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Techcaliber
2020-11-29, 09:59 PM
Hello! Recently I’ve had an idea for a campaign I don’t think D&D 5e would fit very will, and as such, I thought it would be a good opportunity to expand my realm of experience and learn a new game system.

I’ve used some D20 Modern in the past and thought that would be a good option, but I wanted to know if there were any other options you think would work well. Thanks in advance!

EDIT: So I've seen some posts that want more information, but at the time I didn't have it. Now I do, so here it is.
- The setting would be between 1990-2010 (still deciding, but that's the basic range I want)
- By "Modern-Fantasy", I am picturing something where the world is the same as it is now, but with a (oh watch out, this is super original) hidden world of magic.

Mastikator
2020-11-29, 10:45 PM
Can you be more specific what the game will be about? Spy stuff? Gun play? Vehicle adventure? Hacking? Heist? Noir? Modern Warfare? Cosmopolitan stuff? Suburban horror stories? If your answer is "everything" then GURPS does the job, but "everything" is a lot of work for a DM and it's crunch heavy while playing.

Shadowrun is a magic cyberpunk game, just strip out all the scifi and it becomes an urban fantasy game.

There's FATE with Dresden Files RPG which is more of a detective/urban fantasy

GentlemanVoodoo
2020-11-29, 10:47 PM
Well, modern like games that come to mind off the bat would be Fate mostly. Gurps/Rifts from what I remember has a sizable catalog for modern setting items. I have also heard Savage Worlds has done some good things but have no real experience with this one.

zarionofarabel
2020-11-29, 10:59 PM
Conspiracy X for X-Files/Fringe style games. For more supernatural try Ghosts of Albion, Army of Darkness, Angel, or Buffy the Vampire Slayer. All of these games use Unisystem.

Alternatively you could use one of the White Wolf games. Chronicles of Darkness for normal people, or one of the others like Vampire or Changeling if you want to play supernatural characters.

If you want an even easier system to use get Hollow Earth Expedition, and the supplemental books, Secrets of the Surface World, Mysteries of the Hollow Earth, and Revelations of Mars. Then just set the campaign in a modern setting instead of the 1930s.

Techcaliber
2020-11-29, 11:01 PM
Can you be more specific what the game will be about? Spy stuff? Gun play? Vehicle adventure? Hacking? Heist? Noir? Modern Warfare? Cosmopolitan stuff? Suburban horror stories? If your answer is "everything" then GURPS does the job, but "everything" is a lot of work for a DM and it's crunch heavy while playing.

Shadowrun is a magic cyberpunk game, just strip out all the scifi and it becomes an urban fantasy game.

There's FATE with Dresden Files RPG which is more of a detective/urban fantasy

Wish I could give more details that would actually help, but the idea is still pretty vague in my head. I’ll be sure to check out these systems, so thank you!

Techcaliber
2020-11-29, 11:02 PM
Well, modern like games that come to mind off the bat would be Fate mostly. Gurps/Rifts from what I remember has a sizable catalog for modern setting items. I have also heard Savage Worlds has done some good things but have no real experience with this one.

Thanks! I’ll be sure to give them a look over.

Techcaliber
2020-11-29, 11:03 PM
Conspiracy X for X-Files/Fringe style games. For more supernatural try Ghosts of Albion, Army of Darkness, Angel, or Buffy the Vampire Slayer. All of these games use Unisystem.

Alternatively you could use one of the White Wolf games. Chronicles of Darkness for normal people, or one of the others like Vampire or Changeling if you want to play supernatural characters.

If you want an even easier system to use get Hollow Earth Expedition, and the supplemental books, Secrets of the Surface World, Mysteries of the Hollow Earth, and Revelations of Mars. Then just set the campaign in a modern setting instead of the 1930s.

It always amazes me to see just how many systems are out there. Thank you so much, I’ll be giving these a look over!

Grod_The_Giant
2020-11-30, 11:12 AM
There are probably two big points to consider when looking for a new system: mechanics and genre.

Mechanics: Basically, how complicated a system do you want? You can simply all the way down to something like Fiasco (https://bullypulpitgames.com/games/fiasco/) that's little more than freeform with some loose incentives, or you can go all the way in the other direction at get something like Phoenix Command (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phoenix_Command) that has you modeling things like bullet arc.

Since you said you're mostly familiar with 5e D&D... do you want something more detailed, or something more streamlined? What are the parts you really like and can't imagine living without, and what are your pet peeves?

