Building a Tank

[BRC]

So, my group has decided to build a tank by modifing a halfling war wagon. Heres what we have going for us.
1: this setting has gunpowder, my character already has a cannon that he's good with using, it fires rockets. My DM has already okayed the idea of me modifying a rocket to give this thing some extra push for ramming.
2: We have both Craft: Metalsmithing and Craft: Wood to help us modify it.
3: We have a few thousand gold were willing to throw towrds this, so nothing too expensive, righ now we were thinking about somthing like this, buying some wheels of speed, buying a summoners bridle to conjure us a horse to pull this thing around.

Due to a cinematic Hint our DM gave us, it looks like the next part of the campaign will be against somebody who has an army of skeletons, so proably other undead.
So what should we do with this.

[Amiria]

Hmm, maybe not really contributing, but I remember that I once played in game where there was an evil gnome engineer in the party. He constructed something what you could use as a backup weapon for your tank:

A kind of rubberband catapult gun which fires rapidly rotating circular saw blades. :smalleek:

[BRC]

Well my character is a cleric, so I was considering building a big holy symbol into the front of the wagon, so I could use the wagon to turn undead.

[daggaz]

Undead? Make sure it can fire explosive rounds of alchemists' fire, and have little holes thru which you can forcefully squirt holy water, for when the skellies get too close.

Yeah, having it decorated with holy symbols is good as well, tho you will still need a Cleric to power those turn attempts.

If you wanna be really safe, stud the tires with silver, for extra trampling damage against some of the more dangerous forms of undead.

One thing tho, be prepared somehow for incorpreal attacks inside the tank. You will almost certaintly want to have it made hallowed ground, at the least.

[BRC]

Undead? Make sure it can fire explosive rounds of alchemists' fire, and have little holes thru which you can forcefully squirt holy water, for when the skellies get too close.

Yeah, having it decorated with holy symbols is good as well, tho you will still need a Cleric to power those turn attempts.

If you wanna be really safe, stud the tires with silver, for extra trampling damage against some of the more dangerous forms of undead.

One thing tho, be prepared somehow for incorpreal attacks inside the tank. You will almost certaintly want to have it made hallowed ground, at the least.

Well I'm a cleric, I'm also the guy running the cannon....Hmm....Silver Fragmentation Rockets, or a silver tipped wild rocket, I must consider those options.

Our Characters don't know were fighting undead yet, but we proably will soon, I figure the holy symbol would just be somthing my character would do anyway. I was considering getting it hallowed, but I think that only works on a permenant location, and this thing will be moving around abit.
As for the holy water, this is kind of off-topic, but one of our party members is a half-dragon with a water breath weapon, could I somehow bless that water? Because holy-water breath weapons are awsome.
As for incorreal attacks, our DM might throw somthing like that at us, heres who will proably be in the tank reguraly, since it's not big enough to fit our party which is preety big and includes two half-dragons.
Me (Dwarf Cleric/Arcane Gunman, AKA Heavy Weapons Dwarf).
Wizard (Dwarf, my characters brother)
Chen (An animated puppet who has abunch of skill ranks(as in 1 rank in many many skills) but can't fight, were going to spend some money to get him trained to drive this thing.
We will proably also have anybody who is low on hitpoints in there if we can fit them, the ranger might stick around in there to shoot with his bow from a safe distance, but the rest of us are preety much melee fighters.

[Lord Tataraus]

One thing tho, be prepared somehow for incorpreal attacks inside the tank. You will almost certaintly want to have it made hallowed ground, at the least.

That is actually extremely easy. There is a gel in Complete Scoundrel that prevents incorporeal creatures to pass through any surface covered in it and it lasts for like 24 hours or so.

[Fax Celestis]

That is actually extremely easy. There is a gel in Complete Scoundrel that prevents incorporeal creatures to pass through any surface covered in it and it lasts for like 24 hours or so.

Dungeonscape. Ghostwall shellac.

[BRC]

If we had a massive amount of money\EXP to spare, we could get somebody to cast Permanancied animate object on the cart, which would be awsome.

