How this ends for Durkon

[Inle-rah]

So, I had a dream about how this whole confrontation ends for Durkon. It was an anxiety dream, so it's not a happy ending.

Durkon and Minrah jump out of the floor and leave the canyon in a hurry, with a breather strip about their dynamic as they try to get away. (I don't know if "Greater Invisibility Sphere" is a spell, and if if is, it's almost certainly not a cleric spell, but it"s involved on the escape.) They run into Xykon, who explains that he has some permanent form of detect magic or something and so noticed them in the stone. (We did recently have a panel of V talking about magical residue.) He then proceeds to give a long villain speech, where the camera is zoomed in on him and we can see Durkon out-of-focus in the background, backing away. (Somehow, Xykon's face and Durkon are both in the shot.) At one point, he walks past Minrah's charred corpse, briefly in shot; Xykon is casting at them while he speaks, and has killed her. Xykon says that Durkon has earned something special, though, and in the last panel, Xykon casts Familicide on him.

Now, I don't *really* expect this to happen; anxiety dreams just be like that. It hit me like a sack of wet mice, though, because the last book explains at length a) how important Durkon's family is to him, and b) how bad it would be for a large number of dwarves to die without reason.

Of course, Durkon's definition of family is not limited to blood relations, which would confuse the emotional impact for the reader, but it still feels like plenty of a gut punch, especially with regard to Durkon's new son. It would also trigger a new round of discussions about how familicide works, which from my long-term lurking of this forum, I can guess would be a fun time.

How Xykon would actually have this spell is an unanswered question, but the IFCC is up to something, clearly, and there was that line about sending someone to collect Haerta way back when; maybe they didn't finish that job, and the IFCC either planned it or didn't think it was that important.

Regardless, while I don't think this would really happen, I'm still left wondering about it. What do y'all think?

TL;DR: I don't want Durkon to have a bad ending, but an anxiety dream said he did, involving Familicide.

[Razade]

I'm willing to bet all the money I have in my bank that not only will none of this happen, your...dream...won't even get within spitting distance of how Durkon's story ends.

[Metastachydium]

I'm reasonably certain that we will never see Familicide again.

[WanderingMist]

So, I had a dream about how this whole confrontation ends for Durkon. It was an anxiety dream, so it's not a happy ending.

Durkon and Minrah jump out of the floor and leave the canyon in a hurry, with a breather strip about their dynamic as they try to get away. (I don't know if "Greater Invisibility Sphere" is a spell, and if if is, it's almost certainly not a cleric spell, but it"s involved on the escape.) They run into Xykon, who explains that he has some permanent form of detect magic or something and so noticed them in the stone. (We did recently have a panel of V talking about magical residue.) He then proceeds to give a long villain speech, where the camera is zoomed in on him and we can see Durkon out-of-focus in the background, backing away. (Somehow, Xykon's face and Durkon are both in the shot.) At one point, he walks past Minrah's charred corpse, briefly in shot; Xykon is casting at them while he speaks, and has killed her. Xykon says that Durkon has earned something special, though, and in the last panel, Xykon casts Familicide on him.

Now, I don't *really* expect this to happen; anxiety dreams just be like that. It hit me like a sack of wet mice, though, because the last book explains at length a) how important Durkon's family is to him, and b) how bad it would be for a large number of dwarves to die without reason.

Of course, Durkon's definition of family is not limited to blood relations, which would confuse the emotional impact for the reader, but it still feels like plenty of a gut punch, especially with regard to Durkon's new son. It would also trigger a new round of discussions about how familicide works, which from my long-term lurking of this forum, I can guess would be a fun time.

How Xykon would actually have this spell is an unanswered question, but the IFCC is up to something, clearly, and there was that line about sending someone to collect Haerta way back when; maybe they didn't finish that job, and the IFCC either planned it or didn't think it was that important.

Regardless, while I don't think this would really happen, I'm still left wondering about it. What do y'all think?

TL;DR: I don't want Durkon to have a bad ending, but an anxiety dream said he did, involving Familicide.
Ah yes, let's negate the ENTIRE last story arc for no reason whatsoever.

