Effectiveness of the Chef feat?

[Rfkannen]

So I asked my gm if I could rebuild my character with the new stuff from tasha's, and she said yes. One of the things I decided to do was replace my level 8 asi which was +1 int, +1 wis, with the chef feat. This was done entirely as a flavor move, I have the most powerful magic item in the group and have sharpshooter, so I am much more concerned with flavor than actually being effective at this point..


However I was looking at the chef feat, and boy howdy does this thing not scale at all. Like oof, great feat at levels 1-5, but gains extremely little power after that, does not keep up.

What do you think? Am I drawing too much of a conclusion, or by level 10 is the chef feat pretty insignificant?
(I picked it entirely for flavor and don't really care how good it is, but I am curios)

[micahaphone]

What are you playing, what's the rest of the party? Any particular theme to the campaign or module?


For those who want to know what the feat does,

Chef feat

+1 Con or Wis
Proficiency w/ Chef Tools
During a short rest, you can cook for some creatures equal to 4+prof bonus. Anyone who eats and expends hit die get an extra d8 healing from the short rest
After a long rest or with an hour of work, you can cook prof bonus number of treats. These treats are good for 8 hours, and can be eaten as a bonus action to gain temp hp equal to the chef's prof bonus


Honestly if you're playing with RAW potions, I quite like the treats. Only thing I can think of with the short rest bit is to use it for roleplay bonuses with NPCs once your proficiency bonus is high enough. See if the DM will give you some sort of bonus to persuasion and diplomacy or what have you when you make an afternoon tea that rivals the desserts of a king's feast. That oughta impress someone.

[Rfkannen]

What are you playing, what's the rest of the party? Any particular theme to the campaign or module?


For those who want to know what the feat does,

Chef feat

+1 Con or Wis
Proficiency w/ Chef Tools
During a short rest, you can cook for some creatures equal to 4+prof bonus. Anyone who eats and expends hit die get an extra d8 healing from the short rest
After a long rest or with an hour of work, you can cook prof bonus number of treats. These treats are good for 8 hours, and can be eaten as a bonus action to gain temp hp equal to the chef's prof bonus


Honestly if you're playing with RAW potions, I quite like the treats. Only thing I can think of with the short rest bit is to use it for roleplay bonuses with NPCs once your proficiency bonus is high enough. See if the DM will give you some sort of bonus to persuasion and diplomacy or what have you when you make an afternoon tea that rivals the desserts of a king's feast. That oughta impress someone.


I am a level 9 Kobold Gloomstalker ranger. The rest of the party are a dragonborn whisper bard/hexblade warlock, a gnome basttlemaster fighter, and a kenku moon druid. The theme of the campaign is a big hex crawl in a desert, currently trying to stop a evil lich demigod from escaping a hell dimension.

we are playing potions raw! so thats fun! Yeah I just really like the idea of playing a character who is a master chef, it has a lot of rp opportunities!

[Pex]

I would rather take Healer or Inspiring Leader.

I have known players and NPCs who are very much into cooking for their characters, so this would be good for them even though I personally find it a waste of a feat. I wouldn't mind the party's adopted NPC having and using it. If a player takes it, he doesn't need my approval.

[Porcupinata]

So how do you cook a Goodberry, anyway?

Actually, there's a serious rules question there - if your party is relying on the Goodberry and/or Create Food and Water spells to keep them going because they're in a place where they can't forage for other food, would you as a DM allow this feat to be used?

I think I would, because it would seem a bit mean not to. It also seems to be in keeping with the flavour of the feat that the person is talented enough as a chef to be able to improve on the already magical food provided by the spells.

[Warder]

I'd allow Create Food & Water to be improved through cooking, but probably not Goodberry. It's just a single berry, what are you going to do with it? Though if a player provided a good explanation for how they improved it, then sure.

[MoiMagnus]

I picked it entirely for flavor and don't really care how good it is, but I am curios


I totally understand. I've personally took the prestidigitation cantrip because it allows me to:
1) Flavour up the food I cook.
2) Warm/cool it.
3) Magically clean the dishes.

It also allows to start fire, which would be practical if I didn't already have "Create Bonefire" for that.
[The DM gave us a +1 HP per hit dice spend during short rest if we're in a situation where I can cook]

[Cicciograna]

Well, if it's flavor that you want, I'd say that "Chef" is the perfect pick.

[sophontteks]

The feat does scale, since it's based on profeciency bonus and hit die. It's a half feat that scales half as fast as a similiar full feat, inspiring leader. But you could get expertise in cooking utensils and push it above that even.

[MoiMagnus]

The feat does scale, since it's based on profeciency bonus and hit die.

About scaling, the feat is unclear to me: is it one d8 per hit die spend, or one d8 per short rest (if you spend at least one hit die). I read it as the latter, so for me the feat only scale on the PB (assuming you keep the same number of short rest per day).

