War Mage Wizard 2 / Armorer Artificer 3+

[AdvTimber]

Hey, building a level 5 multiclass. my forge cleric died last session to an acid breath attack, so im RPing my Deity saved me by fusing my adamantium plate to my body - replacing missing limbs and such, can't decide if one arm should be a cannon (MEGAMAN style) or if I hold a shield but think "The Destroyer" from the first Thor movie; but imagine my body being a mix of twoface and Darth Vader underneath the armor - eatten away by the acid.

I like the armorer's gauntlets that provide a little taunt mechanic and being able to dump strength, being INT and CON and just being a pain in the ass bulwark with a base 21AC (18 plate with 2 shield and 1 defense infusion) and a reaction +2AC from arcane deflection or a +5 from Shield spell. I'll have firebolt as my 120ft ranged attack and Mild Sliver @ 15int saving throw if the target has too high AC.

my debate is running a shield and a single gauntlet and taking both GFB and BB and using my 6th level (4th artificer) ASI/Feat as the Mobile feat — BB target run outside of range and making them either attack at disadvantage or move to hit me and take BB damage effect.

or

Dropping the shield and using that feat slot for Dual Weilder, take the level 5 artificer extra attack and making up to 3 enemies have disadvantage 'taunt' and pretty much just being in the thick of it all the time. Losing 2 total AC (or 1 if my DM lets me cast the defense infusion on my 'magic' adamantium plate) and taking guidance and create bonfire or mending instead for cantrips.

or

skip the feat, get +2 INT so its 20 and double attack action with one gauntlet whist holding a shield in the other keeping 21AC and reactions and taking guidance/create bonfire/mending.

[supercereal]

Hey, building a level 5 multiclass. my forge cleric died last session to an acid breath attack, so im RPing my Deity saved me by fusing my adamantium plate to my body - replacing missing limbs and such

Why not playing the same forge cleric with the race changed to warfoeged? At least why not a full arteficer. How your body being replace by metal suddenly give you arcane knowladge and a wizard spellbook :smallannoyed:

[Lorka]

I expect the Armorer to really come together at level 9, so I wouldn’t delay that with two levels.
Their level 11 and 14 features are also quite nice and the level 20 capstone is amazing.

Multi class with War Wizard seems perfect, but every time I come back to the above conundrum.

The only Armorer multi class I have theorized to work is: Armorer as a ‘dip’ for Bladesinger after level 6, since you can have a light armor Arcane Armor, the Booming Blade Extra Attack Mobile combo really shines.

[Klorox]

Hey, building a level 5 multiclass. my forge cleric died last session to an acid breath attack, so im RPing my Deity saved me by fusing my adamantium plate to my body - replacing missing limbs and such, can't decide if one arm should be a cannon (MEGAMAN style) or if I hold a shield but think "The Destroyer" from the first Thor movie; but imagine my body being a mix of twoface and Darth Vader underneath the armor - eatten away by the acid.

I like the armorer's gauntlets that provide a little taunt mechanic and being able to dump strength, being INT and CON and just being a pain in the ass bulwark with a base 21AC (18 plate with 2 shield and 1 defense infusion) and a reaction +2AC from arcane deflection or a +5 from Shield spell. I'll have firebolt as my 120ft ranged attack and Mild Sliver @ 15int saving throw if the target has too high AC.

my debate is running a shield and a single gauntlet and taking both GFB and BB and using my 6th level (4th artificer) ASI/Feat as the Mobile feat — BB target run outside of range and making them either attack at disadvantage or move to hit me and take BB damage effect.

or

Dropping the shield and using that feat slot for Dual Weilder, take the level 5 artificer extra attack and making up to 3 enemies have disadvantage 'taunt' and pretty much just being in the thick of it all the time. Losing 2 total AC (or 1 if my DM lets me cast the defense infusion on my 'magic' adamantium plate) and taking guidance and create bonfire or mending instead for cantrips.

or

skip the feat, get +2 INT so its 20 and double attack action with one gauntlet whist holding a shield in the other keeping 21AC and reactions and taking guidance/create bonfire/mending.