[Malloon]

Xykon has no idea about Durkon's family. Xykon didn't witness the first use of familicide, and probably has no idea it even exists. If he did, he might research it for funsies, but I don't see at what point he might have gotten time to do that. But even if he did, he's not going to just waste it on a dwarf he's just met (from his perspective). Xykon likes his ludicrous applications of force, but familicide wouldn't kill Durkon any faster than a lot of other spells - familicide is just more personal.

IF he's researched it, and IF he's really, really annoyed with Durkon and IF he finds out Durkon has a large family he cares about and IF he doesn't realise that most of that family isn't related to him by blood (familicide would kill his mum, Sigdi, Kudzu and Hilgya - devastating, but not the mass slaughter Xykon would hope for), then, possibly. So, no. Rest easy. All that's endangering Durkon's family is a reality-erasing apocalypse, you've got nothing to worry about.

[Kish]

No one is going to have a pointlessly brutal ending. Rich's opinion of that writing style is not (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=15874139&postcount=37) at (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=15874171&postcount=38) all (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=15875370&postcount=86) positive (https://forums.giantitp.com/showsinglepost.php?p=15874733&postcount=61).

[WanderingMist]

Xykon has no idea about Durkon's family. Xykon didn't witness the first use of familicide, and probably has no idea it even exists. If he did, he might research it for funsies, but I don't see at what point he might have gotten time to do that. But even if he did, he's not going to just waste it on a dwarf he's just met (from his perspective). Xykon likes his ludicrous applications of force, but familicide wouldn't kill Durkon any faster than a lot of other spells - familicide is just more personal.

IF he's researched it, and IF he's really, really annoyed with Durkon and IF he finds out Durkon has a large family he cares about and IF he doesn't realise that most of that family isn't related to him by blood (familicide would kill his mum, Sigdi, Kudzu and Hilgya - devastating, but not the mass slaughter Xykon would hope for), then, possibly. So, no. Rest easy. All that's endangering Durkon's family is a reality-erasing apocalypse, you've got nothing to worry about.

If there's anything I can see the horrible bone-man doing with Familicide, it would be learning it and then purposely not using it, just hunting down everyone it would kill himself and rounding them up to kill in front of the person he would've cast it on.

[hungrycrow]

If there's anything I can see the horrible bone-man doing with Familicide, it would be learning it and then purposely not using it, just hunting down everyone it would kill himself and rounding them up to kill in front of the person he would've cast it on.

I could see Xykon casting it on Ochul, Vaarsuvius, or Redcloak(after he becomes aware of Redcloak's betrayal). He's aware that they would be particularly upset at being partially responsible for the death of their kinsmen, and they've made him mad enough to get that personal.

That said I think one genocide is enough for this comic. Doing it again but without the moral lesson seems too dark for Rich.

[factotum]

Xykon has no idea about Durkon's family. Xykon didn't witness the first use of familicide, and probably has no idea it even exists. If he did, he might research it for funsies, but I don't see at what point he might have gotten time to do that. But even if he did, he's not going to just waste it on a dwarf he's just met (from his perspective). Xykon likes his ludicrous applications of force, but familicide wouldn't kill Durkon any faster than a lot of other spells - familicide is just more personal.

In fact, I can see Xykon really not seeing the point of Familicide--what fun is it if you don't actually see the people dying? Not to mention, I doubt he'd be high enough level to cast it anyway--Haerta was supposed to be the most powerful splice V had in him by quite some margin, and the other two were both well into Epic levels, so I dread to think what her actual level was. 30+ at least, I would think.

[Worldsong]

Yeah that would be a pointless gut punch which only gives rise to questions about how and why.

[KorvinStarmast]

So, I had a dream The top hit single Familicide from a few years ago is a case of the song doesn't remain the same (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dRnKvXqti6M). Let's say this: it's not a golden oldie, it's a one hit wonder.

I'm reasonably certain that we will never see Familicide again. I'll back that up with a 100 quataloo bet.
Doing it again but without the moral lesson seems too dark for Rich. Understatement of the week. :smallsmile:

For those unsure about the song reference, Led Zeppeling's The Song Remains the Same: the opening line is I had a dream

[Synesthesy]

While the fact is that Xykon doesn't know how much Durkon values family (and that Durkon's one is not based on blood except for his mother) as we know, the main point against this happening is that it would be totally out of character for Xykon. Xykon has another weapon for people he really hates (and all of them are wizard and not clerics, maybe in future with the notable exception of Reddie) and it's Soul Bind. For all other living and undead being, there is fire, and sometimes lightning too.

