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Yakmala
2020-10-16, 09:03 PM
There are numerous ways to raise your Armor Class to ungodly levels. That's not what this is about.

I'm interested in the best combinations of racial abilities, class abilities, feats and spells to stop damage after a hit. I'm primarily talking about single target hits here. We all know a Rogue or Monk can use Evasion to reduce Dex save based AoE's to zero.

Example: A Goliath Conquest Paladin could have Armor of Agythys running, have the Heavy Armor Mastery Feat as well as the Goliath's Stone's Endurance, allowing them (depending on the damage type) to use Stone's Endurance and Heavy Armor Mastery to keep Armor of Agythys up longer and have three layers of defenses against a big hit. And all without having to multiclass.

I'm interested in hearing about other such combinations that you have used to reduce the damage taken.

RogueJK
2020-10-16, 09:21 PM
Make the Goliath a multiclass Conquest Paladin/Abjuration Wizard, and you can stack on Arcane Ward for further damage mitigation. (Plus, Arcane Ward is triggered/recharged by Armor of Agathys, for extra synergy.)

Frogreaver
2020-10-16, 09:24 PM
Battlemaster parry maneuver.

ThorOdinson
2020-10-16, 09:52 PM
Warding Bond or Potion of Invulnerability can reduce damage by half for all attacks.

1 level dip of Barbarian unlocks Rage which can reduce damage by half.

Blade Ward might be workable.

Stoneskin, Investiture of Earth

Spell of Invulnerability is worthy of mention for Tier 4 play.

ProsecutorGodot
2020-10-16, 10:27 PM
Warding Bond or Potion of Invulnerability can reduce damage by half for all attacks.

1 level dip of Barbarian unlocks Rage which can reduce damage by half.

Blade Ward might be workable.

Stoneskin, Investiture of Earth

Spell of Invulnerability is worthy of mention for Tier 4 play.

The issue with most of these is that multiple instances of resistance are redundant.

Warding Bond on it's own gives resistance to all damage.

Hytheter
2020-10-16, 10:51 PM
I've recently started playing a memey Barbarian/Conquest Paladin build that uses Rage and Armor of Agathys and only uses spell slots in combat for smites. Results are promising so far but I don't know how it will turn out in the long run. Thinking of accelerating my slot progression with full caster levels later but I don't really know what.

MaxWilson
2020-10-16, 11:06 PM
Magic Jar into a werebear's body. Available to a bog-standard Hexvoker or high-level bardlock/sorlock. Along the same lines, can True Polymorph into Demilich or something.

Honorable mention to Uncanny Dodge because it stacks with resistance.

Make a Simulacrum of an Ancestor Barb for extra reduction. Also Cutting Words from a Lore Bard.

ThorOdinson
2020-10-17, 01:45 AM
The issue with most of these is that multiple instances of resistance are redundant.

Warding Bond on it's own gives resistance to all damage.

Sure. I thought it was evident I was listing off different ways of acquiring the same kind of damage reduction. I will be more explicit next time. Thanks for your input.


Magic Jar into a werebear's body. Available to a bog-standard Hexvoker or high-level bardlock/sorlock. Along the same lines, can True Polymorph into Demilich or something.

Honorable mention to Uncanny Dodge because it stacks with resistance.

Make a Simulacrum of an Ancestor Barb for extra reduction. Also Cutting Words from a Lore Bard.

Nilbog is an honorable mention along these lines of thinking.

Crucius
2020-10-17, 04:11 AM
From UA:

Stone Aegis from the Stone Sorcerer reduces damage by a flat amount.

Interception fighting style.

Guardian Grasp from the Lurker in the Deep Warlock.

AHF
2020-10-17, 04:39 AM
Sure. I thought it was evident I was listing off different ways of acquiring the same kind of damage reduction. I will be more explicit next time. Thanks for your input.
.

His point was they don’t stack so adding them gives you nothing more than only having one. Only better than multiple sources of AC (monk and barb unarmored defense along with a breastplate - you have them all but only use one at a time) in that these sources of resistance are generally more limited in duration giving more potential for sequential use.