[Alex12]

Dungeonscape. Ghostwall shellac.

My thoughts exactly. Sandwich the stuff between 2 layers of metal (or whatever you're using as armor) and it shouldn't be able to evaporate. Then coat the outside with holy water, and for special anti-undead rounds, swap out your cannon-shell's normal explosive powder load with holy water. Holy symbols on the outside = good idea, as are assorted spikes and pointy things to help you squish undead. Now you just have to watch out for poison gas-type stuff.

[BRC]

I'm investigating the option of animating this thing for extra awsomeness, but I can't find anything saying what size catagory it would be, which would affect the price of getting this spell cast.
Edit: It looks like the cost of getting this thing permanently animated would be 15560 gp, which considering the amount of gold our DM gives us on a regular basis, is surprisingly affordable if I get others to chip in. That would mean we would have ourselves a self-propelling tank (60 ft movement round since it's got wheels) which can attack and that we can deck out with armor and weapons. Oh yeah thats awsomel, Awsome to the EXTREME.

[Gwyn chan 'r Gwyll]

Stick a platform on top, so you could stick your bowman on there.

[13_CBS]

Notice that historical and modern tanks often have heavy machine guns either on top of the turret or near the barrel, often for anti-infantry purposes. You might wanna try replicating that to take out large numbers of smaller, weaker enemies.

[BRC]

Well right now, in terms of weaponery we have
My Cannon (he he, BOOM!)
The Wizard
Anybody else who happens to be inside said tank.
If I get my group to pitch in, the tank itself can attack since it will be animated, and we can trick it out with lots of nifty weapons.
Holy Symbols all over it that I can blast turn undeads from.

[MCerberus]

Just for giggles put a fixed crossbow position on top that has a repeating heavy crossbow of undead bane.

Also holy water rounds and circle of spells!

Edit - better yet make it a holy water mortar. Ooh and smoke sticks to make it harder for them to pinpoint you (like smoke launchers on modern tanks)

[BRC]

Just for giggles put a fixed crossbow position on top that has a repeating heavy crossbow of undead bane.

Also holy water rounds and circle of spells!

Actually, My DM ruled that for guns, returning=infinite ammo, and one of the things I'm saving up for is rapid-fire, essentially a machine gun, I already have returning. If I get enough gold for rapid-fire, Death from above and all that good nonsense.

[Dervag]

So, my group has decided to build a tank by modifing a halfling war wagon. Heres what we have going for us.
1: this setting has gunpowder, my character already has a cannon that he's good with using, it fires rockets. My DM has already okayed the idea of me modifying a rocket to give this thing some extra push for ramming.Is it a bazooka with an open back, or a solid cannon? Where does the rocket exhaust go?

...just wondering.


Due to a cinematic Hint our DM gave us, it looks like the next part of the campaign will be against somebody who has an army of skeletons, so proably other undead.
So what should we do with this.Use it as a traveling fort; set up a way to access it via the roof that skeletons will have a hard time getting to. That way, you have a ready-made escape vehicle if things start getting hairy.


Undead? Make sure it can fire explosive rounds of alchemists' fire, and have little holes thru which you can forcefully squirt holy water, for when the skellies get too close.Now that is a good idea.

[MCerberus]

Using rocketry, you can also have some close-range fun. You stick some lower powered rockets on big metal blades. The rockets jet the blades out cutting down anything in their path. you can the retract them and fit more rockets!


Be sure to have it in a ventilated part of the tank though.

Also slow burning gunpowder can be used to make a flame thrower with a 30' effective range.

[BRC]

Is it a bazooka with an open back, or a solid cannon? Where does the rocket exhaust go?

...just wondering.

Use it as a traveling fort; set up a way to access it via the roof that skeletons will have a hard time getting to. That way, you have a ready-made escape vehicle if things start getting hairy.

Now that is a good idea.

As far as I can tell its a solid cannon, its on a wheeled mount, currently said mount has sheilds attatched to either side for me to take cover behind. We havn't really asked where the rocket exaust goes because it hasn't come up yet. I had a few design ideas I might draw up in inkscape.

