EVE Online

[Amotis]

I'm almost certain I'm gonna start playing this game. Just waiting for a friend to pay his bills so we can start together. And I'm pretty gorram excited.

So, who plays, any tips, what's the main problems with the game, etc etc?

Also, one very noobish question that I couldn't find an answer to: Can two players be different races and still fly together. As in, do the same missions, fight the same battles, etc?

[Sugarmouse]

Hmm. I haven't activaly played for close to a 8 months, although I am still logging in to train skills.

Can't really offer you any tips, other than on the PvE side of things, and that is - upgrade you standings asap. Higher access Agents = more mulah from missions. If you go the PvE route... PvP has other lucerative options.

Also, biggest ships are not necessarily the best. :) Find a class that appeals and learn it inside out.

Main problems? Griefers/Pirates. IMHO. That and the fact that I still believe the game is being dominated by two major alliances. Makes it hard for a small time Corps to get ahead unless they affiliate.

And yes, Players from two different races can hang out and gang up. To get same missions? They need to get standing with whatever corp you guys wanna run missions for. That, and the possible thirty system trip to meet up should be the only hitch to ganging up.

[Yuki Akuma]

Main problems? It's a very slow game. Travelling between systems can take up to ten minutes per system, meaning that some journeys can (and do) take hours. Much of my time playing the game was spent playing on my PS2 waiting for my damn ship to get to its destination.

Another problem is that, like any online game, some players just want to ruin it for everyone. This wouldn't be much of a problem if it weren't for the fact that you can do anything you like to other players' characters as long as you don't try to steal their real-life information. So, you can camp outside the station another player just docked in, and shoot him out of the sky when he undocks, then shoot down his escape pod, and only have the station defenses to worry about (if it even has them). I'd stick to the high-security areas for a while, if I were you!

A good thing about the game is that you don't actively have to play it to get better, as skills train even when you're offline. The bad thing about this is that new players will never catch up to veterans. Those two major alliances that run most of the game world? They're gonna be there until the players get bored and quit. You can't contend with them. It literally takes years to reach the skill cap, and no one actually has yet.

[Ranis]

Amotis, remember-you don't play EVE, you wait EVE.

[Amotis]

Thanks for the input everyone. A few more questions/clarifications if you will humor me.

Does one have to make a conscious decision about playing PvE or PvP? Like you can't validly be blank and play PvP or can you be equally effective in both? Do you have to choose between one or the other, is what I'm asking.

How crowded is EVE? I know it's pretty big in the UK but...how big? I couldn't find any stats on the numbers.

Another question, how important are race and attribute choices? How about beginning skill choice? I know there's a system where after you take a skill the next skill in line takes five times longer, or something like that. Is there strategy guides for recommended skill trees? Are mistakes easy to correct?

The huge alliances/players with years ahead of me doesn't really bother me. I'm playing it with some RL friends and we're just there to have fun and play together. Not be the best there is. So we're thinking about starting out as Gallente mission runners (that's the combat starting, right?), as opposed to being miners (which seems to be the suggestion for beginners). So combat, running with others, etc. This seem like a good idea?

[Tom_Violence]

Info from my experiences:


Thanks for the input everyone. A few more questions/clarifications if you will humor me.

Does one have to make a conscious decision about playing PvE or PvP? Like you can't validly be blank and play PvP or can you be equally effective in both? Do you have to choose between one or the other, is what I'm asking.

If you go into certain areas, anyone can attack. Sadly, after not too long, these areas are where the real content is.


How crowded is EVE? I know it's pretty big in the UK but...how big? I couldn't find any stats on the numbers.

I found that if I didn't already know someone, I wouldn't meet anyone in the game. 'Bumping into people' in the world basically never happens, but there's plenty of chat thingies available to find people.


Another question, how important are race and attribute choices? How about beginning skill choice? I know there's a system where after you take a skill the next skill in line takes five times longer, or something like that. Is there strategy guides for recommended skill trees? Are mistakes easy to correct?

Mistakes can be corrected, but it takes time. Everything takes time. Basically, if you pick the wrong starting attributes, you're better off making a new character cos otherwise you're just wasting time.

[Yuki Akuma]

Note that the world in EVE is very, very big. You can warp to the next planet, cut your warp drive out mid-transit, set a bookmark, and have your very own little pocket of space to drop cargo and no one will ever find it.

