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Him
2020-10-01, 10:33 AM
{Scrubbed}

This is a generic Kensai I would recommend to some one interested in playing the class. Apply your own personal flavor, but I will leave comments and thoughts in general terms.

I say generic, but this Kensai is also an Exotic Weapon Master.

So the goal of a fighter is pretty simple, he is to carry the party in damage dealing until the wizard gets fireball. And he needs to occupy melee combatants so the spell caster and ranged players can do their thing. He is also the primary source of flanking for the rogue, though at high level a rogue should have something like a Rusty Bag Of Tricks to give at least a round of their own flanker, you may need to suggest.

So weapon hitting opponent as often as possible, this kind of build sets up various latent abilities, then gains momentum.

SKILLS:

Well for exotic weapon master at 7th and 8th level you need 3 craft weaponsmithing, and for Kensai, then the requirements are 5 diplo, 5 concentration and 5 ride.

Exotic Weapon Master skill levels, well not much selection, could be tempted to spend on cross class, I just dumped into Intimidate.

The kensai 2 skills I am sure to max out are concentration, for the strength focus, and balance. Since this build fights by tripping with knockdown, a skill that focus on staying on their feet was nice synergy. 5 ranks each in diplomacy, sense motive, knowledge local and royalty+non, means this character can interface with the local troubled nobility, helps with party NPC interactions.

1 rank of Tumble, for when you have mobility.

Human
6 fighter, 2 exotic weapon master, 10 Kensai 2 fighter.
16str
14 con
14 Dec
14 int
10 wis
10 Cha

1. Combat Expertise, Trip, combat Reflexes
2. Knock-down
3.Exotic Weapon Proficiency, Bastard Sword
4.Weapon Focus, Bastard Sword
6. Weapon Spec Bastard Sword, Power Attack
7 EWM: Uncanny Blow
8 EWM: Exotic reach.
9. sunder
12 Dodge
15 Mobility
18 spring attack
20 Whirlwind Attack.

This is a build designed to go epic with whirlwind attack, basics are finished by 9th level

Play progression
Level 1.
Finds you usually 10 in front of the party next to the rogue who is scouting. Carrying 2 shield, 1 is equipped while the is held in one arm, the other arm is occupied by a guisarme.

If surprised, the shield in hand is dropped, the guisarme readied and trip those incoming. If you can swap out the beginning masterwork weapon for potions of Enlarge, even better trip and hit up to 4 times with combat reflexes and normal attacks each turn.
Level 2
An enlarge ring and knock down will see you attacking normally with weapon and shield while still gaining AoO (attacks of opportunity)

Level 4
Large sized damage should be around 2d6+5 so should be activating knock-down in 50% of time damage is delt. DC for the trip is now around +12..

Level 6
Same, but the trip should be triggering 99%.

Level 9.
So we went from pikeman at first level, heavy infantry till now, final shift, we make the shield animated and use the Bastard Sword 2 handed with uncanny blow. This combo allows for the hardest hit I can come up with inside the rules. While there may be option for squeezing a few more damage out per round with a weapon in each hand, that's very expensive and i already have a character i made for myself. The training time on that one is rediculous though.

So yeah, level 9 heavy assault. Floating shield for extra a.c. each hit carrying a crowd control effect and using size(Wu Jen Giant Size spell, take a took) altering custom magic items, for the reach effect.

Exotic Weapon Master means the hardest hit and no one can hide when in your reach like a spell caster behind cover trying to snipe with a spell or whatever..

These tactics are good for human sized creatures, but monsters are different. When fighting monster, sunder. Sunder their wings for crowd control, natural weapons for damage control. Then just beat them up.

Now it's just about getting whirlwind attack for this epic style

Level 14
If you've been saving up, you can now enchant your Bastard sword to be +1 vorpal. Vorpal weapons are the classic mainstay of a fighter.. one of the beauties of this build is it allows you to dictate exactly when this occurs. Usually, to purchase this weapon would cost half your character wealth, but due to class choices you just pay some experience points, thus allowing you to spend your cash in other, beneficial ways.

Level 15.
Combining the fighter armor class with mobilit, attacks of opportunity from opponents can to a large extent be discounted. If a party member is cornered your character may save them by provoking the AoO if your DM doesn't run intelligent mobs.

