taint prc requirements and obtaining taint

[newguydude1]

i need tainted sorcerer. so, so badly. it will solve 100% of all my woes i am feeling at this moment. but it has a taint 4 requirement. so i thought it was unaccessable but then you look at the corrupt avenger prc

Entry Requirements
...
Taint: Moderate corruption
...
Adaptation
...
If you prefer not to use the taint mechanics in your campaign, you could change the avenger’s abilities so that they are powered by the sanction of this divine patron of retribution.

so no taint campaigns can have corrupt avengers. which means in no taint campaigns you can completely ignore the taint requirement of the prc instead of the prc being inaccessible. am i right?



im having trouble finding anything here, but how do you get taint that isnt related to a specific location or a specific... thingy. like black grass?

it says evil acts bestow taint, but i dont see anywhere that lists said evil acts. in campaigns that use taint system i need a way to get my taint score up before level 5.

the only thing i found is summoning a taint elemental and have it hit you, but because i multiclass i dont get 3rd level spells until 6 or 7. i need evil acts! so i can perform them before or at level 5!




Tainted Spellcasting (Su): Rather than using a key ability score for spellcasting, a tainted sorcerer uses her taint score. To cast a spell, a tainted sorcerer must have a taint score at least equal to the spell's level. Tainted sorcerer bonus spells are based on a number equal to the character's taint score + 10, and saving throws against tainted sorcerer spells have a DC of 10 + spell level + the tainted sorcerer's taint score. A tainted sorcerer accumulates taint for casting her spells. All spells a tainted sorcerer casts are evil spells. She must make a Fortitude save (DC 10 + spell level) or increase her taint score by 1.

this is optional right? if i want to not cast a tainted spell, i can right? like if i have sorcerer and wizard, and apply tainted spellcasting to wizard, i dont need a taint score to cast sorcerer spells right?

[Doctor Despair]

All undead have a taint score based equal to their charisma score +1. That's in Heroes of Horror. If taint exists at all, taking Necropolitan should give you a taint score, even if there are no other sources of taint in the world.

[Anthrowhale]

I believe Maho-Tsukai is superior to Tainted Sorcerer.

The Tainted Spellcasting mechanic doesn't sound optional. However, you may be able to lose it via Ability Rip.

There is a Maho spell called "cloud of taint" which provides taint directly.

[newguydude1]

All undead have a taint score based equal to their charisma score +1. That's in Heroes of Horror. If taint exists at all, taking Necropolitan should give you a taint score, even if there are no other sources of taint in the world.

i thought about this but it requires you to petition an npc to perform the ritual on you. unless theres a way i can cast this ritual on myself its not that useful for me.


I believe Maho-Tsukai is superior to Tainted Sorcerer.

The Tainted Spellcasting mechanic doesn't sound optional. However, you may be able to lose it via Ability Rip.

There is a Maho spell called "cloud of taint" which provides taint directly.

took a look, maho is identical to tainted sorcerer. only difference is maho has its own spell list while tainted sorcerer does not. maho has the same tainted spellcasting. i think tainted sorcerer is superior.

and i think summoning a devil (lemure) with sm 2 is easier than summoning a shadowlands thing. unless lemures cant teach you how to become a tainted sorcerer due to their mindlessness.

[Anthrowhale]

took a look, maho is identical to tainted sorcerer. only difference is maho has its own spell list while tainted sorcerer does not. maho has the same tainted spellcasting. i think tainted sorcerer is superior.

Maho-Tsukai get spell access as a wizard and the Maho-Tsukai spell list is in addition to the base class spell list. They also have more spells known than a sorcerer.

[newguydude1]

Maho-Tsukai get spell access as a wizard and the Maho-Tsukai spell list is in addition to the base class spell list. They also have more spells known than a sorcerer.

i cant find the text that says maho gets all the wizard spells.

also how do you summon a shadowland spirit? im not familiar with oa. you can summon a devil with smii.

the only real good thing im seeing about maho is that he has lesser planar binding as a 4th level spell instead of 5th which makes it superior to nar demonbinder.

[Doctor Despair]

You could also use Wyrm Wizard or Recaster to steal the Cloud of Taint spell

[newguydude1]

You could also use Wyrm Wizard or Recaster to steal the Cloud of Taint spell

summon monster iii is better because theres a thing called a taint elemental that bestows taint on hit and smiii summons any small elemental and smiii is a 3rd level spell while cloud of taint is 4th level.

im trying to enter tainted sorcerer at level 5 as wiz3/dreadnecro1. i cant fit druid3 in there for natures ally 2. and i cant get wyrm wizard this early because wyrm wizard has skill prerequisites.

theres no mundane way of getting taint? i have access to animal companions, zombies, and lemures. theres gotta be a way to generate taint from that.