[Precure]

Sadly, a part of me really wants it to be happen for real, but with a slight difference:

It's not Familicide, but Greater Familicide. A spell not only works on blood relations but also on emotional links between people who see each other as family.

[KorvinStarmast]

Sadly, a part of me really wants it to be happen for real, but with a slight difference:

It's not Familicide, but Greater Familicide. A spell not only works on blood relations but also on emotional links between people who see each other as family.
The opening lyrics to that song are

Rock fall and everyone dies.

It's as short of a song as Bambi Meets Godzilla is a movie.

[Metastachydium]

It's as short of a song as Bambi Meets Godzilla is a movie.

I'd watch that one, you know.

[Precure]

I'd watch that one, you know.

It's on youtube.

[Metastachydium]

It's on youtube.

Well. Thanks for the tip, I watched it.
It is indeed short.

[KorvinStarmast]

I'd watch that one, you know. I had heard about that in the early 70's. One of my teachers had seen it at a film festival. I got to see it between movies (at a double feature) the first time I ever saw the Rocky Horror Picture Show (in the 70's). Loved it. :smallsmile:

[Metastachydium]

I had heard about that in the early 70's. One of my teachers had seen it at a film festival. I got to see it between movies (at a double feature) the first time I ever saw the Rocky Horror Picture Show (in the 70's). Loved it. :smallsmile:

Heh. I can see why.
(Also: this was actually shown at festivals? That's huge.)

[Riftwolf]

Wow your Oots dream strips are way more coherent than mine.

I was going to comment that Familicide wouldn't kill that many dwarves as it runs on blood relations (and none of Durkon's extended family are directly related to him), but it would kill Kudzu and Hilgya, which is bad enough tbh.

[Metastachydium]

Wow your Oots dream strips are way more coherent than mine.


Care to tell us more about that?

[Riftwolf]

Care to tell us more about that?

I wish I could, but it usually goes that I see there's an update on the comic, and it's usually Xykon doing something utterly unrelated to the comic and tying up loose threads in the MCU or Skyrim instead.

[Darth Paul]

I have to confess, I've never had any kind of dreams about any fiction series as far as I can recall, unless you count some personal dreams about the female cast members in Firefly.

But that wasn't strictly about the show, more about Morena, Jewel, and Gina. And special guest star Christina Hendricks. (Er... not all at the same time. :smallredface:)

[EyethatBinds]

I doubt Xykon has had the time to learn another epic spell in the month or two since it was cast. He had to drop stuff off at his secret hidey hole, teleport to the prophesized location, and since then he's been fighting near epic monsters daily. Epic spell research takes weeks of concentrated effort and besides Superb Dispelling and Cloister, he probably knows one more epic spell, probably a blasting one.

Besides, Xykon is probably only going to kill Belkar, unless the two die to the Snarl at the same time. Or at least the same comic. Any other character deaths (besides villains) are unlikely.

[b_jonas]

If Xykon somehow knows the Familicide epic spell and casts it, it will be on
Redcloak, when he betrays Xykon.

And Xykon will stand there puzzled for a moment because the spell did absolutely nothing.

[Bilbo Baggins]

Oh no, it'll do something very important, it'll kill...
Redcloak's niece!!!
Yep, I went there.

[KorvinStarmast]

Oh no, it'll do something very important, it'll kill...
Redcloak's niece!!!
Yep, I went there. At last, closure.

[Precure]

Now thinking about this, a familicide spell would kill all of Durkon's clan, an important percentage of dwarven race.

[Ionathus]

No it would not, because Durkon's family (except his mom, and Hilgya&Kudzu) are adoptive family. None of them share a bloodline, even with each other.

(EDIT: Obviously the separate families share a bloodline with each other, don't @ me)

[Dion]

Now thinking about this, a familicide spell would kill all of Durkon's clan, an important percentage of dwarven race.

Durkon doesn’t seem to have many relatives. There may be only three Thundershields in the whole world. I’m thinking it kills Sigdi, Kudzu, and... all of Kudzu’s living relatives.

Hilgya’s clan is toast.

But as long as we’re imagining spells that won’t be cast, it probably also kills the jello jockey for some reason.