Can you really use two shields?

[AdvTimber]

Why not playing the same forge cleric with the race changed to warforged? At least why not a full artificer. How your body being replace by metal suddenly give you arcane knowledge and a wizard spellbook :smallannoyed:

Sorry if that grinds your gears; it's a human only campaign and I've endured through 5 levels of cleric that I'm really, really not enjoying. The DM let me go a class change and my character has a backstory and a plot hook and stuff so I dont want the character to die, just class change and the armorer sounds fun, making magic items for the team and the tauntish mechanic by imposing disadvantage.

I looked around for a Diety for my forge cleric and found 'Gond' a Deity of knowledge and invention in the forgotten realms wiki. I thought it could be fanagled into some story moment. Haven't worked out the kinks but the group we're playing with isn't big into roleplaying over discord so I doubt anyone is going to stress about the little details, and the DM is good with it and excited that I'm excited about my character again.

I understand your reservations; I've heard plenty of people telling me to 'stick with it' for the cleric, 'it's the best domain' but I'm not looking forward to D&D night anymore so I think it's time for a change-- I'm sorry if it upsets you, it's not my intention.

[AdvTimber]

I expect the Armorer to really come together at level 9, so I wouldn’t delay that with two levels.
Their level 11 and 14 features are also quite nice and the level 20 capstone is amazing.

Multi class with War Wizard seems perfect, but every time I come back to the above conundrum.

The only Armorer multi class I have theorized to work is: Armorer as a ‘dip’ for Bladesinger after level 6, since you can have a light armor Arcane Armor, the Booming Blade Extra Attack Mobile combo really shines.

Yeah, 3rd level spell slots and 2 more infusions does sound really nice. I reasoned having a reactionary +2/+5 AC would work well with Armorer as I'm just punching or cantrip anyway and wouldn't be affected by the war magic debuff too much, having a reactionary +4 to saves and a bonus to initiative was just icing. plus going wizard gave me 3 more cantrips. I'll build another character, level 5 in just Armorer and see how it compares and if the juice is worth the squeeze.

[stoutstien]

Keep in mind the war wizard's reaction is only up for a single attack or save so it's noticable weaker against hordes or facing multiple saves per round. Not to say they whole package you get with 2 levels of war wizard isn't tempting.

At face value the flexibility of straight armorer will probably win out if you are using the TCoE version of artificer.

[AdvTimber]

Can you really use two shields?

a base 21AC (18 plate with 2 shield and 1 defense infusion)

I can't tell if joking so I'll try to break it down for you in case your genuinely confused:

18AC Plate armor
02AC shield
01AC defense infusion
21AC total

I'm pretty sure if I have 18 plate armors on I would have the strength to hold 2 shields.

[AdvTimber]

Keep in mind the war wizard's reaction is only up for a single attack or save so it's noticable weaker against hordes or facing multiple saves per round. Not to say they whole package you get with 2 levels of war wizard isn't tempting.

At face value the flexibility of straight armorer will probably win out if you are using the TCoE version of artificer.

This still brings me around to the whole reason I posted, not for people to dismantle my class choices lol

should I be a:
1 punch with shield and GFB/BB triggers -- and go deeper into War Mage and stop at Armorer 3
2 punch with shield (with extra attack)
3 punch without shield (with dual weilder feat and extra attack)

[stoutstien]

This still brings me around to the whole reason I posted, not for people to dismantle my class choices lol

should I be a:
1 punch with shield and GFB/BB triggers -- and go deeper into War Mage and stop at Armorer 3
2 punch with shield (with extra attack)
3 punch without shield (with dual weilder feat and extra attack)

*Shrugs*
Depends on what you can expect to see in game. They all have pros/cons so you won't find a clear best pick. A straight artificer can do both option 1 and 2 depending on what you need in the moment.