Genre: "Modern fantasy" is pretty vague, and could cover anything from... I dunno, Friday the 13th to Marvel movies. What are your pop culture touchstones here? Are you looking for "D&D with guns?" Something more like Supernatural, with human badasses punching way above their weight class? A Happy Potter style hidden magical world? Something more Lovecraftian where magic, madness, and horror are intimately intertwined?

Dungeons and Dragons, by this point, is a genre all of its own-- not only is it fantasy adventuring, it's attrition- and combat-oriented gaming with heavily archetypal heroes, the expectation of victory, and a never-ending ladder of power growth. It's races and classes, it's spell slot based magic and limited use special abilities, it's Fighters and Wizards and fireball and kobolds.

farothel
2020-11-30, 02:48 PM
Alternity is an older D20 system, but I feel it's very robust, although quite lethal. It has things like mutants, magic in different systems, and a lot more. Also everything works the same way, whether it's a skill, a spell, a mutant ability. Character creation can take a while, but once you're playing it's very easy.

Ajustusdaniel
2020-11-30, 03:41 PM
I'll rarely not suggest the PbtA engine when given half an opportunity so...

Urban Shadows covers various supernatural groups scheming and competing in an Urban environment. Think Dresden Files or Angel.

Monsterhearts does much the same, but assumes everyone's teenagers and consequently dials up the angst.

I haven't played Monster of the Week myself, but my understanding is it's geared towards more episodic fare, along the lines of non-arc episodes Supernatural or X-files.

Duff
2020-11-30, 10:52 PM
There's also Mage and/or Changeling from World of Darkness which could go modern fantasy if you want
Or witchcraft. or Over The Edge

Anonymouswizard
2020-11-30, 11:22 PM
There's just a ton of modern fantasy systems. Just off thetop on my head:

Most Whie Wolf stuff, including oWoD, nWoD/CofD, and Scion. Exalted is in a constructed less advanced world, but has rules for running a modern=styled game in one book, and the Trinity games are more sci-fi.

Unknown Armies, which gets weird. Adept schools in the current corebook include farm-wizards, film-wizards, clothing-wizards, car-wizards, and fandom-wizards, although Avatars are more sane (partially because they need to emulate a widely-percieved archetype, mostly because they loose magic for going too mad). Aery good setting aned a pretty decent system if you can handle the combat rules beginning with 'six ways to avoid a fight'.

Pretty much any generic system.

A couple of PbtA games, the Twiglet one and the Buffy one.

Some Unisystem games, I believe Witchcraft, Buffy, and Angel all exist in such a setting.

Any supers game will manage it with a bit of work.

How modern are we talking here? Eldritch Skies is another unisystemor Savage Worlds game which only includes a few pieces of SF technology. And Lovecraft.

Grod_The_Giant
2020-12-01, 11:31 AM
A few notes on generics:

Fate is a classic for a reason--it's fast, reasonably simple, and highly customizable-- but it does operate on story-logic more than in-game logic, and requires a very different GMing style from most other RPGs. There's a generic version (Fate Core), and plenty of independant systems built using the same engine, such as the aforementioned Dresden Files RPG (which does an awe-inspiring job of emulating the Dresden Files books and themes, but would probably stumble if you tried to use it for anything else). Like STaRS, it'll work for just about anything.
Mutants and Masterminds 3e is, ostentatiously, a superhero game, but it's really more of a "build-your-own-superpowers" system. It's reasonably close to D&D, which can make the transition easier, though the way it handles health in particular is radically different. If you want a combat-oriented game where the party has a wide variety of incredible powers (be they super or magic), it's about as good as it gets, but it can fall apart if you want to have similar characters--the Avengers will work great, but Into the Spiderverse will feel like a D&D game where everyone's playing a Fighter.
As I so often do, I'm going to plug my system, STaRS (Simple Tabletop Roleplaying System). It's a fairly rules-light generic that distinguishes itself from a lot of similar options (ie, Fate) by not relying on "narrativist" rules. It's easy to run and lightning-fast in play. Uniquely, the "conflict" system is generic enough to be used for all for all sorts of social interactions, environmental action sequences, and even things like investigations (all of which is explored in depth in the book). Magic and other superpowers are self-described, with a cost based on how broadly useful they are. It won't always be the best option for a given game, but it'll just about always work.


