If you had to play yourself, which class would your like to play? (3.5) [Archive]

Unavenger

2020-07-25, 07:01 PM

With my constitution being probably 6 or 7 IRL, there is literally no difference between a d4 and d6 hit die outside of first level, and my low hit point total in any case becomes a liability. If I get to start at, or have a chance to reach, a decent level, I might want to go druid to port an animal's stats lock, stock and barrel onto my own, although I can still somewhat do that as a wizard with alter self. In fact, I want alter self for personal reasons and my intelligence is probably higher than my wisdom, so...

If no-one else gets anything, healing becomes a concern, which immediately puts druid up a few notches, and the fact that druid gets the animal companion to do the fighting for them is very helpful I would say. Turn Undead is a serious point in cleric's favour, and the ability to wear armour (I own armour) without problems is a big point in the favour of cleric and druid (it's a sheer coincidence that the armour I own is non-metalic).

I guess there's some nontrivial argument in favour of shaper because astral construct is pretty neat I would say, but I think I'm probably better off as druid.

...dammit, why is the answer to "What class would you play?" always druid?

If I'm allowed to rebuild my stats, I can take a better constitution which might justify playing something with a lower hit die, and a good enough dexterity to avoid getting hit. Or I could be a druid.

...it's always druid.

Gavinfoxx

2020-07-25, 09:40 PM

Can I rebuild my stats according to some sane level of point buy and remove my homebrew/houserule flaws and traits? The ones that don't give me any feats or benefit?

Quertus

2020-07-25, 09:50 PM

Zombie apocalypse? Hmmm…

HP don't matter - one bite, and you're "dead"

Turning is rough, because you've got to reach, what, level 4 before you can destroy / command human zombies. And it's questionable whether these zombies actually count as undead, which they might well not by D&D standards.

If zombies count as undead? Evil Cleric. Quickly kill enough random people to dominate zombies. Use zombies to kill more people. Repeat until larger challenges are required for earning XP.

If zombies don't count as undead? Arcane Spellcaster. Aim for Plane Shift to get off world, to level up for Teleport Through Time. Go back, find & kill "patient 0", save the world.

Really, I'd be relying on my non-class skills as much as anything.

But, given that any scratch could be fatal, and society would largely collapse, I think firearms, DR, and survival could be big.

Also good: Create Food and Water, Cure Disease, Raise Dead, Knowledge: local/geography/nature, profession(farmer), craft(all), and maybe even Speak Language. Although the ability to create custom spells tailored to your specific needs ("simulate inhaler", for example) should not be discounted.

PoeticallyPsyco

2020-07-25, 09:53 PM

Paladin. Tankier than a Cleric, with better sustain at low levels due to never running out of sword, and still gets healing, Turn Undead, and disease removal. Leveling up in a zombie apocalypse is going to go fast, too, assuming your survivability is high enough to take those risks. A mount to ensure I'm faster than the hordes is just gravy.

If multiclassing is permitted, I'd then grab at least one level in Crusader and either continue with that or go Ruby Knight Vindicator. Ordinarily, I'd say Bard 4/ Crusader X rather than Paladin, but for a zombie apocalypse specifically Paladin actually has better utility.

And what can I say? I like the idea of being a real life white knight, helping the helpless and kicking ass.

Gruftzwerg

2020-07-25, 10:10 PM

Gavinfoxx

2020-07-26, 12:06 AM

Tvtyrant

2020-07-26, 12:09 AM

Druid. Being a fish or bird most of the time alleviates the whole "Zombie" thing, and depending on setting they might not even chase animal forms.

bekeleven

2020-07-26, 01:24 AM

I've done out my stats before and I'm clearly a standard-array commoner (8 12 9 13 11 10). That pushes me towards warlock, or dragon disciple on the outside.

That said, I could make arguments for a few other classes, like -

Factotum: My favorite base class, and int is my highest stat.

Cloistered Cleric: The best 1-level dip in the game, I can cast first level cleric spells, and I'll most likely die before I hit second level. (Failing that, I'd need to hit third level before I lost any spells.)

KillianHawkeye

2020-07-26, 01:57 AM

I played a game like this almost 20 years ago back in 3.0 edition. Not a zombie apocalypse, but the idea of playing yourself in a D&D world.

I went with a Psion to represent myself. Don't remember which discipline was my focus.

H_H_F_F

2020-07-26, 02:36 AM

I feel like the first few of levels would be the only important ones fighting wise - in a zombie apocalypse, your enemies are going to be zombies. At level 5 or 6 they're gonna be a non factor.
Also, the question clearly stated we were sitting at our computer desk when the apocalypse began. No equipment, guys. You may have weaponry at home, but I'd assume it does pierce damage, and I'd assume you have no armour.
Warlock would be a great choice, but it causes alignment issues. Cloistered cleric with devotion feats would probably dominate at the early levels.

However, if I had to pick something else, I'd probably actually say monk. Yes, monk. Take versatile unarmed strike at level 1, and you've got a slashing weapon always present. You have enough skill points to take survival cross class, and you get hide, sense motive, and listen - and knowledge (religion) for knowledge devotion if you'd like. Assuming you have decent WIS, you'll have by far the best AC around. You should be able to do just fine without equipment, improved grapple is going to be invaluable against typical zombie apocalypse scenarios, and you'll get good saves if that proves relevant.
If you can go prestige, move to tattooed monk ASAP. Ocean tattoo will be the best ability you could possibly get, period - it solves all survival issues bar actual fighting, which again, becomes a non issue at these levels.

So yeah, either cloistered cleric or monk. Warlock if the DM doesn't care about alignment.

Malphegor

2020-07-26, 02:52 AM

Dragonfire Adept for much the same reasons as others have said warlock, but I’m thinking the dragon breath is more of a cone to deal with masses of zombies quickly and purge the land of their flesh. Burn it with fire it’s the only way to be sure

H_H_F_F

2020-07-26, 04:03 AM

So, I actually found myself thinking a bit more about this topic, and about how I would proceed after level 1, all the way to 20. This build assumes I can still level up at least once or twice a year, even though all I can fight is Z. With that in mind:

Monk 1 with improved grapple as a bonus feat, versatile unarmed strike and knowledge devotion for my human feat. That should get me through level 1.
The next 4 levels are ranger. Pump up survival, hide, move silently, listen, spot, and knowledge religion (cross class). Favored enemy undead is great for level 2, archery combat style will be somewhat useful when in range, 1st level spells will be great, and animal companion is probably the best thing you can get for my emotional needs. I think it's something that really draws everyone in when they take up D&D.

Then, 5 levels of tattooed monk. Crane tattoo, then ocean, then crab. No aging penalties for me - I get to stay as fit as I am. Ocean as I said above is obvious for an apocalypse scenario, and crab would be good when the main danger is the horde. Use these levels to get jump and climb up, and take mountaineer as my 9th level feat.

Levels 11-20 are all cloud anchorite. It sucks mechanically, but at this point that's pretty irrelevant. I get to keep bumping my monk abilities, which is nice, but I'm mainly going for immortality of the mountain.

I'm immune to natural diseases and aging, I don't need to (though I think I still can) sleep, eat, or drink, and I have no finite age. I can live indefinitely in my own cherished body - no need to become undead, or a construct, or the like. I'll have maxed survival and 1st level spells to aid others, and I'll always have an animal friend. This build gets me to make it through the early levels and get a nice life at late levels. I think I'm good.

The only risk factor is one of you evil cleric ****s deciding to nuke me. What the hell is wrong with you people?

Maat Mons

2020-07-26, 04:22 AM

If I have to be me, I always say caster. The other classes tend to involve getting close to enemies, and that idea frightens me.

If we don't magically get equipment, that kind of rules out Wizard and Archivist. Kind of need a spellbook for those classes.

I hate animals, so no way am I going Druid.

Psion, Cloistered Cleric, and Sorcerer all seem like reasonable picks, depending on what my mental ability scores turn out to be.

I like to think I'm smart. But 65% of people believe themselves to be above average, so I could be wrong. I think this is still my best hope for a decent ability score though. Lord knows none of the other ones are above average.

Realistically, my Wisdom is not above 10, so I'll probably have to give up on Cleric.

My Charisma is probably 8, but there's an ACF for Sorcerer that lets you pretend your Charisma is 4 points higher, and I can work with an effective 12.

Actually, wait. I'm middle-aged, so I've gotten +1 to all the mental stats. That means the (best guess) 8/9/9/11/9/8 I was born with must have turned into 7/8/8/12/10/9!

The pestilence domain gives immunity to all diseases. That would be handy for typical non-D&D zombies. Otherwise, could I take the Disease Immunity feat from Heroes of Horror, and select "zombie-ism?"

Vizzerdrix

2020-07-26, 06:42 AM

Can mystic and wildshape ranger be combined? I'd do that, after a level or two of generic warrior to get my defences on line. I'd set up for entry into daggerspell shaper. Spend most of my time as a chuul. Doin' chuul things. Ambushing zeds, and stuffing them into lobster traps.

Or maybe a vivasector. Zombie can't move if I steal its brain. Hmm... so many possabilities.

Edea

2020-07-26, 09:05 AM

Cloistered's the correct call for a Cleric in this scenario. Kevlar's light armor and shotguns are (for this time period) simple weapons. You're going to want extra Craft/Knowledge skills for the low levels, and Lore'd be a life-saver all by itself.

Not so sure about domains, though. Assuming I start off at 1st level, I think I'd want the Pestilence domain simply to take the possibility of succumbing to the zombie plague off the table (I mean what if this ****'s airborne and not just injury-inflicted...).

Gavinfoxx

2020-07-26, 10:30 AM

Well... if we're talking about level 1 survival...

