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View Full Version : Cats and Catacombs: A Quick and Stripped Down Dungeon Crawl



Razade
2020-08-22, 11:14 AM
For another project, I decided to do a TTRPG inside a TTRPG but it came out well enough that I think it could run on its own as a very simple, very stripped down dungeon crawl on its own. It's certainly not 100% balanced but figured I'd share.

What you need to Play: To play Cats and Catacombs you need five (or six) people. Four to Five players and a GM. The GM needs the rules, some graph paper, two six sided die, and a pencil. The Players need a flash card for their character and a pencil.

The Furmidable: A dogged warrior wearing mighty armor and wielding a greatsword
Wounds: 5
Ability: Can attack two non-Catster Enemies in a room without marking Wounds
Skill: Can spend 1 Wound to protect another player when entering a room every two rooms.
Weakness: Marks 2 wounds when defeating Catsters instead of 1.

The Ratscal: A sneaky rat, delving the Catacomb to earn their freedom
Wounds: 4
Ability: Can disable traps without taking a Wound
Skill: Can scout a room ahead every two rooms, revealing all Threats
Weakness: Marks 2 wounds from solving a Puzzle instead of 1.

The Catogapher: A curious mapmaker, charting out the scatterbrained Catacomb
Wounds: 3
Ability: Can take out a single Clerlick per room without taking Wounds
Skill: Can solve puzzles without taking a Wound every two rooms
Weakness: Marks 2 Wounds when revealing a Trap instead of 1.

The Ducktor: A trained medic, ducking combat to heal their allies
Wounds: 3
Ability: Can take out one Catster per room without taking Wounds.
Skill: Can heal two Wounds every two rooms
Weakness: Marks 2 Wounds when defeating a Champlion instead of 1.

The Troubaboar: A musician despite all its warts. Never a bore
Wounds: 4
Ability: Earns an additional Coin for every enemy defeated.
Skill: Can mimic another Role’s ability once per three rooms
Weakness: Marks 2 Wounds from Cheeters instead of 1.

The Salamancer: A slippery magician, swamped with work
Wounds: 3
Ability: Can remove a Status Ailment for one Role per Room.
Skill: Can revive a fallen Role to full Wounds every 4 Rooms
Weakness: Marks 2 Wounds from Clerlicks instead of 1.

Actual Play: Players take Turns exploring the Catacombs. Players determine in what order to go and who goes first. The first to enter a Room counts as revealing it. The effects of a revealed Room apply to the Role that reveals it. If additional Enemies, Traps, Puzzles or Status Effects remain they apply to subsequent Roles until the Room is free of Threats. The goal is to defeat the Boss of the Catacomb and move up a floor to find the End Boss..

Players earn Coins by defeating enemies. The players may spend these Coins to make beneficial rooms. It costs 1 Coin to make a Room and additional coins depending on the Room’s ability. The players may choose to make a room before a reveal, placing it before a GM’s room or after.


Tavern: A Tavern in the Catacomb that heals 1 wound per Role, costs 1Coins.

Weapon Shop: Provides a powerful weapon which takes out one Enemy the first time you enter a Room, your choice. Costs 2 Coins.

The Apothocanary: Heals the Status Ailments of your team. Costs 2 coins

Oculus: Reveals the next room, costs 3 Coins.

Shrine: Revives a Role with full Wounds, costs 3 Coins

The GM must have paper and pen to chart out the Catacomb. Every three rooms the GM may roll 2d6. On a 1-6, they earn three Threat tokens. On a 7-9 they earn 5. On a 10+ they earn 6. They may spend these Threat Tokens on the following. The GM must spend 1 Threat every two rooms.


Trap
Cost: 1 Threat. The GM may only spend half their Threat on the following Room to a minimum of 1.
Effect: Marks a Wound on the first Role entering the Room. Can be disabled by Ratscales without marking Wound. Marks 2 Wound if a Catographer is the first to reveal it.

Puzzle
Cost: 1 Threat. The GM loses one Threat if the Puzzle is solved by the first player entering the Room to a minimum of 0.
Effect: Marks a Wound on the First Role entering the Room. Can be solved by Catographers without marking Wound. Marks 2 Wound if a Ratscale is first to reveal it.

Enemy
Cost: 1 Threat per Enemy
Effect: Enemies have 1 Wound unless otherwise stated. An Enemy is defeated when they cannot Mark a Wound. Enemies mark a Role’s Move when they enter a Room. Enemies drop 1 coin each.

