(3.5) Mind Flayer - why spells, why!

[Dellis]

So, Illithids are -the- most iconic psionic creatures I know.

So why, oh why, their statblock still uses "spell-like" effects? Why stat them out as kind-of-spellcasters while there's a perfectly good psionic power system to use?

The answer, of course, is that at the time they were written, psionic powers were no more than a glint in their mother's eye (of father, as the case may be).

When, however, the psionic system was published, I'd have expected them to restat the mind flayers with it.

I can't believe they didn't, hence my question - is there any book in all the published D℥D history where basic (that is, the mind flayer CR 8 base creature, not mind flayers with some psion levels slapped on) is statted out with psionic powers, instead of glorified arcane spell like abilities (cast, by the way, to add insult to injury, as level 8 sorcerers)?

Thank you very much.

[Crake]

They did restat it. It's just not on the srd, check the monster section in your expanded psionics handbook.

[Dellis]

It -would- have been strange not to do that.

Funnily enough, I was convinced if they did that, they would have done so in a different book than the one that published the system, maybe in a subsequent book focused on aberrations.

The more you know.

[Segev]

It -would- have been strange not to do that.

Funnily enough, I was convinced if they did that, they would have done so in a different book than the one that published the system, maybe in a subsequent book focused on aberrations.

The more you know.

The e philosophy on the various books was to assume you don’t have any others, with a few exceptions that explicitly built on others.

[tyckspoon]

I can't believe they didn't, hence my question - is there any book in all the published D℥D history where basic (that is, the mind flayer CR 8 base creature, not mind flayers with some psion levels slapped on) is statted out with psionic powers, instead of glorified arcane spell like abilities (cast, by the way, to add insult to injury, as level 8 sorcerers)?

Thank you very much.

The Illithid is one of the creatures Wizards of the Coast decided to reserve as what they term 'Product Identity' - it is not covered under the licensing that permits free use and reproduction of much of the core material for D&D 3.5. So while it has in fact been remade as a psionic creature you will need a physical copy of the Expanded Psionics Handbook or a legally purchased reproduction to see it, much like you will not find Beholders in OGL material/in the generally available SRD and will need to see a copy of the actual Monster Manual.

[Thurbane]

Psionics are an alternate system, so it's not unusual for there to be a non-psionic and a psionic version of the same creatures.

[tenshiakodo]

What's weird is the Couatl has a spell-like ability called Psionics in MM1, which is just...spell-like abilities.

[RSGA]

What's weird is the Couatl has a spell-like ability called Psionics in MM1, which is just...spell-like abilities.

It's that way because of how the conversion stuff in the Psionics Handbooks worked and because it has a lesser conversion than the Mind Flayer does. Or at least is supposed to. I have no doubt somebody would find a monster with Psionics as spell-likes and a bad conversion note out there.

[Darg]

Psionics are a special ability as denoted in the DMG. It even has a variant rule for opacity between psionics and spells.

It's not like there is a difference between psi-like and spell-like other than the name and people misreading the entry to say that all psionics are psi-like.

In case any one is wondering, the DMG calls them psionic creatures. So it's not like they aren't psionic.

[Psyren]

The e philosophy on the various books was to assume you don’t have any others, with a few exceptions that explicitly built on others.

Which was a huge benefit to PF - since the whole system was OGL they could simply say "hey remember that new thing we put in APG/UC/UM, you'll need it to understand how X functions, you can read it online for free if you don't have the book." It let them do things like print Style Feats in ISC / WMH without needing to explain all over again how they work, or stick psychic and mythic monsters in Bestiary 5, or create Obediences for the minor and quasi-deities in ISF / BotD etc.