Help Wanted

[Raijinken]

Our DM had subscribed to Zoom and is holding his sessions through it. I was invited to join in his new group (D&D 3.5, basics, only certain classes/races/books are accepted, absolutely NO HOMEBREWS as in everything by the official book(s), and definitely NO RIP-OFFS as in "No! Your Fighter cannot look like Sephiroth!"). During character creation, I badly punted my rolls for the ability scores. I begged for a re-do, only to get denied. DM's reasoning was "....then I have to give everyone re-dos too with their bad stats now, do I?". At least he agreed to give me a moment to think about it.

Initially, I was thinking about making something up on the top of my head, and killing my character (by ANY means necessary) at episode 0, but since we are playing with 3 newbies (younger than us, first time with D&D), that might leave a bad impression to them. Secondly, I was also thinking about just slinking out and never attend, but a buddy of mine will be there and I do not want to leave him flying solo (out of place).

Here is what I have to work with: 3-3-3-4-5-7

Too weak to be a Barbarian
Too clumsy to be a Rogue/Ranger
Too soft to be a Fighter
Too stupid to be a Wizard
Too dumb to be a Cleric/Druid
Too ugly to be a Bard

Now what? ....anyone?

[JNAProductions]

Is Warlock or Dragonfire Adept available? They can do well with crap stats.

But honestly, with the DM forcing you to have such an awful array, I'd think long and hard about actually playing in this. I get the appeal of rolling, but I personally dislike it, and would just straight-up not play with stats that bad.

Alternatively, get your PC killed as fast as possible. Then reroll.

[Xapi]

What were you guys rolling? 3d6 worst two?

Play an NPC. Be stupid, useless and scared. You will die probably fast, good for you.

You won't need to actively try to get killed with your CON.

[KillianHawkeye]

Tell the DM that your rolls are actually so low that the rules give you a reroll automatically (PHB 3.5, page 8). You'd get the reroll if you rolled all 10s, and your rolls are MUCH worse than that. Literally unplayable.

If your DM's a jerk about it, then you're stuck playing Farmer Bob.

[dangelo]

I agree it's totally unplayable. Your DM should be giving everyone re-dos if they roll that bad, honestly. I wouldn't recommend getting yourself killed with a random npc character because of how disruptive that can be in a roleplaying game, but I honesty couldn't blame you for choosing to do that. Dealing with limitations make for great character development but right now you have no good options for a D&D character. If the DM wants you to play an adventurer he shouldn't make you use that array.

[Composer99]

If your DM is making you play with that stat array, despite the reroll rule in the PHB, then you should probably take over DMing the game if such a feat could be managed. Those new players don't deserve to have a jerk DM.

Short of that, get killed off right away. Shouldn't be hard with a 3 in Constitution and a low-Hit-Die class.

I'll grant that we only have your perspective here, so there could be lots I'm missing. How well do you know this DM? Have you been playing with them for a while? Are they normally pretty reasonable?

[KillianHawkeye]

Short of that, get killed off right away. Shouldn't be hard with a 3 in Constitution and a low-Hit-Die class.

In all honesty, a character with those stats probably wouldn't survive to adulthood even if they were just a simple farm boy. They say that a level 1 Commoner would get killed by a house cat, but in this case the cat wouldn't even need to try very hard. A stiff breeze would give him pneumonia. Your average childhood case of chicken pox would probably be fatal. He might fall into a coma if a horse looked at him the wrong way.

[Pilo]

If Warlock or Dragonfire Adept are out of the table, druid is your best option. You can still do something with the animal compagnon.
You can leave your array as it is. At that values, stats won't help you.

Don't forget to ask people to repeat anything they say at least twice as your character might not understand the easiest mission.
Don't bother with equipment as a club will be the only thing you can carry, and you wont use it anyway.
Give all your starting gold to an other player as he/she can rip you off easily.

[Berenger]

If you want to act in good faith and attempt to make a working character, choose the venerable age category.

STR 1, DEX 1, CON 1 are not much worse than STR 3, DEX 3, CON 3 and you can have 7, 8 and 10 as your mental stats. This enables you to harness the might of cantrips. Hey, picture this: a senile, cranky, gout-ridden, old-as-the-hills wizard (STR 1, DEX 1, CON 1, WIS 8, INT 10, CHA 7) going off to experience adventure one last (and maybe the first) time! However, you don't really roleplay that wizard. You roleplay the charming, affectionate and slightly worried cat familiar trying her best to keep the old geezer alive and catch him some mice. It's a bittersweet... something!

