So... Which would be better for Icewind Dale... Clockwork Soul or Abberrant Mind?

[samcifer]

I know my plan had been to try a half-orc Eldritch Knight to replace the ice cube my kobold inquisitor rogue got turned into last session, but the DM is letting us use TCoE and is allowing the changed stats ruling, so I'm thinking of giving a half-orc sorcerer a try (with +2 CHA and +1 DEX or CON). I like having more spells and want to try out the new sub-classes, but am a bit torn on which to play.

We get a feat at start up and the new characters will be lv. 4, so I was thinking of taking magic initiate sorcerer (or maybe Wizard) to get Mage Armor for added defenses. Another draw for me is the Trasmutation Meta-Magic, letting me change elemental damage, so I could have a flaming Shatter or a Thunderball (as opposed to a Fireball). Quicken would be my other choice for action economy as well as extra damage.

I really like the lv. 6 Clockwork Soul damage shield option, but I'm wondering if that plus the Half-Orc's feature to drop to 1 hp instead of making death saves along with Mage Armor, the Shield Spell and Absorb Elements along with the CS damage shield is overkill as far as survivability goes.

I like the psychic aspects of the AM sub-class, but wonder of defense is more important than some mind gimmicks, based on the campaign setting. If I were to go AM, I'd still take Mag. Init. for Mage Armor as well as Absorb Elements and Shield for added defenses.

Any advice on this is appreciated. Just curious as to whether or not I'm overreacting to my last PC's death. Rolling HP at each level is also a concern for me as far as survivability goes, and is a contributing factor in my desire for added defenses.

[Trustypeaches]

Uh, why are you taking magic initiate to grab mage armor? Mage Armor is a sorcerer spell.

Also I wouldn't really say Clockwork Soul is more defensive than Aberrant Mind. Sure they get a lot of abjuration spell options, but most of them are things you could pick up from the base Sorcerer spell list if you wanted to.

Their sixth level feature provides a lot of defense, but honestly it's so expensive I would only use it in combination with Armor of Agathys (which you can replace one of the spells on your origin list with).

[samcifer]

Uh, why are you taking magic initiate to grab mage armor? Mage Armor is a sorcerer spell.

Also I wouldn't really say Clockwork Soul is more defensive than Aberrant Mind. Sure they get a lot of abjuration spell options, but most of them are things you could pick up from the base Sorcerer spell list if you wanted to.

Their sixth level feature provides a lot of defense, but honestly it's so expensive I would only use it in combination with Armor of Agathys (which you can replace one of the spells on your origin list with).

Because Sorcs get so few spells to work with and I'd prefer to take other spells for my 'regular slots'.

My spell list (not counting sub-class spells) are:

C:

Acid Splash
Fire Bolt, Mage Hand, Minor Illusion
and Prestidigitation (or Mind Sliver if I were to go CS instead of AM)

Lv1:

Absorb Elements
Chaos Bolt
and Shield

Lv2:

Flaming Sphere
Shatter

Mag. Init.:

Create Bonfire
Shocking Grasp

and Mage Armor

[Kireban]

Magic initiate with sorcerer spells is a nice option for a free cast of mage armor per day. Taking fey touched can be really good too on a clockwork. You get misty step and take thl as the first level enchantment spell. It lets you cast it once per day without using slots.

[samcifer]

Magic initiate with sorcerer spells is a nice option for a free cast of mage armor per day. Taking fey touched can be really good too on a clockwork. You get misty step and take thl as the first level enchantment spell. It lets you cast it once per day without using slots.

I'm strongly considering Fey Touched as well for Bless and Misty Step regardless of which sub-class I go with.

[Trustypeaches]

Because Sorcs get so few spells to work with and I'd prefer to take other spells for my 'regular slots'.
Then there are a lot of far better feats for that, such as Fey Touched. Magic Initiate is pretty mediocre, and isn't helping you push your main stats up.




My spell list (not counting sub-class spells) are:

C:

Acid Splash
Fire Bolt, Mage Hand, Minor Illusion
and Prestidigitation (or Mind Sliver if I were to go CS instead of AM)

Lv1:

Absorb Elements
Chaos Bolt
and Shield

Lv2:

Flaming Sphere
Shatter

Mag. Init.:

Create Bonfire
Shocking Grasp

and Mage Armor
If you go Aberrant Mind, you already get a much better 1st level damage spell than Chaos Bolt with Dissonant Whispers. If you're going clockwork sorcerer and plan to take the Fey Touched feat, I'd choose Dissonant Whispers as your 1st level spell choice still. It's way way better than any other 1st level damage options, and remains useful until at least Tier 3 because of all the extra damage from opportunity attacks you can rack up.

Absorb Elements probably also isn't worth taking until past 5th level IMO, when high elemental damage becomes more common. I also wouldn't bother with Flaming Sphere, on a side note. It's kinda mediocre. I'd sooner take a good crowd control spell like Web.

