5e classes. This is, however, a personal opinion I know not many people share. I do expect some push back due to it.
They can eat my farts.

(It's an optional class, and I think the classic vancian is essential to getting the feel right)


Second thing I have to say is that this class can so so easily break the action economy. It's something you'll have to correct if you don't want players using its mechanics to do so. And do mean "using" instead of "abusing" since it does seem kind of intentional.
This is definitely my big balance concern, too. I'm struggling with where to draw the line, because game-balance wants extracts to be as close to spells as possible, while flavor says that extracts-working-like-potions is the whole point of the class. But... like you said, that causes issues with concentration economy, resulting in a really nova-friendly mechanic. Making Bombs and Poisons Alchemist-only wouldn't be too hard-- the 99% completed thing works well for those. But being able to hand someone a potion to use later is part of the core image of the archetype, as I see it, so I'm reluctant to ditch it if I don't have to...

Maybe a "once prepared, the extract has to be used within 10 minutes?" That cuts down on the ability to load everyone up with potions before the fight starts...

(As for the Pathfinder Alchemist and their limit, it wasn't really a limit--just a Discovery tax, since that's all it takes to avoid it.)


Then there's also the Concentration issue. A Fighter and a Rogue probably aren't Concentrating on anything else, so you can have multiple buffs that weren't meant to be used together running at the same time. This potential for support is unheard of in 5e. It's just that good. Too good, if I'm honest, especially for pre-battle buffs. Starting a fight with 4+ Concentration buffs is really amazing.

There should be a cap, somehow. No idea how to implement it, though
I mean, if you've got two normal spellcasters in the party, they can also both drop a Concentration-duration buff on the Fighter. The fact that the target concentrates instead of the caster isn't a problem in and of itself, I don't think-- more a subset of the previous issue. I could add a line about extracts interacting badly with other types of magic, but I don't think this part is worth worrying about once the first is addressed...


I don't like the new Feat. It's a huge feat tax for anyone in a party with an Alchemist. Yeah, you technically don't need it, just like a Wizard technically doesn't need a good Int score. It's not necessary for you to function, but the benefits of having it are so great that skipping it is shooting yourself in the foot.
Fair enough. It's gone.


Some bombs having the expanding effect is... logical. I do think they shoul expand faster, since at 10ft per round any enemy will just outrun its effects or the combat will be over by the time it's fully expanded. Doubling the rate to 20ft per round might work.
At this point I'm thinking about ditching it altogether-- it's probably an unnecessary bit of complication.


I think you did a great job with the spells available. I couldn't think of any spell that I thought was out of place or that was lacking.
Thanks.


You forgot to put the category for the Mindchemist/Psychonaut, though I assume they are all Poisons. Also, the subclass has these two names, and I prefer Mindchemist over Psychonaut.
Whoops. Yeah, I changed names at one point and must have missed a spot or two.


The Syringe is... Odd. I think it having both effects (Using Int on attack AND the opponent not noticing) is too powerful. I can see the reasoning behind making it unnoticeable, and I think it's better than the Int attack effect. It also interacts weridly with Passive Insight, since anyone without a Wisdom penalty auto-passes the check. I'd make it a Finesse weapon with a Special property that reads:
I find the Int-to-attack was the more important element-- it basically becomes the Alchemist's melee spell attack. I do like your idea for the check better, though.


Lastly, I have one thing to say about Phylosopher's Stone. I don't think it's broken in any way, but as it is, I think you may miss out on potential quests.
I just don't like tempting GMs to take away players' class features-- especially a capstone that's supposed to be a reward.

heavyfuel
2020-07-28, 05:43 PM
Maybe a "once prepared, the extract has to be used within 10 minutes?" That cuts down on the ability to load everyone up with potions before the fight starts...

Fair enough. It's gone.

I just don't like tempting GMs to take away players' class features-- especially a capstone that's supposed to be a reward.

10 minutes is still plenty of time. 1 minute should hit that sweet spot of "theoretically possible, but challenging to pull off in practical terms".

I wouldn't say it should go in its entirety, just the last line. It's nice to have an alchemical equivalent to Magic Initiate. Maybe have it give you the proficiency, a Tincture, and an Extract.

You misunderstand. I don't mean "let the GM take features away", I mean, "let them have multiple stones" :smallwink:

Maybe a number equal to half their proficiency bonus if you worry about abuse, but stopping a villain from obtaining immortality would be a pretty cool adventure. You could also let high level alchemists have long-living friends to share their immortal life with. I mean, it's got to get pretty sad being immortal and watching everyone you love die.

Also, something you didn't address in your response. Was the "ammunition" stuff intentional or not? Sorry if it got lost in my previous wall of text, but I was on my phone and formatting was hell.

Grod_The_Giant
2020-07-29, 09:59 AM
10 minutes is still plenty of time. 1 minute should hit that sweet spot of "theoretically possible, but challenging to pull off in practical terms".
That's pretty brutal for what's supposed to be a key part of the class, though. Passing out potions during combat really doesn't make sense, I don't feel like, even with a rule like "your ally can use their reaction to drink their potion immediately."

...

Now that I think about it, that could... maybe work, actually? Activate the extract as part of your action, and require it to be (drunk/thrown/applied) before the end of your next turn. But on top of that add an Arcane Recovery type pool of long term potions-- the original Artificer UA, the wizard subclass from 5 years ago (holy god I feel old), had a similar ability to turn their Arcane Recovery spell slots into spell scrolls...


I wouldn't say it should go in its entirety, just the last line. It's nice to have an alchemical equivalent to Magic Initiate. Maybe have it give you the proficiency, a Tincture, and an Extract.
Fair.


You misunderstand. I don't mean "let the GM take features away", I mean, "let them have multiple stones" :smallwink:

Maybe a number equal to half their proficiency bonus if you worry about abuse, but stopping a villain from obtaining immortality would be a pretty cool adventure. You could also let high level alchemists have long-living friends to share their immortal life with. I mean, it's got to get pretty sad being immortal and watching everyone you love die.
Alright, I see what you're saying.


Also, something you didn't address in your response. Was the "ammunition" stuff intentional or not? Sorry if it got lost in my previous wall of text, but I was on my phone and formatting was hell.
Right, sorry. No, that wasn't supposed to be a loophole.