[Whyrocknodie]

I begged for a re-do, only to get denied... Here is what I have to work with: 3-3-3-4-5-7

Do not join this dumpster fire of a 'game'. Save yourself the casual bullying and find an RPG!

[King of Nowhere]

Here is what I have to work with: 3-3-3-4-5-7


how is that even possible?
if you are rolling 4d6, takes 3 best, then the chances of getting a 3 are one in 1296. A 4 is one chance in 424. the average roll is 12. getting 3 three times, and the other rolls also abysmal? i can't calculate the exact probabilities, but it's surely less than one in 100billions. probabily less than 1 in 1000billions. so, perhaps you are rolling with some other rules. with the old 3d6 it's already a bit more likely, though still 1/216 for the 3 and 1/54 for the 4.

that you are forced to play with those stats is already a yellow flag for the dm. one thing is accepting bad stats, but those are another thing entirely.


If you want to act in good faith and attempt to make a working character, choose the venerable age category.

STR 1, DEX 1, CON 1 are not much worse than STR 3, DEX 3, CON 3 and you can have 7, 8 and 10 as your mental stats. This enables you to harness the might of cantrips. Hey, picture this: a senile, cranky, gout-ridden, old-as-the-hills wizard (STR 1, DEX 1, CON 1, WIS 8, INT 10, CHA 7) going off to experience adventure one last (and maybe the first) time! However, you don't really roleplay that wizard. You roleplay the charming, affectionate and slightly worried cat familiar trying her best to keep the old geezer alive and catch him some mice. It's a bittersweet... something!
that may be the only workable thing. furthermore, there's the chance for good roleplaying. if your dm forbids that, i would quit the game entirely, bringing my friend away too.

[Kaptin Keen]

Just make the character, and explain to your GM that this guy isn't going to go adventuring. He's going to set up a nice little shop, a general store maybe, selling tools and fodder and rope and supplies to the outlying farms. And just stick with that.

[Anonymouswizard]

Here is what I have to work with: 3-3-3-4-5-7

I'm going to throw my hat in 'RAW you get a reroll', you're twenty points of modifiers below the cutoff. In 2e you wouldn't be able to create a character.

My recommendation if you want some kind of effectiveness is to pick whatever +mental -physical race you're allowed to, put the 7 in a stat that gets the mental boost, and then pull the 'I'm venerable' trick outlined above to play an incredibly mediocre spellcaster. Basically the Call of Cthulhu optimisation strategy, but without the rest of the party doing it.

Or a variation on a Traveller meme. By the rules humans can live up to 110 years and 365 days. Also by the rules you can pick your age. Play a 111 year old human anything, RAW your character will have been dead for up to a year by the time the game starts. Note that you can technically abuse this until you have the stats you want, but it's better to just use it to point out that giving the reroll that is in the rules is easier than having you continually kill characters until you get at least 8-10-10-10-10-13 (which I believe is the exact worst array that doesn't legally give a reroll, but I'm afb).

[Laughing Dog]

Note that you can technically abuse this until you have the stats you want, but it's better to just use it to point out that giving the reroll that is in the rules is easier than having you continually kill characters until you get at least 8-10-10-10-10-13 (which I believe is the exact worst array that doesn't legally give a reroll, but I'm afb).

Actually, the worst array that doesn't legally give a reroll is 8-10-10-10-10-14. The scores are considered too low if the sum of the modifiers ( before adjustment because of race) is 0 or lower, or if your highest score is 13 or lower.

[Faily]

Step 1. Tell the GM that by RAW, you get a re-roll. A legal stat-line must have at least a total of +1 (all modifiers tallied together), iirc for 3.5

Step 2. If he rejects that rule and wants you to continue with that atrocious line? Leave. Save yourself the trouble.

[denthor]

3 in intelligence, wisdom charisma.

4 dexterity

5 constitution

7 strength.

Human barbarian with net proficiency and long spear.

15 foot touch attack with net.

Then pluses to hit with spear.

Also a/c 10 will hinder an opponent giving all attackers either a +2 to hit or something else.

Really no other choice you need the hit points.

[tomandtish]

As others have said, RAW gives you a reroll. If your GM won't allow it then it isn't really everything official by the book as they claim to want.