[sophontteks]

About scaling, the feat is unclear to me: is it one d8 per hit die spend, or one d8 per short rest (if you spend at least one hit die). I read it as the latter, so for me the feat only scale on the PB (assuming you keep the same number of short rest per day).
Oh, yes. That's fine. The main appeal is by far the scaling temp hp. Chef is rivaling another powerful full feat in this regard.

[MarkVIIIMarc]

I have a character with an odd Constitution score and am considering this as an alternative to the other Con boosts half feats.

Consider @ level 10 its 10 hit points per day plus one oer hit die rolled during a short rest for such a character plus 1 to Con saves.

[Dork_Forge]

Mechanically the feat would do best in a game where you actually have a chance of dying and running out of hit die, if you play the kind of game where no one really ever runs out of hit die and you're rarely scraping through encounters then you probably won't notice anything but the roleplay.

I don't really understand the treats thing, it's so miniscule it feels like dead space and purely gamist, I'd have preferred something like until your next rest when you get healed you gain an extra prof mod hp or something...

[x3n0n]

Mechanically the feat would do best in a game where you actually have a chance of dying and running out of hit die, if you play the kind of game where no one really ever runs out of hit die and you're rarely scraping through encounters then you probably won't notice anything but the roleplay.

I don't really understand the treats thing, it's so miniscule it feels like dead space and purely gamist, I'd have preferred something like until your next rest when you get healed you gain an extra prof mod hp or something...

It's in a weird space for sure. The THP value has mini-peaks around levels 1, 5, and 9: early in each proficiency band, a couple of snacks might let you delay a short rest (and make the extra d8 short-rest healing more useful). Since you can administer delayed with a BA, they're not actively anti-synergistic with other sources of THP.

Seems like the non-ASI parts are the most valuable in tiers 1 and 2 (where 1 or 2 d8s of HP and single-digit THP can meaningfully extend your day).

The half-ASIs on Wis or Con would have been unusual pre-Tasha's, but now the opportunity cost went up a bunch. Pre-TCoE:
* Con: Resilient clearly wins for a caster. This does something visible for the party, unlike Durable or Tavern Brawler.
* Wis: Resilient wins for anybody who won't automatically get proficiency. I can imagine taking Chef over Observant.

However, now it's competing with things like Fey Touched or Skill Expert, which raises the opportunity cost quite a bit.

As you said, I think you've got to be in a pretty specific kind of campaign, where you are taking short rests and would benefit from spending fewer HDs during them.

[Segev]

What does "playing with potions according to the RAW" have to do with making the chef feat more fun?

[Dork_Forge]

It's in a weird space for sure. The THP value has mini-peaks around levels 1, 5, and 9: early in each proficiency band, a couple of snacks might let you delay a short rest (and make the extra d8 short-rest healing more useful). Since you can administer delayed with a BA, they're not actively anti-synergistic with other sources of THP.

Seems like the non-ASI parts are the most valuable in tiers 1 and 2 (where 1 or 2 d8s of HP and single-digit THP can meaningfully extend your day).

The half-ASIs on Wis or Con would have been unusual pre-Tasha's, but now the opportunity cost went up a bunch. Pre-TCoE:
* Con: Resilient clearly wins for a caster. This does something visible for the party, unlike Durable or Tavern Brawler.
* Wis: Resilient wins for anybody who won't automatically get proficiency. I can imagine taking Chef over Observant.

However, now it's competing with things like Fey Touched or Skill Expert, which raises the opportunity cost quite a bit.

As you said, I think you've got to be in a pretty specific kind of campaign, where you are taking short rests and would benefit from spending fewer HDs during them.

I think it finds its sweet spot in something like a gritty realism game where you can't rely on frequent long rests to replenish things. An Inspiring Leader Bard would be better at this, but at least it can work with that Bard I guess?


What does "playing with potions according to the RAW" have to do with making the chef feat more fun?

A very common homebrew (and based on player interactions, I take it how Critical Role do it) is to let potions be a bonus action. If you are running them normally then the bonus action nature of the treats has some benefit, if you allow potions as a BA then their value falls even further.

[HappyDaze]

The extra d8 can matter if you have players that want to take frequent short rests. It's not as common as players wanting to take frequent long rests, but it's a thing I've seen.

[Waterdeep Merch]

I've been floating the idea of adding it to a team that already has Healer and Inspiring Leader in order to create the mighty Band That Never Dies. You can make some good arguments about Chef not being as good as the other two, definitely, but it's the only half feat and it can play nice in a party that already has the others.

Maybe slap this on a party consisting of bards, clerics, druids, mercy monks, paladins, divine sorcerers, and/or celestial warlocks.

Especially if you have a bard, that extra short rest healing will suddenly compound to mean a ton of it.

[HPisBS]

What I wanna know is:

Does the +1d8 hp from the feat override the +1 hp from proficiency with cook's utensils, or add to it?

