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Cyclone231
2007-10-30, 10:34 AM
I want to make a first level character with 1 HP. Standard array or point buy, and no Unearthed Arcana. How do I do this?

Palanthos
2007-10-30, 10:37 AM
I want to make a first level character with 1 HP. Standard array or point buy, and no Unearthed Arcana. How do I do this?

Wizard or Sorcerer with a 4 Con.

Next.

Cyclone231
2007-10-30, 10:41 AM
I want to make a first level character with 1 HP. Standard array or point buy, and no Unearthed Arcana. How do I do this?

Oops, sorry, I meant to say elite array or standard point buy.


Wizard or Sorcerer with a 4 Con.

Next.I can only get it down to 6. Eight base, since that's the lowest it goes, plus elf. How can I get lower?

Karsh
2007-10-30, 10:42 AM
Yeah, make it an Elven Wizard with the Frail flaw. Put an 8 in CON and you're golden.

cupkeyk
2007-10-30, 10:42 AM
Wizard or Sorcerer with a 4 Con.

Next.
Neither standard array nor point buy will permit stats lower than 8 previous to racial adjustments.

An Kobold Sorc 1 with minimum con gets a 6, and can start at 2 hp. Go through the draconic rite of passage (RotD)and swap in one hit point for a L1 spell like ability.


Yeah, make it an Elven Wizard with the Frail flaw. Put an 8 in CON and you're golden.

No UA, so no flaws.

Telonius
2007-10-30, 10:44 AM
Hm, hold on a second, I don't think it's that simple. Standard array or point buy. If you're going point buy, you start out with 8's in all stats, correct? You'd need to find a race with a -4 Con modifier to go that route. Ghost Elf from Dragon 313 does that (according to my online source).

Vasdenjas
2007-10-30, 10:46 AM
Or you could just have your Elf be Middle aged or Old aged, to get the minuses to Str, Dex, and Con, and pluses to Int, Wis, and Cha. That's core at least...

Karsh
2007-10-30, 10:46 AM
Ok, Elf Wizard with an 8 in CON before modifiers who died and was resurrected at level 1. You permanently lose 2 points of CON and are 5000 gp in debt.

My bad on the UA; I read it as being allowed. ^.^;

goat
2007-10-30, 10:48 AM
I think Aging rules. 8 from points -> 6 from race -> 5 from being middle aged. That should get you a -3.

edit - Of course, the difficulty then is explaining why your elf is 175 years old, and still level 1.

Perhaps some sort of magical coma. Maybe induced by your evil twin who ran off with your fiancée, but was exposed after a long search by the man who would have been the priest at your wedding, but has always had a secret love for her. Maybe she's found out, and married him, breaking her promise of marrying you when you woke up that she made... errr... 70 years ago (long coma, good medical cover. You knew that private insurance was a good idea). Now you've awoken, and that promise seemed like just yesterday, but for everyone else it's the distant past.

So you've decided to go and kill dragons.

A daytime soap opera set in a D&D style world would be AWESOME.

Aquillion
2007-10-30, 11:14 AM
So you've decided to go and kill dragons.But that's how every episode of "The Dungeons and The Dragons" ends!

...really, though, you don't need an explaination for why you're still level 1. Most people in the D&D world never gain any levels anyway. If they gained levels like PCs, there would be level 20 elves all over the place. In fact, just about everyone over the age of 25 or so would be level 20.

...that could be an interesting campaign, actually. An epic-level universe, where even the commoners are epic.

XiaoTie
2007-10-30, 11:31 AM
But that's how every episode of "The Dungeons and The Dragons" ends!

...really, though, you don't need an explaination for why you're still level 1. Most people in the D&D world never gain any levels anyway. If they gained levels like PCs, there would be level 20 elves all over the place. In fact, just about everyone over the age of 25 or so would be level 20.

...that could be an interesting campaign, actually. An epic-level universe, where even the commoners are epic.

