With the Tasha's optional rule to change ASIs around, which are the biggest winners?

[LordShade]

The Tasha's ability to move around ASIs (and also replace racial proficiencies) seems to create a lot of opportunities that were suboptimal before. Which are the best ones? Everyone knows about busted races like Yuan-ti, and moving the Mountain Dwarf/Half-elf +4 stats around. What are other good plays here?

Some that come to my mind:

1. Hill or Mountain dwarf for any wizard, sorcerer or non-hexblade warlock that's dipping a level of heavy armor cleric. Dump strength and dex while getting Con+Int or Con+Cha boosts. Peace cleric+Divine Soul with 10/10/17/8/13/16 or 17 depending on subrace looks possible. The Mountain Dwarf's useless armor proficiency can be swapped for some extra tools.

2. All of the dragonmarked races are much better for clerics, druids, and wizards now. The extra spells were mostly balanced by already being on the spell lists of the classes who benefited from the marks' ASIs, but now you can have a Mark of Healing wizard with an Int bonus or a Mark of Warding druid with a wisdom bonus.

2b. In general, the gnome and halfling subraces have pretty weak abilities. The strongest powers (Gnome Cunning, Lucky) are found in the core race. Particularly as a spellcaster that benefits from the expanded magic access, I think you lose relatively little by giving away trash abilities like artificer's lore and tinker for Sivis' free cantrip, two free utility casts, flat +1d4 on all History checks, and expanded spell list when you aren't locked in to a useless Charisma bonus.

3. Emeria Merfolk Arcana cleric. This obscure race gets +1 Cha, +2 Wis, swimming/waterbreathing, free Persuasion/Deception, and a free druid cantrip. Move the Cha bonus to Con or Dex and this looks like a winner. From what I can tell, this is straight superior to the classic Vuman arcana cleric build.

3b. I'm wondering if there are generally better ways to do the Arcana cleric build now. Is it as simple as taking the variant ancestry option, using elf as your chassis, taking +2 wis and something like Wood elf magic at level 1? Or do you go Mountain Dwarf, start with 17 Dex and 17 Wis, trade one of your dwarf proficiencies for a rapier, and use 3 ASIs to max out Dexterity and Wisdom, and forget about Shillelagh altogether (and get to use magic weapons instead?) A Vuman needs 3 ASIs for the full combo, doesn't get the extra AC/save/initiative benefits of the higher Dex, and can't benefit from a magic weapon.

4. Do all heavy armor melee clerics want to go High Elf or Half-elf now? +2 Str/Wis, +1 to the other, and a free pickup of Booming Blade? Nature clerics might like this too, but they don't need strength higher than 15.

5. High elf was already a good choice for rogues, but now Swashbucklers can grab a Charisma bonus while they're at it.

6. I know there are some shenanigans involving lizardmen, Loxodons, Tortles, and other freakshow/circus races, but I don't fully grasp what they are.

[LudicSavant]

- Wildhunt Shifter Barbarians can Reckless Attack without granting enemies Advantage to hit them.

- Shifters in general for classes that don't have a ton of bonus actions.

- Sorcerers can now enjoy their own version of the Hobgoblin Iron Wizard.

- Goblins were previously good enough to be worth taking on some classes (like Wizards) despite having the 'wrong' stat choices. Now they have the correct ones, and are therefore powerhouse choices for those classes.

- Jorasco Halflings were in a similar boat to goblins; you wanted to take them on non-Wis-based caster classes, but they had a Wis bonus. Now you get all the 'heals better than most Clerics' goodness of a Jorasco Wizard, but with an Int bonus.

- Yuan-Ti previously had an anti-synergistic stat-line for most builds. Now they don't.

- Mountain Dwarves and Half-Elves, for obvious reasons.

- High Elves are attractive for class that wants to pick up Booming Blade (like Cleric or Bard).

- Aasimar are more attractive now. Scourge Aasimar are probably better suited to non-Cha classes that don't cast Concentration spells (since their aura causes themselves to make checks), and Protector Aasimar enjoy not having that Cha/Wis pairing.

- Shadar-Kai and Eladrin have always been great, and now they're great for a wider variety of classes.

- Satyrs, too.

- Loxodons offer some interesting possibilities for grapplers.

- Goliath's racial ability synergizes with Armor of Agathys and Concentration-users in general.

- Something something Tabaxi cheese grater grappler something something.

[prototype00]

I personally appreciate the ability to make the Lucky Halfling Diviner meme build with optimal stat placement.

[AttilatheYeon]

In AL play your +1 is no longer attached to race choices, so vhuman and high elf are both really good. Vhuman allows you to choose xgte as your plus one and still take a feat from tashas. Helf lets you take a cantrip from either book and use the other as your +1.

[noob]

I personally appreciate the ability to make the Lucky Halfling Diviner meme build with optimal stat placement.