[micahaphone]

I'd be tempted to play Aberrant Mind with theming around John Carpenter's "the Thing", maybe something horrible frozen in the ice caves lead to your strange terrible new powers. A renegade Star Spawn or something. You're trying to understand them and make sure that there's not more of those aberrations lurking in the ice, waiting to unthaw.

But I could also see a clockwork sorc who is a quasi-cleric of Order for Mechanus or some other force, and you came north to investigate this.... unbalanced weather.

Personally I prefer the Aberrant one, you could even be a local of the area who unfortunately uncovered this Thing in the ice, and now your dreams are full of unknowable terrors that promise doom to the whole world. Better figure out how to stop that, or how to at least get these powers under control so you can sleep soundly.
Magic Initiate: sorc for mage armor and endless cantrips, then I'd be tempted for the Metamagic Adept feat, you'll get extra uses of your excellent level 6 feature. Detect Thoughts will be useful in dark and winding caves, but you can swap out Calm Emotions for something else, and cheaply subtle cast Hold Person or Suggestion is nothing to sniff at. At higher levels you can use 5 sorc points to subtle cast Dominate Person!
-Also I have a personal bias towards "everyman" characters who suddenly have adventure thrust upon them.

If you go clockwork, definitely replace Alarm with Armor of Agathys, you can do some real good retribution damage with the level 6 feature then.

[jojosskul]

If you go clockwork, definitely replace Alarm with Armor of Agathys, you can do some real good retribution damage with the level 6 feature then.

That's an excellent point I hadn't been thinking of with Clockwork's level 6 feature. If you build around it somewhat it could be quite powerful. Maybe take cheaper metamagics overall with the intention of using most sorcery points for damage mitigation? Extend seems obvious for use with Aid and later on Tiny Servant (swapped in by taking out Protection From Energy, probably) A sorcerer who wants to get hit with melee attacks, opens up some interesting build possibilities.

[Cerefel]

If you're talking about Rime of the Frostmaiden specifically, there is a plot hook that aberrant could potentially give you access to in a really unique way

[samcifer]

So looking over the spell lists, Clockwork Soul's spells could be replaced with better ones (than I'd get if I were to take Aberrant Mind):

Alarm and Protection from G&E could be swapped out for Absorb Elements (or Mage Armor) and Shield for a better spell line-up, but I worry that the Shield mechanic would be overkill on defenses as a knee-jerk reaction to my last character being one-shot-ed last session (as well as the two other times he took damage from attacks he ended up making death saves) and that I'm being too paranoid over dying in Icewind Dale. I mean I'll be a half-orc with Absorb Elements (for protection from cold damage attacks like the one that killed my rogue) and Shield as well as Mage armor might already be overkill, so the extra damage shield might be something I'll never need.

AM could be a fun sub-class that would only need me to chance a single spell (Calm Emotions changed for either Hold Person or Tasha's Mind Whip (I like having a spell that targets a weak save and can handicap the target so thoroughly for a round), but the lack of a damage shield like CS has is making me doubt if it's the better choice for me in this campaign.

That's my real concern and reason for not being able to make up my mind on which sub-class to take here.

EDIT:

So if I went CS, my spell list would look something like this, taking 4 MMs with Metamagic Initiate for Empowered and Subtle MMs as well as Quickened and Transmuted):

C:

Acid Splash
Create Bonfire
Fire Bolt
Mind Sliver
Minor Illusion

(from Magic Initiate: Wizard: Mage Hand and Prestidigitation


Lv1:

Chaos Bolt
Absorb Elements (replaces Alarm)
Shield (replaces Protection from Evil and Good)
Mage Armor (Mag. Init: Wizard)

Lv2:

Flaming Sphere (not the best, but it's fire damage that can occur several times over different rounds for a single spell slot)
Misty Step
Tasha's Mind Whip
Aid
Lesser Restoration (Might replace with Detect Thoughts as LR has come up rarely as useful in any campaigns I've played in)



AM variation (has Fey-Touched as I won't need Metamagic Initiate as much as with CS. I'd only take Transmuted and Quickened as my MMs so I can have BA casting ogf all my spells, not just the Psionic ones):

Acid Splash
Fire Bolt
Mage Hand
Mind Sliver
Minor Illusion
Prestidigitation
Create Bonfire (Mag. Init.: Sorc)
Shocking Grasp (Mag. Init.: Sorc, taken because I'd get Mind Sliver for my sub-class)

Lv1:

Absorb Ele.
Chaos Bolt
Shield
Arms of Hadar
Dissonant Whispers
Mage Armor (Mag. Init,.: Sorc)
Bless (Fey-Touched)

Lv. 2:

Flaming Sphere
Shatter
Detect Thoughts
Hold Person (replaces Calm emotions)
Misty Step (Fey-Touched)