"Missing" skills

[Greywander]

5e has a rather modular system, where just about everything is resolved by making a d20 roll and adding the most relevant ability score modifier and an optional proficiency bonus. This makes it very easy to add new proficiencies to the game, skill proficiencies in this case. What are some skills you'd like to see added to the game? Here's a couple of mine.

Crafting (Intelligence)

"But Greywander," you say, "tool proficiencies already exist." True, but there's actually not nearly as much overlap with this skill as you might think. What I specifically have in mind is a general purpose arts and crafts/handyman/MacGyver skill. Tool proficiencies are about having technical expertise and using that to produce elaborate results, but this skill is more about using creativity to produce simple items with whatever raw materials and scant tools you have available. If you're not making simple items, then maybe you're creating a single-use tool or short-term solution to a problem that will need to be fixed by a professional later. Speaking of, another way to see this skill is as more of a hobbyist DIY skill, as opposed to the professionalism of a tool proficiency. This skill would more or less be the Prestidigitation of crafting, much weaker than dedicated tool proficiencies, but a lot broader in the things it can do.

Business (Intelligence)

"A fool and his money are soon parted." But those with this skill are no fools. This skill encompasses a wide set of skills related to handling money, from appraising the value of items (can also be done with the related tool proficiency), negotiating better deals, accounting and bookkeeping, managing employees, logistics, marketing, and even skills relevant to banking, as well as knowledge of economic systems. This is more of an NPC skill, obvious for a merchant, PCs with the guild artisan background or who come from wealth might pick this up to represent that.

Warfare (Intelligence)

What Business is to peacetime, Warfare is to wartime. Everything from battlefield tactics to grand strategy, this skill helps you manage soldiers, fortify positions, and insure supply lines are kept running. Basically, if you were a competent general or warlord, this would be the skill you need.

Some Bonus Stuff

Let's remember that you don't have to link skills and ability scores. For example, you could make a Charisma (Warfare) check to try to raise your soldiers' morale. In fact, I almost think it would be better to decouple them entirely, just pick the most relevant ability score and skill independently of each other for the task being attempted.

I feel like there should be a skill for having legal knowledge, knowing what the laws are and how to navigate contracts or look for loopholes and such. I'm not sure it makes sense to have a skill just for this, though. Perhaps something like a Bureaucracy skill, also covering politics and government?

Another interesting idea might be to let each player make up one skill for their character (as a free bonus skill). The only issue with this is that the existing skill system covers most things pretty well, so it would be difficult to come up with new skills every time you make a new character.

[Lupine]

Well, I don’t know why you’re did this, but I like it.

[Tanarii]

Whatever you create, remember it should:
1) be useful and applicable to adventurers doing adventure-y things. (looking at you Performance)
2) keep in mind that checks are only for meaningful things, and those that have a chance of failure and success. (Looking at you again performance.)

Also possibly:
3) Be chosen to replace existing skills based on your genre, in the same general ability score and set of classes.

I've seen several sci-fi 5e mods, including Star Wars 5e, that have canned Arcana and Nature and replaced them with Science and/or Technology. For example.

Warfare might be a good replacement for Arcana if you were trying to do a much lower magic campaign, or one in which all magic was Divine/Nature based. (The latter allowing you to keep arcane classes, just refluffed.)

[PhoenixPhyre]

Whatever you create, remember it should:
1) be useful and applicable to adventurers doing adventure-y things. (looking at you Performance)
2) keep in mind that checks are only for meaningful things, and those that have a chance of failure and success. (Looking at you again performance.)

Also possibly:
3) Be chosen to replace existing skills based on your genre, in the same general ability score and set of classes.

I've seen several sci-fi 5e mods, including Star Wars 5e, that have canned Arcana and Nature and replaced them with Science and/or Technology. For example.

Warfare might be a good replacement for Arcana if you were trying to do a much lower magic campaign, or one in which all magic was Divine/Nature based. (The latter allowing you to keep arcane classes, just refluffed.)