I am not so sure it is meme when it helps that much with rerolls.(that and diviners have some rather strong abilities like getting lower level divinations on casting divinations or something like that)

[LudicSavant]

I am not so sure it is meme when it helps that much with rerolls.(that and diviners have some rather strong abilities like getting lower level divinations on casting divinations or something like that)

It could be considered a meme build because the abilities don't actually synergize to become more than the sum of their parts, since you have to use the Diviner's ability before seeing the roll. You're getting no benefit out of your higher base roll when you're replacing that roll.

In other words, it seems like a build that comes up from people saying 'hey, I'll take all the roll manipulation abilities on one character for the memes!' rather than 'hey, I looked at the math and think that this particular combination is especially synergistic.'

[Galithar]

It could be considered a meme build because the abilities don't actually synergize to become more than the sum of their parts, since you have to use the Diviner's ability before seeing the roll. You're getting no benefit out of your higher base roll when you're replacing that roll.

In other words, it seems like a build that comes up from people saying 'hey, I'll take all the roll manipulation abilities on one character for the memes!' rather than 'hey, I looked at the math and think that this particular combination is especially synergistic.'

Not everyone is as good at working out the math as you though! Lol

[noob]

It could be considered a meme build because the abilities don't actually synergize to become more than the sum of their parts, since you have to use the Diviner's ability before seeing the roll. You're getting no benefit out of your higher base roll when you're replacing that roll.

In other words, it seems like a build that comes up from people saying 'hey, I'll take all the roll manipulation abilities on one character for the memes!' rather than 'hey, I looked at the math and think that this particular combination is especially synergistic.'

It is not particularly synergetic but all of them are limited use powers so stacking them allows to have more of the cool stuff per day and in this case rerolls/dice replacement are very useful for survival against spell likes and supernatural abilities(and can also serve for some other cases).

[TheUser]

Tortles for casters

17 AC without any dex investment is dope for casters.

[Naanomi]

When I went through the 'builds I'd like to play' list I have written up, most of the stat adjustments I made were... more about optimizing suboptimal choices I already made, rather than opening up anything new... Examples:

~Hilldwarf barbarian looking to maximize HP; moved WIS to STR
~Tortle spore druid, moved STR to CON
~Winged-Tiefling Pyromancer, moved INT to DEX
~Mountain Dwarf gimmicky Aberrant Mind, moved STR to CHA
~Kenku scribe wizard, moved WIS to INT (and adjusted racial skills)
~Half-Orc knife throwing fighter, moved STR to DEX

[nickl_2000]

I'm surprised I haven't seen anyone mention Githyanki. It seems like it would be a kill choice now.

[KorvinStarmast]

I'm surprised I haven't seen anyone mention Githyanki. It seems like it would be a kill choice now. Moving stat bonuses around sure makes them more appealing.

[RogueJK]

I'm surprised I haven't seen anyone mention Githyanki. It seems like it would be a kill choice now.

I don't think they really excel at anything different from before, even with being able to move their stat bonuses around now. Like Mountain Dwarf, the medium armor and handful of weapons are only occasionally useful on certain builds, like single-classed Abjurer or War Wizards that want to be able to melee a little.

The only difference now is that you could do something similar with a Sorcerer, or a non-Valor/Swords Bard.

But either way, if you're doing that, you're probably better off going with a different race and dipping 1 level of Cleric, or doing something like Hobgoblin with Moderately Armored feat, to get Shields as well as Medium Armor.

[nickl_2000]

Moving stat bonuses around sure makes them more appealing.

Exactly, +2 Dex and +1 Int/+1 Cha with Medium armor is absolutely worth it for a Wizard/Sorcerer/Bard. Free Mage Hand Cantrip and Misty Step is awesome to have available as well. Then you can trade those weapons for tools or other weapons (Longbow) and you are in a really, really good place.

[RogueJK]

Exactly, +2 Dex and +1 Int/+1 Cha with Medium armor is absolutely worth it for a Wizard/Sorcerer/Bard.

A Wizard/Sorcerer/Bard with Medium Armor but without being able to use shields isn't as helpful as getting Medium Armor + Shields through something like a Cleric dip.

I'd really only consider it if multiclassing wasn't an option. And even then, I'd likely go with Moderately Armored Hobgoblin instead.

[Willie the Duck]

A Wizard/Sorcerer/Bard with Medium Armor but without being able to use shields isn't as helpful as getting Medium Armor + Shields through something like a Cleric dip.

I'd really only consider it if multiclassing wasn't an option. And even then, I'd likely go with Moderately Armored Hobgoblin instead.

I think it depends on for what you are looking. A backline wizard who just needs a little more protection for the odd case where they end up face-to-face with the enemy can do okay with a 17 AC (half plate+14 Dex). If you want an actual front-line wizard, the lack of a shield seems too painful to bother with (and thus look for other option).