Ferocity, Spirit Lion Totem, Skilled City Dweller (Ride for Tumble), City Brawler, Barbarian, perhaps? That's a solid 'no equipment', SHTF survival build for level 1, and a decent alternative to Monk. Maybe take Track and a feat that normally wouldn't be good, like Survivor (+2 fort save and +2 survival seems like it would be very, very useful in the zombie apocalypse...). Though, that Versatile Unarmed Strike... might need that. Are we allowed any Flaws that grant feats? Hmmm. Can we change our blood type to Universal Donor? Because, if we can adjust our stats slightly via a new point buy, it'd make sense we can adjust our blood type, right? If so, I might want to get at least 13 con, take the feat 'Disease Immunity' (which might actually change your blood to Universeal Donor anyway!) for 'Zombification Disease' and help folk that way.

For another angle, is there an way for a level 1 Archivist to have, using only their starting options, the level 1 version of the spell 'Festival Feast' that Level 3 Clerics of Oldimarra with the Initiate of Oldimarra can have, scribed in their prayerbook? Perhaps buying and scribing a scroll of it to the prayer book with starting wealth. I suppose I'd need 'Apprentice: Criminal' for the extra starting wealth. Also, the exchange rate of D&D gold to real life gold -- how is that going to interact?

Alternately, if I wanted to dip 1 single level of Monk like some folk are suggesting, I'd go Hunter, Decisive Strike, Krabi-Krabong Monk, with the Track feat and Versatile Unarmed Strike feat. But I don't think it'd be as survivable as the Barbarian (more relying on wisdom to AC, I don't even know if my Wisdom is positive, again, will I be able to adjust my point buy? And Monks have less relying on hit points, a buffer of which will likely be necessary at low levels), and it'd be a bit less mobile (no Pounce).

Do these zombies count as Undead or something else?

Quertus

2020-07-26, 12:43 PM

Actually… most modern zombie apocalypse scenarios have the underlying mechanics make it the result of a disease. If one were immune to disease (ie, a Paladin), HP (and healing) would suddenly matter again.

So, new builds (continent upon looking up Paladin ethos)

Disease, counts as Undead - Paladin of Slaughter 1 / Cleric of Taumagustra "19". Goal is to kill enough people to reach Cleric 4 to control undead (human zombies) ASAP. Added bonus, zombies shouldn't fight back against my undead, so lots of free XP to be had. Hard to reach level 19, though, without using Plane Shift at 10th.

Disease, doesn't count as undead - Paladin of Tyranny 1 / Arcane Spellcaster 19. Plan is to survive long enough to Plane Shift away to level up to Teleport Through Time to kill "patient 0".

Non-disease "on touch death", counts as Undead - evil Cleric "20". Kill lots of humans to level up before zombies come; control zombies for safety.

Non-disease "on touch death", does not count as Undead - Arcane Spellcaster 20. Strategy is to use Sculpt Self to get Permanent Animate Objects on a tank (Make Whole as needed) while still low enough level to earn XP from zombies. Drive over zombies for unlimited XP for Create Food and Water traps, more Sculpt Self, item creation, etc. Start little pockets of humanity with their own Create Food and Water traps (and maybe even their own Constructs).

Actually, that last scenario is probably the most dangerous; there might be a better strategy. Something where we get an undead familiar / companion ASAP, to kill undead for us while we hide out in the safety of our own… whatever.

Elder Evil "on death" zombification, counts as Undead - evil Cleric "20"? So, when all meat is zombie meat, alternate food sources are a priority. Skeletons to protect humanity's farms & Create Food and Water traps from zombies. Numerous small communities, so, if someone dies, they don't take Humanity with them. Maybe eventually pulling off a Miracle.

"on death by zombie", counts as Undead - evil Cleric "20". If only zombies can turn you into zombies, and only on your death, then HP, healing, and getting rid of uncontrolled zombies are all wins. Best bet here, IMO, would be to "take over" an island nation. Purge it of resistance - zombie or otherwise.

Elder Evil "on death", or "on death by zombie", counts as Undead - Arcane Spellcaster 20. There is no "patient 0" here; if research and Divinations cannot solve the problem, the only path forward is to flee and not look back (taking the Chosen with me).

Quertus

2020-07-26, 01:20 PM

Right, so, what are the questions we need answered?

How is becoming a zombie triggered {bite/wound from zombie, death by zombie, death, contact with (non-zombie) contaminate}

Is it a disease?

Are the zombies "undead" in the D&D sense?

Are the zombies statistically D&D zombies (2 HD, partial actions, ignore undead), movie zombies (1 HD, immune to (most) damage, fast AF, ignore undead), or what?

Have I missed anything?

I feel like the first few of levels would be the only important ones fighting wise - in a zombie apocalypse, your enemies are going to be zombies. At level 5 or 6 they're gonna be a non factor.

In city-sized quantities? I think that'll flatten a 6th level character pretty easily.

If a single scratch is fatal, I think zombies will continue being an issue for… well, forever.

Also, the question clearly stated we were sitting at our computer desk when the apocalypse began. No equipment, guys.

Some of us have computer desks at home…

You may have weaponry at home, but I'd assume it does pierce damage,

That would be a problem, if I were using it on the zombies. *eg*

The only risk factor is one of you evil cleric ****s deciding to nuke me. What the hell is wrong with you people?

You're worth XP.

More seriously, me as an "evil Cleric" would sacrifice a few pawns at the beginning to save humanity at the end. Heck, I might even resurrect and "hero-ify" those noble sacrifices at a later date.

Like… President Snow, I'm not wasteful.

The pestilence domain gives immunity to all diseases. That would be handy for typical non-D&D zombies. Otherwise, could I take the Disease Immunity feat from Heroes of Horror, and select "zombie-ism?"

Not so sure about domains, though. Assuming I start off at 1st level, I think I'd want the Pestilence domain simply to take the possibility of succumbing to the zombie plague off the table (I mean what if this ****'s airborne and not just injury-inflicted...).

This is probably smarter than my Paladin plans… if I'm willing to be a Cleric of Nurgle.

Cloistered cleric with devotion feats would probably dominate at the early levels.

So yeah, either cloistered cleric or monk.

Cloistered's the correct call for a Cleric in this scenario.

OK, yes, some of my "evil Cleric" entries should be Cloistered Clerics. At least when I don't care about HP.

Kevlar's light armor and shotguns are (for this time period) simple weapons.

I'm counting on keeping my existing proficiencies (and skills and BAB and…). Why Kevlar, though?

You're going to want extra Craft/Knowledge skills for the low levels, and Lore'd be a life-saver all by itself.

Hmmm… I was thinking that they'd be important late game. Why do you feel that they'd be important early game?

Not so sure about domains, though. Assuming I start off at 1st level, I think I'd want the Pestilence domain simply to take the possibility of succumbing to the zombie plague off the table (I mean what if this ****'s airborne and not just injury-inflicted...).

… dagnabbit, do I need to add yet another category to my list?

Gavinfoxx

2020-07-26, 01:20 PM

Gnaeus

2020-07-26, 02:20 PM

Will the skill list be combined with the D20 Modern / D20 Future skill list in some way? Will any D20 Modern or D20 Future feats be available (edit: looks like there are no good D20 Modern or D20 Future feats, as near as I can figure, never mind)? Can we rebuild our baseline any (point buy, non-feat-granting-flaws, etc.)?

Because if so, holy heck, I kinda wanna be an Artificer, damn the early chances of horrible death, for the sheer long-term potential payoff! Will any of the D&D super-materials be available and scattered around the planet, or are we limited to 'normal' material sciences?

If modern skills are available?

My first 6 levels in some order will be Marshal 1, Divine mind 1, Truenamer 4.

Truenamer works very well, because the zombies and civilians aren’t climbing in CR. So your powers should work great with only moderate optimization.

I can make any knowledge check in the 20s untrained, and much higher for my trained ones. I know where the zombies are. I know what the zombies are. I know the best tactics to use against zombies. I don’t need 8 hours of rest, or components.

Vizzerdrix

2020-07-26, 02:53 PM

Buufreak

2020-07-26, 03:10 PM

Can I rebuild my stats according to some sane level of point buy and remove my homebrew/houserule flaws and traits? The ones that don't give me any feats or benefit?

I would also like this option. Having a 4 dex and str gets in the way of alot of things.

el minster

2020-07-26, 04:17 PM

Ranger lvl 1 then for levels of scout and become a swift hunter favored enemy zombies archery style something like dex 16 str 10 con 12 wis 14 int 14 cha 8

H_H_F_F

2020-07-26, 04:48 PM

In city-sized quantities? I think that'll flatten a 6th level character pretty easily.
...
If a single scratch is fatal, I think zombies will continue being an issue for… well, forever.

I accept your second point. I was assuming a fort save or a will save or something, which is partly why I went monk - both are good.

As for the first point, however, I was assuming surviving levels 1 to 6 included getting out of major population centers. A 6th level martial can probably deal with 16 Z without being anywhere near overwhelmed, even if their CR is technically higher than hers.

Asmotherion

2020-07-26, 04:51 PM

Gavinfoxx

2020-07-26, 05:25 PM

I'd probably avoid Wizard for fear of loosing the one thing the makes me "not a Commoner Class". Unless I used a tattoed spellbook or smthing.

My guess is, as a Druid I'd be facing constant PTSD from all the unatural energy in the world.

So Sorcerer focusing on utility or Cleric. Cleric would be the standard answear though, as you can be self suficiant by level 1 (purify food and water/Create water) and can establish your own small comunity that doesn't have to leave it's perimeters by level 3 (Create Food and Water/Consacrate/Magic Circle against Evil).

Why not an Easy Bake No Worries Wizard? Or a Convert Spell to Power Erudite?

And Create Food and Water is a level 3 spell, so level 5.

You'd have to be an Initiate of Oldimarra and get Festival Feast, available to you at level 3, or perhaps be an Artificer starting the magical traps economy.

I'd be interested in an Archivist, but I don't know of a good way to get, you know... access to the appropriate weird-class spells. There's also the gold question!

Quertus

2020-07-26, 05:34 PM

I would also like this option. Having a 4 dex and str gets in the way of alot of things.

Ouch.

Oh, wait. *My* stats.