Things like thp, uncanny dodge, resistance, HAM stack but rage, warding bond, blade ward, ancestral guardian, absorb elements, fire or chill shield, arings of resistance, etc. only apply their resistance one at a time.

ThorOdinson
2020-10-17, 05:05 AM
His point was they don’t stack so adding them gives you nothing more than only having one. Only better than multiple sources of AC (monk and barb unarmored defense along with a breastplate - you have them all but only use one at a time) in that these sources of resistance are generally more limited in duration giving more potential for sequential use.

Things like thp, uncanny dodge, resistance, HAM stack but rage, warding bond, blade ward, ancestral guardian, absorb elements, fire or chill shield, arings of resistance, etc. only apply their resistance one at a time.

Thanks for your input. My input is that not all characters have access to the same options. Warding Bond requires a cleric style dip.

So a listing of the various ways of getting resistance to fit your character conception is kind of helpful, isn't it?

Did I mention my code name is Obi-Wan?

Recommendation: Divination. Tabaxi.

Clearance: €{●{€●€{●€{●€{●{●€

Bobthewizard
2020-10-17, 06:32 AM
At lower levels, the fiendish vigor invocation for at-will false life makes hexblade into a great tank. At level 3, start with 8 temporary hit points, once it goes down, cast Armor of Agathys for 10 more and some damage, then when that runs out, every time you get hit cast false life for 1d4+4 more temporary hit points.

AHF
2020-10-17, 07:18 AM
Thanks for your input. My input is that not all characters have access to the same options. Warding Bond requires a cleric style dip.

So a listing of the various ways of getting resistance to fit your character conception is kind of helpful, isn't it?

Did I mention my code name is Obi-Wan?

Recommendation: Divination. Tabaxi.

Clearance: €{●{€●€{●€{●€{●{●€

You may want to alter the title and original post of the thread to one asking for a comprehensive list of all damage mitigation options. Right now it appears to be looking for ones that layer or combine.

You might also get better responses if you consolidate the sources mentioned by posters in the op and organize them by category which would make it more useful for people and easier to identify gaps in the list.

Ir0ns0ul
2020-10-17, 07:42 AM
I believe one of the most well-rounded damage mitigation builds is the Mark of Warding Dwarf Abjuration Wizard. Just saying that by being a Dwarf, you get resistance to Poison out of the gate - and this is really valuable, since it’s a very common damage type.

Your basic routine is Armor of Agathys + Arcane Ward. By level 5 we are talking about 15 THP (upcasted AoA with 3rd lvl slot) + 13-14 hit points from your Arcane Ward. Main benefit is that you can setup and refresh these protection just casting AoA over and over. Anyone who dares to touch you in melee range will suffer big time.

Since you have your basis covered for melee, you have the amazing Absorb Elements spell for any elemental AoE damage. You even have Protection from Energy (which is not a good spell) in case you fight some sort of Elemental or creature who causes recurrent elemental damage.

And of course as a full Wizard you can do things like Shield, PFE&G, Blur, Mirror Image and Blink to avoid getting hit. You can give some value to unusual spells like Warding Wind to grant you protection against ranged enemies, etc. I know these spells are not actually damage mitigation, but you are increasing your survivability big time.

Frogreaver
2020-10-17, 07:57 AM
Thanks for your input. My input is that not all characters have access to the same options. Warding Bond requires a cleric style dip.

So a listing of the various ways of getting resistance to fit your character conception is kind of helpful, isn't it?

Did I mention my code name is Obi-Wan?

Recommendation: Divination. Tabaxi.

Clearance: €{●{€●€{●€{●€{●{●€

I thought it was very useful and spot on for the thread topic. One can take any 1 of those options and combine it with things like HAM, Parry, etc

stoutstien
2020-10-17, 08:06 AM
One if the easiest forms is stacking abjur wizard + resistance+ THP. While the ward takes full damage first it can greatly reduce the initial amount and unlike a lot of mitigation it doesn't specify that the damage has to be from an attack or save.

x3n0n
2020-10-17, 08:14 AM
As others have mentioned, the biggest category is resistance, but those effects don't layer/stack with each other.

