Fun Puzzles or Challenges

[peverbian]

So I'm running my PCs through a dungeon in a while that is more puzzles & challenges than monsters & traps (although traps are fun too). To that end, what are some of the more fun things you've seen/thought of.

Things like you'd expect to see in Indiana Jones, The Mummy, Tomb Raider, that sort of thing.

[Ninja Chocobo]

I've got some neat ones for an upcoming dungeon, but since one of my players will read this, I can't risk posting them.

...Which means this post has contributed nothing to the topic. Sorry.

[Runolfr]

I've got some neat ones for an upcoming dungeon, but since one of my players will read this, I can't risk posting them.

...Which means this post has contributed nothing to the topic. Sorry.

You could always PM the guy.

There's a site (http://www.rinkworks.com/brainfood/p/riddles3.shtml) with all sorts of puzzles you could adopt. Mix and match to your heart's content.

[peverbian]

Thanks Runolfr, that site looks like it might have some fun things to use.

And I completely understand not wanting to post yours on here for an upcoming adventure Ninja_Chocobo. I'm pretty sure none of my players read this forum, much to their loss.

[Indon]

Well, a little while back for my Exalted campaign I had an NPC sucker one of my PC's into a game of Gateway (well, a fast variant). I'd brought a chessboard to the session and let all the players play against me in a game to determine who won the Gateway game.

I ended up winning, and the NPC waltzed off with their MacGuffin as a result. Heh.

[Keld Denar]

These kinds of things are usually tough to plan around. If you throw in a riddle or puzzle, the PCs (and maybe players) could potentially be stumped for HOURS trying to figure them out, just because some clue wasn't hinted strong enough. At higher levels, PCs magic is reshaping reality to taste, and spells like teleport (and similar), stoneshape, knock, fly, and disintegrate make most riddle type door locks or similar encounters into mere speed bumps, where the players simply expend one small resource and continue on, carefully thought out puzzle or riddle be damned. Now, if the puzzle is more like a prophecy the PCs need to figure out, with solutions A B and C turning into situations a b and c, that would be a worthy puzzle.

If you are looking for a puzzle, there is always the everfun 3 knights in front of 2 doors. One door leads onward, one door leads to DOOM (TM). One of the guards always lies, one always tells the truth, and the 3rd guard is there to STAB anyone who asks difficult questions. Throw that at PCs and see how they react.

[TheLogman]

As you walk into the corridor, everything changes. Now, you're outside in the middle of a huge gulch. The walls of the gulch are stained with the blood of fallen warriors. A voice from somewhere far above proclaims: "CAPTURE THE FLAG!". Kill, stab, maim, grapple, and bullrush your way to the flag on the enemy's side, and take it back. Players respawn if they are badly hurt or die, but if you want to make it a challenge, each time they respawn, they take 1 point in two abilities chosen at random. Enemies also respawn. First to 3 points over the other team wins.

Good fun, humorous, and allows them to use all those fun, little used combat tactics. Plus, can you imagine spellcasters in the "Bloody Gulch"? That would be fun.

[Alex12]

If you are looking for a puzzle, there is always the everfun 3 knights in front of 2 doors. One door leads onward, one door leads to DOOM (TM). One of the guards always lies, one always tells the truth, and the 3rd guard is there to STAB anyone who asks difficult questions. Throw that at PCs and see how they react.

Detect Thoughts (it's a simple level 2 spell)

Or just use the Starshine Strategy:smallsmile:
http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0327.html

[Alex12]

Good fun, humorous, and allows them to use all those fun, little used combat tactics. Plus, can you imagine spellcasters in the "Bloody Gulch"? That would be fun.

Would spell slots regenerate after death? Or PP return? If so...
Caster:*uses Disintegrate on enemy fighter*
Fighter: OMFG! U N00B! U CAN'T FITE FAIR!
Caster: Forget this. *DimDoor, appears in enemy flag room, grabs flag, DimDoors back*
other team:OMFGWTF! STOP HAX U NOOB!