[Arkhios]

Can you really use two shields?

Technically there's nothing that says you can't use two. But you can only benefit from one.

[samcifer]

Why not playing the same forge cleric with the race changed to warfoeged? At least why not a full arteficer. How your body being replace by metal suddenly give you arcane knowledge and a wizard spellbook :smallannoyed:

Why do I keep picturing the scene in Superman 3 where the woman gets turned into a robot?

Not a bad ide for character=progression from the OP, tho.

[Reaver25]

Isn't it just the best when no one answers the question? Here's what I'm thinking my guy:
Go to Armorer 5, pick up Dual Wielder feat along the way for dual punching and such. Then go one of two routes:
Dip 1 level in Wizard to get Shield
OR
Dip 3 levels in Fighter (go EK) and get proficiency in martial weapons, Second Wind, Action Surge Dual Wielding fighting style, and Shield spell at level 3 (plus maybe burning hands and something else?)

I'm actually considering the same kind of character and this is what I'll be doing. That gives you:

18 AC (Plate)
+2 AC (if using Shield)
+1 AC (defense infusion)
=21 AC for "Defense Mode"
Or
18 AC
+1 AC Defense
=19 AC for "Attack Mode" with the possibility of this:
2d8+modifier(2), Action Surged = even more output for damage. Cast a spell the second round who cares.

That's what I would do if I were you.

[AdvTimber]

Isn't it just the best when no one answers the question? Here's what I'm thinking my guy:
Go to Armorer 5, pick up Dual Wielder feat along the way for dual punching and such. Then go one of two routes:
Dip 1 level in Wizard to get Shield
OR
Dip 3 levels in Fighter (go EK) and get proficiency in martial weapons, Second Wind, Action Surge Dual Wielding fighting style, and Shield spell at level 3 (plus maybe burning hands and something else?)

I'm actually considering the same kind of character and this is what I'll be doing. That gives you:

18 AC (Plate)
+2 AC (if using Shield)
+1 AC (defense infusion)
=21 AC for "Defense Mode"
Or
18 AC
+1 AC Defense
=19 AC for "Attack Mode" with the possibility of this:
2d8+modifier(2), Action Surged = even more output for damage. Cast a spell the second round who cares.

That's what I would do if I were you.

I honestly never looked at EK... and that has merit. I like adding the ability mod to the second attack with the fighting style. I'll have to build it in DnDBeyond to see it fully fleshed out. THANKS!

also something to note:


Or
18 AC
+1 AC Defense infusion
+1 AC Dual Wielder Feat
=20 AC for "Attack Mode" with the possibility of this:
2d8+modifier(2), Action Surged = even more output for damage. Cast a spell the second round who cares.

Since i can't be removed from my armor unwillingly.. what the heck weapon am I going to bond with lol

[AdvTimber]

I honestly never looked at EK... and that has merit. I like adding the ability mod to the second attack with the fighting style. I'll have to build it in DnDBeyond to see it fully fleshed out. THANKS!



Looking at it built... maybe I'm being naive but my rationale was that I have people in the party that deal consistent damage and I wasn't really building this with the intent of squeezing every iota of damage out. Getting more attacks downrange, and landing those attacks so that the gauntlet proc would "tank"; get deep into their frontline and add all sorts of flanking bonuses to my DPS teammates.. and having the staggering AC pool (and spells to bolster it) to survive being flanked and focused.

I might still go that route, EK; instead grab Defense (Fighting Style) for a mean 21AC while dual wielding, action surg, shield spell, ASI/Feat abundance, extra attack -- the 7th level EK is pretty cool if there's one target out of range; smack one with debuff and firebolt the out of range one.. and just leave Armorer as the 4 level 'dip'. heavily delaying "extra attack" till level 9, but dual wielder and the occasional action surge kinda takes that role in the meantime.