[Anthrowhale]

i cant find the text that says maho gets all the wizard spells.
It's here:

When a maho-tsukai advances a level, she can learn her new spells from either her old spell list or the maho-tsukai spell list...


also how do you summon a shadowland spirit? im not familiar with oa. you can summon a devil with smii.

I'm not sure how, before you are maho-tsukai. (It's easy after.)

[newguydude1]

would consuming undead or fiend flesh result in gaining of taint?

so like i make a riding dog zombie, and i eat parts of it alive. undead zombies are tainted creatures right? so wouldnt consuming tainted creatures result in taint?
or i summon a lemure, and then i eat parts of it alive.

[sleepyphoenixx]

Check the section on taint in OA again.

Iirc there's a rule that any caster can learn a spell as a maho spell with a knowledge(shadowlands) check as long as it's on the Maho-Tsukai list. Casting a maho spell requires passing a will save or you gain 1 taint.

As for summoning a shadowlands spirit, according to the rules for the Spirit Binding spells all incorporeal undead count as spirits, among other things. Complete Arcane also has the list iirc.
I'm not sure if anything valid is on the SM lists but it's worth a look at least. Otherwise see if you can buy the spellcasting service from a Wu Jen.

Edit: the actual rules. Seems i misremembered slightly.

A shugenja, sorcerer, or adept who researches maho can learn
a spell from the maho-tsukai spell list instead of her normal
spell list if she makes a Knowledge (Shadowlands) check against
a DC of 15 + the spell’s level. This spell counts against the character’s normal spells known, and if the character is a shugenja, it
counts as a spell outside the character’s favored element.
Casting maho spells carries a terrible cost, however. Any
character who casts a maho spell (a spell from the maho-tsukai
spell list) must make a Fortitude save (DC 10 + spell level) or
increase her Taint score by 1. The character must make this
saving throw every time she casts a maho spell.

As for summoning shadowlands spirits, SM is a Maho-Tsukai spell and they get special rules for it:

SUMMON MONSTER
The various summon monsterspells functions as described in the
Player’s Handbook, but the monsters available for a maho-tsukai
to summon are specific and limited. Most of the creatures a
maho-tsukai can summon are kansen—corrupt elemental
spirits from the Shadowlands. These are normal elementals
(any type) with the fiendish template applied and the Shadowlands type modifier.
As described in Chapter 9: Monsters, a garegosu no bakemono is a fiendish giant octopus with the Shadowlands type
modifier and a feed ability similar to a barghest’s. Like other
giant octopi, it is mobile on land.

[newguydude1]

Check the section on taint in OA again.

Iirc there's a rule that any caster can learn a spell as a maho spell with a knowledge(shadowlands) check as long as it's on the Maho-Tsukai list. Casting a maho spell requires passing a will save or you gain 1 taint.

As for summoning a shadowlands spirit, according to the rules for the Spirit Binding spells all incorporeal undead count as spirits, among other things. Complete Arcane also has the list iirc.
I'm not sure if anything valid is on the SM lists but it's worth a look at least. Otherwise see if you can buy the spellcasting service from a Wu Jen.

Edit: the actual rules. Seems i misremembered slightly.

alright! this is better than nothing. its something. just be a sorcerer, pass a knowledge shadowlands check, and cast the 1st level maho spell 4 times while intentionally failing the saving throw.


As for summoning shadowlands spirits, SM is a Maho-Tsukai spell and they get special rules for it:

you need to be able to summon the shadowland spirit as a non-maho if you wnat to use summoning as a way to meeting the prerequisite for that class.

anyways youve been tremendously helpful.

edit: oh i c what you mean. your saying maho's summon monster is a different spell than normal summon monster. but even if thats true you cant summon a shadowland spirit (kansen) until smiii. unless fiendish dire rat counts.

[ShurikVch]

Some other things from OA:

Tainted weapon enhancement (+2): every time you hit a honorable character or creature, you must make Fort save or get 1 taint
Also, Tainted bows, crossbows, and slings bestow that power upon their ammunition
Just fail the first 4 saves
Note: nowhere in the RAW it said the damage must be lethal :smallwink:

Oni Armor have inbuilt claws which bestows 1 taint with every hit; but costs 42350 gp

Bakemono (LA +0) starts the game with Taint 3 (but -4 Cha penalty :smallfrown:)

[GrayDeath]

i thought about this but it requires you to petition an npc to perform the ritual on you. unless theres a way i can cast this ritual on myself its not that useful for me.