Champlion: Marks 2 Wounds on the Ducktor.
Catster: Marks 2 Wounds on the Furmidable.
Clerlick: Marks 2 Wounds on the Salamancer
Cheeter: Marks 2 Wounds on the Troubaboar

Status Ailment
Cost: 1 Threat Token per Threat (see text)
Effect: A Status Ailment cannot be put in a Room without an existing Threat. Status Ailments apply to either an Enemy, Puzzle or Trap. Status Ailments resolve when the Threat they are applied to resolve, effecting the first Role entering a room. Status Effects last a single Turn unless otherwise stated.

Poison: Deals 1 Wound at the start of the next Room.
Paralyze: The Role cannot choose to enter the next Room first.
Frightened: The Role cannot engage an enemy, taking one 1 wound if they reveal a room.
Befuddled: Cannot solve a Puzzle if they reveal the Room.
Muddled: Cannot solve a Trap if they reveal the Room.

Boss
Cost: 4 Threat, must be placed after 6 rooms on a Threat Roll of 10 or higher
Effect: A Boss marks 1 Wound on all Roles outside their Room and 1 Wound to the Role revealing their Room. Bosses have 3 Wound and take 1 Wound per Role that enters its Room.

Advancing a Level: The Catacombs are a vast and every shifting labyrinth. Once you beat a boss you progress to the next level in your quest to find the treasures and enemies deeper inside. Bothplayers and GMs level up at the completion of a Floor.

When the Players end a floor, they heal all Wounds and pick an advancement from the list below.

Player Advancement

- Gain one Wound
- Gain a Tool, this can mimic a Role’s Ability. This lasts for one floor.
-Gain a Scroll, this can mimic a Role’s Skill. This lasts for one floor.
-Gain an Item. An Item can deal one Wound to an Enemy, clear a Trap or Puzzle without marking Wounds or clear a Status Ailment once.

For every subsequent Floor past the first, the Players must defeat a number of bosses equal to 1 plus the number of floors they are on. The GM gains +1 to their Threat Roll for every two floors cleared. The GM gains an additional Threat token every two rooms cleared after the first floor. The GM may choose the following when a Floor is cleared[/B].

GM Advancement

-You may spend a Threat Token to increase an Enemy’s Wound by 1 per Threat Token
-Status Ailments lasts two rooms instead of 1. This lasts one floor.
-You may spend two Threat Tokens to include an Enemy, Puzzle or Trap in a Boss Room
-You may spend six Threat to place another Boss into a Boss Room
__________________________________________________ ____________

Once all choices above the line are taken, the GM may add the following to their list of Threats

The End Boss
Cost: 5 Threat, may only appear after the players have cleared two or more Boss Threats
Effect: The End Boss functions like a regular boss but instead marks 2 Wound on all Roles not in its Room. The End Boss has 6 Wound instead of 3 and deals a Status Ailment of the GM’s choice to any Role not in its Room.

noob
2020-08-22, 12:00 PM
Due to the rather low amount of decisions a player or a gm is not needed provided you can find a correct algorithm to estimate decisions allowing to simulate the game entirely on computer without humans involved and thus help to estimate balance.

Razade
2020-08-23, 07:52 PM
Due to the rather low amount of decisions a player or a gm is not needed provided you can find a correct algorithm to estimate decisions allowing to simulate the game entirely on computer without humans involved and thus help to estimate balance.

That's well beyond my pay grade at the moment. I'm getting into coding so maybe I'll give it a shot. At the moment, for an in person game, you still need someone to make the choices for the Catacomb.

Probably the last bit of tinkering I'm going to put on this system since I think it brings it up to a game game, actual progression. Some balance tests would probably be good but what was really just a fun side project that spun out from another fun side project I feel it's pretty elegant and workable and any problems can easily be worked out at the table. Same goes with adding things on the fly and in play. The game is pretty system simple, adding on to it on the fly by a GM shouldn't be difficult.

Yakk
2020-08-24, 02:54 PM
It is unclear what the sequence of play is.

How Status Ailments work is unclear.

It is unclear what Wounding a trap does.

It is unclear what the player's decision points are. A fun game should generally have decision points, otherwise you are playing a math-heavy "candyland".

Razade
2020-08-24, 03:08 PM
It is unclear what the sequence of play is.

It states that players take turns entering rooms. The players can decide who goes in first and then after. Effects trigger when Roles enter a Room until the room as no more Threats.


How Status Ailments work is unclear.

How so? What about the write up is unclear? You add a Status Effect to a Room and the person revealing the Room gets it.


It is unclear what Wounding a trap does.

There's nothing that says a trap takes a Wound. A trap marks one Wound off a Role when they enter a room with it so long as they're not a Ratscal.


It is unclear what the player's decision points are. A fun game should generally have decision points, otherwise you are playing a math-heavy "candyland".