[Precure]

Even if Durkon has no close blood relatives, he and Sigdi must belong to one of those few clans represented by their elders in the council, no?

[KorvinStarmast]

Even if Durkon has no close blood relatives, he and Sigdi must belong to one of those few clans represented by their elders in the council, no?
No. There is no must.

[Sir_Norbert]

Obligatory link to "How Famicilide Works" (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?234374-Familicide-Mega-Thread/page36&p=12856280#post12856280)

It kills everyone related by blood to the target, in any way; and then everyone related by blood to those killed in step 1. A common ancestor, no matter how far back. It's not limited to "same clan"; clans can be expected to intermarry.

Casting it on Durkon would wipe the entire settlement and make a hefty dent in the rest of the dwarven population; and only the fact that the OotS world is very young would prevent it from wiping the entire dwarven race.

[Peelee]

Obligatory link to "How Famicilide Works" (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?234374-Familicide-Mega-Thread/page36&p=12856280#post12856280)

It kills everyone related by blood to the target, in any way; and then everyone related by blood to those killed in step 1. A common ancestor, no matter how far back.

Yes matter how far back. Step 1 is not inhibited by a dead ancestor, but step 2 is.

[woweedd]

Xykon has no idea about Durkon's family. Xykon didn't witness the first use of familicide, and probably has no idea it even exists. If he did, he might research it for funsies, but I don't see at what point he might have gotten time to do that. But even if he did, he's not going to just waste it on a dwarf he's just met (from his perspective). Xykon likes his ludicrous applications of force, but familicide wouldn't kill Durkon any faster than a lot of other spells - familicide is just more personal.

IF he's researched it, and IF he's really, really annoyed with Durkon and IF he finds out Durkon has a large family he cares about and IF he doesn't realise that most of that family isn't related to him by blood (familicide would kill his mum, Sigdi, Kudzu and Hilgya - devastating, but not the mass slaughter Xykon would hope for), then, possibly. So, no. Rest easy. All that's endangering Durkon's family is a reality-erasing apocalypse, you've got nothing to worry about.
To be fair, I wouldn't put it past Xykon to be an admirer of Hareta's work. Sure, he's not much for history, but you gotta appreciate that level of innovation in sadistic cruelty.

[Riftwolf]

To be fair, I wouldn't put it past Xykon to be an admirer of Hareta's work. Sure, he's not much for history, but you gotta appreciate that level of innovation in sadistic cruelty.

Probably not. She was a loser who didn't have the guts to stay in the game, after all.

[Dr.Zero]

Probably not. She was a loser who didn't have the guts to stay in the game, after all.

Which stroke me always as kinda of silly: if it wasn't for Redcloack who had the idea (and helped him to realize it), X would never thought about becoming a lich.
(And if Lirian was a bit less silly and killed the couple on the spot, he wouldn't have had the chance to).

So he is the same kind of loser, only a bit luckier with his enemies and with his associates.

[Goblin_Priest]

I'm reasonably certain that we will never see Familicide again.

Yea, I'm in club "never again". V's act is much less dramatic if it's something that people can do willy nilly.

[Umberhulk]

I always figured he dies getting smoked by Redcloak

[KorvinStarmast]

I always figured he dies getting smoked by Redcloak Is that anything like the people who will be lined up to smoke or snort Keith Richards' ashes when he dies (https://www.thevintagenews.com/2018/10/19/keith-richards/)? :smallbiggrin:

[Umberhulk]

Do you think dwarves ashes are greasy?

More like he dies heroically, protecting others, at Redcloak’s hands in a cleric battle.

[Riftwolf]

I'm guessing he'll survive if only to bump up the number of good fathers.

[Umberhulk]

Well yeah i get that its kind of mad. I like that giant weaves lots of threads into major plot points. This is me weaving those threads on my own. I was also confidant that Cersei was going to order the destruction of King’s Landing by wildfire and then get murdered by Jaime - a revisiting of the events before the main storyline. But alas I was way off.

[Dion]

But alas I was way off.

That could still happen in the books!

[woweedd]

Probably not. She was a loser who didn't have the guts to stay in the game, after all.
Well, yes, her Familicide did have a tragic flaw in that he wasn't the one using it, but he could rectify that error....