Spellsinger: Seeker of the Song + Spells?

[flurryofDQ]

I have an impossible dream: getting several levels of the juicy songs from seeker of the song AND advancing Sublime Chord. Does anybody have an idea? I'm fine losing a couple levels of either/both class if that's what it takes.

So, here's where we are, and it's cheesy:

Major bloodline means that I am able to enter Sublime chord at level 9. Sublime Chord 9+10. Then Speaker of the Song for 11 + 12. Can I think take Spellsinger for the next 5 levels and advance Seeker of the Song bardic music AND Sublime Chord Spellcasting?

I can't post the link :(, but text reads:

"Bardic Music: Spellsingers continue to increase their skill in creating magical effects thorough song and poetics. A character's spellsinger levels and bard levels (or levels in another class with the same ability) stack for the purpose of using bardic music."

Could I use that to get the songs from the Seeker of the Song bardic music? If not, does anybody have an idea for a prestige class or other way to progress seeker of the song bardic music while getting the Sublime chord spells?

[Doctor Despair]

That's an interesting way to read the ability; I hadn't thought of that before. Sadly, I don't think it works in this instance because Seekers of the Song don't actually have bardic music; they have Seeker Music.

Troubadour of Stars explicitly stacks with bard to grant songs known, but a 1-level Heartfire Fanner dip is an easier way to get all the bardic music effects known.

Legacy Champion and Uncanny Trickster would both advance Seeker Music, but don't advance Chord spellcasting if you do, so isn't exactly what you're looking for.

Gestalt obviously does exactly what you want, but is an entirely different game

If you use Polymorph/Psychic Reformation to ignore the skill requirements, you could cram more Seeker/Chord levels into the build. That's a big can of worms to open though.

All in all, as far as I know, the two PrCs don't play nicely together. They both want you to take them from 11-20. As you said, Bloodlines can let you enter early at level 8, so X 7 / Seeker 3 / Chord 10 is feasible.

A Greater Bloodline would inflate your seeker level by 3 for the purposes of class level-based calculations. Arguably all the songs are granted at level 1 and gated by level, letting you qualify for the Hymn of Spelldeath (the best Seeker Music) if you can convince your DM to read it that way. However, that goes directly against what is shown in the table, so it's probably not the correct reading.

Without the broken reading, you'd be stuck with previously mentioned build, or X 7 / Seeker 10 / Chord 3 (which is probably demonstrably worse).

[Anthrowhale]

If you are looking for the concept (not the abilities), then there is an oddball class called 'Spellsinger' in the Kingdom's of Kalamar Player's Guide. This is WotC-endorsed so it has the same second party status as most of Dragon Magazine. The class has Sorcerer spells with a wizard-like access structure (nice!) and eliminates common material and somatic components while requiring a verbal component (mostly good). Bardic music on a Spellsinger might be best achieved via Heartfire Fanner although you'll need something like a Ruathar dip for access to diplomacy.

[Gruftzwerg]

There is a very cheesy option for early entry, but don't expect that your DM will let it fly. Two steps are needed to accomplish this.

1.
Kobold - Bard 1 / Sorcerer 5
Kobolds can get an extra lvl of Sorcerer spell progress at lvl 6 with the Greater Draconic Rite of Passage (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20060420a). So despite having dipped a single lvl into Bard, we haven't lost any spell progression for Sorcerer and thus are now capable of casting 3rd lvl arcane spells (One lvl ahead of pure bard).
At first lvl we pick the Dragonwrought feat. At 3rd lvl Draconic Reservoir.

2.
Find an 8th lvl Void Disciple and pay him to use his Mind of Clarity ability 3 times on you. This ability can give temporary extra ranks (!) in a skill, based on the skills attribute. This requires the Kobold to have 18 WIS and 18 CHA. With the help of the Dragonwrought feat we can ignore aging penalties for a free +3 to INT, WIS & CHA for being old enough. This should help getting the desired stats to get enough extra ranks in Perform, Listen and Knowledge Arcana at lvl 6 (9base ranks +4 modifier = 13. Now you can enter Sublime Chord at lvl 7(instead of 11).

This gives you 14 lvls to juggle with the 2 PRCs, which is 4 more than when you would normally enter at lvl 10.

The question that remains is, how much you have to bribe your DM for this crazy early entrance^^?

[Anthrowhale]

If you want to subvert level requirements on entry a straightforward approach is something like Sorcerer 1/Dire Lion 8/Heartfire Fanner 1/Sublime Chord 9/Seeker of the Song 9 where a psychic reformation / DCFS is used to shift the Dire Lion feats to Heighten Spell + Versatile Spellcaster + Sanctum Spell + Negotiator and Skill Focus (Perform) is picked up via Heward's Hall. The Dire Lion Lycanthropy is cured once you have 8 levels in Sublime Chord (and 10 total classes) at ECL 20, so the character will reach ECL 20 2 distinct times.

[flurryofDQ]

Seekers of the Song don't actually have bardic music; they have Seeker Music.

Ahhhhh....you're probably right.



A Greater Bloodline would inflate your seeker level by 3 for the purposes of class level-based calculations. Arguably all the songs are granted at level 1 and gated by level, letting you qualify for the Hymn of Spelldeath (the best Seeker Music) if you can convince your DM to read it that way. However, that goes directly against what is shown in the table, so it's probably not the correct reading.

That's an entirely reasonable reading. Clever.

Well, Seeker of the Song is probably lots of fun right around 8-10, so 3 levels is fine even if I don't get it. I really did want that Hymn of Spelldeath, though. The BBEG is a wizard, you see.

[flurryofDQ]

If you want to subvert level requirements on entry a straightforward approach is something like Sorcerer 1/Dire Lion 8/Heartfire Fanner 1/Sublime Chord 9/Seeker of the Song 9 where a psychic reformation / DCFS is used to shift the Dire Lion feats to Heighten Spell + Versatile Spellcaster + Sanctum Spell + Negotiator and Skill Focus (Perform) is picked up via Heward's Hall. The Dire Lion Lycanthropy is cured once you have 8 levels in Sublime Chord (and 10 total classes) at ECL 20, so the character will reach ECL 20 2 distinct times.

Wow! That's some next-level trickiness! Thanks for the idea :)