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View Full Version : Rules Q&A shadow planar binding, real monsters or shadow monsters?



newguydude1
2020-11-30, 04:19 PM
shadowcraft mage + miracle = shadow planar binding or shadow greater planar binding if you somehow get access to the demonic domain.
theres as the questionable reading of shades.

so anyways if you cast shadow planar binding, do you get a free willed shadow creature or a regular creature?

both summon spells and calling spells target real creatures, and shadow summon spells like halasters fetch create free willed shadow creatures.

Clementx
2020-11-30, 06:04 PM
Planar binding is Calling, not summoning. It has a target, the extraplanar creature, which it teleports and compels to serve. It has a chance to fail like any nondamaging effect, in which case it would fail to move the creature. Summon X spells have an effect, a copy of the creature, which is 20% real with 20% HP. But in general, I would recommend for flavor that a Shadowcraft Mage Call creatures from the PoShadow anyways, so they will be shadowy, but as real as always, to better confound enemies facing illusions they can will to overcome until they get smacked by a undeniable creature.

DM discretion for more fun would be to call the creature, which appears behind the caster instead of in the circle, tap him on the shoulder, and ask him WTF he thinks he is doing.

Note that Planar Ally spells have an Effect line, despite being almost the same as Binding. Spell formatting is pretty inconsistent, but Planar Binding's format is more in line with the effect it describes, and resolves this edge case better if you consider Planar Ally to be poorly written.

mabriss lethe
2020-11-30, 06:04 PM
My best guess is that it would give you a real creature. Shadow evocation doesn't cover summoning and calling normally. Just that the spell effect is treated as normal unless disbelieved. In this case, the target creature is the one called by planar binding, so it gets a save to disbelieve, which given shadowcraft mage shenanigans, could be a good thing for you.

Metaanalysis: Shadowcraft mages aren't duplicating creatures, but using a backdoor reality hack to open a portal through shadow and fool a creature into believing it's being genuinely called. Once called and successfully bound (that's the part where it's shadow nature is most apparent) then the creature behaves as any other bound creature would.

EDIT: rereading the text of shadow evocation, Using miracle as the vector, you'd Call the creature using shadow shenanigans. That creature then get's the opportunity to make a save to disbelieve, which is pass/fail. Since it's an instantaneous effect, that's the only point where the magic is actually happening. if it disbelieves, then the spell fails automatically. If the creature fails to disbelieve, the creature then gets its normal save to resist the call and the spell proceeds as per the relevant text. You could literally tell the creature you called it with an illusion at that point and it wouldn't matter, since the spell effect is already done and gone the moment it appears before you.. There is not magic remaining to disbelieve.