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sayaijin
2020-12-12, 10:41 AM
Blood Mage (sorcerous origin)

Some sorcerers have found the source of their power not in their heritage or bloodline, but rather in the use of their own blood. These mages empower their spell casting by expending some of their own life force. Favoring their own resolve over their wiles, these sorcerers are often more brutish than others.


Blood Magic
You learn additional spells when you reach certain levels in this class, as shown on the Blood Magic Spells table. Each spell counts as a sorcerer spell for you, but it doesn’t count against the number of sorcerer spells you know. These spells can’t be replaced when you gain a level in this class.

Whenever you gain a sorcerer level, you can replace one spell you gained from this feature with another spell of the same level. The new spell must be an evocation or abjuration spell from the sorcerer, warlock, or wizard spell list.

Blood Magic Spells
Sorcerer Level Spells
1st Armor of Agathys, Sleep
3rd Shadow Blade, Tasha's Mind Whip
5th Summon Shadowspawn, Vampiric Touch
7th Death Ward, Sickening Radiance
9th Cloudkill, Dominate Person

Corporeal Casting
Unlike other sorcerers, your power comes not from your will or influence but from your own body.
When you choose this origin at 1st level, Constitution becomes your spellcasting ability for your sorcerer spells, and any class ability that uses your charisma modifier instead uses your constitution.
Also, as a bonus action, you can roll any number of hit dice you own and take damage equal to the sum. The next spell you cast is treated as if the spell slot you used to cast it was the actual spell slot plus the number of hit dice rolled. You do not lose hit dice using this feature.

Crimson Resolve
Starting at 6th level, your Sorcerer hit die becomes a d10 instead of a d6. You also gain resistance to poison damage.

Sanguine Sorcery
Starting at 14th level, you may perform a blood ritual during a short rest. You may spend any amount of hit dice. You regain sorcery points equal to the number of hit dice spent.

Blood Lust
You now can steal the very essence of your fallen foes. Starting at 18th level, when you kill an enemy with a spell amplified by your corporeal casting, you gain hit points equal to the damage dealt.

Mr Adventurer
2020-12-12, 08:31 PM
Interesting idea. I'd like to see some of these concepts embedded into the core Sorcerer, since their power often is supposed to come from the heritage.

Blood Magic spells are replaceable by "evocation or abjuration spells", but the bonus spell list as it starts is littered with spells from other schools. Feels a bit dissonant. Are the other two origins which do this the same way?

Will you need extra verbiage for Crimson Resolve to specify that it applies to hit points gained on level as well as Hit Dice used to heal in rests?

I think the bonus action function of Corporeal Casting will need the most balancing, as 'free upcasting' isn't I don't think something we've seen elsewhere yet. I wonder if the hit dice rolled should also be expended. If you don't expend them, then you always can mitigate the damage by rolling your first 5d6 before using your later d10s. Is that intentional?

sayaijin
2020-12-12, 09:41 PM
Interesting idea. I'd like to see some of these concepts embedded into the core Sorcerer, since their power often is supposed to come from the heritage.

Blood Magic spells are replaceable by "evocation or abjuration spells", but the bonus spell list as it starts is littered with spells from other schools. Feels a bit dissonant. Are the other two origins which do this the same way?

Will you need extra verbiage for Crimson Resolve to specify that it applies to hit points gained on level as well as Hit Dice used to heal in rests?

I think the bonus action function of Corporeal Casting will need the most balancing, as 'free upcasting' isn't I don't think something we've seen elsewhere yet. I wonder if the hit dice rolled should also be expended. If you don't expend them, then you always can mitigate the damage by rolling your first 5d6 before using your later d10s. Is that intentional?

I looked it up, and yes the new subclasses use spells outside the schools they limit.

I guess I should have specified that it changes the previous hit dice.

As for the upcasting, most spells don't benefit much from upcasting. So even if this character gets cure wounds from another feature, taking 1d6 damage to heal an extra 1d8 isn't great. For magic missile, you take 1d6 for every extra 1d4. I could still be wrong, but upcasting isn't much of an issue until later levels.

Mr Adventurer
2020-12-13, 03:15 AM
I looked it up, and yes the new subclasses use spells outside the schools they limit.

I guess I should have specified that it changes the previous hit dice.

As for the upcasting, most spells don't benefit much from upcasting. So even if this character gets cure wounds from another feature, taking 1d6 damage to heal an extra 1d8 isn't great. For magic missile, you take 1d6 for every extra 1d4. I could still be wrong, but upcasting isn't much of an issue until later levels.

If hit dice change is retroactive, you need to specify how that works - does a player need to reroll?

"Most" spells might not benefit much, but many spells double in effect with +1 slot. It's basically Twin Spell at that point.

sayaijin
2020-12-19, 11:55 AM
Interesting idea. I'd like to see some of these concepts embedded into the core Sorcerer, since their power often is supposed to come from the heritage.



Blood Magic could also be a feat with Sorcerer levels as a prerequisite.