There are other ways. Invisibility Sphere, Fly, or, to be really evil, Alter Self to look like a member of the other team, walk in, pick up the flag, stick it in a Bag of Holding, then walk out.

There are all sorts of other ways magic and psionics just make that absurd.

[Runolfr]

Or just use the Starshine Strategy:smallsmile:
http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0327.html

My solution to that is to...

1) Make the guardians Constructs, so they don't react to damage.
2) Make the guardians only answer a single question, as defined by a Magic Mouth that will speak if a question compatible with its phrase is asked in its presence (multiple MMs allow for different answers).

High-level wizards setting up puzzle paths should have the means to thwart most attempts to bypass their puzzles. Just assume that there's a Dispel Magic effect that targets spell cast in the area until the puzzle is solved; if the PCs can beat your NPC caster's CL check, they probably deserve to get by. Of course, you can always have your construct guardians start hammering on anyone who tries to cast a spell in their vicinity without solving the puzzle.

[Runolfr]

Would spell slots regenerate after death? Or PP return? If so...
Caster:*uses Disintegrate on enemy fighter*
Fighter: OMFG! U N00B! U CAN'T FITE FAIR!
Caster: Forget this. *DimDoor, appears in enemy flag room, grabs flag, DimDoors back*
other team:OMFGWTF! STOP HAX U NOOB!

There are other ways. Invisibility Sphere, Fly, or, to be really evil, Alter Self to look like a member of the other team, walk in, pick up the flag, stick it in a Bag of Holding, then walk out.

There are all sorts of other ways magic and psionics just make that absurd.

It's not all that bad. You can always put spells on the flag to keep someone from teleporting with it, and starting with it inside a fortress limits the use of flight to get it. If it's long enough, it won't go into a bag of holding (which has a volume limit, so you can rule that it also has a height limit). On top of all that, the other team presumably has casters that will be trying their own tricks to get YOUR flag, as well as countering your casters.

[Alex12]

What if the wizard who's lair/whatever you're trying to get in to has a trained Beholder living there? A pit, 200-ish feet across, with a bunch of traps, alarms, etc set up. The trick is, all the traps and such also trigger alarm bells or similar on the other side. This wakes up the Beholder, who then uses its antimagic cone to turn whatever is flying across the pit into something that's falling into it. For extra evilness, make the walls, ceiling, and floor have walls of force underneath, or otherwise be immune to etherealness effects.

The catch? The "really deep pit" that the characters are trying to get across isn't actually really deep. It's a permanant illusion, covering the fact that the pit is only about 1 feet.

[Azerian Kelimon]

Might I suggest something? Get the treasure, or complete the goal, and out of nowhere comes a rolling boulder. Never goes out of style.

[Quietus]

What if the wizard who's lair/whatever you're trying to get in to has a trained Beholder living there? A pit, 200-ish feet across, with a bunch of traps, alarms, etc set up. The trick is, all the traps and such also trigger alarm bells or similar on the other side. This wakes up the Beholder, who then uses its antimagic cone to turn whatever is flying across the pit into something that's falling into it. For extra evilness, make the walls, ceiling, and floor have walls of force underneath, or otherwise be immune to etherealness effects.

The catch? The "really deep pit" that the characters are trying to get across isn't actually really deep. It's a permanant illusion, covering the fact that the pit is only about 1 feet.

Except that the beholder's antimagic cone would negate the permanent illusion...

[Indon]

Except that the beholder's antimagic cone would negate the permanent illusion...

Not if the beholder looks up-ish (I'd probably give my players a spot check to notice that oddity)

Now, does an illusion affect someone in an antimagic cone?

[Prometheus]

Database of Logic Puzzles & Riddles
(http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~wwu/riddles/intro.shtml)
Thieves' Guild (Fantasy Puzzles) (http://www.thievesguild.cc/traps/index.php?p=2)

[Quietus]

Not if the beholder looks up-ish (I'd probably give my players a spot check to notice that oddity)

Now, does an illusion affect someone in an antimagic cone?

Yes, if the cone isn't touching the illusion. The illusion itself is the magic, it isn't a mind-affecting thing, so the magic part isn't within the cone, and so remains viable.