Level 18
Spring attack combined with non lethal damage and a random insta-kill effect, when striking out at a party member stepping out of line can remind the party that while you are lawful good, you are a lawful good trained killer they shouldn't cross.

Level 20
Whirlwind Attack. This allows the fighter with reach to have a aoe of damage and suppression with knock-down. Training completed and ready for epic with battle style.

Gear.
Level 1 is all about the guisarme. After a few fights, you might have a few hundred gold buy a few enlarge scrolls, just pass these to the mage in the party and request that they use them at your request. Level 1 mages don't have many spells being useful to earn h, these should cover you until you get the enlarge ring at level 2. When enlarged you may want to switch to shield and flail.

Level 2
The a fore mentioned ring of enlarge and a few scrolls of magic weapon to cover until you get yours..
Next big magic item, a cloak of resistance.
From here the next item accumulation happens fairly naturally magical weapon
Next up is magical weapon. After that it's just sorta scrounging to get by, and the first "upgraded" is resistance, then strength, then protection, then armor, then con.

For your stat items keep strenght and con up, purchase dex second hand from the rogue and wis second hand from the cleric.
Short out what kinda armor you want, choices should be fairly obvious, I have previously, in a different thread, mentioned that the best a.c. is provided by the monk, but I didn't go the way at when checking out the epic armor, I found some armor of the celectial battalion or whatever for my build, and there is similar quality armor a valuable for this one, this is all around the point that this builds dex can't currently get high that +10 dex modifier, which is the max dex of armor of that level. This is also base medium sized, as there are dex modifiers for size.

Robe of eyes will give uncanny dodge like effects, but a weakness to gaze attacks, the will save bump from Kensai helps here with the fort fighter saves. By the time you afford a robe, your saves should be pretty decent.

A ring of evasion, well evasion eventually might get crafted onto the custom wu jen giant size item. But combined with Withstand at 13th level and a maxed put concentration and maybe a few extra skill points from an item, and you should only be failing with a 1.

For permanent stat increase, when building full blown epic characters, I actually always try a get an intelligence tone +4 as early as possible for the skill points. Even before strength, then followed by a +2 in strength,, then +4 con, dex, wis, cha, then +5 strength for this fighter build.

Oh and if your DM allows, research some kind of psipnics deterrence for anti magic fields. Most high level campaigns do contain one,

And a glove of endless javelin or something for a ranged attack


Throughout this guide I sorta made in a flow chartish way so for the parts that are,t relevant to that situation, you can just drop. The stuff about carrying a shield that you drop in the first round, that only for passive, we got surprised fight. The same character who gets a surprise round on 4 orcs at first level. If he attacks and then they charge, by everyone taking 10 with minimum damage, he can deal with them in 1 round, 5 orcs push it to a 1 in 16 chance of not surviving, 1 in 4 of taking damage.

This may sound over powered but that sort of perfect storm would only happen roughly 30% of the time at first level ,death around 6-7%. And this is pure physical damage area, a fighters forte.

Saves
Fortitude 11 base
Reflex Withstand 23 or 5 base,let's go withstand.
Will 10

So, that the re vamp of the golden oldie plain human fighter that I would recommend for any new player who are checking out this old legacy game. I will be posting my personal build later, as part of my Kensai Order I will be releasing, but please feel free to use this build as a reference for yourselves.

I am particularly of the lawful good being represented by the nonlethal vorpal weapon. I used to like playing knights until this player went feral and decided to just trash my character. The lawful good trained killer, he tries to deal with conflict in the party in a non-lethal way, but you just plain could die, and if you keep trying probably will. Once someone has erred 19 times, he is free to kill them.


As a fighter, build a good relationship with the cleric, since they are defensive, healing and at 9th level onwards, artillery with flame strike. With mages and fighters is fairly use and abuse as you are their meat shield, so tell them to take the meta magic feats as their area, so you are as good a meat shield as you should be. Since the attack style focuses on a situation when the enemy gets denied their dex bonus, rogue burst damage get brought out more often. He will use you as a distraction, while you use the rogue as a scout. Even at first level after you tripped them with reach, if the rogue has a long spear, even non proficiency the rogue could step up and add some damage to a fallen for, -5ac from no dex on an orc easily makes up for the -4 non proficiency.

So good luck, no need to tell me how awesome a build this is, as I already know.

the_tick_rules
2020-10-01, 11:19 AM
couple suggestions for other magic items to consider

third eye of conceal-Immunity to mind affecting. Fighters typically don't have the best will saves are frequently the preferred target of charms or dominations.