Prepare Meals. As part of a short rest, you can prepare a tasty meal that helps your companions regain their strength. You and up to five creatures of your choice regain 1 extra hit point per Hit Die spent during a short rest, provided you have access to your cook's utensils and sufficient food.

[RingoBongo]

Do the treats get stale or expire? Or could you stock up long term?

And if they do could I cast purify food or water on the lot of them?

[PattThe]

What I wanna know is:

Does the +1d8 hp from the feat override the +1 hp from proficiency with cook's utensils, or add to it?

Prepare Meals. As part of a short rest, you can prepare a tasty meal that helps your companions regain their strength. You and up to five creatures of your choice regain 1 extra hit point per Hit Die spent during a short rest, provided you have access to your cook's utensils and sufficient food.

Sounds like a job for Sage Advice.

[Segev]

While we're at it, I assume this is a case of "same source, doesn't stack," but if you have two people with Cooking Utensils in the party, can they both prepare food during the short rest for benefit?

[PattThe]

While we're at it, I assume this is a case of "same source, doesn't stack," but if you have two people with Cooking Utensils in the party, can they both prepare food during the short rest for benefit?
This is what happens when they design HP buffs that don't use Temp HP. They open up a real cluster**** until Sage Advice nails the book shut. Imagine the chaos of some DM out there..

DM: "Okay, everyone had a free feat at level one this campaign. Let's go around the table and hear what everyone picked."
The Party in unison: "Chef."

[Segev]

This is what happens when they design HP buffs that don't use Temp HP. They open up a real cluster**** until Sage Advice nails the book shut. Imagine the chaos of some DM out there..

DM: "Okay, everyone had a free feat at level one this campaign. Let's go around the table and hear what everyone picked."
The Party in unison: "Chef."

Honestly, if that's all they're doing - making a short rest a full heal - they're probably not overpowering anything with that feat choice.

[Galithar]

Oh, yes. That's fine. The main appeal is by far the scaling temp hp. Chef is rivaling another powerful full feat in this regard.

How does proficiency # temp HP compete with level+CHA mod temp HP?

At low levels they will be relatively close. But by level 5 when you get 3 temp HP per snack Inspiring Leader is dishing out a minimum of 4 if you have a Charisma modifier of -1. If you're a Charisma caster, popular takers of the feat, than you have probably +3 making it 8 Temp HP. The next proficiency boost at 9 makes it 4 Temp HP vs. (with a CHA ASI @8) 13 Temp HP.

I guess of you factor in the healing and anyways get two short rests between long rests that adds an effective average of 9 more HP. That keeps it competitive at level 9 but again falls behind by level 13 with +5. 5(+9 average healing) or 14 average effective hitpoints versus 19 or 20 (depending on +4 or +5 CHA).

Since it's a half feat if you have an odd Con or Wis score is decent, but if you don't already have the odd score it's definitely not worth taking in my opinion. And I still don't think it's ever competitive with Inspiring Leader which I think is one of the better Feats in the game.

[Hytheter]

One interesting thing about the treats is that they expire after 8 hours, but only take an hour to make, meaning if you have the time you could be carrying up to 8xprof treats at once. How's 72thp for a 5th level character sound? You might not have the action economy to eat them as fast as you need them, though.

[Galithar]

One interesting thing about the treats is that they expire after 8 hours, but only take an hour to make, meaning if you have the time you could be carrying up to 8xprof treats at once. How's 72thp for a 5th level character sound? You might not have the action economy to eat them as fast as you need them, though.

That's a good point. I didn't think about being able to create more than the one set of treats. That actually does make it a bit more valuable. In my games randomly stopping for hours to cook would be a rare occurrence, and it doesn't say you can prepare them as part of a short rest (probably because you're intended to be busy cooking for the other benefit of the feat). Finding time to stockpile treats could be rare, but when preparing for a known encounter could be valuable.

My reading of the feat is that if you wanted to make treats during a short rest that you would have to bypass taking the rest yourself, though a more permissive DM might allow it to be part of the rest if you forgo the other bullet that rest. Some might even allow both during the same rest.

[iTreeby]

What I wanna know is:

Does the +1d8 hp from the feat override the +1 hp from proficiency with cook's utensils, or add to it?

Prepare Meals. As part of a short rest, you can prepare a tasty meal that helps your companions regain their strength. You and up to five creatures of your choice regain 1 extra hit point per Hit Die spent during a short rest, provided you have access to your cook's utensils and sufficient food.

They do different things, seems like you and five others eat a meal that gives you +1 healing for each hit die spent. You also make 4 plus proficiency meals that give 1d8 healing to anyone who spends any HD. RAW it seems like you are designating individuals who gain benefits from eating your meals so I'd say you could have the separate benefits apply to the same meal.


Technically the utensils and feat don't say how many meals you make in a short rest just how many exrra benefits you can provide. You could make 50 meals on a short rest, most of them would just be regular meals.