[Jakezor]

Does one have to make a conscious decision about playing PvE or PvP? Like you can't validly be blank and play PvP or can you be equally effective in both? Do you have to choose between one or the other, is what I'm asking.

You can always choose not to seek out PvP, but in EVE, PvP finds you. That being said, there is a fair amout of overlap between PvE skills and PvP ones. the same skills fire guns, missiles, ect. PvP has "Electronic Warfare" and other related skills however. You can think of PvE skills as a basis upon which you build PvP skills.



How crowded is EVE? I know it's pretty big in the UK but...how big? I couldn't find any stats on the numbers.

Some systems (I"m looking at you jita!) are so crowded that there's actually a backlog to get into them! but in contrast, there are hundreds of systems that are totally empty 22.5 hours a day. Number of people in a system is directly proportional to how high the security standing is. .7-1.0 is PACKED (except amarr space, which is always deserted) .5-.7 is fairly crowded. and at .4 and below (where you don't have to worry about police if you PvP) the population falls off rapidly. Most of 0.0 is empty most of the time, for example.
In terms of raw numbers, if you're in the euro time zones, expect between 20 and 30 thousand players online at any given time.



Another question, how important are race and attribute choices?

Attributes >>>>>>>> Race. Though some races have high attributes than others. Race, essentially, just determines your starting ship and weapon skill. Depending on what you want to do (combat, mining, science.) You need to get certain attributes higher than others. You can increase each attribute by 10 (though, practically, only 8) through training skills, and by another 5 (though only 3/4 at first) through the use of implants.

I'll tell you this though: few people roll amarr. Why? their ships (but mostly their weapons: lasers) Buh-low.
As such, you'll have to spend time training up another race's ships if you want to accomplish anything, so you start a few days behind the other races. Not much fun...


How about beginning skill choice? I know there's a system where after you take a skill the next skill in line takes five times longer, or something like that. Is there strategy guides for recommended skill trees? Are mistakes easy to correct?

Attribute mistakes are perminant. Never put points into charisma, for example. Other than that, anyone can train any skill (once they meet the prerequisite skills that is) So, for character creation, if you focus on getting as many skills at rank 4/5 as possible (in the field you want to play) you can start out a couple hours to maybe a day ahead of other players. But ultimatly, its not a big difference.


The huge alliances/players with years ahead of me doesn't really bother me. I'm playing it with some RL friends and we're just there to have fun and play together. Not be the best there is. So we're thinking about starting out as Gallente mission runners (that's the combat starting, right?), as opposed to being miners (which seems to be the suggestion for beginners). So combat, running with others, etc. This seem like a good idea?
Good choice IMO. mining is booring as ... well, watching paint dry. White paint. On a plaster wall. Missions are rough to get started. You won't make much money at all during level 1 missions. but once you hit level two... Cha-ching.
Suggestion: Learn salvaging ASAP. and loot everything. Trust me.
My friends conducted an experiment. we each rolled a character. and tried to see how much money we could make in 7 days with "fresh" characters. He rolled a Caldari (the "prefered" Mission runners). I rolled an Amarr (I've been player longer, so I took a handi cap).
At the end of day 7, he had his first cruiser.
I had my first Battlecruiser (6x as expensive.) and enough cash to buy another.
The difference? I trained up salvaging.

Gallente are great to do misisons in as the "rats" (NPCs) you'll be sent against are primarly "serps", which are close to the weakest NPCs in the game (Only ones i'd argue are easier are the blood raiders. You can easily tank several battleships of those with a frigate.)
Also, Gallente space isn't as overcrowded as Caldari space (which is a lag-fest)
Also, gallente ships are good at missioning, AND the "best" pvp ships.

So yeah, that sounds like a fine idea. You'll each probably want to run level 1 missions solo first though so that you can build up your standing to use lvl 2 agents. Watch out for "When Worlds Collide" that mission kills most newbs the first time through. That'd be a good one to team up on.

[Tengu]

Needless to say, the mentioned drawbacks put me off EVE. It's like a very pretty screensaver, but the actual gameplay is more like running a business than having entertainment. If I want to run a business, I will run a business, at least I will earn money that way instead of spending it on the monthly fees.

And then there are gankers. I haven't played enough to experience them (only the 14-day trial), but I am sure I would encounter them sooner or later. Any multiplayer game where the idiocy of others can make you lose everything you worked so hard for is inherently flawed in my book. That's why I play WoW.

But hey, if you have the patience of an ancient stone monolith, and enough free time to spend hours daily watching your ship fly through the space, accompanied by nice music, you can go for it.