Blood Magic
Prerequisite: at least one Sorcerer level.
As a bonus action, you can roll any number of d6 and take damage equal to the total. The next spell you cast is treated as if the spell slot used is the actual slot plus the number of d6 you rolled.

Then it's something for the base class.

BerzerkerUnit
2020-12-20, 01:38 PM
I like the general idea of this subclass but I think there are some issues.

Example, Fighter 1 Sorc 19 turns into a 9 level caster with heavy armor, martial proficiency, amazing spell list, and d10 hd. Sorcadin is arguably worse.

That said, I never balance my stuff around multiclassing (itself an optional rule), so that critique comes with a grain of salt.

Outside that, the d10 hd is an interesting idea, but might be easier to implement as Toughness Feat, just a flat +12 hp when attained and additional 2 hp each level thereafter. That's a net loss of 1hp vs D10 hd and ignored in my above fighter Sorc example.

The free upcasting exists elsewhere (artificer spell storing item, Scribe wizard free scrolls) but is generally limited to 1 free slot level for level 1-2 spells. In this case, as a core function, allowing a free 1/day roll 1hd for 1 level of upcast and spend hd for additional uses seems like a compromise. Especially as a 1st level feature since 2nd level effects at level 1 can be a big deal and the same for 3rd level effects at 3rd level. So it's a major feature for the first 5 levels of play (a range a LOT of games hang around in).

Making everything key off Con is probably too much. Refluffing as "body and spirit synergize more than any other" and having a feature that self cannibalizes to enhance spells keeps the theme. Consider, the avg Sorc has to think of Dex, Con, Cha. This brings it down to Con/Dex, the two most common save stats, Con influences HP as well. Imagine if the Astral Self Monk moved everything, Ki DCs, attack and damage bonuses, to Con?

As an alternative capstone, "Now you can use other people's blood to enhance a spell" could also work.

In fact, a steady progression of features could work. Like level 6 Cantrip buff "When casting a cantrip, you can reduce your max hp by 1 to add 1d6+Proficiency to the first roll of damage for the spell, hp recovers after a long rest." That's a huge buff to damage, but for cantrips which you're generally avoiding casting in combat from level 5 on? Practically a Ribbon unless you are terrible at pacing spell use.

Follow with a level 14 "When casting a spell of 1st level or higher, reduce Max hp by level of the spell slot used to cast to add 1d12+proficiency bonus to damage of spell." This makes spells like Magic Missile absurd single target damage dealers but at the cost of max hp for the day.

and a level 18 of "When using (L6 or L14 features) make a living creature you can see make a con save, on a failure you reduce their max hp by level of spell to (add damage), on a success you reduce your own HP maximum normally." proficiency times/day.

sayaijin
2020-12-28, 12:43 PM
The free upcasting exists elsewhere (artificer spell storing item, Scribe wizard free scrolls) but is generally limited to 1 free slot level for level 1-2 spells. In this case, as a core function, allowing a free 1/day roll 1hd for 1 level of upcast and spend hd for additional uses seems like a compromise. Especially as a 1st level feature since 2nd level effects at level 1 can be a big deal and the same for 3rd level effects at 3rd level. So it's a major feature for the first 5 levels of play (a range a LOT of games hang around in).

So idea I had was to spend HP for unlimited upcasting. This will of course lead to an even bigger nova, but it's limited to the number of spells they have per day. I'm thinking of balancing it by limiting it to spells with a single target, and I specifically put AoA on the spell list so they can trade HP for THP by upcasting it. I'd like the ability to be at-will, meaning they can upcast every single slot they have.



Making everything key off Con is probably too much. Refluffing as "body and spirit synergize more than any other" and having a feature that self cannibalizes to enhance spells keeps the theme. Consider, the avg Sorc has to think of Dex, Con, Cha. This brings it down to Con/Dex, the two most common save stats, Con influences HP as well. Imagine if the Astral Self Monk moved everything, Ki DCs, attack and damage bonuses, to Con?

So both the d10 and the keying off of Con are both there to allow this sorcerer to use the upcasting ability without dying every time they use it. It's a d6 class spending hit points, so they need the extra HP. Also, I've seen a lot of talk about a Con-based caster, and I've always thought the idea fits with a sorcerer.



As an alternative capstone, "Now you can use other people's blood to enhance a spell" could also work.

In fact, a steady progression of features could work. Like level 6 Cantrip buff "When casting a cantrip, you can reduce your max hp by 1 to add 1d6+Proficiency to the first roll of damage for the spell, hp recovers after a long rest." That's a huge buff to damage, but for cantrips which you're generally avoiding casting in combat from level 5 on? Practically a Ribbon unless you are terrible at pacing spell use.

Follow with a level 14 "When casting a spell of 1st level or higher, reduce Max hp by level of the spell slot used to cast to add 1d12+proficiency bonus to damage of spell." This makes spells like Magic Missile absurd single target damage dealers but at the cost of max hp for the day.

and a level 18 of "When using (L6 or L14 features) make a living creature you can see make a con save, on a failure you reduce their max hp by level of spell to (add damage), on a success you reduce your own HP maximum normally." proficiency times/day.