Thats called Forgotten Realms :smalltongue:

On a more serious note, and on topic: OP, I'm a bit curious. Why would you want a character with 1 hp ?

silentknight
2007-10-30, 11:33 AM
Or you could not bother with the regular means of generating stats and just give your character a 4 Con or 1 hp.

Nonah_Me
2007-10-30, 09:35 PM
I've always liked making older than normal characters. It seems strange to me that every adventurer is just out of their (metaphorical) teenage years.

Hawriel
2007-10-30, 11:14 PM
Or you could not bother with the regular means of generating stats and just give your character a 4 Con or 1 hp.

oh my god I cant believ this was the only simple strate forward answer to the question other than mine. Mine is really just a repeat of his.

make a character give him an 8 - 11 con dont roll a hit die just give him 1 hit piont. Guess what you didnt have to poor over a rule book and look for feats or worry about a point system. Gamers really over complicate stuff. :smallmad:

Mewtarthio
2007-10-30, 11:21 PM
oh my god I cant believ this was the only simple strate forward answer to the question other than mine. Mine is really just a repeat of his.

make a character give him an 8 - 11 con dont roll a hit die just give him 1 hit piont. Guess what you didnt have to poor over a rule book and look for feats or worry about a point system. Gamers really over complicate stuff. :smallmad:

You get max HP for your first HD if you're a PC.

Try saying that out lout.

TheOOB
2007-10-30, 11:53 PM
I've always liked making older than normal characters. It seems strange to me that every adventurer is just out of their (metaphorical) teenage years.

There are two reasons for this. The first is that younger people tend to possess more wanderlust and love for adventure, and are usually closer to their peak physical condition then older people. The other is that adventurers who are older tend to be much much more powerful then level 1. Adventuring is dangerous, and those with long life spans get powerful or die.

shadowdemon_lord
2007-10-31, 01:03 AM
If the speed at which PC's tend to level at is any indication, anyone over 35 or so should definitely be able to slap gods into submission for fun. Their's a reason PC's aren't the typical progression for people, but rather the ridicoulously weird and totally strangely nonesensical in all ways exception. That if taken to it's logical limit amounts to 35 year olds with powers that match Asmodeus, a being that pre dates the nine hells.

Shatteredtower
2007-10-31, 01:10 AM
I want to make a first level character with 1 HP. Standard array or point buy, and no Unearthed Arcana. How do I do this?Commoner of any race that doesn't grant you a Constitution bonus. As an NPC class, you only get average hp per die, rounded down. With an 8 Constitution, you're set.

If that's not adequate, play an elven expert with a 6 Constitution.

Hawriel
2007-10-31, 01:18 AM
You get max HP for your first HD if you're a PC.

Try saying that out lout.

yes Im sure the rule is quite unbrakable :smallsigh:

again make a character give him 1 hp or if you really need to stick to the unbrakable rules of D&D give the character a 5 con. Then that unfortunatly forced max hp will brink you to 1.

Cybren
2007-10-31, 01:39 AM
There are two reasons for this. The first is that younger people tend to possess more wanderlust and love for adventure, and are usually closer to their peak physical condition then older people. The other is that adventurers who are older tend to be much much more powerful then level 1. Adventuring is dangerous, and those with long life spans get powerful or die.
Of course, there's no correlation between age and XP. PCs get XP for overcoming challenges.

Besides, for much of a characters life growing up I doubt they have any classes or levels..

Nerd-o-rama
2007-10-31, 01:51 AM
yes Im sure the rule is quite unbrakable :smallsigh:

again make a character give him 1 hp or if you really need to stick to the unbrakable rules of D&D give the character a 5 con. Then that unfortunatly forced max hp will brink you to 1.
The point of this exercise is to do this within the limitations the OP gave: within the rules of D&D, and with either the standard ability score array (later corrected to be the Elite Array instead) or Point Buy, neither of which allows a starting ability score below an 8, and without using Unearthed Arcana material such as traits and flaws. If you break the parameters presented, it's not really a solution, is it?