As an aside, how the hell were you rolling? Even if it was 3d6 "as is" I'd expect better numbers than that. Those dice should be destroyed. And by destroyed, I mean smashed to pieces, melt the pieces, encase the melted remains in lead, and toss it in the sun. And even then those dice are so badly cursed that I'm not sure this will work.

[KOLE]

If these were physical dice, you need to take some drastic measures. Destroying them may not be enough, you may need an old priest and a young priest.

[Mr.Sandman]

Burn those dice and the box they came in, they are cursed. Then play a Monk for as long as you survive, spend the money you get at creation on Cure potions instead of gear, you are going to need it.

[Mystral]

Our DM had subscribed to Zoom and is holding his sessions through it. I was invited to join in his new group (D&D 3.5, basics, only certain classes/races/books are accepted, absolutely NO HOMEBREWS as in everything by the official book(s), and definitely NO RIP-OFFS as in "No! Your Fighter cannot look like Sephiroth!"). During character creation, I badly punted my rolls for the ability scores. I begged for a re-do, only to get denied. DM's reasoning was "....then I have to give everyone re-dos too with their bad stats now, do I?". At least he agreed to give me a moment to think about it.

Initially, I was thinking about making something up on the top of my head, and killing my character (by ANY means necessary) at episode 0, but since we are playing with 3 newbies (younger than us, first time with D&D), that might leave a bad impression to them. Secondly, I was also thinking about just slinking out and never attend, but a buddy of mine will be there and I do not want to leave him flying solo (out of place).

Here is what I have to work with: 3-3-3-4-5-7

Too weak to be a Barbarian
Too clumsy to be a Rogue/Ranger
Too soft to be a Fighter
Too stupid to be a Wizard
Too dumb to be a Cleric/Druid
Too ugly to be a Bard

Now what? ....anyone?

Make a fighter. Die. Make something you want to play.

[Lvl 2 Expert]

If you want to act in good faith and attempt to make a working character, choose the venerable age category.

STR 1, DEX 1, CON 1 are not much worse than STR 3, DEX 3, CON 3 and you can have 7, 8 and 10 as your mental stats. This enables you to harness the might of cantrips. Hey, picture this: a senile, cranky, gout-ridden, old-as-the-hills wizard (STR 1, DEX 1, CON 1, WIS 8, INT 10, CHA 7) going off to experience adventure one last (and maybe the first) time! However, you don't really roleplay that wizard. You roleplay the charming, affectionate and slightly worried cat familiar trying her best to keep the old geezer alive and catch him some mice. It's a bittersweet... something!

If you still want to try playing this game I don't have any better ideas than this one. You want to play something that works as well as possible, that's crazy enough to be fun to play despite the bad stats and that will die relatively soon, though it doesn't look as if you did it on purpose. A character that has a valid way of attacking and a stupid backstory and who doesn't need to frontline with the maximum constitution penalty fulfills all of those criteria. Maybe get a feat like skill focus to also make them not rubbish at a single intelligence skill.

Rolling up a druid might sort of work too actually, even if you're basically playing an animal companion who can sometimes call upon its own animal companion (wildshape).

The biggest risk for both is that the DM will start trying not to kill them.

[Anonymouswizard]

Actually, the worst array that doesn't legally give a reroll is 8-10-10-10-10-14. The scores are considered too low if the sum of the modifiers ( before adjustment because of race) is 0 or lower, or if your highest score is 13 or lower.

Eh, doesn't exactly matter, my point is that they're always the option of PC suicide or creating characters who will drop dead on introduction until something playable is rolled (which I believe is the main reason that rule even exists).

Like in Classic Traveller you'd try to kill off characters with incredibly low stats because either you'd get to reroll or you'd come out of Char Gen with a decent skill set and bonuses to make up for the dangerous career. Ideally the former.

[tomandtish]

Like in Classic Traveller you'd try to kill off characters with incredibly low stats because either you'd get to reroll or you'd come out of Char Gen with a decent skill set and bonuses to make up for the dangerous career. Ideally the former.

Wow. Now there's a game I haven't played in decades.

[dspeyer]

how is that even possible?
if you are rolling 4d6, takes 3 best, then the chances of getting a 3 are one in 1296. ... i can't calculate the exact probabilities

The probability of three 3s out of 6 rolls in 1/1296^3 * (6 choose 3) = 1/2,176,782,336 * 20 = 1 / 108,839,116.

I'm leaving out the rest of the numbers because we'd need to express the concept of "at least that weird" rigorously.