…

I might not be able to be a terribly effective Cleric :smallredface:

Well, I guess, once I find out what *kind* of Zombie apocalypse we're looking at, I'll look at rebuilding my Mii.

Eladrinblade

2020-07-26, 06:56 PM

So, a 3.5 phb class for a modern zombie apocalypse? Ranger. I'm already pretty close; I think I'd be a scout in real life if anything.

Darg

2020-07-26, 07:59 PM

Warlock!

A zombie apocalypse demands endless fire power. You don't want to run out of fuel.

Spiderclimb all day long will ensure your safety starting from lvl 1. Later it gets replaced with Fel Flight for even more safety. Invisibility will further ensure the safety.
Gets DR and a daily Fast Healing ability to survive any kind of injury you might take.

Warlock will keep you alive and is imho the safest class for soloing. Just combo Spiderclimb/Fell Flight with Invisibility and Summon Swarm (Raven). They will distract and blind your enemies, while you watch em slowly die from safety. Later you can nuke your enemies with Eldritch Blasts when you have better shapes.

And past 12 I would go craftlock, abuse WBL and craft myself into immortality.
Warlock would be my definitive choice.

I have to agree with warlock. It's honestly the best class for solo survival and it fits my personality the best. Right from first level you have 2 options to provide yourself with survival and food: spider climb and swimming the styx. Sure you can't just conjure food, but with at will ranged damage option, you can always forage and hunt yourself.

If levels are involved, you get entropic warding for ranged miss chance while being trackless and scentless. At will day long invisibility, flight, animate dead for sentinels. Chilling tentacles will be the start of your mass clean up efforts while at will sending will let you stay in touch with anyone. Impenetrable barrier may not be as able to proliferate as a wizards wall of force, but it is at will structural control, utility, and impervious.

As mentioned you also get the ability to craft any magic item at level 12 which gives you the utility and ability to use any spell you would desire.

Esprit15

2020-07-26, 08:32 PM

Any stats? Cleric or Warlock, for all the reasons mentioned.

My stats? Factotum or Warlock. Remember that Factotums can eventually turn undead as well.

Gruftzwerg

2020-07-26, 09:03 PM

Any stats? Cleric or Warlock, for all the reasons mentioned.

My stats? Factotum or Warlock. Remember that Factotums can eventually turn undead as well.

So if you can't beat em, join em?^^

hey, wait.. If zombies are peaceful to other zombies and don't eat em, maybe that is also another good option? Which class can turn the earliest into an undead/zombi?

Ignimortis

2020-07-26, 09:18 PM

Basically, everything depends on the nature of the zombie apocalypse. If it's "one bite and you're a goner unless you can cure it quickly", then anything with fastest access to Remove Disease or disease immunity is best. If it's "you only become a zombie after you die", then there are a lot more possibilities. If it's a fantastical-ish apocalypse with super zombie mutants who can fly or something, then it's one more thing, because that can invalidate a lot of low-level tactics other than "kill it dead".

Warlock seems to be the best bet for most of these, but I don't think they get to remove diseases. Maybe Paladin of Freedom 3 first just to be absolutely sure, then Warlock? Though that would require me to be Chaotic Good, which I doubt I'm anywhere close to. Monk is a no-go, since magical and supernatural diseases overcome Purity of Body. Straight Paladin seems suboptimal for actual survival, too. No easy way out of here, I think.

Maat Mons

2020-07-26, 09:41 PM

If zombies are peaceful to other zombies, and they don't have any special senses, couldn't you just pull a Bill Murray and wear zombie makeup?

Buufreak

2020-07-26, 10:45 PM

If zombies are peaceful to other zombies, and they don't have any special senses, couldn't you just pull a Bill Murray and wear zombie makeup?

Thank you for referencing Bill Murray and an actually good zombie movie, and not that Simon Pegg swill.

Darg

2020-07-26, 10:47 PM

This is a really good point; is it a magical disease, curse, or animation? Immunity to disease won't protect against the 2nd and 3rd option and there is a chance that immunity won't remove a disease already afflicting. If not the 2nd or 3rd option then clerics cant turn or rebuke.

Without knowing anything more, the best option is to simply not get touched at all. Go go warlock (sea food isn't bad until you go crazy from mercury poisoning)

Telonius

2020-07-27, 12:19 AM

Yeah, nature of the zombies is going to matter a bit. Are they shamblers or runners? Head-shot kills? Are the graves all opening, or is this strictly human-to-human plague? Will a scratch end it, or do they need to bite you?

Even assuming worst-case, the number of enemies is large but finite; 107 billion people is the ballpark for "ever lived," and a lot fewer than that are going to have enough of their bodies left for zombification.

I think that if the zombies caught us all with our pants down (large number of infected already before anybody's aware of it, you're more-or-less alone against the horde), Warlock is going to be the best bet. You're going to need a long-range attack (melee is death) that won't run out (so, no arrows). If levels are involved, Fell Flight means you survive.

If the outbreak is caught early, Cleric is probably the better pick. Various divination anti-undead spells can be used to detect undead, predict attacks, protect your allies, and control the battlefield.

If you want to take the "If you can't beat 'em..." approach, Dread Necromancer.

PoeticallyPsyco

2020-07-27, 01:25 AM

Reminds me of a Mr. Welch (https://theglen.livejournal.com/16735.html) quote.

443. Zombies are not infectious in D&D. So I should stop shooting PCs in the head if they are bitten.

vasilidor

2020-07-27, 01:46 AM

I start with warlock, eventually multiclassing into sorcerer and then eldritch theurge, where upon i get all the benefits of both sorcerer and warlock.

TalonOfAnathrax

2020-07-27, 07:51 AM

Hi,

You are in front of your computer. A zombie apocalypse starts and you can be any class you want, according to 3.5 rules.

Which class would you like to be?
I think that the most important thing at low levels isn't your class, but your feats. For example at level 1 anyone can take Evil Brand and Lichloved. Doing this bars you from Good alignment (so no Distilled Joy for crafters, etc) but it makes personal safety far easier. You can effectively walk through zombie hordes as if they weren't there! This will make the usual zombie apocalypse "scavenge for food, find safety" plans a lot easier. It also makes plans such as "kill zombies to level" much easier, because you can choose when to start such fights and you'll effectively always win initiative. Planning on stabbing your way through fifty zombies in a week to rush the early levels is much less difficult if you can be certain to only face them one on one in areas that are to your advantage. Always have the high ground and surprise!
If this is possible, then I'll pick a class like Urban Druid : immunity to supernatural disease at level 4, good skill access, self-sufficient, animated object companion, and magic!

Obviously if I can't choose my own feats, there's no way I'll actually brand myself and consort with zombies in the hopes of getting these ones. In that situation, I'll just pick Warlock for safety (Warlocks have lots of mobility options from level one, and it's much easier to kill zombies when you're 60 feet up a wall and have inexhaustible ammunition). There's no way I'm risking melee with infectious zombies if I have an alternative!
The goal of Warlock is also to rush myself to about level 6 (for constant flight). Ideally I'll pick a patron like Fey or something (anything is better than Hell!), but if that's impossible I'll go for eternal life through craftlock later on.

In any case, assuming PrCs are allowed I'll always be aiming for serious cheese at the later levels. Why not? This is real life after all, not a game I have to balance.
For example I'd take Residual Magic at level 9, and using Residual Magic + Heighten Spell I could qualify for Shadowcraft Mage and then pull off the "infinite Miracle" bull**** a Gnome Wizard Shadowcraft Mage can do. How would I cast spells like a Gnome wizard? I've thought of actually turning myself into a Gnome or a Changeling with Racial Emulation (either through PaO or Shaper of Form), but IMO the easiest method would be by taking levels in Chameleon.
At mid levels, my ideal PrC would be Chameleon. Good versatility, good divine magic access, and a decent chassis. More importantly, it raises my stats!
And obviously the fact that Chameleon is a PrC frees me from having to struggle through early levels as a squishy wizard, which is fantastic.

Warlock!

A zombie apocalypse demands endless fire power. You don't want to run out of fuel.

Spiderclimb all day long will ensure your safety starting from lvl 1. Later it gets replaced with Fel Flight for even more safety. Invisibility will further ensure the safety.
Gets DR and a daily Fast Healing ability to survive any kind of injury you might take.

Warlock will keep you alive and is imho the safest class for soloing. Just combo Spiderclimb/Fell Flight with Invisibility and Summon Swarm (Raven). They will distract and blind your enemies, while you watch em slowly die from safety. Later you can nuke your enemies with Eldritch Blasts when you have better shapes.

And past 12 I would go craftlock, abuse WBL and craft myself into immortality.
Warlock would be my definitive choice.
While I do agree that warlocks are amazing in this scenario, I don't expect craftlock to be possible. Where will you get the necessary magical reagents to craft with? It's not like they grow on earth, and even if they did the world's trade networks are collapsing so you'll have trouble getting them (there's an apocalypse going on!). Crafting requires societal infrastructure (or amazing Divination + Teleport to gather ingredients) which just isn't there in this scenario.
Unless you're planning on visiting extraplanar markets somehow, I suppose. Can a warlock do that?

Dragonfire Adept for much the same reasons as others have said warlock, but I’m thinking the dragon breath is more of a cone to deal with masses of zombies quickly and purge the land of their flesh. Burn it with fire it’s the only way to be sure
I think that this is a poor plan. The range on a DFA's breath is very poor, and the damage is too low to kill a zombie easily. You'd have to let the undead get close and then spend several rounds breathing on them. Warlocks have the same low DPS issue, but at least they can walk up walls, get more range, and snipe with impunity.

D+1

2020-07-27, 08:05 AM

Assassin. Forget the zombies, there's still too many NON-zombies the world needs to be rid of. :furious:

Really I'd probably wind up something like a paladin. It's what all the "What class are you?" quizzes always put me at.

Quertus

2020-07-27, 12:38 PM

Lich Loved is clearly optimal, except… this isn't your character, this is you. Would *you* go that far to survive the zombie apocalypse?