Freedom of movement ring- Lots of nasty tail or bite attack grappling be gone.

soulfire armor property- SoD spells be darned

Personally I have never been in love with vorpal. It has a 5% chance to activate and then you have to confirm. I love wounding, that can stack up fast. Maybe think about a +5 wounding weapon as a start?

Wildstag
2020-10-01, 11:32 AM
If you wanted to get really goofy while also getting more attacks, you could go Kensai Fighter (using the ACF from Dragon Mag) to get bonuses on attack rolls and damage, and if you wanted to substitute out Sunder. Especially because I'm not entirely certain you can actually target a body part with Sunder; Improved Sunder even specifies "When you strike at an object held or carried by an opponent (such as a weapon or shield)"...

Unless there's a Sunder feat that allows you to just destroy body parts that I'm unaware of...

Silly Name
2020-10-01, 11:38 AM
Especially because I'm not entirely certain you can actually target a body part with Sunder; Improved Sunder even specifies "When you strike at an object held or carried by an opponent (such as a weapon or shield)"...

Unless there's a Sunder feat that allows you to just destroy body parts that I'm unaware of...
In PF there's an optional rule for Called Shots, but it's completely divorced from sundering.

Darg
2020-10-01, 12:05 PM
One level Soulknife gives you a weapon that can't be permanently sundered and the weapon focus feat. 5 levels gives you the option to manifest as a free action and change the shape of your mindblade (dragon material means any weapon is possible).

On top of this you create your mindblade every time you form it, meaning daily enhancements are usable everytime you form your mindblade. Lucky is a really nice choice here.

If you go 9 levels Soulknife, you gain a superior whirlwind attack. Each fragment acts as an individual mindblade meaning they each get their own psychic strike damage, their own daily use abilities, and dropping a fragment doesn't disarm you. The free greater weapon focus ensures you are only 2 ab behind but the lucky enhancement should make up for that. And you get speed of thought for free at level 6. Of course you would have to give up 1 level of exotic wm or kensai to do this. But I think psychic strike makes up for the missing weapon spec. All in all you wouldn't need 5 of your feats or so.

vasilidor
2020-10-01, 07:01 PM
The problem with soulknife is you need to keep taking levels in it for the thing that you want out of it, the weapon, to keep being effective. few classes punish multiclassing more.

Maat Mons
2020-10-01, 10:02 PM
I don't understand why you're taking Exotic Reach. Exotic Weapon Stunts can only be used with weapons for which you have Weapon Focus, which in your case is only Bastard Sword. Exotic Reach can only be used with weapons that have reach, which Bastard Sword doesn't.

I think it's widely acknowledged that the highest damage possible from a melee build is what we like to call Ubercharging. The trick is that the Shock Trooper feat lets you switch the penalty from the power onto AC. So you can Power Attack for full without decreasing your chance of hitting. Then you add on the Leap Attack feat to up your Power Attack returns to 4-to-1, and the Valorous weapon ability to double your damage. This all only works on charges, but you'll be dealing 80 points of damage on each attack from your power attack bonus alone. Then add in your Strength and actual weapon damage, both doubled.

It's also nice to use a bludgeoning weapon so the mage can cast Greater Mighty Wallop on it. That eventually boosts the damage on a Maul or Greatclub up to 6d8, or the damage of a Warmace up to 8d6.

I'm also going to echo the sentiment that I'm pretty sure you can't Sunder body parts.

It's worth noting that the relative value of the various feats and class features that give you equipment varies substantially from one campaign to another. DMs differ greatly in how close they stick to wealth by level guidelines, and in how easily they allow magic items to be purchased.

Darg
2020-10-01, 10:33 PM
If you just want the weapon, 1 level is enough for a Kensai. The only reason I mentioned the 9 levels in Soulknife is the OP built up to Whirlwind Attack and Bladewind as a few perks that make it superior to normal Whirlwind Attack. First is that you only need a full attack rather than the full attack action (pounce anyone?), second is that each of the fragments are their own weapon meaning they get their own instance of each weapon ability and the Psychic strike class feature (used but not expended as they aren't the "regular mind blade" while functioning like it), and third is that combined with direflail mind blade you get a trip weapon you can drop for basically free without disarming you. Another perk is that the Mind Blade isn't a magic weapon even with the enhancements which are simply class features. meaning the enhancements from both classes stack (If you skip adding + to hit and damage you could get up to +14 on your weapon at 10 levels soulknife).