[Lord Tataraus]

Dungeonscape. Ghostwall shellac.

AARRGGHH!! I always get those two mixed up when it comes to awesome items. Anyway, Stormwrack has stats for some interesting weaponry for ships such as a firespout. You might want to look into that for your tank.

[MCerberus]

Continuing along the crazy train that my mind is, let's discuss cannon rounds.

Standard Rounds:
Iron Shot - Bludgeoning Damage
Mithril Shot - Longer range but less damage at long range due to less inertia
Adamantium Shot - When it HAS to be squished
Canister Shot - Little more than scraps jammed into a cylinder, this short range round deals slashing and piercing damage in a cone shape burst
Ironwood Shot - as hard as iron, this shot ignites when it is fired due to the gunpowder of the cannon. Deals fire damage as well as bludgeoning

Alchemy Rounds:
Acid Flask Shot - Reinforced acid flasks tied together and shot at a target. The small amount of bludgeoning/slashing damage this does to the initial target is the least of their worries
Alchemist Fire/Frost Shot - Like the acid shot, but with different elemental damage
Tanglefoot Shot - What can't move can't run away from your doom machine
Sunrod Tracer - While not deadly, this Sunrod placed cradled around a suitable container breaks when it hits the ground, illuminating all around it

Magic Rounds:
Holy Shot - As the acid shot but with holy water
Fireball Special - This round comes with a special cap meant to hold a Delayed Blast Fireball. The survivors of this deadly munition will have a nasty surprise a little bit later. Just be careful loading them.

Wondrous Rounds:
These 1 use rounds created with item creation feats store a spell that is discharged when the round hits. If this is a cone, line of effect, etc, this round discharges the spell in the direction it was fired when it contacts a target.

Examples of good spells to use:
Pretty much any evocation damage spell
Summoning spells
Antimagic Circle
Sleep type spells

[PsyBlade]

If you get the tank animated, see about getting it to take levels in cleric. Extra turn attempts. Or the class that if a warforged takes it, it can repair itself.

[13_CBS]

If you save up enough money you could possibly invent some kind of Wand Turret, or a device that holds mutiple wands all pointing outwards and activated all at once.

Fireball battery, anyone?

[BRC]

I think my DM homebrewed the way the cannons in this setting work, its an oriental setting so the cannons fire rockets which are essentially modified fireworks, I usually use small or medium rockets, though they go up to Imperial for over 1k g per which deals many many D6. There are some other rockets I can buy.
Wild Rockets don't explode, but instead just plow on through, screaming rockets deal sonic damage, I could add alchemists fire to a rocket so it would spread some alchemists fire around, there were a few other types too. But I need to pay for each one and they all are AoE with the exception of wild rockets, which keep going after they hit somebody. I Could proably throw in some tanglefoot rockets or somthing similar.
I'm going to try to stay away from magic stuff, if were doing the whole animate thing, the scroll for that (which the party wizard can use, said wizard has enough caster levels to animate up to a huge object, which should be big enough for what were talking about here), that scroll runs 2400gp, and the permanancy would run 15700 to get it cast. So thats 18100 GP right there, not counting the cost of materials for modifying it, which if we stick to nonmagical materials we should be able to keep under 1000 gp, proably more if we put spikes on it, especially if we make those spikes adamite. Thats what were looking at in terms of costs without throwing on things like catapuls and wand-batteries.

[de-trick]

just a thought if your shooting fire from every which way get it fire proof

[BRC]

Heres a picture of my current favorite plan, I call it the school bus of DOOM
http://i172.photobucket.com/albums/w27/bloddyredcommie/TankDesign-1.png
The thing on top is a turret, I should make a side view so you can see it better, but I imagine the front mounting a buldozer type shovel with adamite spikes on it. Maybe some silver and cold iron spikes mixed in with the adamite so were ready for anything. The side of the school bus of doom has windows which can be quickly sealed, but which people inside can fire arrows out of. Entry would be from the rear from a door that we could hopefully get an arcane lock or somthing on.

[Mr. Moogle]

What about a decanter of infinite water powered turbo-boost/weapon?