Middle-aged or older Elf is probably the way to go here. Gets at least a -3 to Con, meaning you can start with five. For a younger character, go with a middle-aged kobold or goblin.

Tallis
2007-10-31, 02:19 AM
Commoner of any race that doesn't grant you a Constitution bonus. As an NPC class, you only get average hp per die, rounded down. With an 8 Constitution, you're set.

If that's not adequate, play an elven expert with a 6 Constitution.

I'm curious : where does the rule that npc classes only get avg hp rounded down come from? Is it a house rule? Seems like it would make having HD at all pretty pointless, since you'd never actually roll any.


I'll put in my vote for middle-aged elf with minimum con.

Occasional Sage
2007-10-31, 02:29 AM
On a more serious note, and on topic: OP, I'm a bit curious. Why would you want a character with 1 hp ?

I second that: the rules-lawyer gymnastics are entertaining, but is this just an arbitrary problem, or is there a reason behind this? It sounds like a concept-character in the making; I'm dying to know what makes this desirable to you, and what (if anything) you plan to do to make the character viable.

Nowhere Girl
2007-10-31, 02:45 AM
But that's how every episode of "The Dungeons and The Dragons" ends!

...really, though, you don't need an explaination for why you're still level 1. Most people in the D&D world never gain any levels anyway. If they gained levels like PCs, there would be level 20 elves all over the place. In fact, just about everyone over the age of 25 or so would be level 20.

...that could be an interesting campaign, actually. An epic-level universe, where even the commoners are epic.

Epic Skill Focus: Profession (farmer)

Harvest Moon, meet D&D. D&D, Harvest Moon. Play nice together, you crazy kids.

Cyclone231
2007-10-31, 03:25 PM
I second that: the rules-lawyer gymnastics are entertaining, but is this just an arbitrary problem, or is there a reason behind this? It sounds like a concept-character in the making; I'm dying to know what makes this desirable to you, and what (if anything) you plan to do to make the character viable.Well, now I kind of want it so I can give the character sheet to someone to play and wait until they notice how many hit points their character has.

Really though, completely arbitrary problem which I made in order to see how long this thread would last.

Can anyone think of a combination which naming on the character sheet won't automatically lead to the player thinking "I have two hit points", then noticing they only have one? I mean, Kobold Sorcerer and Elf Wizard, not exactly proud proclaimers of their high hit point count.

goat
2007-10-31, 03:30 PM
...really, though, you don't need an explaination for why you're still level 1. Most people in the D&D world never gain any levels anyway. If they gained levels like PCs, there would be level 20 elves all over the place. In fact, just about everyone over the age of 25 or so would be level 20.

But that's the point, You're NOT an NPC, you're one of the few, the brave and talented who go out into the world to try and force it to be slightly more to your liking. You need a background story as to why you don't already have a level in a class that covers what you've been doing for the first half of your life (unless you're a level 1 fighter who's been living in the most peaceful place EVER).

Of course, you could go the PHB2 montage re-training route, but that removes the chance for fantastically convoluted explanations.

Shatteredtower
2007-10-31, 03:43 PM
I'm curious :Be honest. "Curious" wasn't the word you should have been using.


where does the rule that npc classes only get avg hp rounded down come from?DMG. Look it up.


Seems like it would make having HD at all pretty pointless, since you'd never actually roll any.Rolling hp is entirely optional. You want to, fine. You want to take the average, that's fine too. You want maximum all the way? That's also fine. But rolling, rather than taking the average, is just rolling for rolling's sake.

Runolfr
2007-10-31, 03:49 PM
You get max HP for your first HD if you're a PC.

Try saying that out lout.

Is that a requirement, or just a "standard practice". I see no reason why you couldn't accept having a poor roll instead of automatically taking the maximum.

MCerberus
2007-10-31, 03:55 PM
I'm interested in why you would want a PC with only 1 HP.