Not to mention the Soulknife has Concentration as a class skill which is extremely important to the Kensai's abilities. (If you get evasion you'll almost never take damage from reflex saves)


the Valorous weapon ability to double your damage

It doubles weapon damage, not total damage. Power attack, strength, etc wouldn't be doubled.

Him
2020-10-02, 01:38 PM
couple suggestions for other magic items to consider



Some good stuff here, yeah FOM is gold for a fighter, balance should help cover until it could be afforded.

And the tick DOES rule, SPOON!

But I still go Vorpal anyway, this build is truely about trying to revamp a 2nd edition type fighter is into a 3rd edition rules. Much like paladin would choose a holy avenger, your fighter would choose a vorpal.


If you wanted to get really goofy while also getting more attacks, you could go Kensai Fighter (using the ACF from Dragon Mag) to get bonuses on attack rolls and damage, and if you wanted to substitute out Sunder. Especially because I'm not entirely certain you can actually target a body part with Sunder; Improved Sunder even specifies "When you strike at an object held or carried by an opponent (such as a weapon or shield)"...

Unless there's a Sunder feat that allows you to just destroy body parts that I'm unaware of...
OK, about sundering, I think the DM was just impressed that me as a human fighter wanted to cripple a dragon.

There are no clear current rule on Sundering natural weapon.


One level Soulknife gives you a weapon that can't be permanently sundered and the weapon focus feat. 5 levels gives you the option to manifest as a free action and change the shape of your mindblade (dragon material means any weapon is possible).

On top of this you create your mindblade every time you form it, meaning daily enhancements are usable everytime you form your mindblade. Lucky is a really nice choice here.

If you go 9 levels Soulknife, you gain a superior whirlwind attack. Each fragment acts as an individual mindblade meaning they each get their own psychic strike damage, their own daily use abilities, and dropping a fragment doesn't disarm you. The free greater weapon focus ensures you are only 2 ab behind but the lucky enhancement should make up for that. And you get speed of thought for free at level 6. Of course you would have to give up 1 level of exotic wm or kensai to do this. But I think psychic strike makes up for the missing weapon spec. All in all you wouldn't need 5 of your feats or so.

I don't allow psionics as Player Classes in the game.

And plus, I wanted to make a tactical fighter build.

Also, wasn't asking for improvements, I put this out there to educate you all. I hard to scour your post to even under stand that you weren't just posting an add for a soulknife build, I only saw my character references in few sentences.

If you read the second half of my post you will notice that I also go more into how a fighter relates to to your party, to adjust to soulknife would effective as having just to re-write the post about Soulknives, which I have no intention in doing.
So no to Soulknife.


I don't understand why you're taking Exotic Reach. Exotic Weapon Stunts can only be used with weapons for which you have Weapon Focus, which in your case is only Bastard Sword. Exotic Reach can only be used with weapons that have reach, which Bastard Sword doesn't.

I think it's widely acknowledged that the highest damage possible from a melee build is what we like to call Ubercharging. The trick is that the Shock Trooper feat lets you switch the penalty from the power onto AC. So you can Power Attack for full without decreasing your chance of hitting. Then you add on the Leap Attack feat to up your Power Attack returns to 4-to-1, and the Valorous weapon ability to double your damage. This all only works on charges, but you'll be dealing 80 points of damage on each attack from your power attack bonus alone. Then add in your Strength and actual weapon damage, both doubled.

It's also nice to use a bludgeoning weapon so the mage can cast Greater Mighty Wallop on it. That eventually boosts the damage on a Maul or Greatclub up to 6d8, or the damage of a Warmace up to 8d6.

I'm also going to echo the sentiment that I'm pretty sure you can't Sunder body parts.

It's worth noting that the relative value of the various feats and class features that give you equipment varies substantially from one campaign to another. DMs differ greatly in how close they stick to wealth by level guidelines, and in how easily they allow magic items to be purchased.