Without a little more guidance on what specific sort of game you're looking to run, I can't really do better than that.

Alteiner
2020-12-02, 11:45 AM
Kamigakari is my go-to for something like this. It's a Japanese tabletop RPG set in a modern setting with a hidden supernatural world. Humankind is at risk of destruction by demons and monsters combated by a number of secret organizations ranging from a secret order of demon-hunting assassins, to a mage association, to a hidden group within the Catholic church, to an office of special provisions within the government and a megacorp using magical technology to create cyborg supersoldiers. PCs take the role of elites within the supernatural world called Godhunters, who are the only ones capable of killing the aramitama, false gods who, if left to their own devices, could someday ascend in power to the Avatar of Destruction capable of destroying the world. Godhunters range from once-ordinary humans who've been drawn into the hidden world, the heirs to mage families and descendants of legendary heroes and the gods of old, to divine spirits, the spirits of legendary heroes called to the protect the present world and even people from other worlds who've transcended the boundaries of space and time to come to modern-day Earth.

It's a fairly episodic game generally intended for a given "arc" to deal with a single aramitama, and even includes rules for rotating GMs. Generally, the PCs start out separate and doing whatever it is they do between hunts, and independently become aware of the ongoing threat before finding each other. It has an active community on Discord and in a few other places around the internet, so you won't have trouble finding people to bounce ideas off of for whatever kind of game you're thinking of doing.

ngilop
2020-12-02, 12:23 PM
Shadow Run. I am not sure why none have mentioned it before, it was a hidden natural world then the Long Count of the Mayans happened.

Faily
2020-12-05, 10:06 AM
Supernatural/Sci-fi fantasy: Delta Green for military/government agents researching paranormal mysteries. Similarly to Call of Cthulhu, but more if there were government agencies/divisions assigned to look into Lovecraftian horrors around America. Uses Call of Cthulhu's system. The Laundry Files runs in a similar vein, but set in England with more magic and less military. Think more civil servants with magic working on a shoe-string budget to stop teenagers from summoning shoggoths in their mom's basement. Uses Basic Roleplaying System, similarly to CoC.

Horror fantasy: Kult (uses Powered by the Apocalypse). For dystopian-supernatural horror, and is very much for a mature and safe group that is comfortable playing with difficult themes and scenarios.

Futuristic fantasy: Numenera by Monte Cook (uses its own system). Set on earth in a far distant future, in what is called the 9th World (being the 9th incarnation of "the world"). Is very much a fantasy-setting, has it has elements of magic, magic items, and fantasy-themes, but it is also with futuristic technology of sorts in a kind of post-apocalyptic world.

Trench coats and katanas: World of Darkness, and pretty much a lot of White Wolf games, like Vampire (many play this game with a stronger focus on the superpowers of the vampire and less on the angst of no longer being human), Werewolf, Hunter, Mage, Changeling, Geist, etc...

Super-powered contemporary fantasy: Exalted and Scion, from White Wolf. Anything you can do in the other White Wolf games, but on steroids. (I personally like the metaplot of Scion the best, which also does have strong fantasy-elements to it, but a lot of that stems from taking directly from many old heroes and legends that in return inspired creators of fantasy-litterature that influenced D&D's writers over the years).

MoiMagnus
2020-12-06, 12:17 PM
Mutant and Mastermind should work as long as you expect the game to be epic or spectacular of some kind.
Default settings assume that superheroes are famous and everywhere, but the rules don't force that, secret wars can also be epic.

Techcaliber
2020-12-07, 11:34 AM
Shadow Run. I am not sure why none have mentioned it before, it was a hidden natural world then the Long Count of the Mayans happened.

I'd been looking into Shadowrun, but I was sure which edition would be best. Any recommendations there?

RifleAvenger
2020-12-07, 11:04 PM
I'd been looking into Shadowrun, but I was sure which edition would be best. Any recommendations there?

Oh boy, is THAT a question.

The lazy answer I can give is to look this over: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1zDo6pfk1BPgKs8Ak16zPqB2gqPYM7gKu-NvAwmlXhbc/edit#heading=h.wl3vw45t3ud8

This document goes over the coarse differences between the editions, and then has guest testimonials in favor of each edition (except 2e, for now).
----------
One big difference to know immediately is that 1e-3e are a very 80s take on cyberpunk. Everything is wired, your PCs may look like or fight against Fist of the North Star extras, and the world while still crappy is less of a paranoia inducing panopticon (though that last point is GM dependent). 4e onward has a wireless matrix with more similarities to the internet we know in real life. Pulling off a run without being noticed, or at least without incurring major consequences (sometimes a frontal assault is the best choice), has a lot more factors to consider. That said, the core books very helpfully point out that the impression of constant surveillance does not translate into the reality of perfect surveillance.

