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Goober4473
2007-10-31, 06:27 PM
Is there such a thing? How would an umbral character carry items, gold, etc., besides ghost touch armor and weapons? Is incorporeal solid to other incorporeal? So if there was an incorporeal item, would a shadow be able to hold it?

Yuki Akuma
2007-10-31, 06:31 PM
Ghosts get special incorporeal equipment that are replicas of stuff they owned in life. Says so right there in their description in the Monster Manual, in fact.

mostlyharmful
2007-10-31, 07:26 PM
Ghosts get special incorporeal equipment that are replicas of stuff they owned in life. Says so right there in their description in the Monster Manual, in fact.

But they can't ever gain anything new or shiney? or anyone else that happens to be ethereal? maybe they start mugging dead people...

Seriously if you allow ghosts in game they have anouther limitation beyound LS and that is that they can't ever gain new equipment or add qualities to their old stuff, they're stuck with whatever they happened to have with them when they died or what they had witht them when they were buried depending on your DM

Goober4473
2007-10-31, 08:15 PM
Also I never mentioned ghosts, who can use ethereal equipment, which is solid and exists on the ethereal plane. What about shadows? Wraiths? Umbral creatures?

Also, can an incorporeal creature punch another incorporeal creature?

Also note, I am the DM, so I can make a ruling if no rules exist.

Jack_Simth
2007-10-31, 08:47 PM
Incorporeal creatures can be harmed only by other incorporeal creatures, by magic weapons, or by spells, spell-like effects, or supernatural effects. They are immune to all nonmagical attack forms. They are not burned by normal fires, affected by natural cold, or harmed by mundane acids.(Emphasis added)
Yes, one incorporeal can punch another. No strength bonus, though (it's a nonability for both of them - usually).

And there is an enchantment that lets them grab stuff:

Ghost Touch: This armor or shield seems almost translucent. Both its enhancement bonus and its armor bonus count against the attacks of incorporeal creatures. It can be picked up, moved, and worn by incorporeal creatures at any time. Incorporeal creatures gain the armor or shield’s enhancement bonus against both corporeal and incorporeal attacks, and they can still pass freely through solid objects.

Strong transmutation; CL 15th; Craft Magic Arms and Armor, etherealness; Price +3 bonus.(Emphasis added)
Similar wording under the Weapon verson.

Some +1 Ghost Touch Gauntlets ought to do the job pretty well.

Aquillion
2007-10-31, 09:30 PM
Hmm... does that last sentence mean that an incorporeal creature who grabs a ghost touch item can carry it through walls? I hadn't realized that. Makes being incorporeal much more attractive... although, yeah, you do still have to get all your equipment custom-made and pay more for it.

Unless you're a Psion Uncarnate (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/prestigeClasses/psionUncarnate.htm) or something else that gets a special equipment-incorporealizing power, that is.

Feralgeist
2007-10-31, 09:59 PM
take the ephemeral exemplar prestige from libris mortis

Nowhere Girl
2007-10-31, 10:08 PM
I just want to see two ghosts duking it out.

Caewil
2007-10-31, 10:34 PM
I want to see two ghost DRAGONS duking it out.

Nowhere Girl
2007-10-31, 10:39 PM
Ghost pirates fighting ghost ninjas. :smallbiggrin:

BardicDuelist
2007-10-31, 11:10 PM
I just want to see two ghosts duking it out.

Eh, you know they can't be that great of fighters because they both did die and all...

Hmm, how would ethereal grappeling work, with the whole "I pin him so he falls through the floor" thing? :smallwink: (That was a joke, and sarcastic. Please do not try to answer this, as it may hurt my brain).

Keld Denar
2007-11-01, 07:56 AM
I know it was a joke, but it is of note that the incorporial subtype makes you completely and wholey immune to any form of grappling. It says so right in the back of the MM under in incorporial. Even force effects such as Bigby's Groping Grasping Hand or effects that extend extradimensionally such as a metamagic Transdimensional Evard's Black Tenticles.

As far as umbral creatures go, ya, they can use ghost touch weapons, or wear ghost touch armor. If I was umbral though, I'd be more interested in doing touch attacks for the yummy yummy str damage. It tastes like pure life force....Mmmmmmm

hewhosaysfish
2007-11-01, 08:04 AM
If incorporeal creatures can pick up ghost Touch gear... what's the carrying capacity for a creature with a non-ability in strength?

Keld Denar
2007-11-01, 08:43 AM
This isn't 100% RAW, but if you look up the spell Ghost Trap(SC), which makes incorporial creatures corporial, I believe it says that they use their CHA score as their STR score. Otherwise the creatures would be paralized under the weight of their newly corporial selves. I would carry that over to to ghost touch weapons, armor, and equipment as well, for determining carrying capacity.

Alternately, you could roll or asign a str score to all incorporial creatures, and then just say that that STR score doesn't effect anything while the creature is incorporial and not in contact with any ghost touch items. Then it would be there if for some reason you needed it, but would otherwise be treated as a non-stat. This is completely houserule, and should not be taken as RAW in any way, shape, or form.

In other news, there is an magical oil, I believe in Libris Mortis:The Book of Bad Latin, that when applied to an item, allows incorporials to interface with it. Paradoxically, the incorporial can't apply the oil themselves, since it makes no mention of use of the oil allowed by incorporials.

Armads
2007-11-01, 09:02 AM
Ghostly Grasp (http://realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Ghostly_Grasp) could be useful for helping incorporeal creatures use stuff.

Tor the Fallen
2007-11-01, 10:08 AM
Eh, you know they can't be that great of fighters because they both did die and all...

Some fighters die of old age.