I suppose it is a bit more of a board game, the GM is (as the page states) encouraged to provide roleplay and other elements. That's not really the function of the rules however. The goal was to make a stripped down dungeon crawl, the fun is for players who enjoy that sort of thing. The decision points revolve around managing the party's health and clearing rooms and advancing further into the Catacomb. The objective is simple and stripped down like the rules. Getting deeper, beating bosses, etc. Anything in between is player generated.

I've made some edits to make it all a lot more clear however. Thanks for the feedback!

Yakk
2020-08-24, 05:02 PM
It states that players take turns entering rooms. The players can decide who goes in first and then after. Effects trigger when Roles enter a Room until the room as no more Threats.

If they take turns, where is the decision?

How so? What about the write up is unclear? You add a Status Effect to a Room and the person revealing the Room gets it.
"One Ailment Per Token per Role" -- So, if you have 5 Role's of PCs and you spend 1 Token, you get 5 Ailments?

That seems nonsense.

There's nothing that says a trap takes a Wound. A trap marks one Wound off a Role when they enter a room with it so long as they're not a Ratscal.
Um, you said:
[quote]One Threat Token. A trap takes one Wound from any non-Ratscal entering the room.
That trap is "takes one Wound". What does that mean when the trap takes a Wound?

Do you mean takes as in "does damage"?

I suppose it is a bit more of a board game, the GM is (as the page states) encouraged to provide roleplay and other elements. That's not really the function of the rules however. The goal was to make a stripped down dungeon crawl, the fun is for players who enjoy that sort of thing. The decision points revolve around managing the party's health and clearing rooms and advancing further into the Catacomb. The objective is simple and stripped down like the rules. Getting deeper, beating bosses, etc. Anything in between is player generated.
Sure, but a board game should actually describe the sequence of play. You seem to have a sequence of play in your head, but it isn't clear.

A typical board game dictates who goes first, what their options are, and who goes next. Yours just states "takes turns". It doesn't even explicitly state you can reveal a room on your turn, it just seems to assume that.

How enemies work is also confusing. Part of it implies all of the effects of the room applies to "anyone" (I assume a character) who reveals it. But other parts talk as if these things somehow persist, and maybe PCs only encounter one of the threats at once? I can't tell.

Is the catacomb linear, or does it have branches? I can't tell.


You may spend a Threat Token to increase an Enemy’s Wound by 1 per Threat Token
What is "an Enemy's Wound"?

You seem to be using "Wound" as both HP and Damage, and it makes things confusing. If you take a Wound, did you take or deal damage? If you gain a Wound, do you do more damage or do you take more damage to kill? Is this different for Roles and for Enemies? Does "gain a Wound" and "deal one Wound" on an Enemy,


Gain one Wound
- Gain a Tool, this can mimic a Role’s Ability for the duration of a floor.
-Gain a Scroll, this can mimic a Role’s Skill for the duration of a floor
-Gain an Item. An Item can deal one Wound to an Enemy, clear a Trap or Puzzle without marking Wounds or clear a Status Ailment once.
Are the Tools/Scrolls/Items consumable or reusable? I can't tell.

What does "lose one Threat" mean? If the GM has spent all Threat, do they have negative threat? Does the GM spent Threat when she gains it, or when the players enter a room?

How does solving a puzzle work? Do players choose if they solve it, or do they automatically do so?

---

I am stating, sit down and write out the sequence of things that happen in order. Attempt to have unique names for things (like, "Damage" vs "Wounds") to reduce confusion. If you have Enemies, have rules about what stats they have.

Explicitly state what status ailments do.

Explicitly state the steps you go through when you reveal a room.

Explicitly state what you do on each player's turn, and what the decision points are.

Razade
2020-08-24, 06:27 PM
If they take turns, where is the decision?

Who goes in what order? When to use their skills and all that? You say later


A typical board game dictates who goes first, what their options are, and who goes next. Yours just states "takes turns". It doesn't even explicitly state you can reveal a room on your turn, it just seems to assume that.

But there isn't an order. The order will change. It's up to the players to make that call. It states that in the "how to play"


"One Ailment Per Token per Role" -- So, if you have 5 Role's of PCs and you spend 1 Token, you get 5 Ailments?

That seems nonsense.

Yep, it would be. It was meant to be "One Ailment per Threat". Meaning you spend 1 Token on an existing Threat in a Room. Just as it says, that gets taken out by the first person entering the room


That trap is "takes one Wound". What does that mean when the trap takes a Wound?


Do you mean takes as in "does damage"?

Wound is how much damage you can take yes. Each thing specifies how much damage you take from it. You later point out that it's being used for HP and Damage but it's not. HP and Damage are one in the same. If something does more damage it outright states it in the context of how many Wounds you have. I'm sorry you're confused but I think it's fairly plain.


Sure, but a board game should actually describe the sequence of play. You seem to have a sequence of play in your head, but it isn't clear.