Note: arcana covers divine and nature magic too. Arcana is "magic theory, practice, and lore" generally, not specific to arcane magic only.

[Tanarii]

Note: arcana covers divine and nature magic too. Arcana is "magic theory, practice, and lore" generally, not specific to arcane magic only.
Good correction. How about no Religion skill in a game without gods then? :smallamused:

[PhoenixPhyre]

Good correction. How about no Religion skill in a game without gods then? :smallamused:

<Snarky comment preemptively scrubbed>

[Lunali]

Good correction. How about no Religion skill in a game without gods then? :smallamused:

Is it a game without religions?

On a more serious note, I typically also use religion for any knowledge checks related to the outer planes or their denizens. If those also don't exist, then yea, I'd probably take the skill out.

[Jerrykhor]

Playing an Artificer, I just realised that they don't have a "signature" skill. Clerics have Religion, Druids have Nature, Wizards have Arcana and Bards have Performance. There should be a 'Mechanics' skill or something. Taking proficiency in Arcana feels weird.

[Tanarii]

On a more serious note, I typically also use religion for any knowledge checks related to the outer planes or their denizens. If those also don't exist, then yea, I'd probably take the skill out.
That's also explicitly Arcana.

[Aussiehams]

Playing an Artificer, I just realised that they don't have a "signature" skill. Clerics have Religion, Druids have Nature, Wizards have Arcana and Bards have Performance. There should be a 'Mechanics' skill or something. Taking proficiency in Arcana feels weird.

I think tool proficiency is meant to cover all the applications and knowledge associated with that kind of tool. For example carpenter's tools includes knowledge of types of woods and oils etc., as well as having a hammer and nails.

[Jerrykhor]

I think tool proficiency is meant to cover all the applications and knowledge associated with that kind of tool. For example carpenter's tools includes knowledge of types of woods and oils etc., as well as having a hammer and nails.

Maybe. But the precedence is that there is the Performance skill, and there is the Musical Instruments tool. There is more overlap here than some knowledge in Mechanical stuff, versus crafting something with Tinker tools/Smith Tools.

[MoiMagnus]

Crafting -> I agree

Business -> If you change it by Influence, that's a very good PC skill. Where by influence I mean "The ability to efficiently navigate societies, through money, contacts, and legislations, in order to obtain favours and/or resources, or maintain those for extended length of time."

Warfare -> If war is a major part of the campaign, I would advise against. IMO skills tests are much more interesting if you allow instead the PCs to "use their skills in place of their army" (possibly with a bonus depending on the kind of troop), so using Intimidation to show the strength of their army, Stealth to make an ambush with the scouts, Athletics to charge with the cavalry, etc, rather than always using the skill warfare.

Additional Suggestions:

Ballistics (Dexterity)
For when you need to make a skill test for what would be an attack roll during combat. Like using a siege engine.

Anticipation (Wisdom)
If your group doesn't like to play preparation phase, or doesn't like to keep track of the material they have on them and are adepts of "quantum backpack" that contain everything and nothing, you might end up in an awkward situations like "Do we have a rope?" at low level or "Do we have a scroll of planar adaptation?" at higher level, and the players being "Well, that's probably something experienced adventurers like us though about.". A skill that cover "Did you character though about this possibility this morning?" is a smooth way to solve this. [Obviously, this skill only covers material of price insignificant in front of the wealth of the PCs].

Constitution skills:
Either add a new skill Endurance (Constitution), or make use of other skills with the Constitution stats, so "Athletics (Constitution)" for running for a long period of time, "Arcana (Constitution)" for spamming at-will spells uses for long period of time, etc. The constitution ability score is often forgotten in non-combat situations.

[Aussiehams]

Remember, by design everything in 5e is an ability check, that you may be able to add proficiency too. It's up to the DM to decide what ability and relevant source of proficiency a PC can use. My understanding is that it was a design choice to avoid a massive list of overly specific skills.

