Bobur
2020-12-18, 07:58 AM
Hi everyone
I am currently piecing together a rogue in a 3.5e Dragonlance setting.
One available feat allows you to make a sleight of hand check as a free action.
And since the soh skill is a bit unpolished when it comes to its rules(espc in combat), I wanted to discuss this a bit.
1) Sleight of hand already allows you to do it as a free action, but with a -20 modifier.
2) This feat basically doesn't matter out of combat since the action rules usually don't apply otherwise. - one could argue, that is should give a bonus out of combat if you are THAT quick, but technically it makes no difference.
3) You make a DC20 check to obtain a small item. The target also rolls a spot check against your soh check to see if he noticed.
So what does this allow us to do in combat?
The obvious thing that I see is to just move up to a target, hit him in melee, and at the same time, try to steal something from him (as long as we have a free hand I assume)
Flat-footed: Although I heard the argument before, it doesn't say that the target has to be flat-footed or otherwise unaware of you to make a check.
Attack of opportunity: Again, the rules are not clear on this.
But since you have to role for the spot check first, I would say he can't attack you unless he wins the spot check. Otherwise, why even roll? Or would you argue that you do something in front of him that allows an aoo and the spot check is just to see if he notices being robbed?
With the feat: Free actions usually don't provoke Aoos from what I remember. So that should be safe now.
Now, what can you do with this? Disarm falls into a similar area, using a skill or feat to take something from the enemy. It is clearer on the rules though.
Sleight of hand: (DC20) You can take a "small" item from the target. Technically we could snatch a dagger from his hands? The target holding it in his hands doesn't mean that it's safe. If he fails his spot-check he might not even know where it went, just that it's gone. - A ring from a dragon's claw? The focus of a cleric or maybe a spellbook or phylactery of a lich? ...Or put something into his bags? A stone with silence cast on it? An alarm horn, keys, tying shoelaces together...
Obviously something like a bigger weapon, a shield, a cape or armor wouldnt work.
What do you think of the feat? And what do you think one could do with it? What would be off limits?
Thanks
I am currently piecing together a rogue in a 3.5e Dragonlance setting.
One available feat allows you to make a sleight of hand check as a free action.
And since the soh skill is a bit unpolished when it comes to its rules(espc in combat), I wanted to discuss this a bit.
1) Sleight of hand already allows you to do it as a free action, but with a -20 modifier.
2) This feat basically doesn't matter out of combat since the action rules usually don't apply otherwise. - one could argue, that is should give a bonus out of combat if you are THAT quick, but technically it makes no difference.
3) You make a DC20 check to obtain a small item. The target also rolls a spot check against your soh check to see if he noticed.
So what does this allow us to do in combat?
The obvious thing that I see is to just move up to a target, hit him in melee, and at the same time, try to steal something from him (as long as we have a free hand I assume)
Flat-footed: Although I heard the argument before, it doesn't say that the target has to be flat-footed or otherwise unaware of you to make a check.
Attack of opportunity: Again, the rules are not clear on this.
But since you have to role for the spot check first, I would say he can't attack you unless he wins the spot check. Otherwise, why even roll? Or would you argue that you do something in front of him that allows an aoo and the spot check is just to see if he notices being robbed?
With the feat: Free actions usually don't provoke Aoos from what I remember. So that should be safe now.
Now, what can you do with this? Disarm falls into a similar area, using a skill or feat to take something from the enemy. It is clearer on the rules though.
Sleight of hand: (DC20) You can take a "small" item from the target. Technically we could snatch a dagger from his hands? The target holding it in his hands doesn't mean that it's safe. If he fails his spot-check he might not even know where it went, just that it's gone. - A ring from a dragon's claw? The focus of a cleric or maybe a spellbook or phylactery of a lich? ...Or put something into his bags? A stone with silence cast on it? An alarm horn, keys, tying shoelaces together...
Obviously something like a bigger weapon, a shield, a cape or armor wouldnt work.
What do you think of the feat? And what do you think one could do with it? What would be off limits?
Thanks