If you would, it makes surviving (and gaining XP) much easier. Otherwise, I believe killing humans is the easy way to power level.

Disguise (alla Bill Murray) will work on some zombies, not others. I think it's that same movie, however, that points out that you need to sleep and 💩 - these might cause problems if zombies notice.

Rest is a big issue in many ways, and for many classes. Unless you have a clever way to turn yourself into a Warforged Warlock, you're going to need to rest at some point.

Many zombie movies (etc) have alternate contamination points - drinking infected water, for example. So what "defenses" are needed will vary based on the underlying mechanics of this particular apocalypse.

Hi,

You are in front of your computer. A zombie apocalypse starts and you can be any class you want, according to 3.5 rules.

Which class would you like to be?

Well, Milo says we've failed: the OP doesn't specify level 1, so we should pick a class that has strong prerequisites. Like my homebrew that has prerequisites that include divinity. :smallbiggrin:

Are there published answers better than, say, Incantrix? Maybe something that requires you to be a Dragon?

Zhepna

2020-07-27, 02:28 PM

Gavinfoxx

2020-07-27, 03:22 PM

Think you're Jesus, eh? Look into the following Cleric domains: Community, Renewal, Feast, Liberation, Life, Healing.

Gruftzwerg

2020-07-27, 04:10 PM

While I do agree that warlocks are amazing in this scenario, I don't expect craftlock to be possible. Where will you get the necessary magical reagents to craft with? It's not like they grow on earth, and even if they did the world's trade networks are collapsing so you'll have trouble getting them (there's an apocalypse going on!). Crafting requires societal infrastructure (or amazing Divination + Teleport to gather ingredients) which just isn't there in this scenario.
Unless you're planning on visiting extraplanar markets somehow, I suppose. Can a warlock do that?

1. You don't need Material Components for the required spell when crafting as a warlock. He UMDs the spell and thus fakes the required material components as part of his fake casting. He only needs the required item to enchant (e.g. paper for scrolls, rings/amulets for magical rings/amulets and so on..).

2. You start with scrolls of spells that can either create the desired resources or teleport you to the locations where you can get em. Once you have enough paper for scrolls and access to locations/maps with the desired resources you are set to craft yourself into nirvana

Really, imho the warlock one if not the cheesiest class in 3.5. If you abuse WBL and crafting XP (thought bottle), nothing can stop a craftlock*. Access to ALL spells, can abuse spells with expensive components (simulacrum, whish.. you name it..). I mean, you could cast up to 4 (sorcerer) spells in one round from 2 scrolls (Quicken Arcane Fusion + Greater Arcane Fusion).
Craft (Greater Arcane Fusion) Contingent Spells for some ultimate panic buttons.
The abuse potential is massive.

Treat this as a lil teaser for my next anime character adaptation showcase I am working on the past month(s).. ;)

* craftlock = warlock 12 / chameleon 2 / xxx

Darg

2020-07-27, 05:14 PM

Gruftzwerg

2020-07-27, 06:15 PM

You misread what imbue item does. It only substitutes the spell component (and costs only associated with the spell). If you succeed your roll you still pay gp, xp, and material costs. It's only if you fail that you don't pay (lose for another word).

If you don't have materials such as scrolls and ink you could also simply craft contingent spell: materials are literally anything worth half the cost. Hint: a lot of expensive things will be lying around, free to be appropriated.

I never implied anything else.

You don't need Material Components for the required spell when crafting as a warlock.
Sure, your still need the gold and xp, but that ain't a problem. Gold ain't rare and thought bottle can solve most of the xp problem.

With "Flee the Scene" you can enter any building, vault or bigger safe and loot anything without the need to ever open a door all day long. That should sooner or later solve the gold problem. Just go to banks or to jewellery stores and loot anything you want or need.

Now we just need some ink and paper. Shouldn't be a big problem I assume ;)

Finally there is the option to go Blood Magus. Now we can scribe scrolls on our skin and brew potions in our blood. But imho not really necessary as above mentioned.

Gavinfoxx

2020-07-27, 07:31 PM

How much gold is in a D&D gold piece?

How many equivalents, in volume, D&D style gold pieces are in the US Treasury? Hint: it's fewer than you'd think, real life gold is worth orders of magnitude more than in D&D!

Sinner's Garden

2020-07-27, 07:40 PM

Per the WotC designers, 1gp is worth roughly 20 USD, so it's not quite as odious as you suggest.

Gavinfoxx

2020-07-27, 08:54 PM

Per the WotC designers, 1gp is worth roughly 20 USD, so it's not quite as odious as you suggest.

I didn't ask value. I asked volume. Or we could go by weight. I would presume that going by volume of goals gets you one USD amount, and going by weight another!

Some back of the napkin math has 1 gp between $600-$750 usd, depending on how it's figured?

Sinner's Garden

2020-07-27, 10:28 PM

I don't understand the purpose of buying the gold, then. We can use that figure to determine the expected material cost. Buying gold won't help unless you're trying to make something out of gold.

tiercel

2020-07-28, 12:50 AM

Milo of Harry Potter and the Natural 20 (https://www.fanfiction.net/s/8096183/1/Harry-Potter-and-the-Natural-20) would like to remind you that D&D rules consider salt to be a form of wealth in which 1 pound of salt = 5gp (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/equipment/wealthAndMoney.htm).

So... how much Costco can you hit before zombies disrupt all the supply chains? :tongue:

This, of course, depends on how much you can channel pure D&D wealth directly into craftomancy without having to pass through generally unspecified “special materials”; if nothing else, it should certainly work for Ancestral Relic.

PoeticallyPsyco

2020-07-28, 12:58 AM

This being a zombie apocalypse, it's probably also a good idea to hedge your bets with the Pure Soul feat, making you immune to taint. Now you just have to worry about the physical health problems of eating, drinking, and sleeping in infested areas.

Lans

2020-07-28, 12:59 AM

I would go with binder, the free full plate or dove would be highly useful.

Vizzerdrix

2020-07-28, 01:23 AM

Quertus

2020-07-28, 01:34 AM

I spoke with my dm.

It'll be poison in some area. People become poisoned and it turn to cancer then zombie. Process in minimal 1 hour and longer if you are healhty.

It doesn't count as a disease but as a poison. Thanks to your answer, I'll probably play a cloistered cleric. I'll receive a hit on the head and the beginning and act like I'm jesus... It'll be fun.

I'm… not sure if that answers the question(s) or not.

If it's a poison, I would "rule 0" / derive that…

Zombies do not spread the apocalypse.

Tainted areas / water / meat (/air?) will spread the apocalypse.

Death will prevent becoming zombified.

Animals (and, heck, plants) other than humans may or may not be able to become zombified.

Zombies cannot be turned.

Zombie stats (and behavior) are unknown.

In this scenario, Lich Loved omnicidal Arcane Spellcaster is sounding good.

Anyone want to comment on good sources of poison immunity?

thethird

2020-07-28, 02:03 AM

Reads title, Artificer.

Hi,

You are in front of your computer. A zombie apocalypse starts and you can be any class you want, according to 3.5 rules.

Which class would you like to be?

Reads description, Artificer. You can get hide from undead from the cleric list, turn undead from bone talisman scrolls from Druid list, you can get control undead from the wizard list, and you can get animate dead from the death master list. You are doing fine.

While I do agree that warlocks are amazing in this scenario, I don't expect craftlock to be possible. Where will you get the necessary magical reagents to craft with? It's not like they grow on earth, and even if they did the world's trade networks are collapsing so you'll have trouble getting them (there's an apocalypse going on!). Crafting requires societal infrastructure (or amazing Divination + Teleport to gather ingredients) which just isn't there in this scenario.
Unless you're planning on visiting extraplanar markets somehow, I suppose. Can a warlock do that?

That is arbitrary. And contrary to the per 3.5 rules in the OP. I also honestly believe that the backlog of available materials in our industrialized world is bigger and better than the materials being regularly produced in pre industrial fantasy world.

I spoke with my dm.

It'll be poison in some area. People become poisoned and it turn to cancer then zombie. Process in minimal 1 hour and longer if you are healhty.

It doesn't count as a disease but as a poison. Thanks to your answer, I'll probably play a cloistered cleric. I'll receive a hit on the head and the beginning and act like I'm jesus... It'll be fun.

Neutralize poison is a 2nd lvl spell of nentyar hunter, artificer's got you covered. If it's poison in some area it sounds inhaled poison to me. Don't forget to get some mundane blockers to the poison (wear a mask).

TalonOfAnathrax

2020-07-28, 09:50 AM

I was about to say that the best single class would be Incarnate. At level 1 it's got immunity to disease and an always-on 30ft 360° zombie detector (ideal for exploring buildings hunting for food, etc). Then at level 2 they get what is effectively an infinite ammo pistol (dissolving spittle) - and it can have the pistol at level 1 if it doesn't want the undead detector - and from then on they have excellent mobility options for the next few levels (at level 4, walking on water + dimension door + walking speed increases, all in one meld). At higher levels they can get a lot more mobility options, skill boosts, things like Suggestion, and even Gate at very high levels. It's not a Tier 1 caster, but unlike Cleric or Artificier it's combat-ready all day long from level 1.
If I feared not being able to choose feats or PrCs, Incarnate would be a solid choice.

Then I noticed that the zombie plague was poison and not a disease, so Incarnate isn't that good. Not that Incarnates can't be constantly immune to poison, but it takes them about 9 levels to get that far...
No, in that case the obvious classes are Cleric and Druid. Both can beat poison, both are strong solo, both don't rely on equipment that much, and the main difference is that while Cleric is very strong vs undead (turning, spells that are better against undead) Druid is strong solo in general (animal companion meatshield, Wild Shape to wreck face and be mobile, etc).

If you don't like those classes, then Binder isn't bad. You can be immune to poison at level 5 (with Buer and Improved Binding), which is AFAIK the earliest you can be immune to poison without changing your race.
Well, you could take the Ancestral Relic feat and make it an anti-poison item at level 3.