[Drascin]

What about a decanter of infinite water powered turbo-boost/weapon?

Given the sheer weight this thing is going to have (he mentioned adamantine lining and spikes, and that thing is heavy like all hells), I'd say you'd need at least half a dozen decanters set to "Geyser" to achieve any kind of noticeable speed boost, and that might end up a tad expensive.

If you have money for it though, have a Wizard set them all to the same command word (preferably "activate ludicrous speed!" for extra effect) and go for it. Besides, it'd also help shake up pursuers :smallamused: .

[BRC]

Given the sheer weight this thing is going to have (he mentioned adamantine lining and spikes, and that thing is heavy like all hells), I'd say you'd need at least half a dozen decanters set to "Geyser" to achieve any kind of noticeable speed boost, and that might end up a tad expensive.

If you have money for it though, have a Wizard set them all to the same command word (preferably "activate ludicrous speed!" for extra effect) and go for it. Besides, it'd also help shake up pursuers :smallamused: .
In terms of pursuers, provided they can catch up to us, since the Entry for an animated object dosn't mention anything about weight, just gives it a flat 60 ft movement speed, we'll be going 120ft per round, and the dozer scoop in the front should handle any small obstacles (Like bushes, rocks, towns, ect) and if anything can catch us then, the turret can rotate 360, and I'm going to set up some caltrop droppers.

[BRC]

Some other things:
I figured we could have entrances on the roof and on the back, which since a scroll can have on average 2 spells, means that for 175g our wizard can throw an arcane lock on both entrances. Also, I was going to see if I could include two small catapults, one on either side of the turret, that could be fired by the tank itself. we could only use them once an encounter unless somebody stood on the roof to reload them, but we could stick a bottle of holy water in there , or some caltrops or somthing.

[Prometheus]

Splice with the Apparatus of Kwaz... (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#apparatusoftheCrab) to make it submersible and with pinchers.
If it is under 1600 lbs (unlikely) use a 10by 10 Carpet of Flying (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#carpetofFlying).

The Strength of a tank is near unlimited storage and therefore flexibility
Add Quaal's Feather Tokens (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#featherToken) especially as munitions - plenty of Trees (defense) and Whips (offense), Anchors if you go seaside, and Fans if you might need them
Don't forget Dust of Dryness (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#dustofDryness) and Dust of Appearance (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#dustofAppearance) if you think you might need them.

Also don't forget to have the wizard learn Resilient Sphere (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/resilientSphere.htm), it can be useful in a pinch (to be used on a foe,to protect the tank from imminent attack, or stall for time).
Edit: Darkness (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/darkness.htm) is also much more effective when munition is shot rather than thrown (and cam be added on to the ammunition that you already have as long as you a) cover it up while it is in the tank and b) make sure the munition doesn't end up lodged in someone's stomach ineffectually).

You see, I am a DM dealing with a creative band of PCs with a mobile alchemist's lab//storage/brewery/coffin/tank

[Forrestfire]

you should make the bulldozer ram angled, so that it pushes stuff to the sides as you move. (like Ash's car/tank's ram in army of darkness)

[thorgrim29]

Oh man, the hillarity...... Just a tought, could you make it a construct? Because I'm going to play a level 8 artificer soon and a tank would be pretty awesome.

[BRC]

Oh man, the hillarity...... Just a tought, could you make it a construct? Because I'm going to play a level 8 artificer soon and a tank would be pretty awesome.
Right Now, it looks like it will be an animated Object, but you could do this as a construct if your DM lets you.

[BRC]

Alright, I did some art of the Topview of what is now called the Hippie Van of Doom. Knowing my group we'll go with tradition and name it after the first thing we kill after finishing it.
http://i172.photobucket.com/albums/w27/bloddyredcommie/TankDesigntop.png
As you can see, its got two hatches on the top that are both sealed with Arcane Locks, as will be the door in the rear. It has 3 windows on each side,as well as two on the front and two on the back, all of which can be easily sealed and will be simple to design in such a way that they cannot be opened from the outside, this will allow the occcupants of the tank to fire out of it. The top mounts the ever-important turret which will contain my character and his cannon. The Dozer Shovel is set up like a snowplow, to shunt anything it runs into to one side, leaving an easily traceable trail, of rocks, bushes, re-deaded undead, villages and commoners. But we don't care about that, you can track us all you want, We have a friggin TANK! I'll do the inside shot in a bit.

