How do beholders' eye rays work?

[Halphinian]

I am a fairly new to 3.x, and I have decided to play a druid that can wildshape into aberrations, and have found a feat that lets me use their eye rays while I am in the form of a beholder. However, I am very confused about how beholder's eye rays work. According to Lords of Madness, "Each of a beholderkin's small eyes can produce a magical ray once per round as a free action," which to me sounds like you can fire them as a free action. However, the eye rays are listed under "Full Attacks," which leads me to believe that you have to use a full attack to use them. Which is it?

[Segev]

I am a fairly new to 3.x, and I have decided to play a druid that can wildshape into aberrations, and have found a feat that lets me use their eye rays while I am in the form of a beholder. However, I am very confused about how beholder's eye rays work. According to Lords of Madness, "Each of a beholderkin's small eyes can produce a magical ray once per round as a free action," which to me sounds like you can fire them as a free action. However, the eye rays are listed under "Full Attacks," which leads me to believe that you have to use a full attack to use them. Which is it?

It is listed under both attacks and full attacks. You can use all your eye rays and make a bite attack as a standard action or as a full attack action, each eye ray only functions once per round regardless of how many actions you have to expend, however. Additionally, remember that a beholder can only focus three eye rays per 90-degree solid angle. Other eyes must be focused in other arcs.

[Halphinian]

It is listed under both attacks and full attacks. You can use all your eye rays and make a bite attack as a standard action or as a full attack action, each eye ray only functions once per round regardless of how many actions you have to expend, however. Additionally, remember that a beholder can only focus three eye rays per 90-degree solid angle. Other eyes must be focused in other arcs.

Thanks for your help! And that makes sense, being able to use the rays as standard or full attack actions, but I am still confused about the free action text. Is it that I can only fire one ray as a free action, or can I fire all of them as a free action (provided I have enemies in all directions), or is there something I'm missing?

[ixrisor]

Thanks for your help! And that makes sense, being able to use the rays as standard or full attack actions, but I am still confused about the free action text. Is it that I can only fire one ray as a free action, or can I fire all of them as a free action (provided I have enemies in all directions), or is there something I'm missing?

You misunderstand, you make the eye ray attacks as free actions. You can shoot each eye ray once per round. Then, with your standard and move actions you can full attack, move and attack, or anything else you could normally do. The eye rays are listed under full attack and attack as a reminder for the dm to use them.

[Gruftzwerg]

The eye rays are listed under full attack and attack as a reminder for the dm to use them.

This is not the sole reason. "They are Natural Weapons which do ranged touch attacks to apply certain spell effects."
This is because they are listed under "Attacks:" (which have to be either manufactured or natural weapons, manufactured disqualifies by default here, leaving natural weapon as sole other option).

This enables the use of some combat related stuff, some feats, combat options like fighting defensively or even use em for AoO (if you have still unused eyes in the direction of the enemy causing the AoO left).

[Falontani]

This is not the sole reason. "They are Natural Weapons which do ranged touch attacks to apply certain spell effects."
This is because they are listed under "Attacks:" (which have to be either manufactured or natural weapons, manufactured disqualifies by default here, leaving natural weapon as sole other option).

This enables the use of some combat related stuff, some feats, combat options like fighting defensively or even use em for AoO (if you have still unused eyes in the direction of the enemy causing the AoO left).

You can't aoo with ranged weapons without something specifically allowing you. This is the same for the manticore's tail spikes which are the traditional ranged natural weapon.

[Gruftzwerg]

You can't aoo with ranged weapons without something specifically allowing you. This is the same for the manticore's tail spikes which are the traditional ranged natural weapon.

dong..^^ thx for pointing it out. I somehow missed that. Shows how often I play ranged characters xD

[Fouredged Sword]

Thanks for your help! And that makes sense, being able to use the rays as standard or full attack actions, but I am still confused about the free action text. Is it that I can only fire one ray as a free action, or can I fire all of them as a free action (provided I have enemies in all directions), or is there something I'm missing?

You can only fire one ray from one eyestalk as a free action with the limit of only being able to fire each eyestalk once per round and needing to aim only a limited number of them in each direction, but you get as many free actions a round as the DM determines is reasonable. In practical terms this means you can fire each of your eyestalk rays each round without using any limited actions. The actions are free. You get to take as many of them as you like.

[Halphinian]

Thank you all for your help! Here is what I am getting from all of your responses (please correct me if I am wrong):

1) I can fire my eye rays as free actions. Each ray uses its own free action to use, but since it is a free action, I make more than one of them in one turn (assuming I have targets in the right arcs)
1.1) Because I can use my eye rays as free actions, I can use them and then go on to cast spells, move around, and do other things using my standard, swift, movement, and full-round actions
2) Eye rays count as natural weapons that make ranged touch attacks, so I can use effects such as Magic Fang and things like it to enhance them
2.1) If I use an eye ray within melee range of an opponent, that opponent does not get to make an attack of opportunity against me, unless they have a special ability that would allow them to do so
2.2) They are only listed under "Attacks" and "Full Attack" because they are attacks with natural weapons (they just have their own special timing) and so that DMs can easily see the bonuses to hit and what kind of AC they need to roll against

Am I missing anything, or is that about it?