That is arbitrary. And contrary to the per 3.5 rules in the OP. I also honestly believe that the backlog of available materials in our industrialized world is bigger and better than the materials being regularly produced in pre industrial fantasy world.
You're assuming that mundane materials are used as crafting components, and not things like rare magical plants, the blood or bodies of supernatural creatures, magical materials like mithril... Can titanium alloys substitute for giant bone?
But I can't remember if what I'm saying is a common houserule or RAW, so I'll shut up about that.

Although the requirement for an expensive crafting lab could be an issue, I suppose. I have no idea where I'd go about looking for that IRL.

thethird

2020-07-28, 10:15 AM

You're assuming that mundane materials are used as crafting components, and not things like rare magical plants, the blood or bodies of supernatural creatures, magical materials like mithril... Can titanium alloys substitute for giant bone?
But I can't remember if what I'm saying is a common houserule or RAW, so I'll shut up about that.

Although the requirement for an expensive crafting lab could be an issue, I suppose. I have no idea where I'd go about looking for that IRL.

What you are saying is indeed a houserule, a nice flavorful way of describing the expenditure of wealth but a description nonetheless. And in regards to a crafting lab, you will most likely need one if you are crafting a construct. You will need alchemist equipment if you are making alchemical items. But in both cases current technology should beat D&D setting medieval stagnancy. For example a mechanic's garage probably has everything you need to be able to move and assemble te golem, and you can get some basic home made chemistry equipment in a kitchen (if you need more raid a university, a lab, a hospital, a pharmacy or a high end kitchen store)

Gavinfoxx

2020-07-28, 10:33 AM

Well it sounds like the zombie plague is a poison AND a disease. The poison is the initial part. The super-cancer is the disease. Does that sound right?

Wildstag

2020-07-28, 12:36 PM

As a human? And specifically a zombie apocalypse? That kinda skews things away from Rogue/Ninja/Scout, which is kinda unfair.

To be honest, I'd probably want to be a Scout or a Mystic Ranger. Both are well suited to getting out and surviving in the wilderness. With a lot of wilderness around me (a county with 64,000 people and 6600 square miles), that'd be the dream. A decent bab from scout or great one from Mystic Ranger would allow me to fight well, and my skill ranks would allow me to hide and survive well.

If I could mix the Mystic Ranger with the Predator Ranger from UA (which should be kosher), then I'd just go Mystic Predator Ranger instead.

However, if I had to pick something else, I'd probably actually say monk. Yes, monk. Take versatile unarmed strike at level 1, and you've got a slashing weapon always present. You have enough skill points to take survival cross class, and you get hide, sense motive, and listen - and knowledge (religion) for knowledge devotion if you'd like. Assuming you have decent WIS, you'll have by far the best AC around. You should be able to do just fine without equipment, improved grapple is going to be invaluable against typical zombie apocalypse scenarios, and you'll get good saves if that proves relevant.

For those that lack Wisdom but have Charisma, you could go this route but with Battle Dancer, and luckily, with a bonus human feat, you could pick up TWF to approximate flurry and still go the VUS route. Knowledge's would also be cross-class though, so there's that downside.

tiercel

2020-07-29, 04:28 AM

You are thinking too small. Every city and town that has snowy winters will have piles of coarse road salt someplace.

Also- I miss that series. Do you know if he is still writing it?

I wasn’t sure if salt has to be of a certain purity to qualify, but then, compared to faux-medieval quality, road salt probably works. (I think that is actually what Milo uses anyway. —Yyyyyep. (https://www.fanfiction.net/s/8096183/34/Harry-Potter-and-the-Natural-20))

I had a look and it appears Sir Poley last updated HPN20 in August 2018, though he does have an active tumblr.

H_H_F_F

2020-07-29, 05:11 AM

For those that lack Wisdom but have Charisma, you could go this route but with Battle Dancer, and luckily, with a bonus human feat, you could pick up TWF to approximate flurry and still go the VUS route. Knowledge's would also be cross-class though, so there's that downside.

I guess so. I really like monk level 1 here because I think "zombie-apocalypse zombies" are usually depicted as going for a grapple+bite combo, so improved grapple can be very significant.
Also I think my wisdom may be slightly better than my CHA, though that may just be wishful thinking.

But I guess most people here made good points about the futility of melee anyway, so...

Mordante

2020-07-29, 07:42 AM

Hi,

You are in front of your computer. A zombie apocalypse starts and you can be any class you want, according to 3.5 rules.

Which class would you like to be?

Lich.

Join the zombies and be their mighty leader.

Gavinfoxx

2020-07-29, 09:11 AM

I guess so. I really like monk level 1 here because I think "zombie-apocalypse zombies" are usually depicted as going for a grapple+bite combo, so improved grapple can be very significant.
Also I think my wisdom may be slightly better than my CHA, though that may just be wishful thinking.

But I guess most people here made good points about the futility of melee anyway, so...

Why not bear totem/spirit bear totem barbarian then? Improved grapple and improved grab, I believe.

H_H_F_F

2020-07-29, 09:18 AM

Why not bear totem/spirit bear totem barbarian then? Improved grapple and improved grab, I believe.

Could work, but again, I am assuming I'll have the level of equipment actually available to me. So good unarmed damage and WIS to AC are very valuable.
Also, maybe alignment issues, though I'm not a 100% sure.

Gavinfoxx

2020-07-29, 09:29 AM

Could work, but again, I am assuming I'll have the level of equipment actually available to me. So good unarmed damage and WIS to AC are very valuable.
Also, maybe alignment issues, though I'm not a 100% sure.

Then take the city brawler/ferocity for Barbarian as well, for even more survivability and unarmed competence?

Wildstag

2020-07-29, 10:54 AM

Then take the city brawler/ferocity for Barbarian as well, for even more survivability and unarmed competence?

I think the issue with your argument is that Ferocity is a 1/day ability, whereas monk's ac bonus is permanent. A d12 hd at level 1 is great when equipment is allowed, but when equipment isn't available, the ehp that comes from a higher ac is better. The City Brawler option is really only good for early entry into fist of the forest to replicate the ac bonus of the Monk. As for the 'as well' portion of your argument, you can't mix Barbarian and Monk without Chaos Monk, which is pretty bad.

Vizzerdrix

2020-07-29, 11:12 AM

I think the issue with your argument is that Ferocity is a 1/day ability, whereas monk's ac bonus is permanent. A d12 hd at level 1 is great when equipment is allowed, but when equipment isn't available, the ehp that comes from a higher ac is better. The City Brawler option is really only good for early entry into fist of the forest to replicate the ac bonus of the Monk. As for the 'as well' portion of your argument, you can't mix Barbarian and Monk without Chaos Monk, which is pretty bad.

So AC>HP? Then wouldn't DR be even better than both? Their are a few feat heavy ways to get DR 5 at 1st level.

H_H_F_F

2020-07-29, 11:37 AM

So AC>HP? Then wouldn't DR be even better than both? Their are a few feat heavy ways to get DR 5 at 1st level.

DR 5 would be incredible for this scenario. How would you get that done?

Kyutaru

2020-07-29, 12:04 PM

Normally I'm a Wizard due to my real life scores and talent for preparation and foresight. But if it's the end of the world anyway I'd rather be someone with high Charisma and mind control magic to deal with the inevitable "hostile NPCs". Zombies aren't the problem. Betrayal and intelligent enemies are the problem.

So I'd go with the Warlock and command my subjects to the best of my abilities. After all, I know what's best for them and they need to trust me -- by force, if necessary.

Wildstag

2020-07-29, 12:14 PM

So AC>HP? Then wouldn't DR be even better than both? Their are a few feat heavy ways to get DR 5 at 1st level.

Yeah, damage avoidance is better than being able to take damage. Being able to combine the two seamlessly is even better. It's why I think Fist of the Forest might actually be a decent option here, because higher Constitution directly keys into both avoidance and health. But yes, DR would be better than both if you could find a way for DR to block enough damage to be worth it.

I think at low levels, AC + DR is better than DR + HP or HP + AC, or at least, that's my opinion. But that's an optimization route, and I'd prefer to be something different than that.

How many of those ways to get DR at first level are also without equipment? Horselord Barbarians have a good option of +4 Dex/Con and DR 1/-. That's actually kinda the best of all worlds. Getting a mount if you make it to 4th would be a great option too.

Implacable Barbarians get the same deal of +4 Dex/Con and DR 1/-.

El Dorado

2020-07-29, 12:17 PM

I'd go with psion, likely telepath, with most (all?) feats going into expanded knowledge to get whatever out of discipline power looks good. No inherent immunity to the zombie poison/disease but there's no guarantee that the standard spells and abilities would be effective against it.

Vizzerdrix

2020-07-29, 01:21 PM

DR 5 would be incredible for this scenario. How would you get that done?

Dragonmark feats. Their is one for DR5/magic, and one for DR5/Byshk. Any of the houses can get the first, only aberrant marks can get the second. It is part of what I would do, coupled with some troll blooded, and aberrant wildshape.

H_H_F_F

2020-07-29, 02:24 PM

Dragonmark feats. Their is one for DR5/magic, and one for DR5/Byshk. Any of the houses can get the first, only aberrant marks can get the second. It is part of what I would do, coupled with some troll blooded, and aberrant wildshape.

We're all humans though (I assume) and don't belong to any house. I wouldn't think we can get Dragonmarks.

Still, very cool idea.

Vizzerdrix

2020-07-29, 03:07 PM

We're all humans though (I assume) and don't belong to any house. I wouldn't think we can get Dragonmarks.

Still, very cool idea.

You qualify for aberrant dragonmark as human. You will need that, and mark of madness to get mark of xoriat for the DR5/Byshk.

H_H_F_F

2020-07-29, 05:06 PM

You qualify for aberrant dragonmark as human. You will need that, and mark of madness to get mark of xoriat for the DR5/Byshk.

So level 3? That's awesome, and would be very effective. Thanks for explaining!