Non-resistance prevention, mostly already mentioned:

No reaction required:
Heavy Armor Master
Arcane Ward

Self-only reaction:
Goliath Stone Endurance
Parry maneuver
Uncanny Dodge
Deflect Missiles/Gloves of Missile Snaring

Reaction:
Lore Bard Cutting Words
Ancestral Spirits Barbarian Spirit Shield
UA Interception fighting style
UA Lurker in the Deep Warlock Guardian Grasp

Not going to look up right now:
UA Stone Sorcerer

MaxWilson
2020-10-17, 10:46 AM
You may want to alter the title and original post of the thread to one asking for a comprehensive list of all damage mitigation options. Right now it appears to be looking for ones that layer or combine.

You might also get better responses if you consolidate the sources mentioned by posters in the op and organize them by category which would make it more useful for people and easier to identify gaps in the list.

You're talking to ThorOdinson, but the OP is Yakmala.



Reaction:
Cutting Words
UA Interception fighting style
UA Lurker in the Deep

Plus Spirit Shield from Ancestor Barb.

TrueAlphaGamer
2020-10-17, 11:48 AM
I believe one of the most well-rounded damage mitigation builds is the Mark of Warding Dwarf Abjuration Wizard. Just saying that by being a Dwarf, you get resistance to Poison out of the gate - and this is really valuable, since it’s a very common damage type.

Your basic routine is Armor of Agathys + Arcane Ward. By level 5 we are talking about 15 THP (upcasted AoA with 3rd lvl slot) + 13-14 hit points from your Arcane Ward. Main benefit is that you can setup and refresh these protection just casting AoA over and over. Anyone who dares to touch you in melee range will suffer big time

. . .

What do you mean by casting AoA over and over? It would still take a spell slot, right? And you'd only be able to refresh a number of HP equal to twice the spell level.

Though, you can easily get a refresh on the Arcane Ward HP through any race by taking two levels in Warlock for the Armor of Shadows Invocation, which allows you to repeat-cast Mage Armor whenever there's downtime. I played this build recently, maxing dex for higher AC, and had alot of fun taking no damage.

RogueJK
2020-10-17, 11:51 AM
I believe one of the most well-rounded damage mitigation builds is the Mark of Warding Dwarf Abjuration Wizard.

Yep, that would seem to be the ideal way to get AoA without delaying your Wizard progression. And AoA is just so good on an Abjurer.

If Dragonmarks aren't an option, another potential alternative to the earlier mentioned Conquest Paladin 3/Abjurer X combo for AoA access is a Hexblade 1/Abjurer X. You'd have to spend a feat on Heavily Armored if you want Heavy Armor, and it would delay/remove your ability to take Heavy Armor Master (which you may or may not want since it is very good at lower levels but loses some steam as you progress), plus you wouldn't be able to Smite.

But in return, you'd have Hexblade's Curse, 2 extra levels of Abjurer for a better Arcane Ward plus being ahead 1 spell level in your spells known, and would have a short rest rechargeable 1st level Pact Magic slot for more frequent use of Shield/Absorb Elements. And it wouldn't lock you into being STR-based since there's no longer the Paladin's STR requirement for multiclassing, so you could go DEX-based instead with Light/Medium Armor or Mage Armor, instead of spending a feat on Heavy Armor.

Frogreaver
2020-10-17, 11:54 AM
If you count healing as providing damage mitigation then a life cleric does a fantastic job.

MaxWilson
2020-10-17, 11:57 AM
What do you mean by casting AoA over and over? It would still take a spell slot, right? And you'd only be able to refresh a number of HP equal to twice the spell level.

Though, you can easily get a refresh on the Arcane Ward HP through any race by taking two levels in Warlock for the Armor of Shadows Invocation, which allows you to repeat-cast Mage Armor whenever there's downtime. I played this build recently, maxing dex for higher AC, and had alot of fun taking no damage.

Yes, it still takes a spell slot. They must mean "devote plenty of spell slots to AoA."