[Segev]

Thank you all for your help! Here is what I am getting from all of your responses (please correct me if I am wrong):

1) I can fire my eye rays as free actions. Each ray uses its own free action to use, but since it is a free action, I make more than one of them in one turn (assuming I have targets in the right arcs)
1.1) Because I can use my eye rays as free actions, I can use them and then go on to cast spells, move around, and do other things using my standard, swift, movement, and full-round actions
2) Eye rays count as natural weapons that make ranged touch attacks, so I can use effects such as Magic Fang and things like it to enhance them
2.1) If I use an eye ray within melee range of an opponent, that opponent does not get to make an attack of opportunity against me, unless they have a special ability that would allow them to do so
2.2) They are only listed under "Attacks" and "Full Attack" because they are attacks with natural weapons (they just have their own special timing) and so that DMs can easily see the bonuses to hit and what kind of AC they need to roll against

Am I missing anything, or is that about it?

I'm not sure you can use magic fang on them, because they're rays, but you might be right.

[Falontani]

Thank you all for your help! Here is what I am getting from all of your responses (please correct me if I am wrong):

1) I can fire my eye rays as free actions. Each ray uses its own free action to use, but since it is a free action, I make more than one of them in one turn (assuming I have targets in the right arcs)
1.1) Because I can use my eye rays as free actions, I can use them and then go on to cast spells, move around, and do other things using my standard, swift, movement, and full-round actions
2) Eye rays count as natural weapons that make ranged touch attacks, so I can use effects such as Magic Fang and things like it to enhance them
2.1) If I use an eye ray within melee range of an opponent, that opponent does not get to make an attack of opportunity against me, unless they have a special ability that would allow them to do so
2.2) They are only listed under "Attacks" and "Full Attack" because they are attacks with natural weapons (they just have their own special timing) and so that DMs can easily see the bonuses to hit and what kind of AC they need to roll against

Am I missing anything, or is that about it?

Mostly correct; however: minor nitpick
2.1: You do not provoke an attack of opportunity, this is correct, but for the wrong reason. Eye Rays being a ranged natural weapon would still provoke attacks of opportunity if not for the fact that they are a free action.

I would ask your DM if magic fang can indeed increase their damage, but enhancing their to hit seems straightforward. The effect of the natural weapon Eye Ray is that it is a spell effect, not specific damage.

[Halphinian]

I'm not sure you can use magic fang on them, because they're rays, but you might be right.


Mostly correct; however: minor nitpick
2.1: You do not provoke an attack of opportunity, this is correct, but for the wrong reason. Eye Rays being a ranged natural weapon would still provoke attacks of opportunity if not for the fact that they are a free action.

I would ask your DM if magic fang can indeed increase their damage, but enhancing their to hit seems straightforward. The effect of the natural weapon Eye Ray is that it is a spell effect, not specific damage.

Thanks for the help! And I completely forgot about the damage boost Magic Fang gives you, I was just going to use it to increase my bonus to hit

[Gruftzwerg]

Thanks for the help! And I completely forgot about the damage boost Magic Fang gives you, I was just going to use it to increase my bonus to hit

the to hit bonus should definitively work.

It's the damage part imho which requires physical (weapon) dmg to buff it. With one exception imho and that is Telekinesis. Since Telekinesis can be used to do weapon damage (Violent Thrust) which imho would be a legal option for the damage buff.

[Fouredged Sword]

the to hit bonus should definitively work.

It's the damage part imho which requires physical (weapon) dmg to buff it. With one exception imho and that is Telekinesis. Since Telekinesis can be used to do weapon damage (Violent Thrust) which imho would be a legal option for the damage buff.

I am AFB right now, but I would advise reading the rules for weapon like spells for clarification about what does and does not work with things of this nature. This may all be right, but it's a bit of a mess really. "Ask your DM" is very much in effect.

[Gruftzwerg]

I am AFB right now, but I would advise reading the rules for weapon like spells for clarification about what does and does not work with things of this nature. This may all be right, but it's a bit of a mess really. "Ask your DM" is very much in effect.

In chase of violent trust - Telekinesis you can throw actual weapons which than deal their weapon damage.


Weapons cause standard damage (with no Strength bonus; note that arrows or bolts deal damage as daggers of their size when used in this manner).

It's therefore a special exception/chase.

[Bohandas]

Thanks for your help! And that makes sense, being able to use the rays as standard or full attack actions, but I am still confused about the free action text. Is it that I can only fire one ray as a free action, or can I fire all of them as a free action (provided I have enemies in all directions), or is there something I'm missing?

I would assume the former (although if that were indeed the intended case I'm not sure why they wouldn;t just make it a swift action)

[JNAProductions]

I would assume the former (although if that were indeed the intended case I'm not sure why they wouldn;t just make it a swift action)

Did swift actions exist when Beholders were first statted?

[Bohandas]

Did swift actions exist when Beholders were first statted?

They did when Lords of Madness came out, and that's where the OP's quoted passage is supposedly from

[JNAProductions]

They did when Lords of Madness came out, and that's where the OP's quoted passage is supposedly from

Oki, garch.

I thought the OP was talking about the Monster Manual one.

[Fouredged Sword]

the to hit bonus should definitively work.

It's the damage part imho which requires physical (weapon) dmg to buff it. With one exception imho and that is Telekinesis. Since Telekinesis can be used to do weapon damage (Violent Thrust) which imho would be a legal option for the damage buff.

Yes, but the damage done is the weapon damage of the weapon used. If you use it on an enchanted weapon you get the +1 damage from telekinesis, but I am not sure you could meaningfully apply an enchantment bonus on the spell itself.

I THINK you could get something like "Weapon focus telekinesis", but I am not 100% sure on that.