Maat Mons

2020-07-29, 05:31 PM

If we're not restricted to single-classed characters, a Psion could go into Crystal Master for immunity to poison. Crystal Master can also give timeless body and immunity to disease, and remove the need for food, water, and sleep.

A possible multiclass build would be Monk 1 / Psion 5 / Crystal Master 8 / Psion +4 / Crystal Master +2. Take the feats Ascetic Psion and Tashalatora (Crystal Master) to switch your AC bonus to Intelligence, and up your Flurry of Blows to 2 extra attacks and your Unarmed Damage to 1d10.

If you go Telepath, you can cast Psychic Chiurgery on yourself to give yourself redundant knowledge of all the powers you already know. Then you can use Psychic Reformation to learn all new powers, turning those "redundant" powers known from Psychic Chiurgery into, just, extra powers known.

Similarly, if we're not restricted to single-classed characters, a Cloistered Cleric could go into Contemplative for immunity to poison, timeless body, and immunity to disease.

Sorcerers, unfortunately, have to be emo or Evil to get poison immunity, as far as I can tell.

Darg

2020-07-29, 09:33 PM

As a warlock, by level 3 you could have DR 4/cold iron with the fey heritage feats. With higher levels this obviously improves and continues to stack. It also opens up some pretty decent SLAs at level 6 and 9.

Also, BoVD has the Poison Immunity feat to immunize you to one particular poison.

HoH has the Disease Immunity feat for a particular disease. As a bonus, your blood can be used to help cure people of the disease.

Vizzerdrix

2020-07-29, 09:50 PM

So level 3? That's awesome, and would be very effective. Thanks for explaining!

Human with 2 flaws start with 4 feats. You can start with DR, and have a feat left to do what ever with. Play a generic class, and that gets you 5 starting feats.

H_H_F_F

2020-07-30, 04:48 AM

Human with 2 flaws start with 4 feats. You can start with DR, and have a feat left to do what ever with. Play a generic class, and that gets you 5 starting feats.

But that would lose me 2 elegance points :wink:

Aniikinis

2020-07-30, 04:48 AM

It depends on if they count as undead.

If they do, TTS Dread Necromancer going into Pale Master and doing the lich ritual myself rather than go the full levelling until after I've completed it so I can get more spellcasting.

If they don't then either warlock for obvious reasons or dirgesinger lichloved bard going into lich. Warlock would give me tons of useful mobility, scavving, and hunting options and if I wanted to survive long enough to get myself to lich status I'd become lichloved even though I'd need roughly a month's worth of hot water in that shower afterwards.

Darg

2020-07-30, 09:25 AM

even though I'd need roughly a month's worth of hot water in that shower afterwards.

Brimstone blast = infinite fire for your hot water needs.

Gnaeus

2020-07-30, 10:05 AM

I can’t tell if y’all don’t read the thread or the feats you are suggesting.

If you, personally, aren’t out there maiming animals and small children for the lols and to sacrifice them to your demon master, you don’t qualify for evil brand, which rewards you for unthinkable depravity in the service of a demon lord. Who can take your stuff away if you fail to please him.

So:
1. I call BS. I don’t care how emo you think you are, I doubt anyone on the forum is actually willing to carry it out. If you are, call your shrink. Because eww. If you suggested this, be ashamed of yourself.

2. If you are that gross and personally depraved, it’s still stupid. It’s 2 feats to be invisible to mindless undead. But you have brought yourself to the attention of intelligent undead, and made a deal which is revocable at will by a demon lord. I’ll repeat. You are invisible to undead until a demon lord decides it is funny for you not to be. This has got to be at least 10 times worse than the apocalypse of mindless zombies ever thought about being. I mean how many ways are there to get flight without boning a corpse and selling your soul?

Also, BoVD has the Poison Immunity feat to immunize you to one particular poison..

After prolonged exposure to a poison or toxin, the character has rendered himself immune to it

So... your plan is to repeatedly expose yourself to zombie plague in hopes that you become immune. Well, it’s better than lichloved.

Alcore

2020-07-30, 10:18 AM

Warlock. Burn the whole world down.

Vizzerdrix

2020-07-30, 12:40 PM

Lvl 2 Expert

2020-07-30, 01:18 PM

In general my stats (Str, Con and Int pretty decent, Dex and Cha pretty down the drain) are probably best suited for some sort of Fighter/Wizard/Eldritch Knight or Psychic Warrior build.

But specifically for a scenario set in the real world during some sort of disaster? I suppose equipment vital to all martial classes will be rather hard to come by. So uhmmm, does the DM track material spell components? He does? Psionic classes don't use spell components do they? I guess Psychic Warrior or Soulknife it is.

Except that in this even more specific scenario the disaster is zombies, and those are essentially harmless. :smallsmile: We might have to work from home for a bit, but it will all in all probably be over quicker than the corona pandemic. So Expert maybe? I'm pretty close to my third level. Or Ranger? Something I just plain like?

EDIT: Except those psionic classes I mentioned don't use intelligence. So... multiclass fighter/psion specialised in psychometabolism maybe? A ported 5e Eldritch Knight?

Quertus

2020-07-30, 02:16 PM

I can’t tell if y’all don’t read the thread or the feats you are suggesting.

If you, personally, aren’t out there maiming animals and small children for the lols and to sacrifice them to your demon master, you don’t qualify for evil brand, which rewards you for unthinkable depravity in the service of a demon lord. Who can take your stuff away if you fail to please him.

Reading the Evil Brand feat, I'm not seeing that.

Yes, you have to do *something* evil to get the Evil Brand, but it doesn't seem quite as… specific about the details as Lich Loved.

Nor does the feat say that it can be removed - in fact, the word "forever" is used twice in the text.

Becoming a Lich, however, does require some "unspeakably evil" acts, which were specified in earlier editions (iirc, one of the ingredients of the potion of lichdom is a baby you have poisoned (with arsenic or belladonna)).

Either sound a little further than *most* of us should be willing to go - which is why my verbiage changed from "I would pick (evil omnicidal Cleric)" to "it would be optimal to be (Lich Loved)".

Going the Lich route has the additional drawback of requiring the defeat of "beyond zombie" challenges.

Edea

2020-07-30, 02:52 PM

I think I'm just going to stand by my initial 'cloistered cleric' decision. It just seems to be the best fit for the situation, it's fully-SRD, and it fits my perceived stat array (meh Str/Dex/Cha, good Con/Int/Wis). Probably would go with Travel and Trickery domains if I'm staying SRD (gets Hide and Survival on the class skill list, amongst other things).

Druid might be a nice alternative, particularly since they get access to neutralize poison two levels earlier than clerics, and the animal companion's a great defense against random undead attacks during the early going. I did have one concern, though: would a druid be able to operate a modern vehicle without losing their class features? I tried to find a ruling on whether or not operating an apparatus of kwalish counted as 'wearing metal armor', but due to said apparatus being...well, awful...nobody's made a call on that one.

Celestia

2020-07-30, 02:56 PM

Well, my stats are probably 9 str, 8 dex, 8 con, 12 int, 9 wis, and 6 cha. So...I'm going to assume my class will be undead HD.

Darg

2020-07-30, 03:09 PM

So... your plan is to repeatedly expose yourself to zombie plague in hopes that you become immune. Well, it’s better than lichloved.

I'm the protagonist of my own story. This means plot armor galore (until not, but I digress). Either way these are an option if one has regular means to survive the disease. Of course, the best option would be to prevent being poisoned in the first place.

Gnaeus

2020-07-30, 04:10 PM

Reading the Evil Brand feat, I'm not seeing that.

Yes, you have to do *something* evil to get the Evil Brand, but it doesn't seem quite as… specific about the details as Lich Loved.

Nor does the feat say that it can be removed - in fact, the word "forever" is used twice in the text.

Becoming a Lich, however, does require some "unspeakably evil" acts, which were specified in earlier editions (iirc, one of the ingredients of the potion of lichdom is a baby you have poisoned (with arsenic or belladonna)).

Either sound a little further than *most* of us should be willing to go - which is why my verbiage changed from "I would pick (evil omnicidal Cleric)" to "it would be optimal to be (Lich Loved)".

Going the Lich route has the additional drawback of requiring the defeat of "beyond zombie" challenges.

All vile feats can be removed. BoVD 47. “Vile feats are granted to characters at the behest of a powerful evil entity...The patron creature may even (At the DMs discretion) have the ability to revoke the feat should the character displease it.” That’s the rule text backing up the flavor text “The bearer is forever in the sway of the blackest powers”.

No, it isn’t as clear as lich loved. It’s worse. Dumb girl in Twilight qualifies for Lichloved (but for Evil Brand). Unthinkable depravity? Ok, think of the evilest, sickest most vile thing we can think of to not discuss on the forum. It’s a bit beyond that. And you are permanently marked with it, until the moment the boss demon decides he wants it back.

It’s funny that you mention “forever“ in the sense of “you get these benefits forever” rather than, as the actual text reads, you are forever bound to follow a vile evil master.

I'm the protagonist of my own story. This means plot armor galore (until not, but I digress). Either way these are an option if one has regular means to survive the disease. Of course, the best option would be to prevent being poisoned in the first place.

If you have enough plot armor you feel safe injecting yourself with zombie poison, or if you have regular means to survive zombie poison, you shouldn’t need a feat to protect you from zombie poison.

H_H_F_F

2020-07-30, 06:47 PM

Darg

2020-07-30, 10:09 PM

if you have regular means to survive zombie poison, you shouldn’t need a feat to protect you from zombie poison.

Regular doesn't mean always available. It's quite possible for a cleric to have used their spells for the day, got diseased, and turned into a zombie before they could get more spells. The time frame was left in the air.

Quertus

2020-07-31, 05:16 AM

Gotta say, I'm glad I'm not the only one who took this challenge to mean "what would you do" and therefore avoided evil.

However, I feel like we could probably chill out with the tone. Some people took it more as an optimisation challenge rather than thinking "I would actually kill innocents for power", I believe.