[Maxymiuk]

Never put points into charisma, for example.

Unless you want to be a trader. You can make ridiculous amounts of cash trading. How? Rule #1: people are lazy. I'll let you figure out the implications yourself. :smallamused:

[Amotis]

Thanks for all the help people, it's been really...er...helpful. No srsly, I could barely find newbie friendly info on the EVE sites out there.

Anyway, it's downloading right now. Can I get any starting character/ship builds thrown out here? Like starting attributes/skills? Things to do right away? Etc?

edito- okay started, Gallente Special Forces. But I think I made some mistakes already.

Stats:

Int 6, Per 15, Will 12, Cha 8, Mem 4

Drone 4, Elec 2, Engin 2, Gun 2, Ind 1, Learn 3, Mech 2, Nav 2, Science 1, SC 2

And I started training my first skill, Starship Command, Gallente Frig Rank and it says 14 days! :smalleek: Is this common?

A few more questions: How do Increase power and cpu on my ship? Will the contradiction between my mem and drone attribute and skill be a problem?

So far it's pretty and fun. :smallsmile: Done the newbie missions and now am just trying to upgrade my ship...which is vast and having me a bit confused. Is it worth it traveling to find the best deal?

another question: I want to be a fast, disabling, dogfighting ship. Should I have taken the soldier instead of the special forces? Should I use drones? What should my attributes and skills ideally be?

should I take the recommended skill tree?

• Instant Recall (Memory) Level 1

• Analytical Mind (Intelligence) Level 1

• Learning Level 1

• Instant Recall (Memory) Level 2

• Analytical Mind (Intelligence) Level 2

• Learning Level 2

• Instant Recall (Memory) Level 3

• Analytical Mind (Intelligence) Level 3

• Learning Level 3

• Instant Recall (Memory) Level 3

• Analytical Mind (Intelligence) Level 3

• Learning Level 3

• Instant Recall (Memory) Level 4

• Analytical Mind (Intelligence) Level 4

• Learning Level 4

Also, the looting skill. What's that under? Or are you just referring to the looting everything?

[Sightless]

Note that the world in EVE is very, very big. You can warp to the next planet, cut your warp drive out mid-transit, set a bookmark, and have your very own little pocket of space to drop cargo and no one will ever find it.

LIESS!!!!!
As a former lowsec pirate (before the curse nerf (LOVED THAT SHIP)) you can find ANYTHING with the right skillset, and containers de-spawn. Do NOT leave your stuff floating about, it will disappear, or if you anchor it somebody will blow it up/loot it.

Btw your stats are skewed, and you are screwed. You want a balance of skills, because you WILL end up becoming more well rounded than you could imagine right now, and your Learning skills (VERY IMPORTANT TO MAX THESE) are based on int/mem if I recall correctly. The other poster was right, cha is the only semi unimportant stat out there. All the others should be about the same level. I remember starting out with higher int/mem than you and my build was still considered skewed to perc. I suffered for that later in the game when it was time for me to pick up higher level electronics and basic drone skills.

PS I really cant stress the importance of the learning skills. Learn to learn! You should get a skillset that lets you have a little fun, and then focus on your learning skills for a while.

PPS If you want my old account (Decent stats, almost a yearś of skillpoints, maxed learning etc) you can have it. I dont plan on returning to eve, and starting out is rough since you really never will catch up to the more vet players.

Edit: If you have any other questions, just PM me or something. I can really help get you learned in EVE (and as far as a dogfighter you may want to go for T2 frigates asap)

[Jakezor]

Unless you want to be a trader. You can make ridiculous amounts of cash trading. How? Rule #1: people are lazy. I'll let you figure out the implications yourself. :smallamused:

You can do all that with a 2 in charisma. it only really makes a difference with NPCS, the deals are from the lazy/stupid PCs.

On to stuff from the OP.

skills take a LONG TIME to learn. Just finished Heavy Drones to level 5, for example, know how long it took?
23 days.
you read that right: days. And I have max learning skills, and +4 implants.
But you know what else? Ogre IIs are worth every second of it.
EvE requires friends, if you don't have any, make some. The game is just boring without it. Figure out what you want to do, find a like-minded group, and play slowly....
The top players have been playing since the game started, they have over 70 MILLION skill points. Once you get 1/2 million, you can start to be useful in PvP battles, or just rake in the dough in PVE missions. (some people say you need more SP than that, they LIE, you just need the SP in the right places)

The "Salvaging" Skill is under "mechanics" by the way, but it has some prerequisites that you may not have. It not as much a cash-cow as it was when I ran my comparison test, but it's still good, easy money.
Check out the official eve-online forums too at their website. people have great strats for running missions, salvaging... heck, anything! its a great resource to use and learn from.