{scrubbed}


If you just want the weapon, 1 level is enough for a Kensai. The only reason I mentioned the 9 levels in Soulknife is the OP built up to Whirlwind Attack and Bladewind as a few perks that make it superior to normal Whirlwind Attack. First is that you only need a full attack rather than the full attack action (pounce anyone?), second is that each of the fragments are their own weapon meaning they get their own instance of each weapon ability and the Psychic strike class feature (used but not expended as they aren't the "regular mind blade" while functioning like it), and third is that combined with direflail mind blade you get a trip weapon you can drop for basically free without disarming you. Another perk is that the Mind Blade isn't a magic weapon even with the enhancements which are simply class features. meaning the enhancements from both classes stack (If you skip adding + to hit and damage you could get up to +14 on your weapon at 10 levels soulknife).

Not to mention the Soulknife has Concentration as a class skill which is extremely important to the Kensai's abilities. (If you get evasion you'll almost never take damage from reflex saves)



It doubles weapon damage, not total damage. Power attack, strength, etc wouldn't be doubled.
{scrubbed}

I used to own Dark-Sun and loved it. All my character just happen to get the wild talent defence of Tower of Iron Will was it?

But it just became too much as it was just a new system of magic, that just added confusing layers to a already rules heavy game.

Now Psionics in my games gave been reduced to producing a few items or tattoos, or maybe a boss in a pre bought game.

Silly Name
2020-10-02, 03:10 PM
{scrub the post, scrub the quote}

If I understand the wording of the ability correctly, the weapon itself needs to have reach, not you.

Maat Mons
2020-10-02, 03:13 PM
(Edit: ninja'd on this paragraph) I don't think having a natural reach and wielding a (non-reach) exotic weapon counts as "wielding an exotic weapon with reach." I think the exotic weapon you're wielding has to, itself, have the reach property.

If the purpose of this thread is to educate, then it is probably wise to account for the differing situations your readers might be in. For example, you mentioned gaining Large size via custom magic items. But for a new player looking to use your build, there's a pretty solid chance that they might be gaming under a DM who doesn't allow custom magic items. So it would be helpful to discuss the alternative options that are available in case that's off the table.

In fact, I'd say one of the prime reasons someone might go looking for Kensai builds is that they've found themselves under a DM who is very restrictive with magic items. Kensai allows acquisition of a magic item without having to find it in loot, find an NPC selling it, or find an NPC magic item crafter who is willing to do custom orders. So when a DM is being stingy with equipment, it's a natural thing for players to start looking at. So I might even say that you should regard limited magic item access as the norm for people who would be interested in this.

You probably also shouldn't bring up sundering body parts without mentioning that it's not an explicitly allowed use of the feat, and will require a favorable houserule from your DM. Again, if this is to educate, it should not be assumed that educatee has the kind of pre-existing knowledge that would allow them to know that that's a thing they'll have to ask about, and not a standard part of the rules.

Those who are truly new to the game, and thus most in need of help building characters, likely won't know what many of the elements of your build are, where to find them, or what they do. Those would all be good things to explain if that's your target audience.

It's rather unusual to post something on these forums and say you're not looking for improvements. The vast majority of what goes on here is looking for ways to improve posted builds. When someone writes a handbook, people will typically chip in with ideas for how the handbook could be improved. I think even showcases of optimized builds and optimized build contests usually get some discussion of possible improvements.

Saintheart
2020-10-02, 06:43 PM
It doubles weapon damage, not total damage. Power attack, strength, etc wouldn't be doubled.

Actually they most likely would. Whilst the Valorous weapon quality does say "When used in a charge, the valorous weapon deals double damage..." and thus one can try to argue that it's only the weapon and not the person who does damage, this rather ignores the other half of that sentence: "...much like a mounted warrior with the Spirited Charge feat."

Spirited Charge is pretty clear: "When mounted and using the charge action, you deal double damage with a melee weapon (or triple damage with a lance)."

That is, even if you could split out Valorous' damage as applying only to the weapon itself (and thus a very boring increase in damage dice and nothing else), Spirited Charge makes it pretty clear that it applies to all the damage you're dealing in your attacks with that weapon.

This is the same amusing issue that haunts Improved Critical, albeit in reverse. That feat says your critical threat range is doubled, but then applies the increase in threat range to the weapon you're wielding.

Lastly, there's the general rule on how one deals damage:



Multiplying Damage
Sometimes you multiply damage by some factor, such as on a critical hit. Roll the damage (with all modifiers) multiple times and total the results. Note: When you multiply damage more than once, each multiplier works off the original, unmultiplied damage.