Hellpyre
2020-10-17, 02:28 PM
Yeah, recasting AoA isn't generally how you want to refresh your ward. Ritual casting Alarm (or eventually Forbiddance if you can get it) is pretty good for that at no investment but time, however.

x3n0n
2020-10-17, 03:17 PM
Plus Spirit Shield from Ancestor Barb.

Nice! Added.

Ir0ns0ul
2020-10-17, 03:28 PM
Yes, it still takes a spell slot. They must mean "devote plenty of spell slots to AoA."

It’s precisely that. Sorry for the wording, English is not my first language. What I meant is that AoA grant you THP & refresh your Arcane Ward, so it’s a synergy benefit.


Yeah, recasting AoA isn't generally how you want to refresh your ward. Ritual casting Alarm (or eventually Forbiddance if you can get it) is pretty good for that at no investment but time, however.

Indeed. Cast Alarm as a ritual is perfect to refresh Arcane Ward out of combat. During combat, however, Mark of Warding Dwarf can cast Mage Armor one time for free and then keep the Arcane Ward up through other good Abjuration spells (Shield, Absorb Elements, Counterspell, etc).

x3n0n
2020-10-17, 03:45 PM
Since nobody else has added new things, it sounds like the most layers of damage prevention so far are:

Resistance (many options) plus
Heavy Armor Master (assuming b/p/s) plus
Arcane Ward plus
A self-only reaction (several options) plus
Any allies' reactions (several options)

Or

Immunity. :)

MaxWilson
2020-10-17, 03:46 PM
Since nobody else has added new things, it sounds like the most layers of damage prevention so far are:

Resistance (many options) plus
Heavy Armor Master (assuming b/p/s) plus
Arcane Ward plus
A self-only reaction (several options) plus
Any allies' reactions (several options).

Plus damage immunity.

Hellpyre
2020-10-17, 05:14 PM
I feel like you should add tHP to the list if Arcane Ward has made it on.

x3n0n
2020-10-17, 05:36 PM
I feel like you should add tHP to the list if Arcane Ward has made it on.

I can mention it if you want, but I think part of the point is that AW actually prevents the loss of those temporary HP, which is relevant for things like Armor of Agathys and Spores Druid Symbiotic Form. Damage prevention effects (unlike tHP) also affect things like concentration saves.

They're different enough from a rules perspective that I don't want to mix them unnecessarily.

Hellpyre
2020-10-17, 06:09 PM
Fair enough. I just feel that from a mitigation standpoint they are important to consider, since they scale as well with other mitigation sources as your actual HP.

But really, it's fair to leave them off even with Arcane Ward on there. They are a different beast, just very similar conceptual space.

On a related note, it isn't functional for damage mitigation per se, but how do we feel about attirition mitigation effects like Survivor, heroism or ring of regeneration.

Yakk
2020-10-19, 12:25 AM
The Owlbear is a Bear Totem Barbarian 3/Rogue 5. Resistance+Uncanny Dodge is crazy.

Rune Knight 3 can replace Bear 3 (you lose non-BPS resist, gain heavy armor).

AT rogue 6 gives you 2 caster levels.

Dwarf Dragonmark can give you AoA and no slowdown in heavy armor, regardless of strength.

AT6/RK3/Abjurer 11 or AT6/Bear3/Abjurer 11 are interesting builds for this.

MaxWilson
2020-10-19, 12:38 AM
Dwarf Dragonmark can give you AoA and no slowdown in heavy armor, regardless of strength.

I think you mean "-5 feet of slowdown no matter what armor you're wearing."

MrCharlie
2020-10-19, 03:45 PM
There are numerous ways to raise your Armor Class to ungodly levels. That's not what this is about.

I'm interested in the best combinations of racial abilities, class abilities, feats and spells to stop damage after a hit. I'm primarily talking about single target hits here. We all know a Rogue or Monk can use Evasion to reduce Dex save based AoE's to zero.

Example: A Goliath Conquest Paladin could have Armor of Agythys running, have the Heavy Armor Mastery Feat as well as the Goliath's Stone's Endurance, allowing them (depending on the damage type) to use Stone's Endurance and Heavy Armor Mastery to keep Armor of Agythys up longer and have three layers of defenses against a big hit. And all without having to multiclass.