[Sightless]

You can do all that with a 2 in charisma. it only really makes a difference with NPCS, the deals are from the lazy/stupid PCs.


Another good point about stats... cha is only really used when making corps and dealing with npc's for missions... So unless you plan on mission grinding forever (not really fun) cha should be dumped as hard as possible. As far as making corps there are characters out there who will give you a fully skilled corp for a flat rate (if you MUST be a corp leader) so having cha for corps is a poor idea also =/

[Amotis]

Well I started over with a more nicely stated guy and with the learning skill tree. The problem is that I think I need to use shields and armor but I need to learn those skills to use them. But my training is being occupied with the learning tree.

Sightless, while I don't see how I could use your account right now, considering that I'm starting new with a bunch of new players. I think I might. That's a generous offer and one that will open up the game to a level I might not experience. At least not for a while.

Well...so far it's very fun. Pretty too. A bit laggy in some areas, especially since that every mission runner battle seems to have a gas cloud and lots of light effects going on. Iono, and it gets pretty laggy sometimes randomly. I'm not sure if it's my comp or internet. Hopefully it'll disappear. Died my first time too :P Had insurance though.

When do I upgrade ships? ASAP? How much should I put into each aspect? I'm having trouble with the...I assume it's lvl 2 agents, though I'm still using the free ships they gave. Atron and Incursus...I think, but the second one just got blow'd up. When should I upgrade? How do I upgrade? I know there are tech II frigates, like the steath and covert ops ones but how does that work? Do I buy them? Or do them come from tech I frigs? Is a clocking ship a viable option?

I am getting into the EVE forums but it's pretty dense. ><

[NEO|Phyte]

You'll generally want to upgrade to the biggest ship you can pilot that suits your needs. If by aspects you mean skills, if taking an hour from your Learning skills will get you your shield modules, its probably worth the hour. Level II agents require you to have a high rating with the related corp AFAIK, and offer tougher jobs. Upgrading ships consists of buying a new one (or simply better modules to mount). What I've seen of the TII ships indicates they're better (or more specialized for a given task), but require more skills to use. They're bought like any other ship. I couldn't tell you if cloaking is worth it, as I've never used it, having only played 14-day trials.

[Moechi_Vill]

Its fun. I played it twice but I quit both times because the game is just too slow. The really good parts, war and all, take a lot of investment to get to.

[Erloas]

Well I started over with a more nicely stated guy and with the learning skill tree. The problem is that I think I need to use shields and armor but I need to learn those skills to use them. But my training is being occupied with the learning tree.

.
.
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When do I upgrade ships? ASAP? How much should I put into each aspect? I'm having trouble with the...I assume it's lvl 2 agents, though I'm still using the free ships they gave. Atron and Incursus...I think, but the second one just got blow'd up. When should I upgrade? How do I upgrade? I know there are tech II frigates, like the steath and covert ops ones but how does that work? Do I buy them? Or do them come from tech I frigs? Is a clocking ship a viable option?


You won't be able to fly Tech 2 frigates for quite a while. They are also a bit expensive to learn in. Get the biggest frigate in your race and fly that, they should be affordable within a day or two (depending how much you play of course). You should move up to the high end frigate as soon as you possible can and still have enough money left to put some basic gear on it. I don't remember the names of most of the other races' frigates since I just flew minmatar ships. The cheapest frigates are practically useless for general use, but some of the frigates will have a solid use throught the game no matter what your skill level/income is. As I said, I don't remember the names of the better frigates, but if you look at the tech 2 assault frigates, the base frigate they are designed on is the good tech 1 frigate. Minmatar it is the rifter, which the wolf and jaguar are based off of.

I wouldn't worry about any of the tech 2 frigates until you are pretty familiar with the game.



While the learning skills are absolutely vital to the long term game it takes a while before they start to pay off. I think it was calculated that it takes about 6 months of playing before the time saved on other skills by increasing your learning skills comes out ahead of just ignoring your learning skills. I would make sure to get a couple levels in on each of the learning skills right away since it doesn't take long, then take a bit of a break from them to make sure you have enough offensive and defensive skills to actually be able to play the game and then go back to the learning skills.