Him
2020-10-03, 12:22 AM
If I understand the wording of the ability correctly, the weapon itself needs to have reach, not you.


(Edit: ninja'd on this paragraph) I don't think having a natural reach and wielding a (non-reach) exotic weapon counts as "wielding an exotic weapon with reach." I think the exotic weapon you're wielding has to, itself, have the reach property.

If the purpose of this thread is to educate, then it is probably wise to account for the differing situations your readers might be in. For example, you mentioned gaining Large size via custom magic items. But for a new player looking to use your build, there's a pretty solid chance that they might be gaming under a DM who doesn't allow custom magic items. So it would be helpful to discuss the alternative options that are available in case that's off the table.

In fact, I'd say one of the prime reasons someone might go looking for Kensai builds is that they've found themselves under a DM who is very restrictive with magic items. Kensai allows acquisition of a magic item without having to find it in loot, find an NPC selling it, or find an NPC magic item crafter who is willing to do custom orders. So when a DM is being stingy with equipment, it's a natural thing for players to start looking at. So I might even say that you should regard limited magic item access as the norm for people who would be interested in this.

You probably also shouldn't bring up sundering body parts without mentioning that it's not an explicitly allowed use of the feat, and will require a favorable houserule from your DM. Again, if this is to educate, it should not be assumed that educatee has the kind of pre-existing knowledge . . . .

I said no to psionics.

{scrubbed} I have reach, this is my exotic weapon. I wield an exotic weapon with reach. I took the wording to be more a sales pitch for the class, if a fighter has been having issues with casters in the second rank of enemy.

I still remember the excitement from running to the store when it came out.

{scrubbed}

And so far all but 1 post on this thread gave all just ignored the core feature of this build , which controlling the battle field to allow the rest of the wolf pack, or party, to capitalize. {scrubbed}

Him
2020-10-03, 11:31 AM
If I understand the wording of the ability correctly, the weapon itself needs to have reach, not you.


I don't understand why you're taking Exotic Reach. Exotic Weapon Stunts can only be used with weapons for which you have Weapon Focus, which in your case is only Bastard Sword. Exotic Reach can only be used with weapons that have reach, which Bastard Sword doesn't. . . . .

.
.
.


The rules lawyers, hey?

So this argument I didn't have with my DM, but I actually had with a different player, it came down to wording and mechanics. So they are saying that the wording would have to be something like "when wielding an exotic weapon with reach or an exotic weapon, with reach, the Kensai can . . . . . "
Or something.

Convoluted hey....

I said please explain how a medium sized creature using a great spear can have that attack, or a large guy who can plain attack from a better, higher angle with a Bastard sword can't.

You can see their argument is weak.

This is why I say no to psionics for Player Classes I believe these trying to send me down some weird mind trip.

I have been playing since the original books came out. One of the underlying principles the guys producing the material drilled in the books for rules adjudication was 'these are the rules for a game, not a fully comprehensive set of rules that cover every option that you could EVER be stuck in. So take what rules you all agree on, describe the scenario, and let the DM apply his logic"

So yeah, if you take exotic weapons like the kusari-gama, spiked chain, they're argument looks like it gaining ground, with those weapons being flexible or with hooks, attacking around some one would indeed be easier with such weapons. But what about something like a great spear. I could perform this action with a great spear, we all agree. but with a Bastard Sword that we all could imagine as being actually easier to perform with a natural reach they try saying no?

And here I thought I was playing a fun game. My argument, logic, their argument oh, you need to go through this convolution.

Nah, I already figured it out. I am an Exotic Weapon Master, and my weapons just that funky.

And I say no to psionic's for players😀 to me psionic's for players dies with 2nd edition.

Khedrac
2020-10-03, 01:00 PM
I said please explain how a medium sized creature using a great spear can have that attack, or a large guy who can plain attack from a better, higher angle with a Bastard sword can't.
Welcome to 3.5 where reality is not allowed in the room.

The explanation is "that is what the rules say". It may be a perfectly reasonable (and even common, though I doubt it) house-rule, but you cannot assume DMs will permit it.

There are loads of examples of silly rules effects in 3.5 where the RAW has unrealistic consequences, but then characters being able to survive a 50' fall is reasonable fighting trim without magic is pretty unrealistic too (yes, people survive 50' falls IRL, but they rarely walk away afterwards).