[KorvinStarmast]

The longer I look at the custom racial build, the more I like it. A +2 and a feat and another useful feature, be it dark vision, proficiency, what have you. You can really front load a character concept with this.

[RogueJK]

The longer I look at the custom racial build, the more I like it. A +2 and a feat and another useful feature, be it dark vision, proficiency, what have you. You can really front load a character concept with this.

With the downside of likely excluding certain racial feats. RAW, a "Custom Lineage" character isn't an "Elf" or a "Dwarf" or whatever. So if you're wanting that Crit-fishing Elven Advantage build, or plan to take Wood Elf Magic at some point, you won't be able to do that with a Custom Lineage unless your DM is willing to play ball.

RAW, Custom Lineage cannot be "built on an elf chassis" as the OP previously suggested, to qualify for Elf-related feats. Instead, you're a standalone non-race-specific humanoid. The section reads "Instead of choosing one of the game’s races for your character at 1st level, you can use the following traits to represent your character’s lineage..." There's no mention in that section of "based on an existing race" or "as a unique member of an existing race" or similar.

So flavor-wise and appearance-wise, you might say that your Custom Lineage humanoid is a Wood Elf that was raised by Orcs, but mechanically you're not a Wood Elf for racial purposes, RAW.

[KorvinStarmast]

With the downside of likely excluding certain racial feats. There is no problem for me with that, I despise the racial feats. All feats need to be available to all PCs: that's what is in the PHB, and I really dislike what they did with that in Xanathar's. And for that matter, Prodigy is what "skilled" could have been; I seen no reason to restrict it to Half Orcs, Humans, and Half Elfs. In my games, anyone who is eligible for the skilled feat can instead take Prodigy.

I very much like "skill expert" in Tasha's as a feat.

OK, rant over, it is what it is, I understand what you are getting at.

[jojosskul]

Half-Orcs are more appealing generally now. A free self pickup, even if it's only to 1 HP, shouldn't be underestimated. Some subclasses get similar abilities that heal for more when knocked down, but that usually isn't until tier 3. Being able to put that ability on ANYONE and put your stat bonuses in the best place for you (and get one extra skill of choice since you can swap out their free intimidation) makes them a strong all around choice in my opinion.

[RogueJK]

A free self pickup, even if it's only to 1 HP, shouldn't be underestimated. Some subclasses get similar abilities that heal for more when knocked down, but that usually isn't until tier 3.

You can get similar from Level 1 of Shadow Sorcerer. (Although that one isn't technically "free" since it requires a CHA saving throw against DC 5+damage taken.)

It's part of what makes a 1 level dip into Shadow Sorcerer so nice on a Paladin, along with the 120' Darkvision, some extra defensive spells (Shield/Absorb Elements), and some cantrips for utility and to shore up the STR-based Paladin's otherwise lackluster ranged options.

With Paladin's typically decent CHA, plus CHA save proficiency, and later Aura of Protection, they're likely to be able to make that CHA saving throw to keep from going unconscious (barring massive damage from a crit or similar, which wouldn't be an issue with the Half Orc ability).

[Rule-Of-Three]

I personally appreciate the ability to make the Lucky Halfling Diviner meme build with optimal stat placement.

That's a meme build? With one level of Clockwork Soul Sorceror, I was hoping to control all the maths, and the engagements through divination. Sounds strong to me...

[samcifer]

If you're talking using races on classes they wouldn't be optimal in before, I'd say half-orc (the one with the once per long rest drop to 1 hp version) and warforged really stand out on class features. Halflings are also much better now, too, as are elves.

[diplomancer]

There is no problem for me with that, I despise the racial feats. All feats need to be available to all PCs: that's what is in the PHB, and I really dislike what they did with that in Xanathar's. And for that matter, Prodigy is what "skilled" could have been; I seen no reason to restrict it to Half Orcs, Humans, and Half Elfs. In my games, anyone who is eligible for the skilled feat can instead take Prodigy.

I very much like "skill expert" in Tasha's as a feat.

OK, rant over, it is what it is, I understand what you are getting at.

I see you and agree with you, EXCEPT for the feats that work based on racial features (like Dragon Fear, or Bountiful Luck). Those are fun ways to make your race choice shine out even more.

[prototype00]

That's a meme build? With one level of Clockwork Soul Sorceror, I was hoping to control all the maths, and the engagements through divination. Sounds strong to me...

By meme, I meant having a certain memetic currency in the community, like Coffeelock, say.

I’m quite aware that it’s good (And has been the cause of a lot of DM angst), that’s why I’d want to play it.

[loki_ragnarock]

Kalashtar Bearbarians aren't so bad anymore.

Aaaaand I wrote that a while ago without pressing submit reply before wandering away for the better part of the day, so I suspect someone's already suggested this in the intervening time, but I'm hitting the submit reply button now without looking.