You will never stay with the game if you can't do anything for the first month because all you have trained is learning skills. Also if you don't even plan on playing the game for 6+ months then you might just ignore the learning skills after level 3 or so and not even get to the advanced learning skills.
I know a few updates ago they completely redid the new character designs so it might not be exactly the same case anymore as when I played.

What I generally did early on is working on learning new skills and the level 1-2 of various skills while I was playing and always made sure I had some long term skills available for when I logged off. The times don't get too long until higher ranks and level 4-5. While you are playing get a lot of the little equiping and offensive defensive skills leveled up a bit (after you've already got level 2-3 on your learning skills) and then switch to longer skills such as learning 4-5 and others (such as for bigger ships later) when you are done with your learning.

Not sure if it has been answered yet, but to increase the grid and CPU on your ships you have to train skills for it. There are always more skills... I forget which skills they are now, I think CPU is under electronics.

[Jakezor]

The best thing to "Upgrade" to would be cruisers.
Use a Vexor if you've got good drone skills, a Thorax if you have good gun skills.
Feel blessed, Gallente have some of the best ships at every size class. (The myrmadon, for example, is one of the most OP ships in the game)
Tech II is shiny, and good, but you really should go bigger before you go better. You'll get more millage out of fewer skill points in a cruiser than you will in an assault ship.
I love tech II ships. I have one (A wolf) that I usually use to tank triple 0.0 Battle-ship rat spawns (The stuff you're killing in missions right now is probably 5-40k per bounty, these rats are between 1 and 2 million)
BUT it only became "Worth It" for me to use them recently. and I have ... well, many skill points.
They'll start to add up quickly. By the time your learning skills are done (and it's OK to take a break from them for a day or two so you can actually put modules on your ship) You'll be getting more than a million skill points a month.

By the Way, as a general rule of thumb, if you fitting (Guns, armor modules, afterburners, whatever is on your ship) doesn't cost more than the ship itself, you need to invest more in it.

[Sightless]

Whoa geeze soo many questions... but then again I remember what it was like when I started playing EVE

Anyways good job on the re-stat, thats the thing people mess up the most on. Now onto your other questions

When do I upgrade ships?
Upgrade to the highest tech1 frig you can, for level II missions you should probably get a cruiser

How much should I put into each aspect?
Que?
I'm having trouble with the...I assume it's lvl 2 agents, though I'm still using the free ships they gave. Atron and Incursus...I think, but the second one just got blow'd up.
The free ships are absolute crap, you want to avoid using them if you can, and avoid civilian class modules too.

When should I upgrade? How do I upgrade? I know there are tech II frigates, like the steath and covert ops ones but how does that work?
Stick with tech I for now, tech II requires allot of different skills depending on what class you pilot, usualy a few of those at level 5. And if you want to pilot a tech II without it just being a pretty bullseye then you will need a well rounded combat skillset (quite a few skills at five, max cap regen powergrid cpu main firesystem etc)


Do I buy them? Or do them come from tech I frigs?

You buy tech II, I think there may be ways to turn tech I into a tech II, but those were just rumors I heard before I stopped playing, you would be better off asking adoptions chat about newer things like that (Btw adoptions chat used to be (and probably still is) full of nice people that will help you out, its like the noobie help chat without all the spam)

Is a clocking ship a viable option?
cloaking ships are tech II usually, but they arnt very good, they are very specialized ships and generally make for expensive glass cannons.

As far as having my account, just send me a PM and we can see what we can do about turning it over to you. It hasn´t been active in a while, but the main has decent rep with a few npc corps, and a solid core of skills for combat (plus all learning and adv learning)

My best advice for you right now would be to focus on your combat skills a bit. Its not going to kill you to avoid the learning tree for a week or so while you get yourself in to something flyable. I think I left my learning skills at a mix of 3/4 untill I hopped into my first battlecruiser. Then I focused on learning and adv learning while stockpiling some cash from L3 missions for the future.

[Amotis]

I gots a Tristan now. I think I'm gonna spend some times learning skills so I can actually use shields, boost my CPU and grid, and upgrade my weapons. Apparently I can only fit two turrents on my ship, what are some other recommended weapon options? Also, what are recommended mid and low slots as well? I got afterburners and shields on my mids but my lows are empty. Keep in mind that I'm not really specializing yet, just trying to make it through the missions.