The only edition I've played, and the one I'll recommend, is 4e20A.


It is, by far, the best written and organized of the bunch; certainly moreso than 5e and especially the dreck that is 6e.
I like 4e's attempt to redraft Shadowrun's depiction of the future to better reflect a more recent extrapolation of our times to cyberpunk. I am simply not interested in a setting stuck in an 80s prediction of the future.
4e also uses a point buy system as its default option for character creation, which I see as a benefit.
Magic has gotten more and more powerful in Shadowrun over time. While magic is still *very* strongin 4eA20, it's not quite as powercrept as it got to be in 5e.
No hardcaps on die pool. 5e tried to prevent hilariously oversized dice pools, but only wound up making PCs practically unable to do anything outside their specialty. 4e at least lets you try, and still has an optional cap rule presented in the core book.


5e's biggest advantage is that it tried to simplify some aspects of the game, but I think this effort is held back by the core book's poor organization. 5e also currently has the most and best community support, if only because 6e is a dumpster fire and people are hesitant to switch to it. Anarchy, a rules-lite version of 5e, also exists.

Be aware that any edition of Shadowrun is rough on the GM, and some (including my recommendation of 4e) are rough on players during character gen (to the point people recommend a tool called "Chummer" to do it). Roll xdX and count successes (5+) may seem simple on the surface, but the details bloat pretty quickly. 1e and Anarchy are exceptions in terms of bloated crunch, but they swing in the opposite direction where the GM has to improvise way more things on the fly.

Techcaliber
2020-12-09, 07:54 PM
Oh boy, is THAT a question.

The lazy answer I can give is to look this over: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1zDo6pfk1BPgKs8Ak16zPqB2gqPYM7gKu-NvAwmlXhbc/edit#heading=h.wl3vw45t3ud8

This document goes over the coarse differences between the editions, and then has guest testimonials in favor of each edition (except 2e, for now).
----------
One big difference to know immediately is that 1e-3e are a very 80s take on cyberpunk. Everything is wired, your PCs may look like or fight against Fist of the North Star extras, and the world while still crappy is less of a paranoia inducing panopticon (though that last point is GM dependent). 4e onward has a wireless matrix with more similarities to the internet we know in real life. Pulling off a run without being noticed, or at least without incurring major consequences (sometimes a frontal assault is the best choice), has a lot more factors to consider. That said, the core books very helpfully point out that the impression of constant surveillance does not translate into the reality of perfect surveillance.

The only edition I've played, and the one I'll recommend, is 4e20A.


It is, by far, the best written and organized of the bunch; certainly moreso than 5e and especially the dreck that is 6e.
I like 4e's attempt to redraft Shadowrun's depiction of the future to better reflect a more recent extrapolation of our times to cyberpunk. I am simply not interested in a setting stuck in an 80s prediction of the future.
4e also uses a point buy system as its default option for character creation, which I see as a benefit.
Magic has gotten more and more powerful in Shadowrun over time. While magic is still *very* strongin 4eA20, it's not quite as powercrept as it got to be in 5e.
No hardcaps on die pool. 5e tried to prevent hilariously oversized dice pools, but only wound up making PCs practically unable to do anything outside their specialty. 4e at least lets you try, and still has an optional cap rule presented in the core book.


5e's biggest advantage is that it tried to simplify some aspects of the game, but I think this effort is held back by the core book's poor organization. 5e also currently has the most and best community support, if only because 6e is a dumpster fire and people are hesitant to switch to it. Anarchy, a rules-lite version of 5e, also exists.

Be aware that any edition of Shadowrun is rough on the GM, and some (including my recommendation of 4e) are rough on players during character gen (to the point people recommend a tool called "Chummer" to do it). Roll xdX and count successes (5+) may seem simple on the surface, but the details bloat pretty quickly. 1e and Anarchy are exceptions in terms of bloated crunch, but they swing in the opposite direction where the GM has to improvise way more things on the fly.

Thanks for the great feedback! I'll be checking out that Doc, and I'll be sure to check out 4e!