Tor the Fallen
2007-10-31, 04:06 PM
Be honest. "Curious" wasn't the word you should have been using.

Stop projecting, *******.

Machete
2007-10-31, 04:28 PM
Frail Flaw
AND
Quick Trait

both from Unearthed Arcana. Low CON. Squishy class.

cupkeyk
2007-10-31, 04:36 PM
Frail Flaw
AND
Quick Trait

both from Unearthed Arcana. Low CON. Squishy class.

Read OP; no UA ergo, no Traits, no Flaws.


Second one on this thread alone, too. *shakes head*

Mewtarthio
2007-10-31, 05:08 PM
But that's the point, You're NOT an NPC, you're one of the few, the brave and talented who go out into the world to try and force it to be slightly more to your liking. You need a background story as to why you don't already have a level in a class that covers what you've been doing for the first half of your life (unless you're a level 1 fighter who's been living in the most peaceful place EVER).

Three words: Mid-life crisis. "What have I done with my life? When I was growing up, every said I should be a Wizard, and now my hair's turning gray, and I'm still a Commoner... That does it! I'm going out and buying a spellbook right now!"

Alternative explanation: Rincewind.

Alternative explanation: The crazy owner of the wizarding college told him to go sign up, but accidentally pointed to the exit gates of the school rather than the registrar's office (yeah, I cribbed that from Jolee Bindo. He's fictional; he can't sue me). Too afraid to ask for clarification, the young elf wandered in a straight line until he found a monastery, where he spent the next century meditating with a vow of silence (since he was too weak to be a monk) before his parents finally tracked him down and made him go back to Wizarding because dammit they did not pay twice their annual income per semester for you to sit down and think happy thoughts and are you listening to me young man your father had his own demiplane we he was your age and he didn't start out with the kind of privileges you've been squandering and another thing...

Icewalker
2007-10-31, 05:12 PM
...ask the DM to play a character with 1 hp for RP reasons. You could also ask for something else in exchange.

Dausuul
2007-10-31, 05:20 PM
...ask the DM to play a character with 1 hp for RP reasons. You could also ask for something else in exchange.

Were I the DM, I would be seriously tempted to boot any person from the game who asked to play a 1-hit-point character for "RP reasons." To me, that says, "I'm one of those people who thinks that my grand dramatic performances in-character are more important than anybody else having fun [like the other PCs who will constantly be lugging my unconscious body around, or the DM who will have to design adventures to accommodate this]. Furthermore, I'm a dedicated believer in the Stormwind Fallacy and will probably spend half our gaming sessions sneering at anybody who plays an effective character."

Of course, I'd never start a campaign off at level 1 either.

Albonor
2007-10-31, 05:23 PM
For the 1hp, I agree with the elven wizard in his of her middle age with 5 in constitution. For the level 1: Energy Drain!

With a 5 in Constitution, the Fortitude saves will be kinda crappy.... Your character met his or her match in a magic duel and the winner didn't finish you off. All the magic items stolen, and a special curse to prevent you from having those level Restored. Finding a more original source for the Energy Drain would be advisable. Leave it to your DM to use that to introduce a colorful villain (or good guy!)

After a couple of days wandering you got back to civilization and managed to write a new spellbook. Or still remembered a few spells if you go Sorcerer.

MrNexx
2007-11-01, 02:47 AM
I've always liked making older than normal characters. It seems strange to me that every adventurer is just out of their (metaphorical) teenage years.

It seems strange to you that people who are just beginning their careers in physically demanding, dangerous occupations are usually young and ambitious?

Cybren
2007-11-01, 03:06 AM
It seems strange to you that people who are just beginning their careers in physically demanding, dangerous occupations are usually young and ambitious?

Who says they're just beginning? The correlation between level and worldly experience starts after character creation.

Raolin_Fenix
2007-11-01, 01:29 PM
1hp could be interesting. My current Planescape character could make it on 1hp, probably.