[Murongo]

Needless to say, the mentioned drawbacks put me off EVE. It's like a very pretty screensaver, but the actual gameplay is more like running a business than having entertainment. If I want to run a business, I will run a business, at least I will earn money that way instead of spending it on the monthly fees.
Yeah forget call of duty if I want to fight a war I'll join the marines :smallconfused:


And then there are gankers. I haven't played enough to experience them (only the 14-day trial), but I am sure I would encounter them sooner or later. Any multiplayer game where the idiocy of others can make you lose everything you worked so hard for is inherently flawed in my book. That's why I play WoW.
Isn't the point of an MMO the ability to interact with others? Otherwise it's just a single player game. I quit WoW for the same reason you appear to like it, the reason I play MMOs is to cooperate and compete with other people. Hence multi-player. Is it idiocy on their part if someone kills you and takes your stuff with no consequences? Or was it YOUR idiocy for not bringing enough guns along to defend yourself?


But hey, if you have the patience of an ancient stone monolith, and enough free time to spend hours daily watching your ship fly through the space, accompanied by nice music, you can go for it.
It's a game that requires you to read something or do work or play another game in the meantime, yes.

[Leliel]

You know why the Amarr are the largest empire in EVE?

It's beacuse that in their religon, Paitience is one of the highest virtues. It's also the reason why Caldari space is small.

I still like it though.

[Tengu]

Yeah forget call of duty if I want to fight a war I'll join the marines :smallconfused:


Call of Duty, unlike war, is entertaining. There are entertaining games where you run a business. EVE is not one of them.



Isn't the point of an MMO the ability to interact with others? Otherwise it's just a single player game. I quit WoW for the same reason you appear to like it, the reason I play MMOs is to cooperate and compete with other people. Hence multi-player. Is it idiocy on their part if someone kills you and takes your stuff with no consequences? Or was it YOUR idiocy for not bringing enough guns along to defend yourself?


There's a lot of cooperation (raids, group quests) and competition (pvp you do not have to participate if you don't want to, and without annoyingly high loses if you die) in WoW. Are you trying to say that when someone gets ganked, it's their fault?

[Triaxx]

The trouble is that in games like WoW, there are no controls on player characters. A level 70 character can sit and pop level 5's all day long. If they were limited to only skills that the character had at level 5, you could solve the problem in short order. Unfortunately, they aren't, because gankers would scream their heads off until it was removed.

[Sightless]

Triaxx, I have no clue what you are talking about.... if anything it is the inverse. In wow the pvp areas were medium to high level areas, so the monsters were almost a larger threat than the PCs... and in the non pvp areas a level 5 would have to attack the level 70 first =/

In Eve, a high level can come and blow up a player in the middle of the tutorial just because he feels like it. And if wouldn't cost him much to do it either.... (loosing a 100k ship to the cops is nothing after a few months)

Edit: It is super easy to pop a new player just by duping them into a violation, like spreading out cans with lewt in them, then just waiting for some poor new player to come and be like "coooool, new loot" and just hope the ignore the little "you could get shot" message....

[Triaxx]

I guess we must have been playing on different servers, because I stopped playing the trial after continually getting popped by much higher level characters.

[Lord_Butters_I]

It looks like it might be fun, but it's way too expensive per month.

[Amotis]

I guess we must have been playing on different servers, because I stopped playing the trial after continually getting popped by much higher level characters.

There's more then one server? This is news to me. I thought there was only Tranquility.

[Tengu]

I guess we must have been playing on different servers, because I stopped playing the trial after continually getting popped by much higher level characters.

If you do not want to get ganked constantly, do not play on a pvp server. And don't take it as an offense, because I don't play on such myself.

[Amotis]

If you do not want to get ganked constantly, do not play on a pvp server. And don't take it as an offense, because I don't play on such myself.

Are we talking about the same game? >< I thought EVE didn't have any set rules against PvP. Just the CONCORD Police force.

[Tengu]

Triaxx said that he was constantly being ganked in WoW. To which I responded.

[Amotis]

Apologies. Forget my two posts. I was completely out of context. ><

"The walrus is paul."

[Sightless]

I guess we must have been playing on different servers, because I stopped playing the trial after continually getting popped by much higher level characters.

I was playing on a pvp server... there are plenty of non-pvp areas to train where the enemies cannot attack you unless you attack first and become flagged. If you quit after getting popped in a neutral zone, well... thats your own fault =/

[Murongo]

Call of Duty, unlike war, is entertaining. There are entertaining games where you run a business. EVE is not one of them.
Well that's pure opinion so there's no way I can argue with it.