Reducing max HP is another interesting resource. The way I envisioned this subclass, they use their own life to empower their spells, and late game they can regain their spent HP with another subclass feature.

In order to do this, they need extra HP (d10 and Con-based casting). I also want them to be tankier.

I built this entire subclass around the idea of upcasting using your HP - preferably as many times per day as you have slots.

CptnCopyright!~
2021-01-07, 11:20 AM
Blood Mage (sorcerous origin)
Corporeal Casting
Unlike other sorcerers, your power comes not from your will or influence but from your own body.
When you choose this origin at 1st level, Constitution becomes your spellcasting ability for your sorcerer spells, and any class ability that uses your charisma modifier instead uses your constitution.
Also, as a bonus action, you can roll any number of hit dice you own and take damage equal to the sum. The next spell you cast is treated as if the spell slot you used to cast it was the actual spell slot plus the number of hit dice rolled. You do not lose hit dice using this feature.


Style Tips: "Any class ability" should be "any sorcerer class ability" or more specifically "any Metamagic Option" since this subclass doesn't use your Charisma modifier. Ability Scores are always capitalized as well.

The reason Constitution isn't a spellcasting ability except for the Barbarian is the universal gain from it being your casting ability. You get increased Hit Points, higher Con saves for Concentration, and now you get to use it for your spells. I don't know how to help this feature without hurting the core idea of this subclass. I think Con casting is a neat idea, just that it's too powerful later on.
Additionally, at 1st level, you have no higher level spell slots, so you shouldn't be able to cast spells with them. The feature that allows Hit Dice to be used to increase the level a spell should be at least at 6th level, and should read like this:
"As a bonus action, you can roll any number of Hit Dice (up to the amount of total Hit Dice you have) and roll them. You take an amount of force damage equal to the sum, which cannot be resisted. The next spell you cast before the end of your turn is treated as if you had cast it with a slot equal to the original slot used + the amount of Hit Dice spent, as long as you have spell slots of that level."
This way, you spend Hit Dice (a useful resource later on in this subclass), you can't spend spell slots higher than the ones you already have, you have a typed damage, and you can put something else at 1st level. But this feature is still overpowered, because you're still just casting much more high level spells than you should be at 6th level, and higher levels later on. Upcasting spells all the time at will is insanely powerful, especially if a healer just happens to exist near you and be in on the plan to kill every possible thing.



Crimson Resolve
Starting at 6th level, your Sorcerer hit die becomes a d10 instead of a d6. You also gain resistance to poison damage.


This is why Con casting is too powerful. If you get an average of 11 additional hit points per level, then you'll be miles ahead of other casters. Even the cleric doesn't have a d10 Hit Die. I think you could include an ability where you spend Hit Dice to mitigate damage instead of this. You could increase the Hit Die to d8 at 1st level and include the feature I mentioned above.



Sanguine Sorcery
Starting at 14th level, you may perform a blood ritual during a short rest. You may spend any amount of hit dice. You regain sorcery points equal to the number of hit dice spent.


If the feature at 6th level didn't exist, this feature would be very neat. Spending Hit Dice for sorcery points is a cool idea, maybe you do that instead of this? You spend an amount of Hit Dice up to half your total Hit Dice and can use them as if they were sorcery points on a Metamagic Option you know, or something. Not as actual sorcery points, then you could spend Hit Dice for extra spell slots as well.



Blood Lust
You now can steal the very essence of your fallen foes. Starting at 18th level, when you kill an enemy with a spell amplified by your corporeal casting, you gain hit points equal to the damage dealt.


Style Tips: "Gain" should be "regain," and it should read, "Starting at 18th level, when you kill a creature with a spell amplified by your corporeal casting feature, you regain an amount of hit points equal to the damage dealt."

This is good as a final feature, however any player will now be casting spells at 9th level all the time and get healing from it. Additionally, this is very undetermined, because if a spell such as Fireball effects more than one target, you're healing an insane amount of damage. You're invincible at that point. With tweaking, you might be able to save it:
"Starting at 18th level, when you kill a creature with a spell amplified by your corporeal casting feature, you can use your reaction to regain an amount of hit points equal to your sorcerer level."

anthon
2021-01-08, 02:23 AM
d10 hp is fine, did something like that for a weird mage a while ago.

the heal dps inflicted is not good for wizard class.

you should instead convert it to say something like "heal 1 hit die for every spell level", this gives damage values a range of d10 to 9d10 healing, thus 5-45 healing.

see, if you Meteor Swarm something for 40d6 damage, that's like a 120-240 healing attack. Follow up with Horrid Wilting or whatever, and you end up with a Chain-casting dragon slayer.

granted, that's cool, but i think 5-45 average is a tad more balanced than 50-120 average.