Elan psion, AC boosts up to the stratosphere by powers so that enemies have to roll a natural 20 to hit, then use Elan Resilience (and Biofeedback, or any other DR mechanism) to ignore any damage you do take from natural-20 rolls. Make him old-aged or even venerable, and your Con score is dropped enough to bring you to 1 hp, and your Intelligence has risen enough to give you massive Power Points to burn.

Shisumo
2007-11-01, 01:52 PM
But that's the point, You're NOT an NPC, you're one of the few, the brave and talented who go out into the world to try and force it to be slightly more to your liking. You need a background story as to why you don't already have a level in a class that covers what you've been doing for the first half of your life (unless you're a level 1 fighter who's been living in the most peaceful place EVER).

Ooh! Ooh! I've got one! (http://syndicated.livejournal.com/paizo_blog/5037.html)

MrNexx
2007-11-01, 03:00 PM
Who says they're just beginning? The correlation between level and worldly experience starts after character creation.

No, because NPCs of NPC classes will also be post-1st level without adventuring. They get that way because life provides them challenges (with CRs and everything) and they meet them... just on a less daily basis than people who are throwing themselves in front of orc hordes.

the_tick_rules
2007-11-02, 12:33 AM
a neg con modifer or be an undead and take a 1 ya first hp roll are options.

Nowhere Girl
2007-11-02, 01:54 AM
A housecat could have you on the ground and dying in just one full-round attack.

That's magnificent.

Next round, given how bad your Fort save would be, it could probably successfully coup de grace you.

Tengu
2007-11-02, 05:34 AM
Were I the DM, I would be seriously tempted to boot any person from the game who asked to play a 1-hit-point character for "RP reasons." To me, that says, "I'm one of those people who thinks that my grand dramatic performances in-character are more important than anybody else having fun [like the other PCs who will constantly be lugging my unconscious body around, or the DM who will have to design adventures to accommodate this]. Furthermore, I'm a dedicated believer in the Stormwind Fallacy and will probably spend half our gaming sessions sneering at anybody who plays an effective character."

Of course, I'd never start a campaign off at level 1 either.

You're my hero, except that Stormwind Fallacy is the opposite of what you think - it actually states that having a mechanically-optimized character does not make you a worse roleplayer, and an unoptimized character a better one.

OneWinged4ngel
2007-11-02, 06:13 AM
You're my hero, except that Stormwind Fallacy is the opposite of what you think - it actually states that having a mechanically-optimized character does not make you a worse roleplayer, and an unoptimized character a better one.

Uhm, actually, the way I read it I think he's saying that the person in question holds firm beliefs that commit the Stormwind Fallacy, as opposed to believing that the Stormwind Fallacy is logically true.

Irbis
2007-11-02, 06:37 AM
A housecat could have you on the ground and dying in just one full-round attack.

That's magnificent.

Next round, given how bad your Fort save would be, it could probably successfully coup de grace you.

Actually, a housecat can do that to most normal 1th level characters, too. :smallamused:

GoC
2007-11-02, 02:58 PM
But that's how every episode of "The Dungeons and The Dragons" ends!

...really, though, you don't need an explaination for why you're still level 1. Most people in the D&D world never gain any levels anyway.

Even hunting a deer with your four friends a couple of times per year will get you a level up 50 years or so.
Of course most humans have large CON penalties by then and thus don't have noticably more hp...

In my campaigns all PC races have a minimun of 1 level per 30 years of age.

Nowhere Girl
2007-11-02, 03:32 PM
Actually, a housecat can do that to most normal 1th level characters, too. :smallamused:

Well, not as reliably. A typical commoner has 2 or 3 hit points, which means a housecat can only successfully push 50 percent of typical commoners to dying in one round, and only if they land all of their attacks. The other 50 percent, they can only disable in one round, and again, only if they land all of their attachs.

But for that matter, a character with one hit point ... I mean, wow. A single caltrop would disable the character. A little lizard biting the character could do it ...