There's a lot of cooperation (raids, group quests) and competition (pvp you do not have to participate if you don't want to, and without annoyingly high loses if you die) in WoW.
The "cooperation" is trial and error and based more on how good your gear is than how well you get along. Most people have like 3 or 4 buttons they press during the entire instance. I'm not just mouthing off here, I raided I know how it was. The PvP was competitive like a no-stakes game of rock-paper-scissors is competitive, it wasn't based on skill and it wasn't even remotely exciting.


Are you trying to say that when someone gets ganked, it's their fault?
Yes? Whose fault would it be? That's the problem with games today, the playerbase is full of bleeding hearts who hate the idea of virtual death. They want a game in which you can't experience loss, only gain. It's perfect for the game-makers who collect monthly fees from people who are perfectly content gaining something for nothing.

The WoW formula is only one repeated step
1) Grind so that you can get better gear to get to the next instance so that you can...

There's never any payoff or profit, you never control, conquer, compete, accomplish, you just run in the endless loot circle and virtual numbers tell you you're doing better. That's why I can't stand people who make fun of roleplayers because their characters are "just pixels". So is your loot.

I miss the UO days when online gaming meant online competing. You fought and made money not so your character would get a higher number, you did it to gain land, resources, to crush people whose ideologies conflicted with yours, to gain skill so that you could better accomplish the aforementioned goals.

But, instead of competing, we now have coddling, all because gaming corporations are greedy and the internet is full of high-minded self-righteous squalling babies who can't handle having a chance of loss. This is so far off the topic of EVE it's ridiculous I should make a "the problems with MMOs these days" thread.

[Jakezor]

that's why I like eve. If I do something stupid, it hurts. If I want to make someone else hurt, I can.

PVP isn't about numbers (People or lewt stats), its about skill, and planning. Doubt me? try it out. Round up as many people as you want. hundreds, thousands. Doesn't matter. You'll get destroyed by any (real) alliance out there. Why? Because they're organized, trained, and prepared. (Rich too, which helps)

Things have -value- in eve, because they're not there for ever.
That Officer drop capacitor recharger? yeah, its worth billions. Because people use them, and therefor loose them. If you never lost ships, loot or anything else, EvE would be as pointless as WoW, I could probably be in a Titan or something stupid, and I'd happily run around dying over and over again because it would cost me nothing. That would be stupid. that would be wow.
Eve is the anti-wow.

[Triaxx]

It's far easier to destroy a ship, and have it replaced than it is to say... kill a mount that isn't allowed in combat anyway. Mounts are much harder to replace than ships.

[MandibleBones]

Amotis (or anyone else hanging around in Empire space with good standing with the Gallente) - drop me an EVE-mail (Character name: Eros Serafiem) and I'll run some missions with you. I've got decent standing with the federation and am working on getting us some more - plus I can salvage, which means more ISK.

Unfortunately, I joined a corp that seems about dead - I'ma see if I can revitalize it, but if not, I may be looking for a new one soon. Wouldn't mind seeing an GITPer corp on EVE.

[G-Man]

As much as I love the game, the price turns me off more than anything else.

I found a nice corporation, big enough to protect me, and I was smart enough to get to work immediately for them.

The game is undoubtably fun, but can be very frustrating as well.

Note: PvPers rarely target a small ship with no cargo, unless they just feel like being evil that day. Missiles cost too much to waste on a shuttle, so if you just need to go somewhere (like to get another ship from a different station) I suggest buying a cheap shuttle and forgoing the danger of possibly losing another ship. (shuttle is so dang cheap I've used 100's)

[FreddaH]

The thing with Eve is that all people are PvPers. You PvP when you use the market. You PvP when you mine. You PvP when you PvP, etc. The only people who aren't actively PvPing in a broad sense are mission runners, and then only when they are running their mission. The instant they start selling their loot and salvage, they PvP.

This is what appeals to me about Eve. There are consequences for every action, and despite your best efforts, anyone with a grudge can find a way of stepping on your toes.

@ the OP: If you want to try out the dark side of Eve, drop me a mail in game. My character name is Ki An. I am what some people call a 'griefer', what is commonly known as a pirate in Eve.

[MandibleBones]

Just tell me you're a decent pirate, ambushing the big game in 0.0, not some newb-camper sitting just barely outside of .5 space and gatecamping every bloody newb to come through.