How to play gives the sequence. You go in order of who is picked and you move Roles into a room until the threats are cleared. That's spelled out word for word, the sequence is there.


How enemies work is also confusing. Part of it implies all of the effects of the room applies to "anyone" (I assume a character) who reveals it. But other parts talk as if these things somehow persist, and maybe PCs only encounter one of the threats at once? I can't tell.

Same as above. It expressly says how Turns are handled and how Threats are handled.


Is the catacomb linear, or does it have branches? I can't tell.

I'm not even sure what this means. The GM can draw the Catacomb however they want, have you circle back to old floors or whatever. It's fully up to the GM and it's stated as such. The GM draws the Catacomb and makes rooms as you go.



Are the Tools/Scrolls/Items consumable or reusable? I can't tell.

It says "for the duration of". That's as literal as can be that it's consumable.


What does "lose one Threat" mean? If the GM has spent all Threat, do they have negative threat? Does the GM spent Threat when she gains it, or when the players enter a room?

I grant it should probably say it can't go into negatives. The GM can spend Threat, as stated, when they want to fill a room. There's no upper limit and they gain it at intervals. It shouldn't stack up too much.


How does solving a puzzle work? Do players choose if they solve it, or do they automatically do so?

It's automatic like everything else. I'm not sure how that's in question.

---


I am stating, sit down and write out the sequence of things that happen in order. Attempt to have unique names for things (like, "Damage" vs "Wounds") to reduce confusion. If you have Enemies, have rules about what stats they have.

I've done so, despite some editing misses. Thanks for shoring that up.

I see I missed saying that all Enemies start with 1 Wound. I felt that was implied as it keeps with the rest of the Threats but I'll specify.


Explicitly state what status ailments do.

I don't think it can get any more clear.


Explicitly state the steps you go through when you reveal a room.

Same as above. It's clear in the How to Play section.


Explicitly state what you do on each player's turn, and what the decision points are.

It's all detailed in the Role and how Threats are calculated. It might help if I did an Example Play section but I think if you read through the whole thing, the flow is apparent.


Edit: I touched up the layout. I hope it makes things more clear to people. I'd done it for the Roles, didn't feel I needed to for the Threats but now it should all be much more plain and clear. Also pumped up Traps to be more in line with Puzzles in that solving them takes something from the GM and it's not just a static deal.

Yakk
2020-08-24, 07:58 PM
There is no "How to Play" section. I search for the text "how to play" and I only see you saying things about it.

Possibly you mean "actual play"? Maybe. I don't think it covers what you claim it does. For example: "Take turns" does not describe how you determine whose turn it is. It doesn't mean "they decide among themselves" because it doesn't *say that*.

But you are getting sour at me, and I am frustrated. So I think I'm gone. Good day.

Razade
2020-08-24, 08:50 PM
There is no "How to Play" section. I search for the text "how to play" and I only see you saying things about it.

Possibly you mean "actual play"? Maybe. I don't think it covers what you claim it does. For example: "Take turns" does not describe how you determine whose turn it is. It doesn't mean "they decide among themselves" because it doesn't *say that*.

I did, and I think most would take it to mean that without direction honestly. It does however say how it's chosen.


Actual Play: Players take Turns exploring the Catacombs. Players determine in what order to go and who goes first. The first to enter a Room counts as revealing it. The effects of a revealed Room apply to the Role that reveals it. If additional Enemies, Traps, Puzzles or Status Effects remain they apply to subsequent Roles until the Room is free of Threats. The goal is to defeat the Boss of the Catacomb and move up a floor to find the End Boss..

Players earn Coins by defeating enemies. The players may spend these Coins to make beneficial rooms. It costs 1 Coin to make a Room and additional coins depending on the Room’s ability. The players may choose to make a room before a reveal, placing it before a GM’s room or after.

Highlighted the important bit. It just outright says what I said it says.


But you are getting sour at me, and I am frustrated. So I think I'm gone. Good day.

I'm most certainly not. I've thanked you on multiple occasions for pointing out where I should expand on things and I've put your critique to clearing up and clarifying things. I apologize that you're getting frustrated but I'm not going to bend on things that don't need changing simply because you think they ought or don't grok something that seems fairly obvious in context. If me not agreeing to each and every one of your points is frustrating to you, it's probably best if you stop for your own sake. I appreciate the feedback all the same.

Thank you again for all your feedback. For what it's worth, you've helped make things more clear and got my lazy but to touch up the Threats so they're also more clear to the reader and formatted like the Roles. I wouldn't have done that otherwise.


I am always happy for feedback, just not sure how much is needed at this point. The goal was to write a system neutral, bare bones dungeon crawl and I feel that the game as presented is there.