[KorvinStarmast]

Remember, by design everything in 5e is an ability check, that you may be able to add proficiency too. It's up to the DM to decide what ability and relevant source of proficiency a PC can use. My understanding is that it was a design choice to avoid a massive list of overly specific skills. This. Sometimes, Business is INT based, when analyzing. Sometimes, Business is Wisdom, based on whether we should do business with {some entity}. Sometimes, Business is Charisma, based on selling a used car wagon :smallcool:

For the OP: there is no need to add more named proficiencies (FWIW, I'd almost rather that Acrobatics was deleted). For crafting anything non magical, there are tools. For crafting anything magical, I would suspect that Arcana would be the check.

KISS principle is (or at least was) a design aim/goal for this edition.

My recommendation is: embrace it.

[cutlery]

It would be nice if intelligence was less of a dump stat.

Business or Influence (or, Politics) would make a good Int skill; and reflect a sort of slow-moving getting-people-to-do-things that Persuasion doesn't quite capture.

[Dienekes]

Personally, I’m all for warfare and business. As both of those are broad knowledge skill sets that can be very relevant to the game. Though I would give a tacit agreement to MoiMagnus here a little. Warfare and Business can be great and useful skills but they shouldn’t be the universal skill for their frame of influence.

Like Arcana doesn’t let you cast spells. It gives hints, it provides extra understanding, allowing you to remember important enemy units, potentially recognize the tactics the enemy is using, maybe give you an idea of where strategic resource points would be when looking at a map, that sort of thing. What it should not be, is the sole skill used to set up ambushes, how good your soldiers are, or being the sole determining role for a battle.

Business would be much the same. I’m just less knowledgeable on business stuff to get in detail here. I’d just say haggling should probably still be Persuasion.

Honestly, your description of a Crafting skill sounds more like a class ability (I’m leaning toward Rogue or Ranger) than anything else. Creating makeshift nonsense for single use MacGyvering actually was a set of pretty awesome abilities in the quite awesome Star Wars Saga Edition. Maybe look to that for some inspiration?

[Willie the Duck]

It would be nice if intelligence was less of a dump stat.

While this is true, I don't feel that adding skills 'an intelligent ______' (politician, entrepreneur, etc. ) character needs to take is a way to do it. In my group, we tend to use the History skill as a catchall for knowledge about terrestrial social concerns ('Social Studies,' as US primary education tends to split things out). A pretty nebulous connection, but it works. If, instead, there were a Politics or Business skill, that would instead be the catchall. That would change whether the generic smart non-wizard/cleric/druid character would both know how to hobnob at a Rotary Club meeting and when the War of the Roses was fought, but it probably wouldn't change how often the party fighter dumped Int.

[Elbeyon]

Characters already get too few skills. I would hope as more skills are added more characters get extra skills.

[Amnestic]

It irks me that there's no skill for contemporary knowledge of the world/countries.

History is described as "lore about historical events, legendary people, ancient kingdoms, past disputes, recent wars, and lost civilizations." which doesn't fit for things like modern disputes, local guild shenanigans, or the like. Doesn't feel right at all. Either History should be expanded to include contemporary cultural knowledge (which honestly is probably a common houserule) or another skill needs to be added for it.

[Willie the Duck]

It irks me that there's no skill for contemporary knowledge of the world/countries.

History is described as "lore about historical events, legendary people, ancient kingdoms, past disputes, recent wars, and lost civilizations." which doesn't fit for things like modern disputes, local guild shenanigans, or the like. Doesn't feel right at all. Either History should be expanded to include contemporary cultural knowledge (which honestly is probably a common houserule) or another skill needs to be added for it.

That's certainly how my groups use it. It's civics, geography, heraldry, basic courtly etiquette, probably a fundamental bit of functional legal knowledge ("don't go to ____land with a _____").

[Thunderous Mojo]

Personally, I’m all for warfare and business. As both of those are broad knowledge skill sets ?