I'm interested in hearing about other such combinations that you have used to reduce the damage taken.
I think the most basic might be simply playing abjurerer all the way to level 14. You get advantage against spells, resistance to the damage, and arcane ward to absorb damage that does get through. Being tougher to hurt with spells is very hard outside of a flat out antimagic field.

So in general you want some source of resistance, a HP pool to eat damage that can be recharged, if possible some flat mitigation (stones endurance, heavy armor master), and a high chance to make either saves or for the enemy to miss.

Additionally I want to emphasize rechargable sources of temp HP or HP. If you have temporary HP that recharges every round, that's a free 9 HP of damage you cant take. If you cast abjuration spells every turn or even off-turn, restoring 2-6 HP each time, you have even more mitigation. We may consider this healing, but it's the best type of healing-the type that does not need actions and which occurs constantly. Regeneration effects are similar but apply to actual HP.

Now, in addition to these numerical ways to mitigate damage, but there is another aspect; not being in a place to take damage. Either being out of range of certain attacks entirely, or forcing enemies to make worse attacks (for instance, moving closer to a Manticore so that it has to use claws instead of tail spikes, or moving away from a knight so it has to use it's heavy crossbow instead of its sword).

Hence, mobility, avoiding attacks of opportunity, being able to fly, being able to climb, etc. all represent ways to mitigate damage holistically in addition to tradition methods. Thus, to consider the question holistically, you should be able to move quickly and layer traditionally damage mitigation if you want to be super, super tough.

Finally, the last way to mitigate damage-and this is a big one-is to use one of the abilities which just flat out negates lethal hits. There are several ways to do this, but they can potentially disappear an infinite amount of damage; death ward would negate the implosion of a star if it occurred in a single burst of damage. Similar effects exist throughout the game (some clarify that if you would pulped you still die) but these abilities exploit overkill damage, effectively acting as another type of mitigation. I would not choose to live here without staying at positive HP as a build, but there may be a way to exploit this using summons, familiars, magic items, or other sources of healing to effectively restore at least 1 hp after dropping to 0 consistently and thus mitigate damage by virtue of being a beating bag. It's super risky as anything but a desperation play, but it "wastes" enemy damage.

MaxWilson
2020-10-19, 04:21 PM
I think the most basic might be simply playing abjurerer all the way to level 14. You get advantage against spells, resistance to the damage, and arcane ward to absorb damage that does get through. (A) Being tougher to hurt with spells is very hard outside of a flat out antimagic field.

So in general you want some source of resistance, a HP pool to eat damage that can be recharged, if possible some flat mitigation (stones endurance, heavy armor master), and a high chance to make either saves or for the enemy to miss.

Additionally I want to emphasize rechargable sources of temp HP or HP. If you have temporary HP that recharges every round, that's a free 9 HP of damage you cant take. If you cast abjuration spells every turn or even off-turn, restoring 2-6 HP each time, you have even more mitigation. We may consider this healing, but it's the best type of healing-the type that does not need actions and which occurs constantly. Regeneration effects are similar but apply to actual HP.

(B) Now, in addition to these numerical ways to mitigate damage, but there is another aspect; not being in a place to take damage. Either being out of range of certain attacks entirely, or forcing enemies to make worse attacks (for instance, moving closer to a Manticore so that it has to use claws instead of tail spikes, or moving away from a knight so it has to use it's heavy crossbow instead of its sword).

Hence, mobility, avoiding attacks of opportunity, being able to fly, being able to climb, etc. all represent ways to mitigate damage holistically in addition to tradition methods. Thus, to consider the question holistically, you should be able to move quickly and layer traditionally damage mitigation if you want to be super, super tough.

Finally, the last way to mitigate damage-and this is a big one-is to use one of the abilities which just flat out negates lethal hits. There are several ways to do this, but they can potentially disappear an infinite amount of damage; death ward would negate the implosion of a star if it occurred in a single burst of damage. Similar effects exist throughout the game (some clarify that if you would pulped you still die) but these abilities exploit overkill damage, effectively acting as another type of mitigation. I would not choose to live here without staying at positive HP as a build, but there may be a way to exploit this using summons, familiars, magic items, or other sources of healing to effectively restore at least 1 hp after dropping to 0 consistently and thus mitigate damage by virtue of being a beating bag. It's super risky as anything but a desperation play, but it "wastes" enemy damage.