Shrug. D&D "evil" is "green / purple" morality, and bears little beyond occasional superficial resemblance to meaningful versions of those terms.

Sticking to your own sense of right and wrong is good. However, allow me to present a new "trolly problem":

You mention killing ("innocents") for power. However, what if it's more mercifully killing those who will die anyway (euthenasia morality)? What if the power gained is the ability to resurrect them in (relative) safety? What if they cannot be resurrected if they die the worse way? What if the power gained is the ability to travel back in time and prevent their deaths in the first place?

At what step is the morality of these actions interesting to deliberate?

Perhaps more interesting to a role-playing forum, how does your answer change depending on whether you take a Simulationist vs Narrative definition of "zombie apocalypse" (ie, whether you treat it as a trolly problem or not - which, IMO, is where the incongruities in the original trolly problem originate).

I, personally, find such "trolly problem" morality interesting to discuss.

Sinner's Garden

2020-07-31, 07:56 AM

All vile feats can be removed. BoVD 47. “Vile feats are granted to characters at the behest of a powerful evil entity...The patron creature may even (At the DMs discretion) have the ability to revoke the feat should the character displease it.” That’s the rule text backing up the flavor text “The bearer is forever in the sway of the blackest powers”.

No, it isn’t as clear as lich loved. It’s worse. Dumb girl in Twilight qualifies for Lichloved (but for Evil Brand). Unthinkable depravity? Ok, think of the evilest, sickest most vile thing we can think of to not discuss on the forum. It’s a bit beyond that. And you are permanently marked with it, until the moment the boss demon decides he wants it back.

It’s funny that you mention “forever“ in the sense of “you get these benefits forever” rather than, as the actual text reads, you are forever bound to follow a vile evil master.

If you have enough plot armor you feel safe injecting yourself with zombie poison, or if you have regular means to survive zombie poison, you shouldn’t need a feat to protect you from zombie poison.

You realize the text you quoted doesn't say "the demon will revoke this power when it would be funny," but "the DM may optionally choose to give the demon the ability to revoke the feat." By default, it can't do so.

Menzath

2020-07-31, 10:46 AM

I am having a hard time choosing a class and feats. Maybe I've been lurking and taking this far to seriously.

So instead of lichloved or posion immunity wich are sorta okay, I would take the best of both and do willing deformity, and deformity(parasites).
Immediate action remove poison or disease, including magical ones? Yes please. All I have to do is mutilate myself and do evil prayers and take in some strange parasites? Easy.

Then I was thinking aberrant blood, and starspawn for 1st level fly speed and better spot checks. Although troll blooded is highly tempting, its easier to get out of dodge and not take any damage. And cold resist means I don't need endure elements for most mild cold weather if I rough it.

I wanted dragonfire adept and breath feats too, or maybe a turning class with profane lifeleech and sacred purification. But not enough feats. So then we need a class that has all day ranged attacks, and only 1 really makes the cut.

Sadly warlock doesn't meet my needs at higher levels. Although I wouldn't have as much range with dragonfire adept, it is much easier to ramp up breath damage, and with one feat, and the free dragon touched lets us qualify for improved speed at 3 netting us a fly speed of 50. Even fast animal zombies would have trouble keeping up.

And let's face it, at will fire makes cooking and getting potable water easy. And level 2 frost or lightning breaths, free ice, or electricity? Gods yes please.

Edit: This is all under the assumption that 2flaws is legal for building myself. I should hope so, cause man do I have some irl flaws.

Gnaeus

2020-07-31, 02:14 PM

You realize the text you quoted doesn't say "the demon will revoke this power when it would be funny," but "the DM may optionally choose to give the demon the ability to revoke the feat." By default, it can't do so.

Who do you think “the DM” is if not the god or arch devil in question. By default, you don’t know. By default, the only time you know is when the teeth enter your brain.

Gotta say, I'm glad I'm not the only one who took this challenge to mean "what would you do" and therefore avoided evil.

However, I feel like we could probably chill out with the tone. Some people took it more as an optimisation challenge rather than thinking "I would actually kill innocents for power", I believe.

I find it disturbing on 3 levels.

First, it seems like a kind of hot topic satanism. If D&D were real I would be a devil worshiper 😝😝😝😈😈😈😝😝😝. No you wouldn’t. If you would, prove it. Send me some pics of your unspeakable deeds, along with your id so that I may forward to the police. I strongly doubt that anyone on this forum would qualify for vile feats. But either you do and are a tremendously sick individual, or you are trying to pretend that you do. Neither one is a good look.

Second it’s emblematic of a forum problem of just looking at the “crunch” like nothing else matters. The entire feat was printed and the words mean things. I’m just going to read as far as “immunity to mind affecting” and ignore the part about how it comes from being diabolically evil and insane. Someone was trying to take Troll blooded. You are from a barbarian tribe in northern Faerun IRL? Seriously?

Third, on top of everything else, it’s terrible optimization. Whether it is revocable or not, it unquestionably is a gift from the darkest powers in the universe. Taking that to solve zombies is like using a fuel-air explosive on my house because I have ants in my kitchen. You are setting yourself up as a pawn to something smarter than you (strongly suspect all our brains fall into the human range), with centuries of experience, and untold malice. It could crush you for fun. Its enemies could crush you for fun. Its friends could crush you for fun. Most vile feats make you unplayable as a murder hobo in a typical game. “IRL” you become an insane freak or just a smear. Min-maxing means you minimize your weaknesses while maximizing your strengths, not minimize your lifespan while maximizing your problems. That’s not optimization.

It’s not even like lich. Lich is “I will do some horrific things for a brief period to become immortal”. Yes, that is also hideously wrong and why would anyone want to be a living corpse forever, but short term distasteful vs immortal is at least a deal. Lich loved is performing unspeakable acts for a dark master and branding yourself with their hideous mark so uncontrolled or poorly ordered zombies won’t attack you (unless it is revoked). That’s a terrible idea.

Vizzerdrix

2020-07-31, 02:47 PM

Someone was trying to take Troll blooded. You are from a barbarian tribe in northern Faerun IRL? Seriously?

2 points into Knowledge- Local solves that. Yes know the books put an axe to that. The dragon mag articles reinstates it.

People are willing to stoop to some low, low levels to stay alive. During the 30s, the Soviets had to put up posters telling people not to eat their kids. Do you think any society wouldn't rapidly devolve to that level of depravity during a zombie outbreak? Either way, it doesn't matter. This topic is just for funnsies. Don't worry so much about what others think they can and can't do.

Menzath

2020-07-31, 02:56 PM

People are willing to stoop to some low, low levels to stay alive.

Fixed that for you.

But for the most part I wholly agree. When people are faced with outstanding circumstances, with no clear means for survival, they often take outlandish actions that would normally never be considered.

All the more if dnd feats and powers get involved.

H_H_F_F

2020-07-31, 05:51 PM

Shrug. D&D "evil" is "green / purple" morality, and bears little beyond occasional superficial resemblance to meaningful versions of those terms.

Sticking to your own sense of right and wrong is good. However, allow me to present a new "trolly problem":

You mention killing ("innocents") for power. However, what if it's more mercifully killing those who will die anyway (euthenasia morality)? What if the power gained is the ability to resurrect them in (relative) safety? What if they cannot be resurrected if they die the worse way? What if the power gained is the ability to travel back in time and prevent their deaths in the first place?

At what step is the morality of these actions interesting to deliberate?

Perhaps more interesting to a role-playing forum, how does your answer change depending on whether you take a Simulationist vs Narrative definition of "zombie apocalypse" (ie, whether you treat it as a trolly problem or not - which, IMO, is where the incongruities in the original trolly problem originate).

I, personally, find such "trolly problem" morality interesting to discuss.

I really don't know how to respond to this point. I think there is no RAW *definition* of good and evil, only RAI. If a DM decides you did something justifying an alignment change, you would get an alignment change - that's in the rules.

Now, obviously, a 2 axis 9 possible "alignments" system of morality is idiotic, and I haven't played a game actually using it as-is in about 13 years. However, I don't think any DM would look at a person killing the dying to alleviate their suffering and planning to revive them and allow that player to say "My character is a lawful evil cleric of Nerull with vile feats."

That's the exact reason there's no stone cold definition, that's exactly why you have DM fiat. Your point could be reiterated if I said the same thing about killing innocents in an IRL context. If that was the case, I would say "We both know that's not what I intended and not what I was talking about." Same would go in D&D.

Gavinfoxx

2020-07-31, 08:38 PM

I still maintain that my Barbarian idea is crazy, crazy survivable for a single level dip.

Consider: Bear Totem, Spirit Lion Totem, Ferocity, Spirit Lion Totem, Skilled City Dweller (Ride for Tumble), City Brawler, Barbarian.

Bear Totem gets you Toughness. At level 1, 15 HP from your class and a bonus feat is NOTHING to sneeze at, since many of us have relatively low Constitution. If zombies deal, like, 1d4 damage, having a HP pool higher than everyone else can get you out of some pretty nasty situations!

Spirit Lion Totem gets you pounce, the better with which to use two weapon fighting while unarmed.

Ferocity gets you a way to get you bonus to strength AND dexterity, AND it can be used while flat-footed, improving your initiative.

Skilled City Dweller gets you Tumble, useful for those fights (or parts of fights) where you DON'T use Ferocity, to move about tactically.

City Brawler gives you improved unarmed strike AND the ability to two weapon fight while unarmed -- extremely useful, most of us don't have access to functional, useful melee weapons.

Barbarian gives you strong Fortitude saves and Survival as a class skill, extremely relevant!

And add to that some possible useful feats:

Track (to use your Survival in more scenarios)
Survivor (to bump your Survival and your fortitude save, very important, you might have to eat some odd things...)
Extra Rage (to Ferocity more than 1/day)
Versatile Unarmed Strike (in case the zombies require slashing damage or something)
Disease Immunity: Zombification Cancer (you wouldn't be immune to the poison, but you would be immune to the cancer the poison causes. May also change your blood type to Universal Donor.)