But 1 in a hundred million is enough. This is what scientists refer to as p<10^-8 evidence that something went wrong with the stat-rolling. If these were physical dice, they're missing pips. If it's a forum roller, there was a syntax error.

[Squire Doodad]

I feel the need to point out that some games have a rule that, if the player rolled 3 stats of 3 or lower (or something to that effect, I think it was one of the earlier DnD manuals that said that?), the DM can label the character as unplayable and have them rerolled. The idea there is more that unless the player wants to, they shouldn't be burdened with nothing but annoyingly low stats by virtue of poor dice.
Your character is so poor statwise that you either get two sessions out of them, or you roll a new character. It's not "I have poor DEX on my caster", it's just going to make for a character who is a person to escort around more than an enjoyable party member.

The "senile old man (wizard?) who wants to go on an adventure" take sounds good, and you'll probably be dead pretty easy if you want to get a new character. Work a "do not resurrect" into his backstory by saying he just wants to live a little before joining his dear, beloved wife in the afterlife.

If you really want to dedicate yourself to fate in dice rolls, whenever he casts a spell roll dice from behind your screen to determine where he aims them!

[Spriteless]

If DM is running old school, don't even bother to name characters until they become important. Be like a certain male elf with acid arrows named after him.

And ask if you can make a backup character or three. Be sure to play them in order, though. Wouldn't want to cheat.

[Grod_The_Giant]

If your DM is making you play with that stat array, despite the reroll rule in the PHB, then you should probably take over DMing the game if such a feat could be managed. Those new players don't deserve to have a jerk DM.
This. Absolutely everything about your story is a red flag for bad DMing. Is this a stranger or someone you've gamed with before?



(If you really want to kill your character off fast... "I put a 3 in Constitution and play a venerable elf. There, I'm dead, can I use the standard array this time?")

[Berenger]

(If you really want to kill your character off fast... "I put a 3 in Constitution and play a venerable elf. There, I'm dead, can I use the standard array this time?")

I don't think so. You were an elf before you became venerable and venerable explicitly doesn't lower a stat below 1.

[Lvl 2 Expert]

I don't think so. You were an elf before you became venerable and venerable explicitly doesn't lower a stat below 1.

I had a species change.



A wizard did it.

(Note: this post is humor. I'd advice against this type of rules lawyering to an authoritarian GM if the goal is to either play the game or to slowly change the DM's ways.)

[Raijinken]

Thanks for the great ideas guys! I appreciate all of it. Game starts soon.... their game!

Yeah, I know. I guess it was not just my day, or the Dice Gods were probably pissed off and decided to take it out on me. But those are honest-to-goodness physical 3d6 rolls, which Vegas would probably love me for.

Yeah! I decided not to go through the drama (disputes, negotiations, "think of the kids") and bailed out on this one (not show up) before this potential spark becomes a big roaring flame. Since our DM refuses to budge (threw him the reroll policy, he never responded), I am budging away from it. As for THAT character, I already flushed it down the toilet (because its basically crap; I guess we all agree on that). Its basically a piece of paper with a bunch of random numbers now.

I also discussed this with my buddy, and we both decided to do something else, Monster Hunter. The moment I told him I do not want to play anymore, he wanted out too (and maybe because he is the type who strongly prefers playing games like these with close friends, and not a bunch of kids he/we never met before). And besides, we are already in a different D&D group anyway. At least there, our DM is far more "open minded" and will very much listen to (non-whiny) disputes.

[Grod_The_Giant]

Sounds like all's well that ends well. Glad to hear it :smallsmile:

[KillianHawkeye]

Keep living your best life.

[Jay R]

I'd have suggested playing a commoner, "Philbert the Paladin". He'd be a farm boy with INT 3 and WIS 3 who believes he's destined to become a paladin, and who tries to do all the things he thinks paladins should do.

Jump out and challenge the troll to single combat when the party wants to hide.
Insist on negotiating for the party.
Try to arrest everyone in the tavern who has a weapon.
Insist that the king lower taxes, or you'll try him for treason and replace him with a honest king.

Each time he gained a level, you should ask the DM, "Can I take a level of paladin now?"

It would either be hilarious, or he'd die quickly. Either way, you win.

[Matuka]

My suggestion would be to play a joke character. It's obvious that this character is going to get his **** rocked the moment he steps into battle. So why not have as much goofy fun as you can before you inevitably get turned into meat paste.

[Faily]

Good on you for walking away from that. Life's too short to be spent on games you know you won't have fun with.