Nope. it just requires you to not be on bad footing with the cult they serve, and to pay them.

No petitioning necessary unless you want to save the gold and offer a deed.^^

Now, if you cant find people to do that, how do you expect to get to all the encessary Shadowland locations for your Taint?
There are reasons that, RAW, Settings must specifically be allowed when not playing in them. :)




took a look, maho is identical to tainted sorcerer. only difference is maho has its own spell list while tainted sorcerer does not. maho has the same tainted spellcasting. i think tainted sorcerer is superior.

and i think summoning a devil (lemure) with sm 2 is easier than summoning a shadowlands thing. unless lemures cant teach you how to become a tainted sorcerer due to their mindlessness.

Obvioulsy a being without a Mind cannot Teach anyone anything, with the exception of how to kill it or keep it alive, and even that requires trial and error. ^^



As has been explained by others, a Maho is a more or less Upgrade to a Wizard (as long as one ignores the Settings fluff/does not have ti interact with the factions hunting down and killing tainted people there...), so yes, outside of specific situations, it is clearly superior to a Sorcerer.

However since you seem to be playing alone (why, btw, if you dont mind the question? Youa re not only suffering mechanically, but also losing out on at least half the Fun of the Game...).




also how do you summon a shadowland spirit? im not familiar with oa. you can summon a devil with smii.

the only real good thing im seeing about maho is that he has lesser planar binding as a 4th level spell instead of 5th which makes it superior to nar demonbinder.

You only can summon Shadowland Spirits if you are playing in Rokugan, or your Dm specifically crossed over wherever you paly with it, otherwise the resp4ective spirits and Spells dont exist.

Better make sure, as I seem to remember yous tating repeatedly and very loudly that your DM is "RAW or DIE(!!!)^^.


Less jokingly, how about trying to find a group to adventure with?
Even if its only "inGame" and youa re still playing a Solo Game, fellow adventurers would allow you to circumvent a LOT of the problems for which you are asking for solutions here.

Just my 2 CP.

[newguydude1]

Obvioulsy a being without a Mind cannot Teach anyone anything, with the exception of how to kill it or keep it alive, and even that requires trial and error. ^^

made another thread about the subject matter and the consensus there was the mere act of summoning the devil would give me the know how to become a tainted sorcerer, no teaching necessary.
https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?623510-would-summoning-a-lemure-qualify-you-for-tainted-sorcerer


However since you seem to be playing alone (why, btw, if you dont mind the question? Youa re not only suffering mechanically, but also losing out on at least half the Fun of the Game...).

i have a group. i just like making my characters fully self sufficient. for fun. and my dm doesnt mind throwing my characters through a gauntlet so its a win win.


Better make sure, as I seem to remember yous tating repeatedly and very loudly that your DM is "RAW or DIE(!!!)^^.

he is raw or die. 100%. setting specific material is also very highly frowned upon. but he treats the adaptation section of prcs as raw too. so i can be a wyrm wizard who bases his knowledge from consorting with fiends or mephits instead of dragons if i so choose.


how do you expect to get to all the encessary Shadowland locations for your Taint?.

heroes of horror gave non setting taint rules that directy says is supposed to be an update and to replace the taint rules in oa and unearthed arcana.

do you know how to get taint of hoh's rules without 3rd level spells? smiii can summon a taint elemental but i need the 4 taint by level 3 or 4.

[sleepyphoenixx]

do you know how to get taint of hoh's rules without 3rd level spells? smiii can summon a taint elemental but i need the 4 taint by level 3 or 4.

Assuming Abyssal Blackgrass is nonmagical (the description doesn't say) you could create it with Hidden Talent: Psionic Minor Creation, though that'd cost a feat.

[newguydude1]

Assuming Abyssal Blackgrass is nonmagical (the description doesn't say) you could create it with Hidden Talent: Psionic Minor Creation, though that'd cost a feat.

hah i thought of the samething. but hidden talent is like precocious apprentice, a sidebar feat.

but yeah better than nothing.

so the best raw way is hidden talent
another way is the sidebar violence and taint and just torture my animal companion a few times. obviously i hate this because torture is not something im comfortable with.

i guess an unknown way is to do "things" with zombies because undead have taint scores built in. maybe consume part of them, or maybe stay in physical contact with it for an extended period of time?