Sure, your armor class is a LITTLE lower than, say, a Monk... but I'd consider this a damn bit more survivable than a Monk! Also, you can wear armor. Armor is great.

H_H_F_F

2020-08-01, 06:14 AM

... Bear Totem, Spirit Lion Totem...

Is this legal? I don't see a rules problem with, say, UA wolf totem combined with CC spirit lion totem; they replace different things. But how can you replace your fast movement for pounce if you don't have fast movement, having replaced it for toughness?

Otherwise, yeah, maybe it would actually be better, though I think my stat array could really use both improved grapple and WIS to ac.

Gavinfoxx

2020-08-01, 09:51 AM

Is this legal? I don't see a rules problem with, say, UA wolf totem combined with CC spirit lion totem; they replace different things. But how can you replace your fast movement for pounce if you don't have fast movement, having replaced it for toughness?

Otherwise, yeah, maybe it would actually be better, though I think my stat array could really use both improved grapple and WIS to ac.

Ah, forgot about that. I guess Bear Totem and Spirit Lion totem don't mix. I thought the normal totems didn't remove fast movement for some reason. *checks* Seems to just be Jaguar and Wolf? Ugh. What a ripoff...

Soranar

2020-08-01, 11:12 AM

I would go for an urban druid build

At early levels you get a small animated object (with hardness it's basically immune to zombies so it'll kill them eventually)
a riding dog (easier to explain than a wolf to the muggles than a living object)
or a light warhorse (provides a bodyguard and transportation)

at level 4 you're immune to diseases
at level 5 you can wildshape into humanoids and a few other things

and urban druids get plenty of spells that can handle fellow survivors (charm person) and zombies (scatterspray, animate object, detect undead, etc) or help you survive (create water, rope trick, leomund's shelter spells)

Vizzerdrix

2020-08-01, 03:06 PM

I would go for an urban druid build

At early levels you get a small animated object.....

Wait. Do you pick off of a list, or can it be anything that is small? Say, like a chainsaw? Gett em Mr Chewy! :smallyuk:

Gruftzwerg

2020-08-01, 06:45 PM

Wait. Do you pick off of a list, or can it be anything that is small? Say, like a chainsaw? Gett em Mr Chewy! :smallyuk:

"anything" that is small following the rules for animated objects (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/animatedObject.htm)

the chainsaw wouldn't get anything special for being a chainsaw. just the regular stats for a small animated object (without qualifying for any of the optional stats like extra movement speed and such).

Vizzerdrix

2020-08-01, 07:20 PM

"anything" that is small following the rules for animated objects (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/animatedObject.htm)

the chainsaw wouldn't get anything special for being a chainsaw. just the regular stats for a small animated object (without qualifying for any of the optional stats like extra movement speed and such).

True, but it would still be a freaking chainsaw! With all the sweet sweet zombie killin action that entails. Think about it! Never needing gas. Never being disarmed. Sentient chainsaw would be mans best friend in these rotter filled times! You sir, are a genius!

unseenmage

2020-08-01, 08:04 PM

Vizzerdrix

2020-08-02, 05:54 AM

An artificer if I get those sweet sweet gamist elements like skill points and feats to literally make me competent at it.

With my IRL abilities. A very very bad ranger instead. And I'd be grumpy about it.

You can always go human paragon and chameleon to boost stats, and ranger isn't so bad. Has a very nice chassis if nothing else.

Quertus

2020-08-03, 06:00 PM

People are willing to stoop to some low, low levels to stay alive. During the 30s, the Soviets had to put up posters telling people not to eat their kids. Do you think any society wouldn't rapidly devolve to that level of depravity during a zombie outbreak?

OK, this has been bothering me - and not just for the reasons one might expect.

In movies, it's usually the parents sacrificing themselves for their children's survival. Even a book I read in my youth had a youth on a nazi train murder his father for a crust of bread, not the other way around.

So, has media poorly portrayed human nature? Do parents in stress commonly sacrifice their offspring for their own survival? Or is this a culture thing? Or even a "sign of the times" thing, because children weren't really expected to survive anyway, and parents already considered them disposable and their names recyclable?

Or does that media exist to combat this facet of human nature? Does art here direct reality rather than imitate it?

In any event, this discussion makes the one-off evil of becoming a Lich (which, granted, involves multiple evil steps) seem much more… reasonable… under the circumstances.

H_H_F_F

2020-08-03, 07:31 PM

There are a lot of factors to keep in mind, but in general, when parents really believe their children have a realistic chance of survival even if they sacrifice themselves to keep them alive, they'll do it. Even in more difficult cases, there are a thousand stories of mothers giving up their life for their children for every one story about a mother letting her child die so she could live. Culture is a factor, and so are many other things - but (again, in general) parents will usually resort to killing their own children only after managing to convince themselves that the child will soon die anyway, and that it's actually "better this way". Unfortuneately, you see parents dying for their children all the time, while the opposite decision (in general, of course) only happens when society is pushed to its absolute limit, and even then, it's by far rarer.

Quertus

2020-08-03, 07:59 PM

parents will usually resort to killing their own children only after managing to convince themselves that the child will soon die anyway,

Thank you for the detailed reply. I'm going to go with this bit as the key takeaway regarding what piece of human psychology I was missing.

Gnaeus

2020-08-04, 01:58 PM

2 points into Knowledge- Local solves that. Yes know the books put an axe to that. The dragon mag articles reinstates it

Even were that true, which I dispute, it is still an excellent example of reading half a feat to cheat your way into something.

“Your family tree contains the blood of the trolls of the Thillonrian Peninsula.”

Which member of your family tree was a troll of the Thillonrian peninsula? Pics please. The words mean things, not just the numbers.

People are willing to stoop to some low, low levels to stay alive. During the 30s, the Soviets had to put up posters telling people not to eat their kids. Do you think any society wouldn't rapidly devolve to that level of depravity during a zombie outbreak? Either way, it doesn't matter. This topic is just for funnsies. Don't worry so much about what others think they can and can't do.

What people might do after years of starvation has nothing to do with “my first plan after a zombie apocalypse is to start performing unspeakable acts and F a corpse in hopes that an evil supernatural being will reward me with a lame power”

The topic is for funsies. Quit cheating. And if you think necrophilia and diabolical evil are cool, seek religious and psychological counseling.

Lans

2020-08-05, 12:38 AM

Do we know our own stats before we choose? I imagine I'd have an above average strength, con, intelligence and lower in the other stats, but to be on the safe side I wouldn't assume this. If I choose wizard or Incarnate and it turns out my intelligence or constitution is only 10, then I'm in trouble. So anything that requires stats is out, and I would like to be magical. This leaves warlock, swordsage, dragonfire adept and binder as magic classes that I can work with. Binder breakes the game at 10 and has very strong low levels, so that would be my choice.

yarrowdeathbloo

2020-08-06, 10:10 PM

Okay so according to this: http://www.easydamus.com/character.html
My stats are
9
8
12
16
14
12

And according to this:http://www.kevinhaw.com/add_quiz.php

They are
9
8
8
17
14
14

So I'm gonna take the lowest scores from both tests for my character sheet for a spread of

9 strength
8 dexterity
8 constitution
16 intelligence
14 wisdom
12 charisma

I'm obviously a human so I'll take wild talent as my bonus feat from that, psionic talent as my first level feat and I'll pick psion(shaper) as my class and grab up the walls as my bonus feat from that.

For powers I'll go with

Psionic minor creation: this pretty much gives me access to all the supplies I'll ever need, if I get thirsty I can make watermelon or dragonfruit, if I get hurt I can make bandage's, and if I get sick I can make herbal medicine.

Astral Construct: I would be near worthless against monster manual zombies on my own so this would probably be my best at actually dealing with them. Also has the bonus of a higher strength score than me so that'll definitely come in handy.

Matter agitation: good for starting fires or getting through metal barriers with the help of my construct.

My plan for survival is fairly simple find someplace high and non-flammable with no way of getting up there use up the walls to get to the top, survive using my creation and matter agitation powers having my astral construct wipe out any zombies that stray too close.

As I level up I'll grab more feats for increasing my maximum number of powerpoints and more utility powers until I can plane shift to a plane of my own making and live there indefinitely

Ruethgar

2020-08-07, 03:25 PM

Major Fey Bloodline 3/Improved Shadow Illusionist 1/Psychic Adept 1/Mind Mage 10/Cerebromancer 7/Uncanny Trickster(C)1
Flaw: Sculpt Self(All negative level spells at will but requires elf. Elvencrafted Bow Bladed Quadruple Wand Chambered Longbow Staff and Runestaff Quintuple Bio Charger Quintuple Chemical Battery. Wands: Shadow Conjuration, Shadow Evocation, Mnemonic Enhancer, Arcane Fusion. Staff: 50 charges War Word of Genesis, 20 charges Gate, Node Genesis, Energy Transformation Field, 10 charges Bestow Curse, Break Enchantment, Heal, Fabricate, Extended Control Weather, 5 charges Telekinesis, War Servant Horde, War Unseen Crafter, War Wall of Stone, Widen Plant Growth, 1 charge Twin Concussive Chain Missile, Shield, Magic Vestment, Extended Power Word Shield, Prestidigitation, Arcane Mark, Arcane Eye, Persist Arcane Sight, Wieldskill. Feats: Enhanced Shadow Reality, Magical Training, Precocious Apprentice, Sanctum Spell, Earth Sense, Heighten Spell, Earth Spell, x10(Extra Slot: 1,2,3), x5(Extra Slot: 4,5,6), Extra Spell x15, Psycarnum Infusion, Psionic Meditation, Azure Talent, Hidden Talent, Psionic Talent x10, Improved Essentia Capacity, Heighten Power, Heretic of the Faith, Circle Magic, All Psi-Spell, Improved Familair)

Double Familiar Form into a buffed up Dancing Lights familiar via wish race change and dismiss it for an extra 40d10 HD.