[de-trick]

only thing would suck if your dm makes the tank unusable
eg a dungeon

[Xuincherguixe]

Make sure you get some nice reach weapons too, like spears for if anything approaches the tank.

Most of the interesting stuff you could pull would probably require some kind of engineering skill.

Hopefully you'll be able to make some holy rockets.

[BRC]

only thing would suck if your dm makes the tank unusable
eg a dungeon
Our DM isn't big on dungeon crawls, He's more likely to throw us up against an army of armored skeletal dire rhino's to counteract the effects of us having a tank than to repedietally deny us the ability to use it.
Oh Yeah, Here be the interior of the tank, with a key.
http://i172.photobucket.com/albums/w27/bloddyredcommie/TankDesigninterior.png
The Portable Hole is the tricky part, due to the fact that right now, it costs more than the tank itself proably will.

[Xuincherguixe]

My thought is that as the game goes on, you could upgrade your tank. So get the portable hole later.

Who knows, maybe you can put a trebuchet on it. Or turn it into a giant mechanical spider.

[Alex12]

When you get the resources, stick a spell turret on top. It has 4 spells, which it casts in order at targets, then it repairs itself, then cycles through the spells again. Give it something like detect hostility, and you'll have an autofiring self-repairing gun that can spam Disintegrates and the like with ease.

[BRC]

When you get the resources, stick a spell turret on top. It has 4 spells, which it casts in order at targets, then it repairs itself, then cycles through the spells again. Give it something like detect hostility, and you'll have an autofiring self-repairing gun that can spam Disintegrates and the like with ease.

That sounds very expensive, I doubt this campaign is going to go on long enough for us to get enough money for that.

[Alex12]

I'm AFB ATM, so I can't tell you how much they cost. I do know, though, that for the listed CR, they're likely to TPK a non-munchkin party.

[Fawsto]

Fire and Holy Water are definetly a must there. If possible, get a way to that tan continuously rain the holy water when the enemies are close. Dude, Holy Rain is something that the undeads should fear o.O

You also should consider a escape route. Pehaps a small ammount of tanglefoot bags and thunder stones should do the trick in a emergency. Also, ading something like a "Full Plate with Spikes" to the Tank is nice, since you can go and turn the Spikes into Holy weapons and own every undead that comes trying to turn the thing upside down.

Oh yeah, prepare some Daylight spells taht you can use from above the Platform, it will own any vampire that should be in the army of dead. :smallamused:

[Alex12]

Okay, some of the stats for a spell turret (DMG2 page 45)
you need true seeing and 4 spells of the same level from different schools, then just follow the spell trap creation costs table.
It fires off 1 of the 4 spells (the order never changes, you designate it when making it) every round at any unrecognized creatures within 120 feet, and self-repairs 4d8+20 hp every 5th round. hp=200, hardness=that of material it's mounted on (minimum 5) AC=7

One of the examples uses 4th-level wizard spells, and costs 14,000 gp and 1120 XP.

Just for fun, the 9th-level wizard one (meteor swarm every 5 rounds, anyone?) costs 76,500 gp and 6120 XP.

Put one of those babies on top of your tank. They've got a 360 degree arc, and since they use true seeing to detect targets, it'll shoot invisible stuff too. Plus, since it can't see through solid objects, have a retractable shell so you can park it in town or someplace and not have it kill everyone who gets near it (since reprogramming the thing takes 8 hours.

[Fawsto]

That remembers me the time that I wanted a Gnome War Airship as a Moving base 4 our team... Ohh nice days... Rainind death over armies being sellswords... Snif.. Brings me memories...

[Fawsto]

That remembers me the time that I wanted a Gnome War Airship as a Moving base 4 our team... Ohh nice days... Rainind death over armies being sellswords... Snif.. Brings me memories...