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Savageman
2007-11-01, 07:49 PM
I'm a semi-experienced player, but most of my experience is in DMing (oddly enough) or with the PHB classes and races. A friend is getting ready for a new "high powered" campaign, and he's allowing up to a +2 level adjustment. I've been thinking about playing a beguiler, but have never actually done so. I'm looking for any help I can get on this: best race, builds, how do you play the class, etc. I've read the class description, but after playing and DMing for a while now I've noticed the theory behind the class and the practical play style tend to diverge often. Please post anything you think might help me in playing, thanks!

Temp
2007-11-01, 07:57 PM
The Beguiler actually does a pretty good job doing what it's clearly intended to do (take stuff by surprise with Enchantments and the like).

I believe the Dark Template from ToM would be worth looking into. Phrenic (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/monsters/phrenicCreature.htm) from XPH is fun and gives some handy boosts.

Grey Elf (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/elf.htm#grayElf) could be a good move as well.

[Edit:]And Beguiler's a pretty solid class on its own. It does well without multiclassing.

Savageman
2007-11-01, 09:19 PM
Can you post a link to the dark template please? Sorry, I only have the basic books (+1 or 2 from friends).

BardicDuelist
2007-11-01, 09:21 PM
Be a Beguiler Beguiler!

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=61922

why123
2007-11-02, 04:03 AM
I believe the Dark Template from ToM would be worth looking into. Phrenic from XPH is fun and gives some handy boosts.

Iku Rex
2007-11-02, 04:13 AM
I believe the Dark Template from ToM would be worth looking into. Phrenic from XPH is fun and gives some handy boosts.


I believe the Dark Template from ToM would be worth looking into. Phrenic from XPH is fun and gives some handy boosts.Ok, this is really weird. You joined the forum so you could post a couple of sentences copied from another post in the thread?! :smallconfused:

Edit: Maybe it's a bot of some kind? :smalleek: Or just a silly troll?
EditEdit: Ah - I have signatures tuned off. Checked the profile. I'm guessing it's a search engine rank boosting spambot.

Nerd-o-rama
2007-11-02, 04:49 AM
Dear bot,

Please die in an Aperture Science Emergency Artificial Intelligence Incinerator.

Thank you.


Anyway, back to the topic, Whisper Gnomes (Races of Stone and here (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20040807a&page=3)) make ludicrously good sneaky characters, although as a Beguiler you'll probably want to focus on social skills rather than Hide/Move Silently. And for some reason, they have no LA, so you could still put a template on top of that.

Drow are a classic choice for +2 LA that get bonuses in the Beguiler's three most important stats in addition to their mixed bag of other racial goodies (just don't carry scimitars). Really, I can't give that many good suggestions for a +2 LA race, since I usually avoid LA like the plague. If it's free, though...

As for building your character, keep some feats in mind:

Improved Feint will stack with one of your early class features to let you Feint as a Swift action. Considering the bonuses to spells you get against a flatfooted opponent, I recommend this. The prereq, combat expertise, is also not bad for a light-armored character who might get into melee to make touch attacks, which you are.

Spell Focus in Illusion, Enchantment, or both is your friend, since almost every one of your spells has a save, and every last one period is in one of those two schools.

In more general tips:

Mindless opponents are your Kryptonite. However, the stupider ones will probably fall for simple illusions without testing them.

When you get Expanded Learning, take Shadow Evocation/Conjuration. Trust me.

If you don't plan on getting to level 20 and your capstone ability, one level of Mindbender can make you language-dependent spells much more effective.

Keld Denar
2007-11-02, 07:36 AM
If you go whisper gnome, look into Shadowcraft Mage (Races of Stone). It is possible to qualify for it by taking Mindbender at 6 or 7 to delay your expanded learning feature a level to get shadow evocation/conjuration. Its kind of complicated and pretty feat intensive, but can add some neat versitility to a beguilers rather limited spell list. Just a thought, by no means the only way to build a Beguiler.

Straight Beguiler 20 is pretty powerful in his own right, no major need of multiclassing required.