(A) Meh, you still get eaten alive by (for example) the first Beholder that comes along--you have no advantage because eye beams aren't spells, no ability to Counterspell, and your Arcane Ward barely suffices to stop the first Enervation Ray that hits you (Con save for half, which you're not natively proficient in but might have Resilient Con for), leaving you helpless against Death and Disintegration (which require Dex saves that you're definitely not proficient in).

Going all in on anti-spell defenses specifically isn't a great plan in 5E. You'd be better off as a Yuan-ti (or Goblin) Hexvoker or something so you would have advantage on your saves (or be ineligible as a target) and also could kill the beholder quickly.

On the other hand...

(B) I endorse this thinking. These (range, mobility, stealth, cover, active countermeasures) are much, much better kinds of defenses than spell resistance and Arcane Ward.

x3n0n
2020-10-19, 04:53 PM
(A) Meh, you still get eaten alive by (for example) the first Beholder that comes along--you have no advantage because eye beams aren't spells, no ability to Counterspell, and your Arcane Ward barely suffices to stop the first Enervation Ray that hits you (Con save for half, which you're not natively proficient in but might have Resilient Con for), leaving you helpless against Death and Disintegration (which require Dex saves that you're definitely not proficient in).

Going all in on anti-spell defenses specifically isn't a great plan in 5E. You'd be better off as a Yuan-ti (or Goblin) Hexvoker or something so you would have advantage on your saves (or be ineligible as a target) and also could kill the beholder quickly.

On the other hand...

(B) I endorse this thinking. These (range, mobility, stealth, cover, active countermeasures) are much, much better kinds of defenses than spell resistance and Arcane Ward.

I had assumed that part of the goal of this thread was to devise/discover combinations with effects that care about preserving specific temporary HP pools, which in turn often rely on being in melee to be relevant. For example, Armor of Agathys and other "punish you for successfully hitting me" effects, as well as Spore Druid Symbiotic Form.

MaxWilson
2020-10-19, 04:54 PM
I had assumed that part of the goal of this thread was to devise/discover combinations with effects that care about preserving specific temporary HP pools, which in turn often rely on being in melee to be relevant. For example, Armor of Agathys and other "punish you for successfully hitting me" effects, as well as Spore Druid Symbiotic Form.

Hmmm, yeah, maybe I was off topic for this thread. Got my threads crossed...

MrCharlie
2020-10-19, 05:38 PM
(A) Meh, you still get eaten alive by (for example) the first Beholder that comes along--you have no advantage because eye beams aren't spells, no ability to Counterspell, and your Arcane Ward barely suffices to stop the first Enervation Ray that hits you (Con save for half, which you're not natively proficient in but might have Resilient Con for), leaving you helpless against Death and Disintegration (which require Dex saves that you're definitely not proficient in).

Going all in on anti-spell defenses specifically isn't a great plan in 5E. You'd be better off as a Yuan-ti (or Goblin) Hexvoker or something so you would have advantage on your saves (or be ineligible as a target) and also could kill the beholder quickly.

On the other hand...

(B) I endorse this thinking. These (range, mobility, stealth, cover, active countermeasures) are much, much better kinds of defenses than spell resistance and Arcane Ward.
Arcane ward is better than the Tough feat; 2 HP per level + INT mod. Also, it recharges as you cast abjuration spells-not particularly applicable against a beholder per say, but in many combat situations banish is a very strong CC option due to its save type and other abjuration spells may be situationally useful. Hence it might translate to 20-40 HP over the course of a major fight.

While you can absolutely say that it's an enervation ray, an enervation ray is 1/6 of a CR 13 creature (Which, honestly hits a bit outside of its CR).

That said, abjurer is only really a layered defense against spells, while if you want a real layered defense you want applicability to everything.