ExLibrisMortis
2020-10-03, 02:50 PM
I don't think your build can rightly be considered "generic". You recommend custom magic items for enlarge person and giant size, you rely on a houserule that allows sundering body parts, and I don't think your interpretation of Exotic Reach is standard either. That said, I see what you're going for, and the core of the build is solid, although some of the parts could be improved upon.

First a small note: I assume the "enlarge ring" you're referring to is a custom item of continuous enlarge person? Because that item usually costs 4000 gp (depending on the DM, naturally), and you have it listed at level 2, at which point your WBL is only 900 gp. Under standard assumptions, such an item would be available at level 4 at the earliest.

Your use of giant size is also via a custom continuous item, and that is a lot of money to sink into one item--182 000 gp by the standard formula. Though giant size is, of course, awesome for boosting Strength and reach, I don't think it's ideal in this build, since you only get Huge size (Gargantuan requires an epic item, under standard assumptions). It's probably a better deal to get a custom item of use-activated draconic polymorph (180 000 gp) and take the form of a creature with good stats, like a warden archon (LG, Large, +12 natural armour, 35 Strength with draconic polymorph's boost). That still only comes online at level 15, of course, and then only if you spend 90% of your WBL on it, but you get a lot more versatility.

I'd use Kensai or Exoticist fighter (Dragon #310 variant) for the free EWP, throw in the hit-and-run ACF, and then go into warblade. Warblade has some extra skill points and Concentration and Diplomacy as class skills, so entry into Kensai is much easier. Exoticist hit-and-run fighter 2/warblade 3/kensai 1/EWM 1/kensai +2/warblade +1/kensai +2/warblade +1/kensai +2/warblade +1/kensai +2/warblade +1/kensai +1 (weaving in the warblade levels is both effective and flavourful) seems like a good bet--IL 13 for 7th-level maneuvers, Improved Uncanny Dodge, INT bonus on critical confirmation and damage rolls when flanking/attacking a flat-footed target, and a bonus feat for good measure.

Exotic Weapon Master pairs well with warblade, since you can use Weapon Aptitude to switch out your Weapon Focus feat to any weapon you like. Of course, Kensai tend to stick with the same item, but you can always make it morphing--it's nice to have options. Besides skills and Weapon Aptitude, warblade gives you Diamond Mind maneuvers, which are really nice for a Kensai, since they get additional use out of your Concentration (bastard swords are, in fact, Diamond Mind associated weapons). In particular, Power Surge > Ruby Nightmare Blade (double PA and double STR, all doubled) looks like a good way to start a fight, following up with Avalanche of Blades on the next round, or, if you're more about debuffing, Disrupting Blow or Dazing Strike.

Overall, a solid build, but needs less houserules and more Tome of Battle.

Him
2020-10-03, 03:55 PM
I don't think your build can rightly be considered "generic". .
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{scrubbed} .

Him
2020-10-03, 04:23 PM
Welcome to 3.5 where reality is not allowed in the room.

The explanation is "that is what the rules say". It may be a perfectly reasonable (and even common, though I doubt it) house-rule, but you cannot assume DMs will permit it.

There are . . . .



Wrong again..

And still no question.

DMG 3.5 ver1. Page 6, 2srcpnd column, first bullet point.
"Look at any similar situation covered in a rulebook. Try to extrapolate what you see there and apply it to the current situation"

What we are really having is an argument involving the semantics of the English language. (Why I hate psionic s, such a head ****)

I got to a pie shop and say "can I have a pie with sauce"

Whether I get the sauce on the pie or in a sachet next to the pie, I still get a "pie with sauce"

Thus, my "Exotic Weapon with reach".

Him
2020-10-03, 04:56 PM
I actually posted th8s build here for a particular person.

So, Joe, this is the build I got for you to use, like i said earlier in the post, I'll be posting my own order later.

Questions for/from Joe?

The stuff they're talking about can all be answered by the books, so grab this reference and sit down with the core rule books. Just the process of figuring out the Ring of Giant Size will intro you to custom magic items, which can really open up game play.

Also read that whole section from the DMG that I quoted, not just that single bullet point

Oh, and tell the DM that the build is a 32 point build, I assume 3.5 basics, no Drag mag feats or others and no psionic's, as I posted above.

Peelee
2020-10-03, 05:05 PM
The Mod on the Silver Mountain: Thread permanently closed.