I disagree both disciplines are very specific and reliant on their tools.
The stock markets of today a very different from the Market of the 1970's.
An MBA from Wharton, won't make you a successful Roman salt merchant.

Swap an Ancient Greek General Officer of Hoplite soldiers with an US Air Force General, and neither person is drawing upon a "Military skill" to achieve victory.

Both Business and Warfare are trades that depend, heavily, on the tools of their time.

[MoiMagnus]

It would be nice if intelligence was less of a dump stat.

I don't think adding more skills is going to make Intelligence less of a dump stat.

It can help, but in the end, you need to adds a gameplay component that relies on intelligence.

Strength get carry capacity & requirements for heavy armour.
Dexterity gets initiative, and is a requirement for any stealthy build (which the case of a LOT of stereotypical characters)
Constitution gets HP and concentration checks.
Wisdom gets passive perception, on top of protecting against the most annoying spells.
Charisma is at the centre of non-combat interactions with NPCs.

The nearest Intelligence has from a gameplay component unique to it are the illusions. Unfortunately, Intelligence doesn't grant a passive anti-illusion protection, and most illusions have a way to dispel them that doesn't require an Intelligence check.
If physical interaction did not reveal illusions (because they are magical illusions, not just optic illusions), and that the fact objects can pass through just made you confused and "WTF" unless you succeed at an Int check against the spell DC, Int would be much more necessary for surviving in the D&D universe. [And illusion magic would be OP, but that's another issue.]

While you are right that adding a full gameplay component of fortune management that has significant impact on the character's power and relies primarily on Int would make Int much more attractive, adding a skill to represent it is not absolutely necessary. Skills helps specialists that consider making Int one of their main stats, but don't really matter when peoples are trying to decide "which stat to dump".

[cutlery]

It's true that these skills alone wouldn't be nearly enough to make int not a dump stat; rather I said that as a reason why I'd be more inclined towards them than usual.

In the space of a few editions we've moved from charisma being a dump stat and intelligence being of importance for various classes (skills as well as spells) to a position where neither intelligence nor strength are terribly important relative to the other ability scores. Strength is more useful than intelligence, but not much more beyond level 5 or so when the almighty crowbar has been surpassed by the ability to bend the rules of physics.

Meanwhile Charisma can, with some characters, contribute markedly to all three pillars of the game. That's hard to do with either Strength or Intelligence.

The new skills alone won't fix that, but I don't see them hurting, either.

[Dienekes]

I disagree both disciplines are very specific and reliant on their tools.
The stock markets of today a very different from the Market of the 1970's.
An MBA from Wharton, won't make you a successful Roman salt merchant.

Swap an Ancient Greek General Officer of Hoplite soldiers with an US Air Force General, and neither person is drawing upon a "Military skill" to achieve victory.

Both Business and Warfare are trades that depend, heavily, on the tools of their time.

True, to a point. There are a lot of similarities in basic goals and understandings. The importance of terrain, fielding movement, funding, and the importance of intel. There’s a reason why Sun Tzu is still read in military academies today despite being close to 2000 years out of date. As it focuses more on the universal aspects of war rather than something like Caesar’s works which focus far more on the nifty details of influencing and utilizing late Roman Republic era Legions.

But all that said, we are discussing tools used in character for the game we’re playing in. Should my PCs ever step out of a portal into the modern world then I would worry about how Warfare and Business (and Religion and History and Languages and ...) are now affected.

[cutlery]

True, to a point. There are a lot of similarities in basic goals and understandings. The importance of terrain, fielding movement, funding, and the importance of intel. There’s a reason why Sun Tzu is still read in military academies today despite being close to 2000 years out of date. As it focuses more on the universal aspects of war rather than something like Caesar’s works which focus far more on the nifty details of influencing and utilizing late Roman Republic era Legions.

But all that said, we are discussing tools used in character for the game we’re playing in. Should my PCs ever step out of a portal into the modern world then I would worry about how Warfare and Business (and Religion and History and Languages and ...) are now affected.

I suppose you’d want to include Machiavelli, too.