I guess one example might be a Warlock/Barbarian using armor of agathys and rage to preserve those temp HP. You can actually make a pretty viable warlock build that just uses long-duration non-concentration buffs with its spell slots and thus can absolutely multi-class into a barbarian. This build would need to justify getting targeted by enemy melee attacks given that enemies die trying to damage it, but that's what a truly effective layered defense would look like.

Another example from the same build might be mirror image+hex armor+AC to create three different forms of "AC" against attacks. That kind of thing.

TrueAlphaGamer
2020-10-19, 07:36 PM
Now, in addition to these numerical ways to mitigate damage, but there is another aspect; not being in a place to take damage. Either being out of range of certain attacks entirely, or forcing enemies to make worse attacks (for instance, moving closer to a Manticore so that it has to use claws instead of tail spikes, or moving away from a knight so it has to use it's heavy crossbow instead of its sword).

Hence, mobility, avoiding attacks of opportunity, being able to fly, being able to climb, etc. all represent ways to mitigate damage holistically in addition to tradition methods. Thus, to consider the question holistically, you should be able to move quickly and layer traditionally damage mitigation if you want to be super, super tough.

There arises an issue in being "the guy who can't be targeted" when playing with other people. Namely, they become "guys who are more likely to be targeted". This is fine in certain situations, but generally leads to diminishing returns if you have already spent resources on boosting your survivability through things like damage mitigation (which is what this thread asks for). For most situations, being the guy that takes the damage and has the ability to mitigate it is better than being the guy who hides behind a wall and makes his allies face-tank the hit.

MaxWilson
2020-10-19, 07:39 PM
I guess one example might be a Warlock/Barbarian using armor of agathys and rage to preserve those temp HP. You can actually make a pretty viable warlock build that just uses long-duration non-concentration buffs with its spell slots and thus can absolutely multi-class into a barbarian. This build would need to justify getting targeted by enemy melee attacks given that enemies die trying to damage it, but that's what a truly effective layered defense would look like.

Another example from the same build might be mirror image+hex armor+AC to create three different forms of "AC" against attacks. That kind of thing.

Another example along those same lines: Mark of Warding Dwarf (for Armor of Agathys), then play a Moon Druid, and by the time Tier 3 rolls around you can Shapeshift into a Mage Armored Fire Elemental with Armor of Agathys V and AC 16. Anyone who hits you takes 1d10+25 cold damage, and it takes probably two or three hits for Armor of Agathys to wear off because you have resistance to nonmagical weapon attacks (though of course it depends on what you're fighting). E.g. a CR 17 dragon turtle bites you for 3d12+7 (13 after resistance), claws for 2d8+7 (8 after resistance), and claws again for 2d8+7 (8), which barely takes down your Armor of Agathys and does ~82 HP of damage to the dragon (after fire resistance), and you haven't even acted yet.


There arises an issue in being "the guy who can't be targeted" when playing with other people. Namely, they become "guys who are more likely to be targeted". This is fine in certain situations, but generally leads to diminishing returns if you have already spent resources on boosting your survivability through things like damage mitigation (which is what this thread asks for). For most situations, being the guy that takes the damage and has the ability to mitigate it is better than being the guy who hides behind a wall and makes his allies face-tank the hit.

Unless the enemy can tell that the damage is being mitigated, and gives up on targeting you in favor of the other guys anyway.

It matters quite a lot whether (1) Reckless advantage is perceptible to monsters but Rage resistance is not (which makes the Barbarian a deceptively strong "squishy" target that isn't), or (2) if monsters have an accurate picture of how much damage is actually being done (which makes Barbarians far less attractive targets than Lore Bards, even if the Barbarian is Reckless).

DarknessEternal
2020-10-21, 12:29 AM
Svirfneblin Fighter 1/Abjuration Wizard X

Plate, Shield, and ideally cloak+ring of protection, and staff of power.

Svirfneblin Magic and Shield Master feat.

Proficiency in Str/Con saves, shield bonus to Dex saves, advantage on Int/Wis/Cha saves, and the save number will be quite high.

Abjuration ward can be refilled consistently and constantly with at-will Nondetection.

Shield and Absorb Elements on reaction.