'Cause seriously, I expect piracy in EVE, and piracy isn't griefing in my opinion. Newbcamping, after you've been playing the game long enough, isn't cool.

But I'll tip my hat your way if I see Ki An pop up on my overview - a pirate deserves as much. *tips hat*

[FreddaH]

I pirate in 0.0, and recently it hasn't been much piracy at all. More like regular warfare. I do run through low sec now and again, but I tend to engage in proper fights as killing defenseless ships doesn't thrill me. I'm not washing my hands completely though, a few haulers here and there goes pop. They're like piñatas you see, so I can't stop myself from cracking them open :smallbiggrin:

When it comes to noob baiting, if you are talking about can baiting in starter systems, that's against CCP's rules and is a bannable offence.

That said: "Yarr!" *tips his three-cornered hat back*

[Triaxx]

:smallbiggrin: Tip my hat as I turn the other way and accelerate...

[MandibleBones]

They're like piñatas you see, so I can't stop myself from cracking them open

Well, they also tend to have lots of candy inside - er, minerals :)


When it comes to noob baiting, if you are talking about can baiting in starter systems, that's against CCP's rules and is a bannable offence.

Naw, they're not starter systems, nor are they baiting. Just 0.4 sec just out of the main Empire hubs and gate-camping. Perfectly legitimate piracy, just annoying and childish. I'd agree that most people traveling alone in, say, Tech 1 cruisers, should probably not be venturing into .4 sec in the first place and this at least teaches us to check system sec before jumping (and to keep our clone updated - thankfully, that second lesson was one I learned the first day of EVE without having to learn it the hard way).

But 0.0 piracy and hauler/miner piracy? Perfectly legitimate business operations. Though your license seems to be a bit out of date, Captain... Harbatkin? /firefly reference

[Triaxx]

Which is a good reason not to go below 0.5 unless you're part of an armed convoy.

Which is possibly the most fun you can have. I got the chance to do it, when a friend of mine got called into work. His clanmates needed the ship, so he asked if I wanted to fly in his place so they wouldn't be a ship short. Naturally I said yes, and jumped in. Probably the most fun four hours I've had playing online. This was back before the introduction of the tech 2 ships, so I was flying his destroyer, ending up the only surviving destroyer in a fleet of thirty ships. The two mining ships we were delivering survived, even though one was Badly damaged. Tremendous fun. Makes me wish I had the cash to get into it. (Since now you can buy cards to play with ingame currency.)

[MandibleBones]

Yeah, no, I totally learned my lessons (1. Don't go into .4 space alone; 2. Don't do courier missions in a cruiser).

And I'm slowly but surely working myself up to a battlecruiser, 'cause my destroyer is no fun and my cruiser isn't good enough. Not that I don't like my little Vexor, but eventually I'm going to have to run lvl 3 missions, and then where am I?

Taking a break for the holidays (Drone Interfacing 5's 40-day training time means not having to log in until New Years if I don't get the chance to), but back online later.

[Jakezor]

As far as griefing goes, my personal favorite is ore theft.
Its only moderately annoying, and it spontaneously generates PvP fights when those silly miners decide they want "revenge" (also know as them forgetting to de-equip their mining lasers from their apocs and then dying to my battle-cruiser)

I'm quite successful at it, if I do say so myself (although its only a part time hobby) I've been doing it in the same hauler since '03! How many ore thief's can boast that?:smallwink:

[Zeful]

I've seen Eve at a book store once and looked it up. I found it interesting but I don't have a computer that can run it. That aside, I've wondered about ship to ship combat. How's it done? Is it done at distances where I could reach out and touch the ship or is it done at the large distances that space allows?

Just curious.:smallsmile:

[Seraph]

I've seen Eve at a book store once and looked it up. I found it interesting but I don't have a computer that can run it. That aside, I've wondered about ship to ship combat. How's it done? Is it done at distances where I could reach out and touch the ship or is it done at the large distances that space allows?

Just curious.:smallsmile:


depends. its a point-and-click affair, and ranges have to do with the weapons you choose, so that vulcan cannons have very short range, while railguns can hit enemies from dozens of kilometers away.

[MandibleBones]

You might also be surprised at the computers it can run on - definitely doesn't require the newest or fastest 'puter to run.

[Zeful]

Except the most advanced pc in the house couldn't run it and it meets 90% of the minimum requierments. The graphics card is sub par.