Come to think of it, that sort of text describes a kind of influence and planning not well captured in 5e at all.

[Vogie]

Remember, RAW explicitly calls out that you can mix and match the skills and their corresponding ability scores (PHB 175).

Crafting could easily be Dexterity (Performance) or Intelligence (Sleight of Hand), depending on the thing you're making, while business could be an Intelligence (Performance) check. Tactics could be considered Intelligence (Insight) or even Wisdom (Performance). An Intelligence (Medicine) check would be more clinical and business-like than the traditional, more face-value Wisdom (Medicine) checks.

[PhoenixPhyre]

Remember, RAW explicitly calls out that you can mix and match the skills and their corresponding ability scores (PHB 175).

Crafting could easily be Dexterity (Performance) or Intelligence (Sleight of Hand), depending on the thing you're making, while business could be an Intelligence (Performance) check. Tactics could be considered Intelligence (Insight) or even Wisdom (Performance). An Intelligence (Medicine) check would be more clinical and business-like than the traditional, more face-value Wisdom (Medicine) checks.

Yeah. Blacksmithing crafting and fine detail wood carving likely require different ability scores. And Xanathar's actually uses Tinker's Tools as the "improvise an object" proficiency.

[cutlery]

Remember, RAW explicitly calls out that you can mix and match the skills and their corresponding ability scores (PHB 175).


It's a variant rule, though, and (like all things) subject to DM approval. If I'm the DM, cool. If I'm not, the non-variant rules for skills likely take precedence in most cases.

How often do we think a player request for Intimidation (Strength) is granted?

[patchyman]

I’m a big proponent for adding new skills that are likely to see use in the campaign (or conversely, removing skills that are unlikely to be useful). That being said, the new skills tend to be campaign specific, so I am not sure how useful it would be to create a list of them.

For a seafaring campaign, I would include a Seafaring skill that would include knowledge of ships and ports, sailing or operating ships, navigation, etc.

In a more horror-oriented campaign, I would probably include an Occult skill that would apply to hidden and forbidden knowledge.

Finally, for an adventure that principally takes place in the Underdark, I might include some sort of Underdark lore skill.

Note that the above cases don’t preclude characters from using a different skill to do something, just that if it is the focus of the campaign, it makes sense for someone to play (for instance) a sailor without having to invest in 3 different skills.

[DwarfFighter]

Are you going to make those skills free?

-DF

[Thunderous Mojo]

For a seafaring campaign, I would include a Seafaring skill that would include knowledge of ships and ports, sailing or operating ships, navigation, etc.
.

Tool Prof Water Vessels does this already. Seems, to me to be a redundant ruleset.

[Lunali]

Tool Prof Water Vessels does this already. Seems, to me to be a redundant ruleset.

Along with tool proficiency navigator's tools, which is rightfully an entirely different skillset from actually sailing a ship.

[EroxESP]

Unlike 3.5e, I have always seen the 5e ruleset as boilerplate. While I'm DMing, my PCs always start out with very simple character sheets but typically accumulate floating bonuses. A more eccentric example from a recent game would be "+2x Proficiency for Intelligence checks relating to Accounting"

A lot of these fall into the category of unofficial (or "Missing") skills.

Some are just weird and hard to explain out-of-context, however. I'm still not 100% sure how my parties Rogue got "A bonus equal to your height in feet to any check related to finding edible fruits while your bare feet are on the ground."

[Spriteless]

In my Ravnica game, I replaced water vehicles with air vehicles.

A lot of missing skills make sense as background features. I mean, if there's a story reason for competitive bureaucracy, then it makes sense to roll. (I wouldn't be surprised if AcInc has a system in place...) If not, a background like the courtier from SCAG makes sense.

Actually, maybe the other skills but keyed to intelligence would make sense for competitive bureaucracy. Int (deception) for fraud, int (diplomacy) for requisitions, and int (survival) for the logistics to feed cities or armies. Mention a house rule like that and see who pumps up their int...